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  #251  
Old 05-26-2017, 09:25 AM
Johnny Ecks Johnny Ecks is offline
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The upcoming episodes look to be a big shift in the status quo. We finally get to see Homeworld! My guess is that Steven's presence will catalyze some changes in gem society- could a gem civil war be in the offing? Is there a gem resistance on homeworld? Will the revelation of the Diamonds corruption of the Gems on Earth cause dissension?

My hope it happens but probably won't idea is that White Diamond orders Steven released- at the request of her ex-girlfriend, Pearl.
  #252  
Old 05-26-2017, 02:51 PM
Spice Weasel Spice Weasel is offline
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I can't read this whole thread because I'm worried about spoilers, but my husband and I have fallen in love with this show. I like to call it sweet and heartwarming with an undercurrent of existential horror (Cat Fingers, anyone?) We just watched the first episode where Ruby and Sapphire are revealed and Garnet sings ''Stronger Than You.''

I just love it. It's rare that a kid's show with so much heart can successfully navigate such weighty issues as grief, loss, and responsibility for others, all while smashing gender stereotypes.

Last edited by Spice Weasel; 05-26-2017 at 02:52 PM.
  #253  
Old 05-28-2017, 11:57 PM
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And now on to "Are You My Dad?" and "I Am My Mom", which ends the Stevenbomb and ends Season 4 with a bonafide cliffhanger.

-Very effective callback whammy to Steven running his mouth at Peridot back in "Marble Madness".
-Aquamarine pretty much shoots to the top of the "Will Never Be Steven's Friend" list.
-Aquamarine very much comes across as the snooty, nasty Head Girl in an Enid Blyton-type British school story. I'm guessing the posh accent and the school outfit meant the crew was intentionally going with this trope.
-I was wondering how the characters trapped in Topaz could breathe, but I noticed that everyone was carefully depicted with their noses protruding.
-However, would Aquamarine and Topaz even know that humans need to breathe? "Look, Topaz! This silly organic has stopped thrashing about and turned almost as blue as me!"
-Jamie suddenly turned of the drama when Topaz was about to snap his neck.
-I'm not liking that Steven seems to have internalized that Rose did bad things and was a war criminal. Someone needs to take him aside and remind him that Earth is home to billions of people, none of whom would be alive without Rose Quartz.
-Lars is gonna Lars. That being said, I'm betting Steven will fuse with him while in space.
-I can't see how the Crystal Gems can launch a rescue mission, but if they do, I bet they unbubble Bismuth for extra muscle and weapons.
-Poor Connie. That was a cry of pure anguish. I'm not sure I want to see Greg's reaction either....
  #254  
Old 05-29-2017, 01:56 PM
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My hope it happens but probably won't idea is that White Diamond orders Steven released- at the request of her ex-girlfriend, Pearl.
Talk about a deus ex machina.

The Crew is obviously saving White Diamond for something big, I really don't think that she was Pearl's original owner is going to be the big reveal. All the "Pearl Belonged to White Diamond!" theorizing is based on the premise that both Pearl and WD have their gems placed on their foreheads and by this point in the show, we've seen enough gems to realize that it's not necessarily significant.

Rose Quartz was not Pearl's original owner, but the question is how did she end up with Rose? I don't see a line between White Diamond and Rose Quartz. Our Pearl was already in Pink Diamond's court before coming to Earth. Her spacesuit in "Space Race" still has a Pink Diamond motif.

My own personal theory is based on the fact that Pearl is one of the very few gems (and only Pearl) to have a multi-color palette. Pearl was made for Pink Diamond by the other diamonds, who anticipated she would need a Pearl when she emerged. This would explain why Pearl's color scheme includes white, yellow, and blue. At some point, PD decided she wanted to design her own custom Pearl (Pink Pearl?), which is how our Pearl got passed down to Rose Quartz, PD's trusted subordinate.
  #255  
Old 05-29-2017, 04:30 PM
bmoak bmoak is online now
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And the Season 5 Opener 4-Episode special starts tonight at 7 EST!
  #256  
Old 05-29-2017, 08:31 PM
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Well that was pretty amazing.

I know it's aired but I still don't want to risk spoiling for anyone but really very very good.
  #257  
Old 05-29-2017, 08:31 PM
bmoak bmoak is online now
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Well, that was unexpected. Several big curveballs thrown here.
  #258  
Old 06-04-2017, 12:34 AM
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Well, I assume i can spoil the "Wanted" Special Event now! "Stuck Together" picks up right after "I Am My Mom" and the other three episodes ("The Trial", "Off Colors", and "Lars' Head") flow together pretty seamlessly. The crew has really come a long way from the show's early single episode days.

