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Old 12-30-2019, 08:17 PM
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the first time I tried pot I was 13 and my physical problems were bothering me mom and stepdad bpot smoked daily ....stepdad handed me a loaded pipe and said "try this" and i did and finished it and when I woke up a few hours later id felt better than I did in a month

But I only smoked moderately because i lived around people who had to smoke 3 bowls to get up in the morning and decided i didn't want to be that type of person.. although my vice was drinking .... i found out i have a dangerously high tolerance for booze........
  #52  
Old 12-30-2019, 08:23 PM
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Actually, that poll doesn't cover what I said. I said adults below age 70. But I can't find a poll or survey to support my 70%. But we do know there is an age point were people who used pot drops a lot. So maybe we can compromise and say it is closer to 60%?
Sounds reasonable to me.

For the OP: I can't really add anything beyond the advice already given in this thread. Teenagers do experiment -- even good kids from good families -- and they often try to hide this fact from their parents, who worry an awful lot about their kids. I suspect it's hard to realize this at this moment, but all that this means is that your family is typical, even normal.
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Old 12-30-2019, 08:25 PM
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(Edited to add something I think you need to hear: you're a good mom. You really are.)
Well, she was a good Mom.
Up until she was "done with" her sons because they smoked a little pot.

I agree that counseling would be a good idea.

Look back at the OP. The title is about your sons, but nearly every sentence there begins with "I".
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Old 12-30-2019, 08:35 PM
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Well, Tim, I’m using “I” because “I” am the one posting on a message board with “my” feelings, “my” conflict with the situation. Stands to reason to use “I,” no? Reading thru the thread you can see my kids feelings’ on the subject are addressed. ��

Last edited by Declanium; 12-30-2019 at 08:36 PM.
  #55  
Old 12-30-2019, 08:40 PM
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I have a friend. When her daughter was in high school she was damn-near perfect. Straight A student at the governor's school. Ballet dancer. Beautiful. Confident. She got a full scholarship to an excellent university, where she did very well.

Fast forward to today. She's in her late 20s. Unemployed. Alcoholic. Credit card thief. Self-absorbed and hateful. Attracted to the very worst men. I suspect all the drinking has fucked up her brain...
I think of adolescent deviance like a pressure cooker; better to let off a little steam or it might explode one day.

Iím a prime example. I never went out, never drank or did drugs, honors student, a total homebody...I didnít even try alcohol until my 21st birthday.

But I was so drunk that I donít remember that birthday. And it led me on a multi year effort to ďmake up for lost timeĒ by trying any drug I could get my hands on before I finally settled into a crack cocaine habit. (I got better )

So Iíd much rather a kid act out in their teenage years than suppress their urges and try to be a perfect kid.

Having said that, I do think that there is an important role for the parent to play. Itís ok to tell your kids that some activities arenít appropriate at their age. I personally suspect that kids growing up want and crave boundaries even as they instinctively try to push them. The alternative - parents who just donít care what time you come home or what you do - put enormous stress on the kids and arenít doing them any favors.

So the OP should, in my opinion, explain to her kids that their bodies are in a time of great change, and that this is also occurring internally, including in their brains, and that weed at that age is counterproductive. And, of course, smoke in your lungs is unhealthy. And bootleg vapes have caused people to get really sick. And you need to show respect to your parents, who, after all, are paying the bills. And other such reasonable reasons that weed is not allowed.

But I hope she doesnít think that this means her kids are anything but typical kids, and react accordingly.
  #56  
Old 12-30-2019, 09:40 PM
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When I was a very young woman my mother accused me of being a lesbian and using my sexuality as a way to "get back" at her for something. It was at that point I realized she'd been saying things like this since I was in junior high. If I did something she disapproved, or if my opinion of something was drastically opposed to hers it was always "why are you doing this? why do you hate me? do you want my friends to know this about you?"

And I realized what a controlling and self-centered woman my mother was. None of this was about her or about how she raised me, it was about ME living my life through things I'd learned. She couldn't handle that she hadn't created a little automaton to parrot whatever she'd programmed into me and she spent the rest of her life trying to make me feel guilty for having my own identity.

