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Old 10-11-2018, 06:54 PM
Babale Babale is offline
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What is your ideal world, 200 years from now?

It struck me that when we debate, we often disagree even when we agree on the facts and even our interpretation of them. Sure, sometimes that's not the problem, sometimes we believe our different sources and our opinions diverge before we even get to this point, but every once in a while someone on the other side of an issue has me nodding along right until the conclusion, which is the exact opposite of the one I arrived at. Not only do we disagree about the best way to reach our goals, we have profoundly different end goals.

So I have to ask-- if, for the next 200 years, politicians with your exact ideology, whatever it may be, are elected to every office, and if like-minded politicians are elected in free countries across the world, and you can get literally whatever you want done -- what does your country look like 200 years from now?

What sort of economy does your country have? What sort of healthcare?

What is the role of women and minorities in society?

What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation?

What does the world look like? Other countries, the environment?

I have my own idea, but I don't want to prejudice this thread, so I'm still working on it, and I'll post it soon. But I'm really interested to see what some of you think, especially those I don't usually agree with.

Who knows? Maybe we want the same things, we just have different ideas of how to get them.
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Old 10-11-2018, 07:10 PM
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Cool concept for a thread. I'll give it a go:

What sort of economy does my country have? Capitalist with social democracy. Like the US, but more mellow and less racy. What sort of healthcare? I hope this is an issue that will be long solved by then, but essentially a single payer system with some amazing integrated tech, so that we basically wear (or have nano-bots) the stuff and it tells us what the issues are and fixes most things. If it can't, then we are directed to go see a doctor or robo-doc for more extensive work.

What about religion? Do I think there will still be religions in 200 years? Yeah. I don't really care, one way or the other.

Role of women I expect to be about the same as today, but less gropy and less discrimination. I expect that, with half the population being women that we will have about the same percentage in government (unless the AI is in charge of course). I expect minorities to be, well, not minorities anymore, as I expect people will just be people. Perhaps we'll all be able to hate on robots or something.

The environment....well, I expect that to be pretty bad. 100 or 500 year storms occurring ever decade. However, I think that in 200 years we'll be seriously mitigating this, and perhaps even geo-engineering solutions to really control the weather and climate. Heck, on that time frame I really expect the first large space mega-cities and serious exploitation of solar system resources to be ramping up. Other countries? I expect there to be other countries, unless the AI is in charge, and perhaps the first space based nations.

I'm pretty positive about the future. I expect our technology to do what it's done for hundreds of years...continue to improve our overall lives and increase our standards of living. I expect that many of our current issues today will look like issues 200 years ago look today, and many of the attitudes today to be equally frowned on or completely abandoned and censured.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if I'm alive in 200 years to see how my predictions turn out.
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:11 PM
FlikTheBlue FlikTheBlue is offline
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Since this is about what I would like the world to be in 200 years rather than what I expect, here is my wish list. Some of these are probably unlikely, but I'll stick to things that are at least plausible.

1. The big sticking point is energy, so in 2218 the vast majority of the world's energy will be generated by a combination of solar, wind, hydroelectric, geothermal, and nuclear fission. We'll have figured out how to be able to provide enough energy to the whole world with those sources, since I think nuclear fusion is out of the question, even 200 years from now. We'll have also sequestered enough carbon to return us to the levels of CO2 found 200 years ago (since we're dealing with 200 year time periods ).

2. Politics. I don't see the need for a single nation, but ideally all the countries will get along well enough by 2218 that war is thought of as a thing of the past. There will still be economic competition, but no serious thought of military solutions. Since I'm a fan of Star Trek I see the UN evolving into something like Star Trek's Federation, with every country as a member.

3. The economy. Human nature being what it is, I think the best thing would be to have capitalism with regulations set up to protect the consumer and the environment. No leasing of public lands to private corporations for private benefit. No more privatization of profits with socialization of risk (the heads I win tails you lose rule that big banks currently play under). I believe in a meritocracy, and people with talent as well as those who put forth more effort will be rewarded for their hard work, but there will also be a minimum income for those just don't or can't participate in the workforce. The tax burden will fall largely on the rich who make their money via the work of others, however, and not on the upper middle class who make their money with their own hard work like it currently does.