Anyway, this is a series of game-changer episodes. We see Homeworld. Steven faces down Yellow Diamond and Blue Diamond. Steven goes on trial. There's something suspicious about the official accounts of Pink Dimaond's death. We see Eyeball again. And a whole bunch of new gems (Blue Zircon! Yellow Zircon! The Rutile Twins! Rhodonite! Fluorite! Padparadscha!). Lars has his big breakthrough. Lion's origin is revealed. And Steven makes it home.

-Steven, who usually can't shut up, was awfully quiet when Aquamarine was talking down Topaz. IMHO, if he had chimed in that Earth is a place where Topaz could be together and not have to go on any more awful missions, he could have swayed her.
-Of course, he goes back to type during the trial. When your lawyer tells you to shut up, you STFU. I'm surprised Steven didn't blurt out that he bubbled the Cluster.
-If you look at Blue Pearl's vid-screen, she doodles Steven's head, then draws a red X over it.
-Homeworld looks a lot like Coruscant, especially in the scene where the palanquin crashes through the wall and we see the view all the way down.
-Padparadscha is absolutely adorable. I love the way she is so chipper and cheerful when sharing her visions of something that has just happened.
-Theoretically, if Rhodonite (Ruby + Pearl) and Padapardscha (off-color Sapphire) fuse, they would make a completely different Sardonyx
-I guess the skull on Lars' T-shirt was foreshadowing.
-Lion has eaten food other than gem lizards: In "Cooking With Lion", he ate both the tuna fish and the snack sushi.
-Occam's Razor still says Rose Quartz did it, but "The Trial"makes it seem like she was wittingly or unwittingly receiving help from a Homeworld higher-up.
-Where is White Diamond? Where is Pink Pearl?
-How do they get Lars and the Off-Colors off Homeworld?
  #259  
Old 06-04-2017, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by bmoak View Post
-If you look at Blue Pearl's vid-screen, she doodles Steven's head, then draws a red X over it.
She also draws a little outline of Steven jumping when he's speculating about Rose performing some cool action moves.
  #260  
Old 06-04-2017, 09:02 AM
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And it's back to theorizing!

I've done some Rose Quartz theorizing in the past, but we've learned a lot more about Homeworld and Gems since then. Especially since we now know that Rose Quartzes were a (relatively) new line of Gems created by and for Pink Diamond. We also know that each Gem has a specific function or purpose.

So the question is: What was Rose Quartz' purpose?

Obviously, she's a Quartz and Quartzes are big, tough warriors and Rose is no exception. However, we've met lots of Quartzes and, other than her size and bulk, Rose doesn't look much like Amethysts, Jaspers, Carnelians, etc. Obviously, there's a dress and hair, but also her form and features are soft and rounder. Jasper could never be described as maternal, but Rose certainly can be. Not only is she Steven's mother, but she is also a defacto mother to Amethyst.

Then there's the matter of her powers. Why would a Gem society that officially disdains emotions create a Gem whose powers depend on her emotions. Obviously, Rose's healing powers would be a great boon to Gemkind, but to make them so that they will only work when she has strong feelings about the afflicted? Gem society also disdains organic life, so why was Rose given powers linked to organic life?

Rose Quartz was created with powers that depend on her empathy to function and powers that tie her to organic life. Is it any surprise that she developed empathy towards humanity and life on Earth and then decided to take action to prevent its utter destruction? Did Pink Diamond sow the seeds of the Rebellion and her own demise by creating Rose Quartz?

Maybe Pink Diamond, as the "newest" Diamond, saw the cracks in rigidly hierarchical Gem society run by fear-based control and denial of emotions and wanted to try running her court along different, perhaps kinder and familial, principles, thus creating Rose Quartzes? And is it possible that some elements of Homeworld (*cough*Yellow Diamond*cough*) could have seen this as a threat to the future order of Gem society?

Note: Occam's Razor still dictates that Rose shattered PD, but the revelations of "The Trial'" seem to indicate that PD might have been set up by a high-ranking Gem for Rose to ambush.
  #261  
Old 06-04-2017, 12:26 PM
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I dunno. I see it as us being set up to believe that Yellow Diamond somehow orchestrated PD's death, possibly creating a purposed Rose Quartz to do the deed (and maybe not for political reasons but out of jealousy since it is clear that BD had particularly strong feelings for PD) but of course that makes me suspect a twist yet to come. WD is still the completely unknown factor. I suspect WD orchestrated the murder of PD (framing Rose) and that YD is more in on the cover up.

But yeah the why the Rose Quartz class was created in the first place, given the strengths of the gem, is a question. Maybe some connection to the depths of BD's feelings?