Fine, be pissed at your kids for using pot before they're legally allowed by law, ground them, lecture them, whatever. But stop making this about YOU and YOUR LIFE and YOUR DREAMS and YOUR MORALS because guess what, ain't none of this about you...except for whatever common sense you've instilled in them. IF you've instilled anything other than guilt and resentment by now, I mean. I'm serious here, you are just like my mother.

Last edited by Fiveroptic; 12-30-2019 at 09:41 PM.
  #57  
Old 12-31-2019, 12:53 AM
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Exactly. Exactly this. I quit my career to stay at home and gave them all I could. Reading books, crafts, all that. And I guess you nailed it. I feel betrayed.
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Originally Posted by Fiveroptic
Fine, be pissed at your kids for using pot before they're legally allowed by law, ground them, lecture them, whatever. But stop making this about YOU and YOUR LIFE and YOUR DREAMS and YOUR MORALS because guess what, ain't none of this about you...
This is the part I'm wondering about. OP, you're entitled to feel angry at your kids for this, and part of the shit you're taking is just because of unrealistic sentimental cultural expectations about how mothers are supposed to love. But that's not the whole story here.

AFAICT, your sons' misbehavior isn't really a "betrayal" because there is no agreement that they signed onto that they can betray. That agreement seems to exist only in your own head, in the form of some unspoken bargain with fate.

On some level, do you feel that you made some kind of "deal" that you would sacrifice your career and devote yourself to nurturing your kids, and in return for your sacrifice, your kids would turn out fine and not disappoint you and make it all worthwhile? Because if so, I regret to have to inform you that that contract isn't worth the imaginary paper it's written on.

Mind you, AFAICT your kids do seem to be fine and non-disappointing in many respects, and it well may be that the pot thing will turn out to be just a temporary youthful rebellion and nothing to worry about. But I think what's freaking you out might be the realization that your sacrifice didn't actually guarantee that you'd have nothing to worry about.

You were offering up part of your life and personal fulfillment in an attempt to secure the safety and well-being of your sons, and you are now realizing that that imaginary deal is not to be depended on, and so you're feeling betrayed. But it wasn't your sons who made that deal with you. Nobody actually made that deal with you.
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Old 12-31-2019, 01:44 AM
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Declanium, I'm not sure why you're getting such shit here, either, except that people tend to respond based on their own views and experiences (adolescent and adult).

You're seeing your sons' use of weed as basically an "F--- YOU!" after all your cautioning. I mean, you told them. Why would they ignore you and use cannabis if they weren't, in essence, flipping you off? The answer is because their experience of the world can't be filtered through your teaching. It's not that they've scoffed at what you've said; odds are they haven't. It's that they have to start questioning. It's an important part of the maturation and separation they need to become independent.

So here they are, bored teens (Because teens in general tend to be bored and feel they're missing out. I always think of Springsteen's "There's something happening somewhere/baby, I just know that there is.") Their friends are smoking and vaping and truly having a great time. There's an assumption of invulnerability because their frontal cortex is under construction. There's a natural attraction to thrill-seeking: bungee-jumping, crazy amusement park rides, etc. And yes, there's peer pressure. During adolescence, kids start switching their primary allegiance from their parents to their peers.

This really is a good opportunity for you and for them. Tell them how you're feeling. Tell them you feel betrayed. Listen to them without judgment (the hard part) so you can learn. This is the difference between childhood and adolescence: in childhood, kids don't understand the world and rely on parents as their guides; in adolescence, kids think they understand the world and recognize their parents, having been raised in a different time, don't understand it--or them--in the same way they do.

Try to bridge the gap. You won't be sorry.
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Old 12-31-2019, 07:52 AM
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Declanium, I'm not sure why you're getting such shit here, either, except that people tend to respond based on their own views and experiences (adolescent and adult).
The thread title is quite provocative. OP has declared she is completely writing off her children because they disappointed her. That is the emotional reaction of someone who is not much more mature than the teenagers she is condemning. Sorry, but that very much deserves some shit reception.
  #60  
Old 12-31-2019, 08:26 AM
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The thread title is quite provocative. OP has declared she is completely writing off her children because they disappointed her. That is the emotional reaction of someone who is not much more mature than the teenagers she is condemning. Sorry, but that very much deserves some shit reception.
So you’re going to rip OP based on a literal reading of the subject line, then go off and invent your own armchair psychoanalysis to justify why you think you’re entitled to pile shit on? It’s clearly the venting of a frustrated parent, but you’re just adding to the smug condescension as if you’re acting like it’s her fault for not reading through the “How To Be A Parent” manual we all get handed to us which has all the answers for everything.