4. Religion. Again, as something fundamental to human nature (for some people), religion will still be around. Any religious groups, however, will have to follow laws that guarantee basic rights to all people regardless of things like gender, sexual orientation, etc.

5. Gender relations. We will have reached a point where men and women have reached equality of opportunity. By then enough generations will have passed that the "boys will be boys" attitude will no longer be taught, which will significantly reduce sexual harassment and assaults.

6. Medical care. By 2218 I think it's likely a way to stop the aging process will have been developed if the 5 above things have occurred, but that would lead to such a radical departure from our current society that it would be a whole separate thread. Instead I'll simply suggest that we have universal healthcare provided worldwide. Those who actually provide the care (doctors, nurses, therapists, basically everyone who actually does something that benefits the patient) are compensated appropriately. Middle management and the owners and upper management of big insurance companies and big pharma companies, however, are no longer needed, since those people don't do anything to actually benefit patients, and are largely the reason our healthcare system costs way more than it should.

Last edited by FlikTheBlue; 10-11-2018 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 10-11-2018, 10:53 PM
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I had a vision. There was a massive effort to send a manned mission to Mars, but we went about it a little differently. Children were selected from a very early age and sent to institutes to train. There were some 20 of these places, where they would learn the human half of space travel – autonomous metabolism control, how to not kill all the rest of the crew after months of close quarters, technical skills, along with a general education. As part of the process, the children were rotated around the institutes every six months to broaden their learning experience.

Out of half a million, a dozen were selected for the trip, of which eight made through the three year expedition and back to Earth (along with, of course, a couple of Martians). In terms of discovery, there was a lot of great science, but nothing especially jaw-dropping.

What really happened, though, was that there were thousands of young adults that came out of institutes with an eye on changing the world. And they became, basically, impossible to contest.

They turned all of humanity into orderly groups of bedouins. Being accustomed to not staying in a place for more than six months, they imposed that way of life on everyone. There was obviously resistance and objection, but over time, most people came to accept it as the cultural norm and eventually began to view the old sessile manner as unappealing. Over time, the big cities were systematically dismantled by their temporary denizens, because who needs these absurd monstrosities anymore?

It was not a crudely spartan existence, as the means of communication over long distances could maintain a sense of global community. And all over the world, in common settling places, there were large structures (similar in shape to road salt huts) where people would ritually leave some thing behind, where others might find a useful thing or something to decorate their living space.

And the institutes continue to operate, bringing in children to train for managing society, and for some other reason that has, 200 years in the future, not become clear yet.
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Old 10-11-2018, 11:56 PM
Wesley Clark Wesley Clark is offline
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The world in 2218?

Humans have reverse engineered the brain so we can transfer our consciousness to bio-engineered bodies, machine bodies, or virtual reality.

Due to advances in machine intelligence and interstellar travel, GDP doubles every few months. It is a post scarcity economy where most things are abundant and free.

Humans are a multi-stellar society and have developed FTL travel (or if not, engines that can approach 80% the speed of light).

Religion is gone

Health care is different. Most people live in VR or in machine bodies which can be easily repaired. Human bodies are engineered to not age and to have very advanced self repair mechanisms.

Women and minorities are treated as equals, the same way Polish and Italians are treated as equals in today's society.

Due to advances in machine intelligence, virtually any problem humanity faces are easily solvable including problems we currently consider near impossible to solve.

The rest of the world is on the same level technologically and culturally.

Political systems are based on a system of trillions of sensors gathering data, processing them and determining the best government policy from a utilitarian perspective. Democracy doesn't exist, it is more of a bureaucratic system with wide scale feedback.

People devote most of their time to exploring and enjoying new subjective experiences. Due to understanding the brain, we have the ability to create infinite experiences with emotions, perspectives and thoughts we can't currently fathom.
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Old 10-12-2018, 12:08 AM
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Well said Wesley Clark. Probably some will think it is too optimistic but personally I have no doubt we will get there...the only question is the timescale.