When is the next ep?
  #262  
Old 06-04-2017, 10:16 PM
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She also draws a little outline of Steven jumping when he's speculating about Rose performing some cool action moves.
LOL! I missed that. It looks like Blue Pearl has just been phoning it in for a long time.
  #263  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:40 AM
Johnny Ecks Johnny Ecks is offline
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Ok, lets do this:

Suspects:

Rose Quartz
-Admitted to/ did not deny shattering PD
-Ruby (Eyeball) claimed to have seen her shatter PD
-Known enemy of PD
On the other hand
-A known enemy could not have gotten so close to PD
-Her sword could not shatter gems

Yellow Diamond
-Generally unpleasant and hates Earth
-Opposed the trial and eliminated witnesses when the official story was questioned
-Had the authority to meet with PD and cover it up
On the other hand
-Too easy. The most obvious suspect

Blue Diamond
-Nope

White Diamond
-All we know is that she's the Diamond that controls the most colonies and didn't attend the trial. Presumably the leader of the Diamonds.
Note that we see a silhouette of White Diamond's head among the buildings on homeworld- my guess is that it isn't a statue, but that White Diamond is just that big, dwarfing the other diamonds like they dwarf the regular gems.

Pink Diamond
-She faked her own shattering and framed/was helped by Rose
-Explains how Rose got through security, but was seen attacking PD.
-Works from a story point of view- Rose isn't an assassin, but still keeps secrets.

Pink Diamond's Pearl-
-Everyone is surprised when she is mentioned- Where is she now?
-Is she our Pearl?

Any other suspects?
  #264  
Old 06-05-2017, 11:37 AM
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Note that we see a silhouette of White Diamond's head among the buildings on homeworld- my guess is that it isn't a statue, but that White Diamond is just that big, dwarfing the other diamonds like they dwarf the regular gems.
I've seen speculation that it's not White Diamond's head: Blue Diamond has a spaceship that's a right arm, Yellow Diamond has a spaceship that's a left arm. White Diamond may have a spaceship that forms Gem-Voltron's head.
  #265  
Old 06-05-2017, 07:18 PM
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Pink Diamond
-She faked her own shattering and framed/was helped by Rose
-Explains how Rose got through security, but was seen attacking PD.
-Works from a story point of view- Rose isn't an assassin, but still keeps secrets.
This is my pet theory that I was going to mention. I think Rose rebelled on orders from PD. She fell in love with Earth/Earthlings and created Rose Quartz as a sort of response to that. Tho Diamonds seem to have supreme authority over their vassals, they still can't just do anything they please. Hence secretly fomenting a rebellion while publicly opposing it, in order to go "Hey fellow Diamonds, this earth place isn't worth the aggravation, I'mma go colonize some other planet, kay?"
So I figure Yellow D cottoned on to what was going on with earth, YD and PD argued about it. And at this point either PD decided the jig is up and faked her death, or the argument with Yellow was so heated she accidentally shattered PD. Perhaps that was the reason for creating the Cluster, to punish the planet for making her kill a fellow diamond, as she saw it.
  #266  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:43 PM
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a) Rose Quartz was not created on Earth.
b) Gems witnessed Pink Diamond's demise. Eyeball may not be the best witness, but I don't think she would confuse Rose Quartz for Yellow Diamond. I could certainly see Yellow Diamond involved in setting up Pink Diamond and covering it up, but not actually doing the deed.
c) Rose would have no reason to take the fall for Yellow Diamond. YD can certainly arrange for Rose to take the blame on Homeworld, but Rose would have no reason to let Garnet and Pearl think she shattered PD.
d) For your theory to work, it means that Rose is a monster. If Pink Diamond and Rose cooked up the Rebellion together, it means that the thousands of Gems who were shattered in the war died for a ruse. And Rose recruited all these Gems for her army by feeding them a line of hooey
  #267  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:59 PM
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I've seen speculation that it's not White Diamond's head: Blue Diamond has a spaceship that's a right arm, Yellow Diamond has a spaceship that's a left arm. White Diamond may have a spaceship that forms Gem-Voltron's head.
The Giant White Diamond in the background on Homeworld in "Off Colors" could very well be a Head/Torso ship. Also, the structure seen in the desert in "Lion 4" looks a lot like part of a pair of pink legs mostly submerged underground.
  #268  
Old 06-06-2017, 12:58 AM
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The Giant White Diamond in the background on Homeworld in "Off Colors" could very well be a Head/Torso ship. Also, the structure seen in the desert in "Lion 4" looks a lot like part of a pair of pink legs mostly submerged underground.
It was pretty striking at the time that Steven seemed to be sorta reverse birthing when he entered. And in his metaphoric womb of origin he found the what if potential of what he would be.