Last edited by jz78817; 12-31-2019 at 08:26 AM.
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Old 12-31-2019, 08:47 AM
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So youíre going to rip OP based on a literal reading of the subject line,
Yes.

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then go off and invent your own armchair psychoanalysis to justify why you think youíre entitled to pile shit on? Itís clearly the venting of a frustrated parent, but youíre just adding to the smug condescension as if youíre acting like itís her fault for not reading through the ďHow To Be A ParentĒ manual we all get handed to us which has all the answers for everything.
I stand by what I wrote.

I was not addressing you. I wasn't even addressing the OP. I was answering the question, posed several times in this thread, of why people were giving the OP shit.
  #62  
Old 12-31-2019, 09:38 AM
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Your reaction concerns me more than their actions.
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Old 12-31-2019, 09:55 AM
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Iím sorry about your son, Chefguy. And thatís exactly what Iím afraid of. That my sons will also be opioid addicts and will eventually succumb to it. Isnít that a valid concern? I donít get why Iím getting shit for this.
I'm sorry that you are going through this pain, and not getting the support you're looking for.

I'm of two minds about your dilemma. First, the vaping and the weed stuff isn't all jokes and laughs, so your fears are not irrational. Teenagers are putting themselves in the hospital with this stuff. A lot of the posters here are older and may only be superficially aware of how much things have changed. Don't let them make you feel like a hysterical person, because you aren't. Vaping of unregulated substances (including THC and CBD) is an emerging public health problem that is unlike anything we've dealt with before.

But the other part of me says you are taking their actions way too personally, in a way that spells unhealthy relationship dynamics. The sacrifices you've made to take care of them have nothing to do with their decision to vape. They didn't force you to give up your career and the whole nine, right? Hopefully you didn't make these sacrifices expecting them to never disobey you, because that's not how parenting works. If you've been laying on guilt trips, for your own good it needs to stop. Because I guarantee if I were in their position, the last thing that would convince me of my wrongness was hearing my mother focus on how betrayed she felt by me simply exercising self-autonomy (which is how they probably see their own actions). Them vaping has no direct bearing on you.

At this point, you need to try to figure out what it is you want from them so that you can move forward emotionally. Signs of remorsefulness? An apology? A vow to do better? If you don't get these things, what then? I don't know if there's a right or wrong answer here, but having a conversation with yourself about your own expectations might make you feel better.
  #64  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:18 AM
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edit: no, not worth it.

Last edited by jz78817; 12-31-2019 at 10:19 AM.
  #65  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:19 AM
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I'm sorry that you are going through this pain, and not getting the support you're looking for.

I'm of two minds about your dilemma.

1. First, the vaping and the weed stuff isn't all jokes and laughs, so your fears are not irrational. Teenagers are putting themselves in the hospital with this stuff. A lot of the posters here are older and may only be superficially aware of how much things have changed.

2. But the other part of me says you are taking their actions way too personally, in a way that spells unhealthy relationship dynamics. The sacrifices you've made to take care of them have nothing to do with their decision to vape. They didn't force you to give up your career and the whole nine, right?
1. I agree. Lots of older counter-culture type posters here I think not necessarily realizing as you said things aren't necessarily the same, also maybe not comfortable with the idea that marijuana might do permanent harm to young brains, maybe including theirs . The fashionable response ever since their youth (and mine) is 'but drinking is much worse!' but that doesn't really address the issue.

2. I also agree here though I'm sure you agree it's not easy to avoid this kind of feeling as a parent. I sense OP is reacting in the moment (or the short term at least). You also can't tell a person 'you're not allowed to feel anger and alienation toward your kids for disappointing you'. It's just not how most people are wired IME. But you try to work through it.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:21 AM
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Love your sons and talk to them without recrimination about pot. It isn't a gateway drug except in the concept it might put people in contact with dealers that sell harder stuff.
Yeah, that's what bothers me too. Personally, I'd be slightly worried if my 14-year-old was smoking pot, but I'd be VERY worried if I found out he was associating with criminals and other sleazebags. I don't want him on that kind of people's radar.
  #67  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:22 AM
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Vaping of unregulated substances (including THC and CBD) is an emerging public health problem that is unlike anything we've dealt with before.
It's possible to find ways to enjoy marijuana that are quite safe - certainly safer than alcohol, probably safer than driving a car or eating too many cheeseburgers. That being so, I think OPs overreaction is likely to endanger her kids further, because they will feel that they cannot be open with her about their activities. By far the healthiest approach (for both their literal health and the relationship) would be for OP to work with her kids to educate herself and them about where the real potential health risks lie, and to help them feel that they can make autonomous decisions with her support to find safe ways to consume marijuana in moderation if they choose to. Sure, there's a point to lay down stricter boundaries if the kids are running wild and getting in trouble with the cops or doing badly at school, but I saw no indication of that in the OP.

