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Old 01-03-2020, 07:48 AM
phantom lamb is offline
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Who/what kind of person will succeed Trump as leader of GOP?


I apologize if this type of thread has already floated around.

I'm curious as to where the GOP is headed post-Trump - I don't see another Romney or McCain leading the party anytime soon.

The only person that comes to mind, as unsettling as it sounds, is Donald Trump Jr.

Who do you think will be the face of the party 4 years from now?
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Old 01-03-2020, 07:54 AM
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No love for Ivanka?
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Old 01-03-2020, 07:55 AM
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Well people thought it could not get worse than Bush II.
It obviously could.

So by that standard, an actual Klansman?
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Old 01-03-2020, 07:56 AM
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Well people thought it could not get worse than Bush II.
It obviously could.

So by that standard, an actual Klansman?
David Duke is still around
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Old 01-03-2020, 09:53 AM
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And this is part of the problem with the GOP turning into a party of Trump sycophants: When all you do is kiss the Big Man's arse, no one can imagine you becoming the Big Man yourself. Is there anyone in the current GOP leadership you could see taking over from Trump?

It will be someone none of us expect.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:05 AM
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I think Ted Nugent has a shot. He has plenty of media appearances. He says stupid, hateful and violent things. He's ludicrously unqualified. He's very pro-Trump. All characteristics that the current Republican supporters seem to love.

I wish I was kidding.

Last edited by BeepKillBeep; 01-03-2020 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:08 AM
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This is a fascinating question. And while I understand the reluctance of many conservative dopers to post and risk anti-Donald pushback, this would appear to be a relatively safer subject for them to discuss. After Trump, where do you want/see the party going? And behind whom?

As a libbie, I have no idea. I thought the reactionary wing of the GOP was dead after the 2012 autopsy was performed by the pros in the Republican Party. I was pretty wrong about that.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:24 AM
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Could we spend a moment defining what "after Trump" means? The premise that there is a GOP independent of the Trump party is not a sure thing. Yes, at some point in the future Trump will not be in the White House, but he will likely demand that he remain the leader of the party. Who will be able to stand up to him and tell him "No, that's not how it works!" How has that worked out so far?
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:31 AM
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Could we spend a moment defining what "after Trump" means? The premise that there is a GOP independent of the Trump party is not a sure thing. Yes, at some point in the future Trump will not be in the White House, but he will likely demand that he remain the leader of the party. Who will be able to stand up to him and tell him "No, that's not how it works!" How has that worked out so far?
I'm going with the assumptions that

A. Trump, a 73 year-old, will not live forever
B. The US will remain for all intents and purposes a two-party country, one of which is not the Democratic Party

Granted assumption B is less certain, but I guess needs to be assumed for the sake of the OP

Last edited by phantom lamb; 01-03-2020 at 10:32 AM.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:43 AM
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It'll probably be a younger, more competent version of Trump. Someone like Tom Cotton, who can push most of the same buttons Trump did, but doesn't Tweet like a teenager and has a much better grasp of domestic/international politics.
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Old 01-03-2020, 11:11 AM
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It'll probably be a younger, more competent version of Trump. Someone like Tom Cotton, who can push most of the same buttons Trump did, but doesn't Tweet like a teenager and has a much better grasp of domestic/international politics.
I had said the same thing about him back in 2016. He's a more conventional Republican candidate type (Right Wing, Military background, not looney-tunes).
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Old 01-03-2020, 11:31 AM
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I've said it before. I'll say it again. There's clearly only one person with the necessary skill set to be Donald Trump's successor.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:03 PM
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The real question becomes not 'how will succeed Trump' but rather 'will the Republican party continue to succeed with Trump'?

If the success continues they'll find another demogogue who uses roughly the same playbook.

If in 2020 they get their ass handed to them for a second straight election cycle there'll be attempts to find a leader who pulls back on the demogoguery. A return to a more pro-business, less crazy approach.

The problem with the second scenario is that the existing party has set up their electorate/primary system in such a way that the craziest among them control who makes the ballot and, if there's a sea change and the Trump brand becomes a negative, then they could be looking at some real time in the wilderness.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:23 PM
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Republicans got their asses pretty much handed to them in 2012 and party leaders recommended a more welcoming attitude towards minorities of all kinds (but particularly Hispanic voters). Donald Trump pounded that seemingly sensible idea into dust, played instead to old timey conservative grievances, won the White House by the narrowest of margins and is favored to win again, even after anyone undecided about him in 2016 has had four full years to wash away any previous doubts about his character.