Simple question that there may not be a simple answer to - are Pearls a special class that is just one per Diamond? We've seen a Blue Pearl, a Yellow Pearl, and our Pearl who has no clear color with white skin but other colors in her design as well and her diamond in White Diamond's gem location. Pink Diamond's Pearl is mentioned but not seen and White Diamond's is as unseen as White Diamond has been herself. Unless, as commonly speculated, our perfectionistic Pearl is the perfect White Diamond's Pearl. Signs point there but misdirection must be suspected.

Where do the separate speculations that our Pearl is WD's or PD's Pearl each lead us?

Our Pearl can holographically project. Could our Pearl have holographically projected an image of Rose doing the deed? Good enough to fool Eyeball and others from a distance. But why would our Pearl do that and why would Rose allow others to believe she had actually shattered PD if she had not and someone else did (YD ... doubt ... or WD ... less doubt) or if it never actually happened and PD is either actually imprisoned (possible) or hiding (doubt).

And doubling back to why Rose Quartz with a strength of empathy would be created in the first place ... it almost has to do something with BD's power being tied with the strength of her emotions and the strong emotions BD clearly had for PD.

I feel like those questions all tie together somehow but I'm just not quite fitting answers together.
  #269  
Old 06-06-2017, 04:35 AM
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are Pearls a special class that is just one per Diamond?
No - it's also possible for other high-caste gems to have Pearls - CG Pearl successfully passed herself off as Sapphire's Pearl once.
  #270  
Old 06-06-2017, 06:59 AM
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No - it's also possible for other high-caste gems to have Pearls - CG Pearl successfully passed herself off as Sapphire's Pearl once.
Eyeball thought she was going to be awarded a Pearl for killing Rose Quartz.
  #271  
Old 06-06-2017, 07:09 AM
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Thank you both. So the Crystal Gem Pearl need not have been a Diamond's as is commonly speculated. Still it is interesting that we have been told origin backstories for Garnet and Amethyst and how they came to join the rebellion, but not for Pearl ... other than that she desperately loved Rose. Is that a dog that did not bark? Is the story of how she came to join the rebellion something yet to be told?
  #272  
Old 06-06-2017, 12:11 PM
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???? We literally saw Pearl holographically re-enact her joining Rose Quartz in the Rebellion at the very start, when it was still just a notion in "Rose's Scabbard"

We know that: a)She was Rose's Pearl at the time. b) She was already devoted to Rose, implying that they had been together for a while. We don't know what Pearl was doing before she was Rose's Pearl.
  #273  
Old 06-06-2017, 01:25 PM
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The recent episodes brought to mind an old theory about Lion being Pink Diamond. Perhaps Rose arrived to the scene after Pink Diamond was already shattered, and resurrected her as Lion similarly to how Steven resurrected Lars. The gems who were present might have mistaken this as Rose being responsible for shattering her.
  #274  
Old 06-06-2017, 09:10 PM
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???? We literally saw Pearl holographically re-enact her joining Rose Quartz in the Rebellion at the very start, when it was still just a notion in "Rose's Scabbard"

We know that: a)She was Rose's Pearl at the time. b) She was already devoted to Rose, implying that they had been together for a while. We don't know what Pearl was doing before she was Rose's Pearl.
My memory may be faulty but I remember that as Pearl being with Rose, clearly being in love with her, and pledging her loyalty before the big battle, but not being Rose's Pearl. I could be remembering incorrectly to be sure. Maybe she was Rose's Pearl but I am thinking both that Rose would not have ever been interested in "having a Pearl" and that there may be more of a story to how she came to be there than Rose being granted a Pearl to have of her own based on her high status is PD's court.
  #275  
Old 06-06-2017, 10:04 PM
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Rose literally addresses Pearl as "my Pearl" during the speech. If she wasn't Rose's Pearl at that time, the only other possibilities are if she was Pink Diamond's, or another Gem in PD's court, as that would be the only way Pearl could have the opportunity to get to know Rose well enough to fall in love with her.

Also, the speech is not before the big battle at the Strawberry Battlefield, but it's when Rose decided to commit to leave Homeworld's service and fight for the Earth.
  #276  
Old 06-06-2017, 10:13 PM
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???? We literally saw Pearl holographically re-enact her joining Rose Quartz in the Rebellion at the very start, when it was still just a notion in "Rose's Scabbard"

We know that: a)She was Rose's Pearl at the time.
This scene is actually the strongest argument against that.

Rose tells her that if she doesn't want to stay and fight, she can go back to Homeworld.

Given the Homeworld attitude toward Pearls - they're not just cogs in the society, like all the other gems, they're property - why the hell would Homeworld let Rose's Pearl return, under any circumstances other than bringing the shattered remains of Rose's gem with her?