It seems to me that OP's reaction is analogous to freaking out over the prospect of a teenager having sex. Freaking out about it and going into denial is going to put them at greater risk. A mature parent has a frank conversation with their kid about all the issues to help the kid make good autonomous decisions and to be safe.

Last edited by Riemann; 12-31-2019 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:27 AM
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I think the OP is a little freaked out but she's open to counseling and analyzing her reaction, and in a little time can recover and go on. I'd guess she's had the misfortune of having a pair of excellent sons who took a long time to get this first blot on a clean sheet or paper. Of course it looks bad from that perspective, but she'll get over it, and maybe get a better concept of how many kids reach adulthood with many more smudges on their record, yet still become fine adults.

I remember a thread where a mother freaked out because her son watched some pornography I think. I was kind of hard on her, but she didn't sound as reasonable as Declanium does here, and I hope I didn't unintentionally do more harm than good in that thread. Sometimes people need to get shocked into reality, but in this case I think we need to talk Declanium down and support her in getting over this. She sounds so much like a wonderful mom other than this over-reaction which can still be worked out.

Declanium, one way to work out some of your anger and frustration is to hit back in this thread. Get it all out, we can take it.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:29 AM
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Yeah, that's what bothers me too. Personally, I'd be slightly worried if my 14-year-old was smoking pot, but I'd be VERY worried if I found out he was associating with criminals and other sleazebags. I don't want him on that kind of people's radar.
Er, you really don't know how kids get weed do you?
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:44 AM
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Hi. Mom of two twentysomethings here. I spent a lot of time wishing I had sold them to the circus as toddlers like I used to threaten to do.

First, I agree with the others who are saying that other parents' kids are screwing up, too. It's just that parents don't want to admit their little angels are anything but, because they are too worried about you and all the other parents judging THEM

Second, you are perfectly justified in being angry and upset that they are using pot. Laws about medical and recreational use are different everywhere you go and they're underage anyway. I don't have a problem with adults who want to smoke up because they are able to decide if the good effects are worth the risks and deal with the consequences, like if they fail a drug test and get fired. Teens are NOT known for their wonderful decision making skills. I assume one of your house rules is no illicit drug use. If they break a house rule, they get punished.

However, you're going way off the rails here. They didn't smoke pot to spite you. They tried something forbidden and they liked it, same as if they were sneaking beer or looking at porn. Teens do that. They look for new experiences and they want to push boundaries.

They never asked you to give up your career and all to be Mrs. Perfect Mommy into their teens.

This isn't about you. It's all about them. They are at a risky age right now, no longer children but not even close to adulthood. They need guidance and stability. MOst of all, parents they can rely on to love and support them at all times even if you do get angry sometimes or have to punish them. They ARE going to have problems with school or bullying or relationships and stuff like that, and I can guarantee they're going to think "No way I'm going to Mommy Dearest for help. I remember how she just about kicked me to the curb just because I smoked some pot. If I tell her about this, she'll kill me."

And they'll go to other sources for help, and some of them won't be good influences. Plus you'll find out and feel betrayed and wonder why they can't come to you and you'll be right back here whining that they don't appreciate your sacrifices.
  #71  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:45 AM
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2. I also agree here though I'm sure you agree it's not easy to avoid this kind of feeling as a parent. I sense OP is reacting in the moment (or the short term at least). You also can't tell a person 'you're not allowed to feel anger and alienation toward your kids for disappointing you'. It's just not how most people are wired IME. But you try to work through it.
I'm not saying she's allowed to feel anger or disappointment at all. But there is a wrong way and a right way to express these feelings, especially if the goal is to encourage better behaviors (rather than just dumping big hairy emotions at their feet).