Of the tech you mention, the main questionable one for me is transfer of consciousness; it may never be feasible to scan a whole human brain, and personally I do think the question of whether it is the "same" consciousness is a significant and real one.
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Old 10-12-2018, 01:22 AM
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What sort of economy does your country have?
Post-scarcity. And I'm answering for my "country" although that term no longer applies.
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What sort of healthcare?
Universal
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What is the role of women and minorities in society?
Same as everyone else.
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What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation?
None. Or, at least, a quaint hobby for some small minority, with absolutely no public accommodation in law or civil society.
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What does the world look like?
Better than now. Greener, less polluted.
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Other countries, the environment?
What other countries?

The environment got a lot better once the global population dropped below 1 billion. A mandatory universal one-child policy will do that.
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Old 10-12-2018, 02:00 AM
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No government. You stand in my way at the sidewalk for too long, I'll blast you with my 44 magnum.

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Old 10-12-2018, 06:10 AM
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Survival.
A non-totalitarian government.
A half-way repaired environment.

At least one off world colony.
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Old 10-12-2018, 06:15 AM
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An excellent topic.

I see a society based on equality and rule of law. Sexism and the like will be firmly in the past. We will be much closer to a post-scarcity economy but not there (crops will still fail, there will still be droughts, etc). Nuclear power based on fission will be standard - the concerns of the 20th century dismissed. Fusion power will still be 50 years away. Socialised healthcare will be ubiquitous but have limits, probably palliative care only after age 80. The global population will be gradually declining, and peace will be spreading. Hatreds will fall to apathy; people will be largely content.

There will still be haves and have-nots, and the latter - and those who seek to take advantage of them - will still cause trouble, but to a much lesser extent.

Humanity will be exploring the solar system with outposts all over; there will be no colonies without artificial gravity. We will have found possibly-habitable planets in other solar systems. How to get there will still be unresolved and this will be what drives humanity forward.
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Old 10-12-2018, 07:08 AM
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Great topic. Plenty to envision, but I'll start with these:

It will be a post-racial world. Everyone will be of mixed race (which really is already somewhat true). People will find it difficult to understand why race or ethnicity was ever important, and why certain trivial physical characteristics were considered so crucial, while others were ignored.

People will come to realize that Mama Nature really dislikes dichotomies; therefore gender will become more fluid. Many will live their entire lives as female or male, but more will identify at times as male, at times as female, at times as bi-gender, and at times as neither. Those with the proper anatomy may choose to become pregnant and deliver a baby, but artificial wombs will be available to all, and many will choose to use them. A household may be comprised of several adults, and they may elect to use everyone's DNA for the child. The notion that people used to have a single mother who was always female and a father who was always male will seem quaint to many.

Since racial identification is no longer practiced, racism will be a thing of the past. Since gender identification is fluid, sexism will no longer exist.
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Old 10-12-2018, 08:21 AM
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The environment got a lot better once the global population dropped below 1 billion. A mandatory universal one-child policy will do that.
Good grief. Why do people always think stuff like this work? Been keeping tabs on what a smashing success it's been for the CCP?? And why do you think we would even need or want a mandatory one-child policy?? Demographic trends are already putting most wealthy countries below replacement levels, and are shifting even poorer countries towards that. You are trying to fix a problem that, even today, 200 years before the target, is already on the way to being fixed.

Hell, by 2218 we might need to encourage folks to have more kids.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:01 AM
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Global climate change is the great challenge and emergency of our time. Children born now are going to be living in a world with (presumably) a still-surging population with resources that are going to be scarcer and unevenly distributed. I'm glad I probably won't be alive to be witness to it.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:16 AM
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Well, it's never going to happen with conditions the way they are. So, after we hit a tipping point and 3/4 of the world's population is wiped out because of conditions that HUMANS, and ONLY HUMANS made, the remaining people would embark on an entirely new path.

1) No more nationalism. All of the new policies would be derived from GLOBAL THINKING and a consideration for what would be best for ALL people on a planet wide basis.