At best, she'd be punished in Rose's stead, at worst, she'd be assumed as a traitor still loyal to her owner.

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Why would a Gem society that officially disdains emotions
This is not supported by the text. You need look no further than the Diamonds we've seen so far to find counterevidence. (They actually seem to embody emotions - Blue: sadness, Yellow: anger. Pink was probably love or compassion, under this paradigm, based on her zoo.)

What they have is a contempt for certain expressions of attachment (hmm...does this remind you of anything?).
  #277  
Old 06-06-2017, 11:25 PM
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Rose literally addresses Pearl as "my Pearl" during the speech. ...
You heard that as an expression of ownership? Okay. My ear heard it as an expression of endearment.

Only? I don't know. The most logical and likely to be sure, but an origin story that reveals things of significance to the larger arc might be able to have some other twists in it. This show is good enough to not always go where we expect them to go and sometimes with good writers expecting something makes it a better bet that they will go a different direction.

Or not!
  #278  
Old 06-06-2017, 11:35 PM
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Rose literally addresses Pearl as "my Pearl" during the speech.
I missed this when making my earlier post.

I call my girlfriend 'my <her name/various terms of endearment>' all the time, and vice versa. Neither of us considers the other her property.
  #279  
Old 06-08-2017, 12:07 AM
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Responses, yay!

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Originally Posted by Kamino Neko View Post
I missed this when making my earlier post.

I call my girlfriend 'my <her name/various terms of endearment>' all the time, and vice versa. Neither of us considers the other her property.
Are you and your girlfriend part of a repressive, caste-based society?

Rose absolutely was using it as a term of endearment, but that doesn't mean she wasn't using it literally. Also, remember that "Rose's Scabbard" appeared well before we found out what Pearls were made for. It's only in later re-viewing that you pick up the implications of "my Pearl". Also, there would have been a difference in how Rose and Pearl acted in public and Rose treated her in private. (I imagine that's actually common in Gem society.)

I agree that Rose probably didn't want a Pearl and wasn't the kind of gem who would aspire to wanting a Pearl. However, she either was given a Pearl by someone she couldn't refuse (*cough*PinkDiamond*cough*) or she intervened to protect a Pearl who was dismissed from service or facing punishment.

If Pearl wasn't Rose's Pearl, then you have to answer two questions: Who did Pearl belong to? How did Rose and Pearl get so close if Pearl's owner wasn't Rose? The second questions kind of limits the first. Looking at Yellow Pearl and Blue Pearl, does it seem like either of them get much Alone Time away from their Diamonds? How would a Pearl even be able to start a relationship with another Gem? The only possibility is if Pearl belonged to Pink Diamond, as she and Rose would have been in the same court and had opportunities to interact. That kind of fits other info, such as Pearl's Pink Diamond spacesuit and the fact that she has been to the Zoo.
  #280  
Old 06-08-2017, 12:31 AM
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This is not supported by the text. You need look no further than the Diamonds we've seen so far to find counterevidence. (They actually seem to embody emotions - Blue: sadness, Yellow: anger. Pink was probably love or compassion, under this paradigm, based on her zoo.)

What they have is a contempt for certain expressions of attachment (hmm...does this remind you of anything?).
I've seen people theorize that the Diamonds are based on the Four Bodily Humours (YD=choleric, BD=Melancholic, PD=sanguine, WD=phlegmatic) While we've seen the Diamonds be emotional, that is how they behave in private. Which is very different than how they present themselves to Gem society. Remember how Peridot thought Yellow Diamond was the efficient, rational decider in the galaxy? And how she disdained the Crystal Gems because their decision-making was clouded by emotions (while getting pretty emotional herself)?

It's okay for Topaz and Topaz to fuse. But it is not okay for them to form strong feeling towards each other and public talk about them because that would be "sentimental". The Famethyst have to keep their natural fun-loving personalities under wraps when Holly Blue is around.
  #281  
Old 06-08-2017, 01:32 AM
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Remember how Peridot thought Yellow Diamond was the efficient, rational decider in the galaxy? And how she disdained the Crystal Gems because their decision-making was clouded by emotions (while getting pretty emotional herself)?
And most human societies also value their leaders making rational decisions, rather than letting their emotions guide them. But nobody would claim that we disdain emotions.

We have never seen a gem who could be described as 'emotionless', even as their public face - the closest is Lapis, who has something of a flat affect, but that's more indicative of depression*. Even ignoring the Crystal Gems and Off Colors, who actively break Gem societal expectations, a few notable examples: Peridot is seriously histrionic. Holly Blue Agate is performatively happy in her public-facing persona. Pearls in general have an overweening smugness, when dealing with beings who rank lower than their owners.