Bad way, IMO:

"You betrayed me so much by your actions. Don't you know how much I've done for you? How could you do this [implied: to me], as if everything I've tried instilling in you was for naught!"

Good way, IMO:

"Since learning you've been vaping all year, I've been beside myself with disappointment and worry. It's going to be weighing on me heavily for a while. I'm really concerned that you aren't taking your own health and future seriously. And because of all the hiding and sneaking, it's going to be vert hard to trust you like boys your age should be trusted."

Although both statements address the effect their choices have on her, the former statement is very much "how dare you hurt me" flavored while the latter shows she's ultimately concerned about them not herself.
  #72  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:48 AM
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[...]weíve had all the discussions about drugs and their negative consequences. My husband [...]scheduled a doctors appointment to have a doctor share the medical concerns of weed and vaping on a developing mind. Heís also told them they will have to take random drug tests. But heís watching football with them, interacting with them. I am not there yet. I am so hurt by this that I canít even be around them without being angry. Is this because I had only one job? To raise them well, and I screwed it up? How can I get back to feeling warmth towards them?
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[...]I feel betrayed.
Like they took my advice and said ďscrew you. Hope it hurts.Ē I know that really isnít how it went, but....
They seem to be shocked at how Iím handling this. It led to a big blowout in my house that they were not expecting.
Maybe counseling is in order.
I went through something very similar when I found a little pipe in my son's stuff when he was 16. Every situation is different but keep this in mind:

1. This is not your parenting failure. You did everything right. Children are not little blank slates, they are people that do what they want to do regardless of how they are raised.

2. Your sons are not doing this as a way to hurt you. Please see this as about them.

3. Counseling is in order.

We reacted strongly when we found our son was smoking weed. I had taken a few hits myself in high school, though my wife never had. Weed today more potent then it was for my experience. I was concerned that he might be psychologically dependent on it, and acting as a dealer to his friends. We talked to him about the illegality of weed, and the negative health effects. We had him talk to his doctor about it. We required him to go to some sessions at a local addiction center; he went to group sessions and I got a better sense of proportion when I realized he was talking to heroin addicts, people who stole money to get coke, etc.

So this is definitely something you need to deal with as a family. I think your husband is striking the right balance between addressing it but also keeping the relationship going and communication pipeline open.

In the end remember that at their ages, they will find a way to do what they want to do, so you can just hope to provide the right guidance and influence and hope for the best. Regardless, please try to keep things open.

The one thing we emphasized over and over again with our son is that we wanted him to be honest with us, and in return we would not go ballistic over everything that we didn't like.
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Last edited by CookingWithGas; 12-31-2019 at 10:49 AM.
  #73  
Old 12-31-2019, 10:56 AM
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Yeah, but CookingwithGas, I already went ballistic. Not sure if I can turn around that quickly.
Thank you for sharing your story.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:57 AM
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Iím sorry about your son, Chefguy. And thatís exactly what Iím afraid of. That my sons will also be opioid addicts and will eventually succumb to it. Isnít that a valid concern? I donít get why Iím getting shit for this.
NO to be honest it's not a valid concern. Smoking a little weed when you're a teen is not some slippery slope to opioid abuse and your hysterical over-reaction is likely doing more damage than the cannabis. You're DONE with them? I can't imagine what my 15 year old would have to do for me to declare that I'm done with him and so disappointed I can't even interact with him like a normal family does. Teens smoke weed sometimes. They drink and have sex too. It's hard for us as parents to witness them growing up but this sort of behavior from THEM is completely normal. What your doing is not healthy for anyone involved. I don't mean to bash or insult you but you need to lower your standards a little or your sons will be done with you pretty soon and you'll really be heartbroken.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:59 AM
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It's possible to find ways to enjoy marijuana that are quite safe - certainly safer than alcohol, probably safer than driving a car or eating too many cheeseburgers. That being so, I think OPs overreaction is likely to endanger her kids further, because they will feel that they cannot be open with her about their activities.
There's always safer ways to enjoy any unnecessary vice. That doesn't mean a 15 year old should be smoking marijuana. Without knowing anything about this people, it might be a neutral thing or it might be a bad thing, but unlikely a good thing at this stage in their development. We don't even know if it's legal where they live.

