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Old 03-12-2019, 04:59 PM
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Who is Pete Buttigieg?


And will his name work against him? (How do you pronounce it?)

The BBC say that he impressed at SXSW.

Quote:
If elected, the mayor of South Bend, Indiana, would achieve a number of presidential firsts - the youngest president, aged 37, the first mayor elected directly to the White House, the first Afghanistan War veteran and the first openly gay president.
The BBC put him joint top with Elizabeth Warren.

Last edited by Bone; 04-05-2019 at 02:08 PM. Reason: fixed typo in thread title
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:10 PM
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And will his name work against him? (How do you pronounce it?)
His Wikipedia entry says it's pronounced /ˈbuːtɪdʒɛdʒ/, or BOOT-ih-jej if you (like me) haven't learned how to read IPA notation.

I've seen a few interviews with him; he comes across as extremely articulate, smart, and energetic. However, he started from close-to-zero name recognition in the U.S., and with a very crowded field (including the heavy hitters like Warren, Sanders, and possibly Biden, plus younger candidates who already have visibility, like Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, and maybe Beto O'Rourke), I suspect he's facing an uphill battle just to get awareness.

Last edited by kenobi 65; 03-12-2019 at 05:15 PM.
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:29 PM
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I'll repeat what I've said before: Mostly what he stands to gain from this cycle is name recognition. If he's smart, he'll build that name recognition into a run for governor of Indiana or Senator at the next good opportunity (I don't know off the top of my head what Indiana's schedule is). And then after he's held that position for a while, then he can make another run as a serious presidential candidate, call it maybe the 2032 election.

He's got a lot more plausible road to the Presidency than most people. But he's at the start of that road, not the end.
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:51 PM
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I'll repeat what I've said before: Mostly what he stands to gain from this cycle is name recognition. If he's smart, he'll build that name recognition into a run for governor of Indiana or Senator at the next good opportunity (I don't know off the top of my head what Indiana's schedule is). And then after he's held that position for a while, then he can make another run as a serious presidential candidate, call it maybe the 2032 election.

He's got a lot more plausible road to the Presidency than most people. But he's at the start of that road, not the end.
Indiana is a very Red state, so his chances at Senator or Governor are unfortunately very dicey. Which is probably why he took the risk of running for President at this stage.

I expect that he will at the very least get a prime time speaking spot at the national convention. That is an effective launching pad for future Presidential runs - Obama being a recent example. Otherwise, he could be on the top of many VP lists.
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:58 PM
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He's hardly known, not much chance of getting very far in the primaries, not much chance of a statewide seat in Republican Indiana, but certainly on to bigger and better things already. The media likes him and the eventual candidate will want his support. He's no VP candidate either but easily could get a position in a Democratic Administration if he doesn't just get a TV show first.
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Old 03-12-2019, 06:37 PM
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I saw him for the first time in his town hall the other night. Had never heard of him but found him to express himself very confidently and to have a firm grip on himself- none of that breathless deer in the headlights stuff like the guy on the town hall before him. But he was opening up for Tulsi Gabbard, who I had also never seen before, and came away thinking Gabbard was in a whole other league in terms of star power.

But- in the Gabbard thread, dope pundits think she is shady or not to be trusted. I liked her far better, personally, but it is March 2019, and no way my first impressions are going to be the end of it. I can see a future for this guy- like others have said, he may just be raising his profile this cycle.

Oh yeah, apparently "Budda jug" is pretty close for the pronunciation.
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Old 03-12-2019, 06:53 PM
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Oh yeah, apparently "Budda jug" is pretty close for the pronunciation.
Based on this clip of him answering the question, it sounds like the last "g" is a "j" sound, rather than a hard "g." So, "Buddha jej" seems to be closer, to my ear.
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Old 03-12-2019, 08:30 PM
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And will his name work against him?
I don't know what effect it will have on voters, but it will cause fifth graders to snicker.
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Old 03-12-2019, 08:55 PM
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His ancestry is Maltese. Not sure if that helps with the pronunciation.

He is very intelligent, a charismatic speaker and young. He is very popular in South Bend.