* Clinical, exacerbated by situational, I would say.

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If Pearl wasn't Rose's Pearl, then you have to answer two questions: Who did Pearl belong to? How did Rose and Pearl get so close if Pearl's owner wasn't Rose?
1) Who knows? Pink Diamond's is likely, since Rose was part of Pink Diamond's entourage until she rebelled.
2) The same way Garnet, Amethyst, Bismuth, etc got so close to her. They met, and Rose showed her she could be something other than A Pearl.
  #282  
Old 06-08-2017, 05:26 AM
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Also, it occurs to me that calling the Diamonds' behaviour at the trial of a major traitor their 'private' behaviour is...really pushing the definition thereof.
  #283  
Old 06-08-2017, 07:18 AM
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Also, it occurs to me that calling the Diamonds' behaviour at the trial of a major traitor their 'private' behaviour is...really pushing the definition thereof.
Why not? It's not like it was open to the public or being broadcast. The only witnesses were Steven (slated to be executed), Lars (human so doesn't count), the Pearls (also don't count), and the Zircons (poofed and presumably destroyed).
  #284  
Old 06-08-2017, 08:33 AM
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Originally Posted by bmoak View Post
... Rose absolutely was using it as a term of endearment, but that doesn't mean she wasn't using it literally. ...

...If Pearl wasn't Rose's Pearl, then you have to answer two questions: ....
It doesn't mean that she wasn't using it literally ... and it doesn't mean she was. It would be a twist to our perceptions though if she was. We do not "know" she was "Rose's Pearl."

If Pearl wasn't Rose's Pearl, then yes, we have to answer some questions. We'd be missing her origin story. Heck, given that our understanding of Rose is that she would not want to own a Pearl, if Pearl was Rose's Pearl it still begs to have the story of how that happened to be told.

Which was what motivated my speculation riff. We don't have big questions any more about Amethyst's or Garnet's histories but we do about Pearl's. Is that lack significant? Is that a hole which will be filled and when it does plays a role in providing answers to the bigger arcs of the show? Or is it just a hole?

As to emotions and gems. FWIW my take is that the yes the Diamonds in particular seem to embody characteristics including emotions, which is to say they are them in the abstract. (I don't think the humoral mapping quite follows one to one but YD being yellow bile/choleric/fire certainly fits - quick tempered, irritable - in Greek medicine powers consumption and digestion and causes jealousy.) Their discomfort is both in dealing with them in the specific interpersonal and in dealing with emotions that are not exactly what their abstract category classifies them as and what their caste position states they should have.

Returning to what the Diamonds each embody ... if PD is Sanguine then she is both hopeful and bloody. Warm and attracting. Outgoing and sociable. So while the bloody might fit with her prosecuting the war the rest of her abstract nature does not fit with her being a destroyer, a consumer of planets. That's YD territory.

I'm still in the trying to work with BD's obvious strong emotional connection to PD, YD's being the embodiment of jealously and anger, and the lack of seeing WD but supposedly representing perfection (or by the humor mapping, the pure, the expulsive force getting rid of waste, associated with passivity and sentimentality). Those characteristics and maybe even dealing with aspects interpersonally that fall outside of them, seem like they should play into how the story evolves.
  #285  
Old 06-09-2017, 09:23 PM
bmoak bmoak is online now
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It doesn't mean that she wasn't using it literally ... and it doesn't mean she was. It would be a twist to our perceptions though if she was. We do not "know" she was "Rose's Pearl."

If Pearl wasn't Rose's Pearl, then yes, we have to answer some questions. We'd be missing her origin story. Heck, given that our understanding of Rose is that she would not want to own a Pearl, if Pearl was Rose's Pearl it still begs to have the story of how that happened to be told.