But even if they got their stuff from a high quality dispensary, the house rule is that it shouldn't be used. It would be inappropriate for the parents to now back down from this position just because the rule was flouted. Given this reality, the boys will never be "open" with their parents if they continue to use it. That's an unrealistic expectation.
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Old 12-31-2019, 11:03 AM
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Er, you really don't know how kids get weed do you?
Honestly? No idea. I was incredibly uncool as a teenager - nobody ever even offered me weed.
  #77  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:07 AM
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Er, you really don't know how kids get weed do you?
How do kids get weed?

When I was in high school, I got it by hanging out with criminals and sleazeballs and classmates. Not that there was a difference.
  #78  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:11 AM
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Apparently dealer brings right to street nowadays
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Old 12-31-2019, 11:20 AM
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When I was in high school, I got it by hanging out with criminals and sleazeballs and classmates. Not that there was a difference.
When I was in high school in the early 90s we still used the traditional black market "a guy I know" system.

Then there was that relatively brief time between medical marijuana being legal in many states, but recreational use and sales were still many years away. During that period, you either got yourself an MM card, legitimately or not, or you found someone else who had acquired one, legitimately or not, and just went through them.

Now, depending where you live, you can just go to the store. And a traditional fake ID or an actual adult is all you need (although I don't know whether a fake ID would work; the two recreational stores I've visited, purely out of curiosity mind you , they scanned the data matrix on the back of my driver's license when I walked in the door). But still, any adult can buy the stuff, so I guess kids today are still using the "guy I know" system or are back to hanging out in front of the store with cash and getting someone to buy them something.
  #80  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:26 AM
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We are in NY. Still not legal.
  #81  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:31 AM
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Yeah, but CookingwithGas, I already went ballistic. Not sure if I can turn around that quickly.
...
Actually you can, you can just start with an apology for going ballistic and start a family dialogue that way.

Take it from someone quick to anger and quick to feel sorry for it.
  #82  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:36 AM
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How do kids get weed?

When I was in high school, I got it by hanging out with criminals and sleazeballs and classmates. Not that there was a difference.
It's the same now. An older brother or sister, any friend or classmate, sometimes even parents. It's everywhere. I guess you can call your friends and classmates who become senators and supreme court justices sleazeballs if you want, but it's not the weed that makes them sleazy.
  #83  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:47 AM
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A question for the OP: as a teen, did you ever do anything rebellious? Did you ever break the law or disobey your parents?
  #84  
Old 12-31-2019, 11:52 AM
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I drank for first time in college.
No drugs. Ever. I’m 53 now.
I was very scared of disappointing my parents. They came from Ireland (had never been to college) so I was first generation to reach that point. Wasn’t going to screw it up.

Last edited by Declanium; 12-31-2019 at 11:55 AM.
  #85  
Old 12-31-2019, 12:02 PM
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No drugs. Ever. Iím 53 now.
Is it safe to assume that you were exposed to the height of the D.A.R.E. program and 'just say no'?
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Old 12-31-2019, 12:04 PM
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I do remember the egg crackling in the frying pan “brain on drugs” thing.
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Old 12-31-2019, 12:42 PM
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Declanium, I hope you don't take these responses as "being dumped on". Some are, but most here seem to be concerned that you do the reasonable thing. There's a lot of tough love, but almost everyone here wants you to get through this with your hair still attached.

You'll be okay. Your sons will be okay.

Talking to someone who is objective is a good idea. Apologizing to your sons for flying off the handle is a good idea, with the caveat that they understand that they broke the law in a couple ways and you can't have that. Apologizing will not be showing weakness.

Pot is not as bad as reported by "the authorities" for the last several decades. It really isn't. Look up the history of it's prohibition- I believe it was tied to alcohol prohibition as away to punish minorities, not because it's as harmful as heroin or cocaine. That being said, kids shouldn't be using it anyway.

I'm not saying anything that hasn't really been said here, but hopefully reinforcing the good advice. Most of us here really want you to succeed here. Good luck.

Jumpbass- father of three late teen/ early adult daughters.

Re: smoking vs vaping: I use a vape pen from a reputable dealer, but I'm in CA. My preference is those low dosage gummies. Less crap in my lungs.
  #88  
Old 12-31-2019, 12:55 PM
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When I was 8 years old, I rode my bike across town to visit my friend on his farm. I bragged, "My dad lets me go wherever I want."
He replied, "My dad loves me and doesn't let me go wherever I want." It hit me like a ton of bricks. My freedom was actually my father's indifference.