I keep thinking that changing demographics doom reactionary conservatism but they keep drumming up just enough fear about the rise of "domestic socialism" to remain a continuing force in U.S. politics. Maybe we haven't seen anything yet; the GOP still controls the presidency and the Senate. It may take the loss of both before we see everything about Republican democratic ideals stripped bare for all to fear.

Yeah, Tom Cotton. He really could be the guy. He's as smart as he is mean. They'll need someone much smarter than the Don to fight the upcoming battles about how we improve and organize our elections.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:36 PM
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It'll probably be a younger, more competent version of Trump. Someone like Tom Cotton, who can push most of the same buttons Trump did, but doesn't Tweet like a teenager and has a much better grasp of domestic/international politics.
Yup. I don't know who Tom Cotton is personally but the next leader of the GOP will have the same hatred for democracy and love for white supremacy that Trump does, but he won't be incompetent the way Trump is.

Basically a more dangerous version of Trump. Also take into account that when this GOP person becomes president in 2028 or so, the courts will have been stacked with GOP yes men due to McConnell stacking the appellate courts.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:38 PM
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Republicans got their asses pretty much handed to them in 2012 and party leaders recommended a more welcoming attitude towards minorities of all kinds (but particularly Hispanic voters). Donald Trump pounded that seemingly sensible idea into dust, played instead to old timey conservative grievances, won the White House by the narrowest of margins and is favored to win again, even after anyone undecided about him in 2016 has had four full years to wash away any previous doubts about his character.

I keep thinking that changing demographics doom reactionary conservatism but they keep drumming up just enough fear about the rise of "domestic socialism" to remain a continuing force in U.S. politics. Maybe we haven't seen anything yet; the GOP still controls the presidency and the Senate. It may take the loss of both before we see everything about Republican democratic ideals stripped bare for all to fear.

Yeah, Tom Cotton. He really could be the guy. He's as smart as he is mean. They'll need someone much smarter than the Don to fight the upcoming battles about how we improve and organize our elections.
The problem with changing demographics is that they are all concentrated in areas that are already blue.

In 2004 the democrat won California by about 1.2 million votes. In 2016 the democrat won by over 4 million votes. Those extra votes don't mean anything since the state is already blue.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:39 PM
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The real question becomes not 'how will succeed Trump' but rather 'will the Republican party continue to succeed with Trump'?

If the success continues they'll find another demogogue who uses roughly the same playbook.

If in 2020 they get their ass handed to them for a second straight election cycle there'll be attempts to find a leader who pulls back on the demogoguery. A return to a more pro-business, less crazy approach.

The problem with the second scenario is that the existing party has set up their electorate/primary system in such a way that the craziest among them control who makes the ballot and, if there's a sea change and the Trump brand becomes a negative, then they could be looking at some real time in the wilderness.
I think it very unlikely they're going to wrecked in this upcoming election. I predict the presidential election, regardless of winner, to be razor thin again. The margins will be small. They will probably be even smaller than the last election, which from a statistical point of view was almost a tie. Trump still has 40 something percent approval rating. It is madness. How can it not be zero??? Who is still supporting this guy? How? I don't get it. But it doesn't matter, the fact is he has enough support to make the election close, win or lose. The GOP will do fine in the Senate. They might lose some seats in Congress.

I think the Republicans will replace Trump with another Trump. I think they're very concerned that if the put up a normal Republican, they'll be accused by their own base as selling out on the Trump ideals. I really honestly believe that Ted Nugent (who has indicated he might want to run before) will run. And I think he has a an actual chance (albeit very small). He checks all the boxes:

1 - Very pro-gun
2 - Very anti-abortion
3 - Hates immigrants
4 - Violent rhetoric
5 - Will piss off the libtards

I don't the Republicans have the guts to run a non-Trumpian figure now. They are the party of Trump, and they will be until they get wrecked in an election. The only people that can stop the decline of the Republican party are Republican voters. Good luck getting them to vote country over party.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:48 PM
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So the two main predictions are

1. Someone like Trump but smarter, less crazy (Tom Cotton)
2. Someone like Trump but even more unhinged/ridiculous (Ted Nugent)

Dwelling on this a bit, I think it could realistically go either way. However, I'm thinking that it would be someone who sets off the highest amount of "librul tears" so I'm guessing option 2.
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Old 01-03-2020, 12:52 PM
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I believe Lindsay Graham is maneuvering for the post-Trump position.
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Old 01-03-2020, 01:20 PM
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If Trump loses in 2020, which I don't really see happening, it will depend on the narrative / perception that prevails of why he lost. Too extreme? Not extreme enough? Whoever wins that fight, gets to define their next candidate.