Which was what motivated my speculation riff. We don't have big questions any more about Amethyst's or Garnet's histories but we do about Pearl's. Is that lack significant? Is that a hole which will be filled and when it does plays a role in providing answers to the bigger arcs of the show? Or is it just a hole?
I had actually thought you were asking when Pearl joined the Rebellion, which he have seen. Her backstory is a different matter. I wasn't sure if it would end up being addressed in the show, but after "Adventures in Lighstpeed Distortion", I'm pretty sure that Pearl's story will be a significant plot point. "Back when I served....Homeworld" is just too loaded of a statement to drop and not explore later.
  #286  
Old 06-09-2017, 09:40 PM
Spice Weasel Spice Weasel is offline
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We just finished Season 3, and... holy shit, what do you mean Season 4 isn't on Hulu???!!!
  #287  
Old 06-09-2017, 11:57 PM
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We have never seen a gem who could be described as 'emotionless', even as their public face - the closest is Lapis, who has something of a flat affect, but that's more indicative of depression*. Even ignoring the Crystal Gems and Off Colors, who actively break Gem societal expectations, a few notable examples: Peridot is seriously histrionic. Holly Blue Agate is performatively happy in her public-facing persona. Pearls in general have an overweening smugness, when dealing with beings who rank lower than their owners.
I don't think I ever said Gems were supposed to be emotionless. They aren't robots or Vulcans. We've certainly seen enough Homeworld Gems get emotional, even if it is mostly negative emotions they're displaying. Rather than saying Homeworld disdains emotions, I should have said that Homeworld disdains certain emotions, namely compassion and empathy, and Rose was engineered that she would need those emotions to use her powers.
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Old 06-10-2017, 12:16 AM
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It could be nothing, but I thought the the insistence that it had to be CG Rose Quartz because all the other Rose Quartzes were bubbled was a little too insistent.

If Season 5 is about the mystery of "Who Killed Pink Diamond?", then views should expect mystery tropes, and the seemingly airtight alibi that ends up being not-so-airtight-after-all is a common one.
  #289  
Old 06-11-2017, 12:40 AM
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In "The Answer", when Garnet is narrating the story, she refers to "Rose Quartz and her terrifying, renegade Pearl", so that's a second time Pearl is referred to as Rose's Pearl.
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Old 06-11-2017, 04:28 AM
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After the rebellion.

Again...assuming Pearl was Rose's Pearl is assuming that Rose is either a complete and total idiot, or she was actively trying to get Pearl killed when she told her she could return to Homeworld.

Because there's no way Rose, if she wasn't thick as pig shit, could possibly think that the Homeworld Gems would accept her Pearl returning to Homeworld with open arms, instead of either punishing her in her stead, or assuming she was sent by Rose to infiltrate.

'You should go back to Homeworld' is equivalent to 'go die horribly', for any Pearl that she owned.
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Old 06-11-2017, 07:48 AM
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In "The Answer", when Garnet is narrating the story, she refers to "Rose Quartz and her terrifying, renegade Pearl", so that's a second time Pearl is referred to as Rose's Pearl.
The "her" there is not too meaningful to me, and to me does not imply the Rose-Pearl owner-property relationship. The "renegade" OTOH is more meaningful. To me the implication is consistent with Pearl's having had served on and directly for Homeworld. Something then brought her to the point of swearing fealty (and love) for Rose.

Again, there is a story that has not been told of how Pearl went from that Homeworld service to becoming one of Roses's (note the possessive here) most trusted and fearsome renegades. And PD's missing Pearl's story is something hinted at. And we've yet to meet either WD or the Pearl we'd assume she would own. And CG Pearl can holoproject. And we now have reason to doubt that Rose shattered PD. Do any of these fit together? Which ones are misdirection?
  #292  
Old 06-18-2017, 08:50 AM
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The "her" there is not too meaningful to me, and to me does not imply the Rose-Pearl owner-property relationship. The "renegade" OTOH is more meaningful. To me the implication is consistent with Pearl's having had served on and directly for Homeworld. Something then brought her to the point of swearing fealty (and love) for Rose.
I always thought that the "renegade" in that phrase was linked to "terrifying". Joining the rebellion isn't what made Pearl a "terrifying renegade". She's just a Pearl, so what is she going to do but stand around and hold things? What makes Pearl a terrifying renegade is that she trained herself to be a deadly warrior who can take out Quartzes with ease.
  #293  
Old 06-18-2017, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kamino Neko View Post
After the rebellion.

Again...assuming Pearl was Rose's Pearl is assuming that Rose is either a complete and total idiot, or she was actively trying to get Pearl killed when she told her she could return to Homeworld.

Because there's no way Rose, if she wasn't thick as pig shit, could possibly think that the Homeworld Gems would accept her Pearl returning to Homeworld with open arms, instead of either punishing her in her stead, or assuming she was sent by Rose to infiltrate.

'You should go back to Homeworld' is equivalent to 'go die horribly', for any Pearl that she owned.
Well, I guess Rose could have been offering a Hobson's Choice that Pearl was too besotted to notice. Or she could have been planning an "accident" for Pearl if she gave the wrong answer. Rose was literally putting her life in Pearl's hands there.

But what is Rose saying when she tells Pearl "You should go back to Homeworld"? Pearls don't go anywhere unless they are with their owners. If Pearls' owner was on Homeworld, what was Pearl doing on Earth with Rose? And if Pearl's owner was on Earth, then why would Pearl need to go to Homeworld?