The point of the story is to let your sons know you care and love them and your position on smoking weed is out of concern. Sure, people like Obama and Elon Musk smoke weed and look how successful they are. They may be the exception not the rule to the effects of using marijuana. Worry less about what your sons think of you now and more of what they will think when they have their own kids.
  #89  
Old 12-31-2019, 12:58 PM
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I do remember the egg crackling in the frying pan ďbrain on drugsĒ thing.
The hardline stance on drugs that kids get is sometimes cited as one of the reasons kids get involved in hard drugs. They try something relatively benign like marijuana or alcohol and find out it's fun without all the dire consequences they were taught in DARE. Then they assume that the adults were lying and all drugs are like that, so they try meth, coke, and heroin thinking those will also be fun without dire consequences.
  #90  
Old 12-31-2019, 01:04 PM
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Is it safe to assume that you were exposed to the height of the D.A.R.E. program and 'just say no'?
Believe it or not, there are a fair number of folks who were never interested in doing drugs, and yet who weren't brainwashed by a government program. People do have different values and experiences, and that doesn't make them any more weird than you are.
  #91  
Old 12-31-2019, 01:07 PM
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If smoking some weed is the worst thing your sons do, consider yourself lucky.

Yes, discourage it the best you can, but they're not spawns of Satan not worthy of your affection. Loosen up a bit.
  #92  
Old 12-31-2019, 01:16 PM
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We required him to go to some sessions at a local addiction center; he went to group sessions and I got a better sense of proportion when I realized he was talking to heroin addicts, people who stole money to get coke, etc.
Having been in some of those rooms, a word of warning: There is a lot of glorifying of past behavior and a tendency to be boastful. It's a fine line when talking about past behavior between nostalgia and regret (a lot of "I was partying my ass off" stories).

A young kid (especially one who is sent there because other people think he has a problem) may get the idea that these harder drugs aren't so bad ('these people are all alive; I guess shooting heroin or snorting coke for years doesn't necessarily kill you') or perhaps a little fun ('this guy was just talking about crazy sex parties').

Last edited by Moriarty; 12-31-2019 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 12-31-2019, 01:23 PM
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I was thinking more of individual/group counseling
Not necessarily a support group
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Old 12-31-2019, 02:20 PM
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I think the counseling thing is a very good idea--there are few people and few families who wouldn't benefit from a few rounds with a good therapist. I look at counseling pretty much like taking my car in for tuneups regularly--it's just good sense to do the preventive maintenance. I think it will benefit you to get to the bottom of why this very normal behavior by your sons hit you so hard and it will benefit them to know that their actions do have an effect on their family members that's real and legitimate--kids have a hard time comprehending that their parents are people with feelings and buttons and trigger points too and I think it's a good thing for everyone to be reminded of that and to learn to consider the human rather than the role when interacting within the family.

You're gonna be okay, you're heading in the right direction with this.
  #95  
Old 12-31-2019, 03:16 PM
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It's the same now. An older brother or sister, any friend or classmate, sometimes even parents. It's everywhere. I guess you can call your friends and classmates who become senators and supreme court justices sleazeballs if you want, but it's not the weed that makes them sleazy.
I don't think any of my classmates ever sank so low as to become a senator. There was a noted dealer who also happened to be the mayor's son. Oddly enough, he never got caught until after his father was no longer mayor.