2) The corporate fueled plutocracies that led us down the road to perdition would no longer exist, and governments would no longer be lobbied and owned by rich, corporate interests anymore.

3) Because there are so few humans worldwide in comparison to the way things were, their health and welfare would be much more important, and things like education and health care would be provided by governments that could afford it because they weren't giving away trillions to the military and industrial complex and the rich corporations.

I think that's a good start.

Last edited by Jasmine; 10-12-2018 at 09:18 AM.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:40 AM
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Well, it's never going to happen with conditions the way they are. So, after we hit a tipping point and 3/4 of the world's population is wiped out because of conditions that HUMANS, and ONLY HUMANS made, the remaining people would embark on an entirely new path.
The OP is asking for the ideal scenario. Personally, I don't think the deaths of billions is ideal.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:45 AM
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The OP is asking for the ideal scenario. Personally, I don't think the deaths of billions is ideal.
The Thanos Solution.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:46 AM
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The OP is asking for the ideal scenario. Personally, I don't think the deaths of billions is ideal.
Some people think that a Mad Maxian or Fallout-esque scenario IS 'ideal'. If 3/4 of humans died out we'd almost certainly be back to hunting and gathering, or, at best, 19th century technology and the survivors clawing to continue. That probably sounds good to some.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:54 AM
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Good grief.
Peanuts fan, eh?
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Why do people always think stuff like this work?
Because the obvious method of getting to my goal population goes against my pacifist nature. So I'm willing to settle for this.
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Been keeping tabs on what a smashing success it's been for the CCP??
They're wimps who didn't carry it out the way I would, with their piddly "exceptions" and "quitting".
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And why do you think we would even need or want a mandatory one-child policy??
Who cares what "we" want?

It's a hypothetical where people are willingly electing politicians who want to enact things I want done, for 200 years - so my assumption is everyone would want it. Or at least shut up about it and do it.
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Demographic trends are already putting most wealthy countries below replacement levels, and are shifting even poorer countries towards that.
I'm well aware, I'm a huge Hans Rosling fan. Not fast enough to get to 1 billion in the timeframe given, though.
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You are trying to fix a problem that, even today, 200 years before the target, is already on the way to being fixed.
Naah. The projections are to have population stabilize (likely around 10 billion).

I'm afraid that's just not good enough to qualify for being my "ideal world"
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Hell, by 2218 we might need to encourage folks to have more kids.
Not in my ideal world.

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Old 10-12-2018, 09:57 AM
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The OP is asking for the ideal scenario. Personally, I don't think the deaths of billions is ideal.

My points 1,2, and 3 address exactly that.

How you feel personally about the only way I believe we can accomplish those points is irrelevant to the OP and, thus, leaves me unmoved.

We are going to have about ten billion people on this planet by the middle of this century. If you know any way for us to achieve an "ideal" anything under those circumstance, I'm all ears.
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:58 AM
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Peanuts fan, eh?

Because the obvious method of getting to my goal population goes against my pacifist nature. So I'm willing to settle for this.

They're wimps who didn't carry it out the way I would, with their piddly "exceptions" and "quitting".

Who cares what "we" want?

It's a hypothetical where people are willingly electing politicians who want to enact things I want done, for 200 years - so my assumption is everyone would want it. Or at least shut up about it and do it.
I'm well aware, I'm a huge Hans Rosling fan. Not fast enough to get to 1 billion in the timeframe given, though.
Naah. The projections are to have population stabilize (likely around 10 billion).

I'm afraid that's just not good enough to qualify for being my "ideal world"