If Trumps wins in 2020, the 2024 elections will be more interesting. I expect it'll depend on the state of the economy. If it's still doing well, the recipe will likely be more of the same.
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Old 01-03-2020, 02:00 PM
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The problem with changing demographics is that they are all concentrated in areas that are already blue.

In 2004 the democrat won California by about 1.2 million votes. In 2016 the democrat won by over 4 million votes. Those extra votes don't mean anything since the state is already blue.
Yes that is true and I think it means we might see a lot more of a Dem winning the popular vote but losing in the EC.
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Old 01-03-2020, 02:48 PM
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I think a couple of us are oversimplifying demographic changes a little. It's not just about California. The rising generations of voters are overwhelmingly liberal and they're not restricted to the west coast. Growth in Atlanta and other southern cities is making southern states less and less red with almost every election. Hispanics are growing as a percentage of the population all across the south, not just Texas.

Yes, demographics ain't destiny. Hispanics could veer right in ensuing generations, for example. But for the immediate decade to come, Republicans are up against it when it comes to demographics and it will bring out the very worst in them. Democracy isn't having a great decade as it is and the GOP is perfectly happy to stoke the idea that "anything goes if it is for a worthy cause."
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Old 01-03-2020, 03:06 PM
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The real question becomes not 'how will succeed Trump' but rather 'will the Republican party continue to succeed with Trump'?

If the success continues they'll find another demogogue who uses roughly the same playbook.

If in 2020 they get their ass handed to them for a second straight election cycle there'll be attempts to find a leader who pulls back on the demogoguery. A return to a more pro-business, less crazy approach.

The problem with the second scenario is that the existing party has set up their electorate/primary system in such a way that the craziest among them control who makes the ballot and, if there's a sea change and the Trump brand becomes a negative, then they could be looking at some real time in the wilderness.
I have a feeling that in some sense, even though they've got control of the Presidency and Senate at the moment, they've got the tiger by the tail because they've gone all-in on the people who support Trump and people like him. But the problem is that changing demographics are against that- younger generations are more liberal and less white, and a lot of middle-aged people may have voted for him without realizing quite how hateful Trump and the current GOP is, and may seek to rectify that.

So what I think will happen is that they'll go all in on that until it doesn't work, then flail around a bit trying to figure out what's going on, and then return a lot more moderate.
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Old 01-03-2020, 03:18 PM
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I think they are likely to swing back to some kind of religious figure. "This guy also hates immigration, not because of the color of their skin but because of "jobs" (wink-wink); and he's built a successful megachurch that's earned him millions of dollars! Plus, he actually stands for family values, like that Jesus invented guns to bless us all with piping hot lead!"
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Old 01-03-2020, 04:49 PM
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I think it very unlikely they're going to wrecked in this upcoming election. I predict the presidential election, regardless of winner, to be razor thin again. The margins will be small. They will probably be even smaller than the last election, which from a statistical point of view was almost a tie. Trump still has 40 something percent approval rating. It is madness. How can it not be zero??? Who is still supporting this guy? How? I don't get it. But it doesn't matter, the fact is he has enough support to make the election close, win or lose. The GOP will do fine in the Senate. They might lose some seats in Congress.

I think the Republicans will replace Trump with another Trump. I think they're very concerned that if the put up a normal Republican, they'll be accused by their own base as selling out on the Trump ideals.
Does that get sidestepped if Pence becomes an incumbent running for re-election?
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Old 01-03-2020, 04:59 PM
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I've seen it suggested that Tucker Carlson could be da guy. (Forget Hannity. Too clownish.)
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Old 01-03-2020, 05:10 PM
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Does that get sidestepped if Pence becomes an incumbent running for re-election?
I hadn't considered that. Trump is not a healthy man regardless of what his physical says. There's some non-zero probability he's suffering from a neurological disorder. If nothing else, then he's not physically healthy.