He once said that since his dad had a tobacco farm, he was just carrying on the family business.
  #96  
Old 12-31-2019, 03:35 PM
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Heh, yeah. My kids are different than me. I smoked weed in my teens, 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, and now 60s. I love it and feel it has enhanced my life. I drink daily. Meanwhile, my daughter will have a glass of wine with dinner, but that's it. My son will have a beer with me to be sociable, and he's tried weed, but didn't like it.
I'm guessing you made weed and booze seem like the uncoolest things in the world, since you're enthusiastic about them, and teenagers never like things their parents like.
  #97  
Old 12-31-2019, 04:01 PM
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Oh, and regarding the dangers of vaping, the research is coming down more and more in favor of Vitamin E acetate being the culprit. I vape for my THC and CBD almost exclusively since I've had a pulmonary embolism and want to protect my lungs from as much as I can. I'm fortunate in that I know processors and can source my concentrates from people I can call up and ask about their manufacturing methods--and Vitamin E acetate is not a factor in any of the processors I patronize. I'm not cavalier about vaping risks, I'm just very certain of my sourcing being okay and safe. Not everyone can say the same so I do hope that the lesson is learned and that including fats in vape cartridges is outlawed. It has no business in cannabis vaping, that's for sure, because proper processing yields a product that vapes perfectly and the only reason to include something like Vitamin E would be to increase profit margins and that's not cool.
  #98  
Old 12-31-2019, 04:42 PM
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The thread title is quite provocative. OP has declared she is completely writing off her children because they disappointed her. That is the emotional reaction of someone who is not much more mature than the teenagers she is condemning. Sorry, but that very much deserves some shit reception.
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Originally Posted by DCnDC View Post
Yes.



I stand by what I wrote.

I was not addressing you. I wasn't even addressing the OP. I was answering the question, posed several times in this thread, of why people were giving the OP shit.
Since you quoted me, I'm assuming you were addressing this to me, so I'll respond. The reactions of distressed adults are sometimes expressed in exaggerations:

Do that again and I'll divorce you before you can draw your next breath!
I'm never going to talk to you again!
You are not allowed to even touch my car after this!

Maybe and for whatever reason, you view everyone who reacts this way in times of deep distress as "immature." But your reaction says more about you than it does about the OP, whose dilemma isn't resolved by responses like yours.
  #99  
Old 12-31-2019, 05:40 PM
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I'm not saying she's allowed to feel anger or disappointment at all. But there is a wrong way and a right way to express these feelings, especially if the goal is to encourage better behaviors (rather than just dumping big hairy emotions at their feet).

Bad way, IMO:

"You betrayed me so much by your actions. Don't you know how much I've done for you? How could you do this [implied: to me], as if everything I've tried instilling in you was for naught!"

Good way, IMO:

"Since learning you've been vaping all year, I've been beside myself with disappointment and worry. It's going to be weighing on me heavily for a while. I'm really concerned that you aren't taking your own health and future seriously. And because of all the hiding and sneaking, it's going to be vert hard to trust you like boys your age should be trusted."

Although both statements address the effect their choices have on her, the former statement is very much "how dare you hurt me" flavored while the latter shows she's ultimately concerned about them not herself.
Basically agree, but one of those things that can be easier to say than do is all. Though you're surely right that I'd weaken my position as parent generally by *saying* things that made it all about me, 'look what you've done to me!'. That's not a good tactic to the degree it can be avoided, I agree.

I'm thinking more of how one feels inside (or might vent anonymously on the internet ) as a parent about disappointments by kids, hurt, IME. Who is *really* 100% in their heart of hearts, 'I care nothing for myself, it's all about you kids'. Not me, unfortunately, if I'm totally honest. And I guess a lot of people would also say I/wife were 'freaking out', 'off the rails', 'overreacting' etc about various things that disappointed, and disappoint, us about our kids. We know they're basically great and we shouldn't complain (and we're long past the point we ever complain to them about them, sugar coated or not, they are in 20's-30's now). But it's not always easy to reconcile sky high expectations even with a good reality. And back to OP as you seem to generally agree in contrast to many other posters, pot smoking/vaping by minor teenagers really isn't OK, OP not IMO overreacting to be quite upset about it. Though it's not the extreme 0.1% worst outcome either obviously, and again you're right (and others have said) you can also make it worse by handling it wrong.

Last edited by Corry El; 12-31-2019 at 05:42 PM.
  #100  
Old 12-31-2019, 06:07 PM
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Exactly. Exactly this. I quit my career to stay at home and gave them all I could. Reading books, crafts, all that. And I guess you nailed it. I feel betrayed.
The message you're sending is that nurturing and caring is a transaction that you use to get control. Imagine how these kids feel. Your love is only real if it comes with control, and in 1-3 years you won't have any control because they'll be be adults. So they're already letting go of you.

I don't know exactly what to tell you except if you want to continue having any influence in their lives, first make it clear that your love doesn't depend on whether you control them. Make it clear that the kindness you show isn't predicated on control. As long as you make this seem like a transaction, their response will be to game it.
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