Not in my ideal world.
Fair enough...it is, as you pointed out, YOUR ideal world. Creeps me out, but then different strokes for different folks.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:01 AM
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If 3/4 of humans died out we'd almost certainly be back to hunting and gathering, or, at best, 19th century technology and the survivors clawing to continue.
Why? That's around the population at the end of WWI. Why on Earth would that population make us revert anything, technologically? Our actual tech isn't dependent on having a huge population. Hell, it's much less dependent on it than, say, the 19th century, with its mass factory labour and larger agricultural base.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:03 AM
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Fair enough...it is, as you pointed out, YOUR ideal world. Creeps me out, but then different strokes for different folks.
Why would it creep you out if people willingly go along with a one-child policy when, as you say, that's part of the growing trend in the West anyway?
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:05 AM
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Why? That's around the population at the end of WWI. Why on Earth would that population make us revert anything, technologically? Our actual tech isn't dependent on having a huge population. Hell, it's much less dependent on it than, say, the 19th century, with its mass factory labour and larger agricultural base.
Because in such a crashing population we wouldn't be able to maintain the tech base. The population of WWI was there already, but we are talking about 3/4 of the population rapidly dying off. Even leaving the logistics aside of how society would deal with billions of dead in a short time frame you aren't going to have enough people with the right skills to keep the lights on...unless you think that only non-productive and non-technical types are going to die off?
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:07 AM
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Why would it creep you out if people willingly go along with a one-child policy when, as you say, that's part of the growing trend in the West anyway?
Because I don't see that as happening that way. If they CHOOSE to only have 1 child, then you don't need a government policy, right? The fact that you have to have a policy implies, strongly, that they aren't choosing...they are being told to. By the government. Which has worked out SO well in places that have tried it.

I think you are trying to solve a problem that doesn't need to be solved. You are doing so because you want to meet an artificial goal of 1 billion people in 200 years. Myself, I think population will level out and start to decline already, just not that fast...or that artificially. I'm a big fan of things happening organically, instead of being forced by some people who think they know what's best. Seems to me that humanity has benefited a hell of a lot more in the last century from a market approach than from a command approach. YMMV of course.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:21 AM
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Why? That's around the population at the end of WWI.
I think you are off by nearly half a century. The world population has basically quadrupled in my lifetime.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:22 AM
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Because in such a crashing population we wouldn't be able to maintain the tech base. The population of WWI was there already, but we are talking about 3/4 of the population rapidly dying off. Even leaving the logistics aside of how society would deal with billions of dead in a short time frame you aren't going to have enough people with the right skills to keep the lights on...unless you think that only non-productive and non-technical types are going to die off?
Just to go into a bit more detail on this, let's say that the current trend in deaths per year continues (well, with a slow acceleration as folks get older). About 60 million people current die per year currently. If we went to a 1 child policy, that would potentially be about 40-50 million kids born per year. That's maximum, it would almost certainly be less if you actually followed the policy with draconian measures, ensuring that no more than 1 child per (presumably married) couple could have a kid. If you are going with 1 child per female, then it's going to be more, obviously (you might actually have MORE kids if you go one per female...currently we are at 140 million births per year and dropping).

You are going to be hard pressed to get down to 1 billion in just 200 years, though obviously as folks get older you are going to have large drop offs. Of course, then you'll be having the issue (world wide) that countries like Japan and increasingly China are having, with a graying population. Unless we get some serious life extension tech...which is, conversely, going to make it harder for you to reach that goal of 1 billion by 200 years.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:27 AM
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My points 1,2, and 3 address exactly that.

How you feel personally about the only way I believe we can accomplish those points is irrelevant to the OP and, thus, leaves me unmoved.

We are going to have about ten billion people on this planet by the middle of this century. If you know any way for us to achieve an "ideal" anything under those circumstance, I'm all ears.
The same way we've achieved what we have so far; solving our problems using our big ol' brains.
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Old 10-12-2018, 10:43 AM
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So I have to ask-- if, for the next 200 years, politicians with your exact ideology, whatever it may be, are elected to every office, and if like-minded politicians are elected in free countries across the world, and you can get literally whatever you want done -- what does your country look like 200 years from now?
There is NO politician with my EXACT ideology, nor will there ever be, unless 200 years from now every politician is created in a lab to be an exact clone of me down to my brain patterns. So let's establish that this is total fantasy. I don't vote for mini-me's, I vote on issues.