If (and I'm not wishing for this) Trump dies in office and Pence becomes president, then I cannot imagine the Republicans turning away from Pence. That actually might be a path to some normalization of the GOP. As strange as that might sound because Pence is a theocrat. How did we get to the point where Pence is could be considered a more central, normal figure? Oh man, bizarre.
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Old 01-03-2020, 05:32 PM
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If Trump and the Republicans lose in 2020, then the party will hopefully decide it's a repudiation of irrational politics and choose more reasonable candidates. They'll probably still be conservatives but at least they'll be presentable in public.

If they pull off a win, then it'll be seen as an affirmation of Trumpism. In that case, Trump will be in a position to designate his political heir.

Last edited by Little Nemo; 01-03-2020 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 01-03-2020, 05:50 PM
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If Trump and the Republicans lose in 2020, then the party will hopefully decide it's a repudiation of irrational politics and choose more reasonable candidates. They'll probably still be conservatives but at least they'll be presentable in public.

If they pull off a win, then it'll be seen as an affirmation of Trumpism. In that case, Trump will be in a position to designate his political heir.
I don't think a narrow loss will do it mainly as a narrow loss will indicate that the Republican base wants more Trump. A major defeat; however, would indicate that Trumpian politics is no longer a winning move.
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Old 01-03-2020, 06:43 PM
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I still don’t think a smarter, more restrained Trump would succeed (in the same way) as the current President. A not insignificant portion of Trump’s current voters would have contempt for him not “telling it like it is,” or being part of the swamp, or just say “who?”

So I’d lean towards the Nugent side, if those are the only options.
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Old 01-03-2020, 08:12 PM
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It'll probably be a younger, more competent version of Trump. Someone like Tom Cotton, who can push most of the same buttons Trump did, but doesn't Tweet like a teenager and has a much better grasp of domestic/international politics.
Watching Matt Gaetz in the impeachment hearings I thought he fit the bill of a next generation trump.

---------------------------------------

But I think that regardless of how lockstep the republican party is now behind trumpish "values", the transition to a new leader will be full of uncertainties.

Trump presses a few buttons, and since no-one will be exactly the same as him (thank god), the new leader will just press some of the same buttons, and it could make a big difference to the direction of the party.
Maybe (s)he is also an ignorant bigot in the same popular way that trump is, but less focused on media / twitter and more inclined to follow the law? Maybe (s)he's the opposite of that? A lot of different ways it could go.
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Old 01-03-2020, 08:36 PM
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Mike Pence is just a bone-stock Middle America white conservative Christian. They're not my fellow travelers when it comes to ideology, but I'm also not afraid of them.

A true "theocrat" would be someone like Ted Cruz, and I am a little afraid of him and guys like him. But I don't think they're the future of the Republican party.

The future of the Republican Party - in my opinion - is 4Chan and The_Donald on the most extreme end, and Joe Rogan and Ben Shapiro on the less extreme end. It's a generation that views liberalism and "wokeness" in the same way that Abbie Hoffman viewed the World War II generation: a stifling cultural orthodoxy to be mocked, scorned, and ultimately dismantled. A whole new generation of young Trumpists are emerging from this milieu, completely in isolation of the religious right and the Bible Belt.
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Old 01-03-2020, 08:50 PM
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No love for Ivanka?
Don't be making fun of the first female president of these United States.

Search your feelings. You know it to be true.
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Old 01-03-2020, 09:42 PM
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I think they are likely to swing back to some kind of religious figure. "This guy also hates immigration, not because of the color of their skin but because of "jobs" (wink-wink); and he's built a successful megachurch that's earned him millions of dollars! Plus, he actually stands for family values, like that Jesus invented guns to bless us all with piping hot lead!"
Oh god, you’re right; Which means we have to consider the possibility of that schmuck Joel Osteen.
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Old 01-03-2020, 09:51 PM
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I don't think a narrow loss will do it mainly as a narrow loss will indicate that the Republican base wants more Trump. A major defeat; however, would indicate that Trumpian politics is no longer a winning move.
Republican politicians don't give a damn about what the Republican base wants. The only important thing to them is getting elected. And if their current base can't deliver, regardless of whether it's a narrow loss or a major defeat, they'll just move to another group of voters.
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Old 01-03-2020, 09:57 PM
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Well people thought it could not get worse than Bush II.
It obviously could.