I also think you're extrapolating a bit in regard to how Homeworld would treat a defecting Pearl. I absolutely disagree with your assertion that a defecting Pearl would be expected to bring Rose Quartz' shards back to Homeworld or face the same fate herself. Homeworld would never condone a Pearl shattering her owner, no matter what the owner's crimes were, as giving Pearls the idea that they can violently turn on their owner is something is not something wants to encourage.
  #294  
Old 06-20-2017, 07:12 PM
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Going to revisit what we know about the timeline of the Crystal Gems and the rebellion. I'm not going to try to pin down the dates, a) because I would have to rewatch the episodes and b) because I'm not sure if the episodes are entirely clear/accurate on dates.

1) Rose Quartz decides to rebel against Homeworld and Pearl joins her ("Rose's Scabbard"). It's unclear if they immediately take to hills and start guerilla attacks or if Rose and Pearl still pretend loyalty to Homeworld while laying the groundwork for the rebellion (setting up secret bases, recruiting, etc.)

2) Rose Quartz and the Crystal Gems launch small attacks and raids on Gem sites on Earth ("The Answer"). The events in the answer take place a significant amount of time after 1), as Pearl has transformed herself into a deadly swordfighter by this time. The Crystal Gems have been active for some time, perhaps even decades, but are still considered enough of a small-scale threat that Homeworld sends a "diplomatic mission" to investigate the matter.

-Sometime between 1) and 2), Pink Diamond bubbled all the other Rose Quartzes ("That Will Be All", "The Trial")

3) The Crystal Gems have their first significant victory in a major battle at the Strawberry Battlefield ("Serious Steven"). This is probably the battle that cemented the rebellion as a significant threat to the Earth Colony. Bismuth disappears during or just after this battle ("Bismuth").

-Sometime between 2) and 3), (probably closer to 3))Lapis Lazuli is poofed by Bismuth and then is placed in the mirror ("Same Old World")

4) Pink Diamond is shattered by Rose Quartz. Details subject to change ("Back to the Moon").

5) The Diamond Authority decides to abandon the Earth Colony and unleash the corruption wave ("Monster Reunion").

-Sometime between 4) and 5), The Diamond Authority secretly implants the Cluster.

Did I forget anything? Does this make sense?
  #295  
Old 07-18-2017, 03:04 PM
Johnny Ecks Johnny Ecks is offline
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"Steven Universe: Art and Origins" has been released. I picked up a copy. I've only skimmed it so far, but it's quite interesting.
First, the show has such well done continuity and foreshadowing, I figured that Rebecka Sugar had the whole thing mapped out beforehand; The book makes it clear that the whole concept was in quite a bit of flux before writing began in earnest. An early draft, for example, had the gems sent by a goddess in ancient times to protect humans; in the present day they learn that the gem monsters they fight are sent by their creator because she decided to destroy humanity. Another draft had the gems disguising themselves as humans and keeping their existence secret- ultimately, it was probably less distracting to write a show where the humans are bizarrely indifferent than one where maintaining the secret is a major ongoing plot.
  #296  
Old 07-19-2017, 11:23 PM
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And the book has apparently caused quite the sh*tstorm on the internet.
  #297  
Old 10-19-2017, 11:16 PM
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Well, the longest ever Steven Universe hiatus continues unabated (Thanks, Cartoon Network!), but there might be light at the end of the tunnel! CN has revealed that the next episode is titled "Dewey Wins" and will air "sometime this winter", which is likely to be Feburary 2018 knowing CN. Preview clip is here.

Last edited by bmoak; 10-19-2017 at 11:16 PM.
  #298  
Old 10-30-2017, 06:20 PM
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ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness is offline
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Woo-hoo!! Steven Universe is finally coming back November 10!!!
...
...
on the Cartoon Network app only...
...
Press release says broadcast on the actual network "beginning in December".
Wouldn't want to have to interrupt the Teen Titans Go reruns....
  #299  
Old 10-30-2017, 11:22 PM
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I swear that Steven Universe is going to end up like Legend of Korra, with Nick pulling the show from broadcast and putting up the last season only on app and website.
  #300  
Old 11-19-2017, 11:52 PM
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Well, Cartoon Network aired the next six episodes of Steven Universe......exclusively on the CN App and On-Demand. They might air sometime on the network itself next month, and these are reportedly the last episodes for the next six months. The episodes are: Dewey Wins, Raising the Barn, Gemcation, Back to the Kindergarten, Sadie Killer, and Kevin Party. These are unlinked, one-off (mostly) Beach City episodes, but these eps actually contain significant changes to the status quo in Beach City (Nanafua replaces Mayor Dewey, Sadie quits her job at the Big Donut, Lapis leaves Earth, and Steven and Connie have their first falling out.)
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