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What sort of economy does your country have? What sort of healthcare?
Capitalist, and running strong. IF somebody found a way to have a "nordic-style" economy and healthcare system that scaled to a diverse huge country like the US, WITHOUT crushing people with taxes, I'd be happy with that. I am highly skeptical that's possible, but that would be ideal.
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What is the role of women and minorities in society?
Well, I think what we now call "whites" will be the minority in 200 years, and I hope they are treated equally under the law, and not discriminated against. I would like women to be able to take on any role they wanted, successfully. I would like the economy to be such that if a family could live comfortably on a single income, with one parent being able to be a stay at home mom or dad, if they so chose.
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What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation?
Free, but separated from the state.
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What does the world look like? Other countries, the environment?
Well, I would like countries to be able to retain their culture and national identity for the most part. I do not think we should force democracy on every country. I don't want open borders, or a "new world order." I tend to think that embracing capitalism has made the world richer outside of the USA, but they can have any economic system they want. Obviously I would like the beauty contestant answer of everyone in the world to be comfortable, healthy, free, world peace, yadayadayada. I do not think that will ever happen though.

Last edited by Ashtura; 10-12-2018 at 10:46 AM.
  #29  
Old 10-12-2018, 10:43 AM
EscAlaMike EscAlaMike is offline
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What sort of economy does your country have? What sort of healthcare?
Technology is making the state apparatus more obsolete all the time. Therefore, one single state-issued currency is a thing of the past. The economy 200 years from now is much more globally integrated, open, and free. Because of technological advances (specifically in transportation and communication), people are free to trade with whomever they desire in mutually beneficial exchanges all over the world.

The same concept applies to healthcare. The old notion of governments propping up, subsidizing, and supporting protected industries has gone by the wayside. The healthcare and health insurances industries, since they are no longer protected and subsidized by the state, are forced to compete in the open marketplace. Because of this, cost has gone down and quality has gone up. "Having health insurance" is no longer synonymous with "having access to healthcare".

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What is the role of women and minorities in society?
Since every woman and every "minority" is a distinct human being, they do not have defined "roles" or boxes that they have to fit into. Every individual is free to pursue the good life.

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What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation?
The great religions profess truths that are timeless and universal. Therefore, the great religions (Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam) will still be around and will still be the (mostly) force for good that they are today.

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Originally Posted by Babale View Post
What does the world look like? Other countries, the environment?
I see national borders becoming less significant. People will have both the freedom and opportunity to pursue their happiness wherever and however they like.
  #30  
Old 10-12-2018, 12:06 PM
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you aren't going to have enough people with the right skills to keep the lights on...unless you think that only non-productive and non-technical types are going to die off?
No, but I do think that there's an excess of skilled people in any field you care to mention...enough to get by with until new people are trained. Sure, power plant engineers will work double shifts for a while. I didn't say it would be easy.

Plus there will be a whole lot of people who do have tech training but currently work in what would be less essential fields post-apocalypse - entertainment, finance, etc.

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Originally Posted by XT View Post
Because I don't see that as happening that way. If they CHOOSE to only have 1 child, then you don't need a government policy, right?
Most people choose not to commit murder, yet we have laws for that....
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The fact that you have to have a policy implies, strongly, that they aren't choosing...they are being told to. By the government. Which has worked out SO well in places that have tried it.
Maybe if it was one generation. But 200 years? Governments could only keep that up with the support of the populace.
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I think you are trying to solve a problem that doesn't need to be solved. You are doing so because you want to meet an artificial goal of 1 billion people in 200 years.
Well, yes, because those are the bounds of the OP.
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Myself, I think population will level out and start to decline already
Level out, sure. Start to decline by that much? That's not what's predicted.
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I'm a big fan of things happening organically, instead of being forced by some people who think they know what's best.
That's not what this thread is about. This thread is all about the magic wand.
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Seems to me that humanity has benefited a hell of a lot more in the last century from a market approach than from a command approach. YMMV of course.
We've still to see where the market approach will take us. IPCC says 12 more years...