So by that standard, an actual Klansman?
Steve King maybe.
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Old 01-04-2020, 12:07 AM
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Oh god, you’re right; Which means we have to consider the possibility of that schmuck Joel Osteen.
I highly doubt it. Joel Osteen is despised among many Christian circles. There are probably many more American Christian voters who oppose Osteen and what he stands for, than oppose Trump and what he stands for.
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Old 01-04-2020, 10:58 AM
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I highly doubt it. Joel Osteen is despised among many Christian circles. There are probably many more American Christian voters who oppose Osteen and what he stands for, than oppose Trump and what he stands for.
Well, I don’t know any current televangelist preachers except him, but it would not surprise me in the least if the GOP picked from among their ranks when seeking a new leader - some good looking, well spoken, tv savvy “man of god” who made millions preaching the prosperity gospel would seem to be an excellent Republican candidate.
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Old 01-04-2020, 05:11 PM
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A current spokesperson for geriatric products would be a good fit. Who's pushing Depends and Viagra now?
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Old 01-04-2020, 05:58 PM
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Well, I don’t know any current televangelist preachers except him, but it would not surprise me in the least if the GOP picked from among their ranks when seeking a new leader - some good looking, well spoken, tv savvy “man of god” who made millions preaching the prosperity gospel would seem to be an excellent Republican candidate.
Then the GOP would be absolutely shooting itself in the foot. Many Christians find Trump's brand of "Christianity" more acceptable than Osteen's. That should tell you a thing or two about Osteen.
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Old 01-04-2020, 05:59 PM
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Republican politicians don't give a damn about what the Republican base wants. The only important thing to them is getting elected. And if their current base can't deliver, regardless of whether it's a narrow loss or a major defeat, they'll just move to another group of voters.
While I agree with you with respect to GOP politicians (I think it could be said of most politicians really), to use a sport analogy, I don't think you throw out your entire team because you lose 3-2 in the final game, when you were the champions the previous season. You could be right, but I just don't see them turning on Trumpian politics so quickly if they think they'll be elected by Trumpian politics. Of course, it depends on what the analysis says on why they will have lost. Turning away from Trumpian politics could be a more losing move.
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Old 01-05-2020, 10:04 PM
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The ET alien worm lodged in the skull of this POTUS will slink out with his defeat and find another to infest. The giveaway, if it attaches to lower functions: 3rd-grader speech patterns. Hmmm, maybe all ranting reactionary rimjobs have already been invaded. Drooling ichor isn't a telltale. Look at their corneas. Do they glow? Wriggle?

Last edited by RioRico; 01-05-2020 at 10:06 PM.
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Old 01-06-2020, 11:55 AM
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Donald Trump pounded that seemingly sensible idea into dust, played instead to old timey conservative grievances, won the White House by the narrowest of margins and is favored to win again, even after anyone undecided about him in 2016 has had four full years to wash away any previous doubts about his character.
Says who? (My bold) Not doubting you, I'm just curious what you base this on. RCP shows Biden, Warren, and Sanders beating Trump as of Dec 20, and Buttigieg losing (not taking into account margin of error)...
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Old 01-06-2020, 02:52 PM
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Says who? (My bold) Not doubting you, I'm just curious what you base this on. RCP shows Biden, Warren, and Sanders beating Trump as of Dec 20, and Buttigieg losing (not taking into account margin of error)...
I don't want to ignore this question, I'm just a little surprised by it. I'll address it specifically later if you still think it's important. Generally speaking, I'm seeing most national polls calling it another toss-up or with The Don a slight favorite because of the inherent favorability the EC gives Republicans.

If some people who do this sort for a living are right, though, there's going to be a record turnout. I'm still seeing some prognosticators saying that means only that there will be lots more Trump voters turning out, too, but I'm betting the opposite way on that one. If there's a record turnout, it'll be because young voters got to the polls and buried Donald.
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Old 01-06-2020, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Red Wiggler View Post
I don't want to ignore this question, I'm just a little surprised by it. I'll address it specifically later if you still think it's important. Generally speaking, I'm seeing most national polls calling it another toss-up or with The Don a slight favorite because of the inherent favorability the EC gives Republicans.

If some people who do this sort for a living are right, though, there's going to be a record turnout. I'm still seeing some prognosticators saying that means only that there will be lots more Trump voters turning out, too, but I'm betting the opposite way on that one. If there's a record turnout, it'll be because young voters got to the polls and buried Donald.
No need to be surprised. But here you say it's either a toss-up or Trump is a slight favorite, not that he is favored. In any case, again, this wasn't to say you are wrong, I was just curious as to why you said that. Because as for me, I think he will lose pretty handily assuming nothing particularly unexpected happens, but I would not be prepared to say I believe that strongly right now. It's way too early.
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Old 01-06-2020, 05:38 PM
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The Republican electorate does not want a Christian president. They may say they do, but they don't really. They don't want Jesus Christ. They want the gladiators of ancient Rome, they want gods with the heads of lions and bulls, they want warrior-priests with wives and concubines. America is a Bosch triptych to these people and they want to be the beast sitting at the top of the pile of skulls. Obviously they can't all be the beast. But they want that beast on their team.
  #47  
Old 01-06-2020, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by BeepKillBeep View Post
While I agree with you with respect to GOP politicians (I think it could be said of most politicians really), to use a sport analogy, I don't think you throw out your entire team because you lose 3-2 in the final game, when you were the champions the previous season. You could be right, but I just don't see them turning on Trumpian politics so quickly if they think they'll be elected by Trumpian politics. Of course, it depends on what the analysis says on why they will have lost. Turning away from Trumpian politics could be a more losing move.
I don't feel this sports analogy works in politics. Politics isn't a game where you score points and can tell yourself that you'll do better in the next competition. It's essentially a popularity contest; you perform and then other people decide if you were the best.

And if they didn't pick you this time, there's no reason to think they're going to pick you the next time. That's why politicians rarely try to run again for an office they lost in an election.
  #48  
Old 01-06-2020, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Wesley Clark View Post
The problem with changing demographics is that they are all concentrated in areas that are already blue.

In 2004 the democrat won California by about 1.2 million votes. In 2016 the democrat won by over 4 million votes. Those extra votes don't mean anything since the state is already blue.
I don't know that that's going to continue to be true - I'm at the age where a lot of people I know are retiring. Lots of them are moving out of New York/New Jersey. But they aren't moving to California or Washington or Massachusetts - they're moving to Florida or South Carolina or Texas and they don't suddenly start liking Trump or the current Republican party just because they move. Add in the new 18 year olds who become eligible to vote every year who are less likely to support Trump/current Republican party than the 70+ year olds who will leave the voting population, and some of those red areas may switch. Maybe not in 2020, but perhaps in 2024. Then account for the states that Trump flipped- some of them barely. Demographics ( or dissatisfaction*) may cause them to flip back to blue.

Which is not to say the Republican party can never win again - but the Republican who can win with a younger, less white electorate is not going to be anything like Trump.





* - he won Michigan by something like .3% of the votes. If my math is right, that was under 1000 votes. I'm guessing at least than many people regret voting for him.
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Old 01-06-2020, 08:24 PM
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I don't know that that's going to continue to be true - I'm at the age where a lot of people I know are retiring. Lots of them are moving out of New York/New Jersey. But they aren't moving to California or Washington or Massachusetts - they're moving to Florida or South Carolina or Texas and they don't suddenly start liking Trump or the current Republican party just because they move.
What this does mean, though, in the short run, is that this will benefit Republicans by swelling the population and House/Electoral College clout of those states (Arizona, Texas, etc.) to the point that Republicans get more House seats and Electoral votes, but not yet turn them blue to the point that those states flip blue.
  #50  
Old 01-07-2020, 06:37 PM
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Assuming that the country remains a reasonably functioning democracy, demographics will doom Trumpism in the next decade. But the current GOP is so identified with him that I think it might actually be more likely that they simply won't be able to survive as a major national party, because their base will refuse to nominate anyone capable of winning a general election, and even if they do manage to nominate a relative moderate, that candidate will still be tagged with the radioactive Trump brand.

Then the Democrats would split into progressive and moderate wings, and those would be the two new major parties. Of course, the Trumpists could still maintain control of certain particularly unfortunate States for a long time to come.
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