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Originally Posted by eschereal View Post
I think you are off by nearly half a century. The world population has basically quadrupled in my lifetime.
No, 25% of 7.2 billion is 1.8 billion. Population in 1920 was 1.86 billion.
  #31  
Old 10-12-2018, 12:17 PM
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You are going to be hard pressed to get down to 1 billion in just 200 years, though obviously as folks get older you are going to have large drop offs.
I had it pegged as roughly halving every generation after the first - so 7.2->3.6->1.8->0.9. Although with a much more generous generation gap than the old 25 years. And that would be because it would be mandatory.
  #32  
Old 10-12-2018, 12:21 PM
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Moderating

This is more IMHO material than GD. Moving there.

[/moderating]
  #33  
Old 10-12-2018, 01:28 PM
Jim B. Jim B. is offline
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My ideal world would be where everyone is loved and accepted, even so-called "evil" people. Not free to do harm. Just loved and accepted.

Actually, I may not be alone in feeling this way even now. Consider the song My Grown Up Christmas List.

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  #34  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:24 PM
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Nanobots. Creation the Borg collective without all the implants. A hive mind as the bots encourage right thinking from infancy via control of the brain's reward center. Isn't this the type of society that R. Daneel Olivaw was working towards, just using genetic and educational methods?
  #35  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:58 PM
Napier Napier is offline
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>What sort of economy does your country have? What sort of healthcare?
Something like capitalism or free market as far as freedom and individual opportunity go, but something that has a low tendency to concentrate wealth and power in a small number of aggressive people.


>What is the role of women and minorities in society?
Equal. In outcome, not just theoretical opportunity.


>What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation?
Its place would be in history museums.


>What does the world look like? Other countries, the environment?
No more nationalism or borders. The environment well cared for.


You didn't ask about cats, but they would be very well cared for and happy.
  #36  
Old 10-15-2018, 01:54 AM
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You didn't ask about cats, but they would be very well cared for and happy.
My ideal world would only have domestic cats in natural history museums, alongside the other extinct animals. The world's birds would be happier.
  #37  
Old 10-15-2018, 05:03 PM
Doubticus Doubticus is offline
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What sort of economy does your country have? What sort of healthcare?

The economy is capitalist with some socialist elements, single-payer health care, with the government producing all pharmaceuticals at cost.

What is the role of women and minorities in society? Both have made greater strides, lingering sexism/racism still exists.

What about religion? What is its place in your ideal nation? Religion fades, but personal ethics improves.

What does the world look like? Other countries, the environment? I imagine there will be a great famine in the next 100 years and biodiversity will greatly be reduced. But after another 100 years, genetic engineering will be applied to allow more crops to grow in varying environments. There will be a migration of populations north, many southern cities abandon. I do think that nuclear fusion will power most of the world, but much of that energy will be spent in ocean water desalination plants as the next big challenge after energy will be fresh water.
  #38  
Old 10-15-2018, 05:06 PM
Ulfreida Ulfreida is offline
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Humans are gone. The earth is slowly healing from the infestation. It will take another five to ten thousand years. Meanwhile an astonishing diversity of life already begins to proliferatein the ruins.

Last edited by Ulfreida; 10-15-2018 at 05:07 PM.
  #39  
Old 10-15-2018, 05:26 PM
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Atomic Alex Atomic Alex is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim B. View Post
My ideal world would be where everyone is loved and accepted, even so-called "evil" people. Not free to do harm. Just loved and accepted.[/URL].
If you haven't you should read 'The Culture' series by Iain M. Banks, in that society the vast majority of people are happy and well adjusted and for those who have darker attitudes this can be redirected into harmless pursuits.

But then I think everyone should read The Culture, that's pretty much my ideal society with the caveat that I'm not comfortable with how human/biological power and direction has been ceded to machines, albeit super-intelligent and benevolent ones.



Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppaSan View Post
Nanobots. Creation the Borg collective without all the implants. A hive mind as the bots encourage right thinking from infancy via control of the brain's reward center. Isn't this the type of society that R. Daneel Olivaw was working towards, just using genetic and educational methods?
Who gets to choose what defines 'right thinking' though, we can see in our own contemporary societies how people and groups can have very different ideas of what constitutes right and wrong.

Last edited by Atomic Alex; 10-15-2018 at 05:27 PM.
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