I already made a donation to his exploratory campaign therefore he is guaranteed to lose.
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Old 03-13-2019, 08:29 AM
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So, an up-and-comer? Or just another wannabe on the make?
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Old 03-13-2019, 08:32 AM
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So, an up-and-comer? Or just another wannabe on the make?
IMO, an up-and-comer. A talented young mayor with a bright future.
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Old 03-13-2019, 01:21 PM
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But- in the Gabbard thread, dope pundits think she is shady or not to be trusted. I liked her far better, personally, but it is March 2019, and no way my first impressions are going to be the end of it. I can see a future for this guy- like others have said, he may just be raising his profile this cycle.
Gabbard is a homophobe and a supporter of Assad. Fuck her, I hope she's run out of the Democratic party.
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Old 03-13-2019, 02:19 PM
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As I understand it, she just doesn't want to topple Assad and does not want to use the government to enforce religious morality. I am still looking into it, I only heard of her a week ago.
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Old 03-13-2019, 02:50 PM
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The Washington Post Magazine ran a multi-page article on Buttegieg a month or so ago. It was fawning, to say the least.
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Old 03-13-2019, 03:24 PM
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IMO, an up-and-comer. A talented young mayor with a bright future.
But given his location isn't a gradual upwards move - to senator or governor - blocked? So he really has to go for the big one, doesn't he?
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Old 03-13-2019, 03:31 PM
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well there is a state called NY where they don't seem too worried about a carpetbagger running for Senate
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Old 03-13-2019, 04:39 PM
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The Washington Post Magazine ran a multi-page article on Buttegieg a month or so ago. It was fawning, to say the least.
Yes, Jennifer Rubin is impressed. But TBH, after reading her article, so am I.
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Old 03-13-2019, 04:43 PM
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At the very least, he should be able to get into the House, since presumably his district would have a large overlap with the city that elected him Mayor.
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Old 03-13-2019, 08:28 PM
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But given his location isn't a gradual upwards move - to senator or governor - blocked? So he really has to go for the big one, doesn't he?
I think his goal this cycle is to get his pronounced name known so the stumbles over it are over in the future, and to get some kind of national level position in the next administration, maybe a cabinet level post (VP may be too much to reach for).

From that sort of a position a future run is just a heavy but not as impossible of a lift. And over 8 years Indiana may change and run for Senate might be realistic as well.

Minimally he can parlay this sort of exposure into a news network position that he can use to advocate for issues he cares about.
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Old 03-13-2019, 09:27 PM
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I wouldn't be so quick to write off his chances at statewide office in Indiana. It's not that unusual for a Democrat to be elected governor in a red state (or a Republican in a blue state). Kansas is redder than Indiana, for example. Additionally, the last Democrat to represent Indiana in the US Senate left office less than 3 months ago. It's not crazy to imagine another Democrat elected in the near future.
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Old 03-13-2019, 10:13 PM
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...will his name work against him?
I remember when I first heard Obama speak, at the 2004 Democratic convention, and I thought "Wow, he could be president, but that name is gonna kill his chances." So if Barack Hussein Obama can do it, maybe this guy can too.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:20 AM
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His ancestry is Maltese. Not sure if that helps with the pronunciation.
I'd be astonished if more than 5% of Americans know what or where Malta is. I think the most common association people have with the word Maltese is "a type of dog."

So no, knowing the origin of the name is not going to help anyone.

This guy's path to political success should be obvious - make his first name his brand. I'm not really aware of anyone noteworthy in American politics at the present time named Pete. That means essentially that "the username is available", and he should just throw that name out there in the same way that "Bernie" did and if he does it properly, there will be no confusion about which Pete it is. If he has advisers working for his campaign who know what they're doing, someone will have already told him this.
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Old 03-14-2019, 07:35 AM
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His ancestry is Maltese. Not sure if that helps with the pronunciation.

He is very intelligent, a charismatic speaker and young. He is very popular in South Bend.

I already made a donation to his exploratory campaign therefore he is guaranteed to lose.


I donated to him as well. My first 2020 presidential campaign donation.
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Old 03-14-2019, 07:38 AM
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I don't know what effect it will have on voters, but it will cause fifth graders to snicker.
And at least one quinquagenarian.

I'm relieved to learn that his name is not pronounced in the way I first thought. That said, after the current administration ends (bang, whimper or yawn), hearing "President Buttcheek" fifty times a day would be a welcome relief.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:35 PM
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I donated to him as well. My first 2020 presidential campaign donation.
Me, too. I listen to some of the Crooked Media podcasts, so I've known about him since he ran for DNC chair in 2017. He strikes me as smart, thoughtful, and blessedly grounded in reality.

Hopefuls need 65,000 distinct donors to make the Democratic debates. As of an email from his campaign yesterday, he's 85% of the way there. I really want him in the debates.

At this point, my dream ticket is Warren-Buttigieg. No chance that will happen, but I like the way both of them talk about why they want to be President better than any of the other candidates.

(NB: As one measure of how unusual his name is, it's misspelled in the thread title--it's Buttigieg, not Buttegieg.)
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:18 PM
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I can already see the conspiracy theories accusing him of dual loyalty and taking orders from the Knights of St. John.
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Old 03-14-2019, 05:30 PM
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I have heard him interviewed a few times and he does very well. I would be open to voting for him if he gets far enough. It wasn't in one of the interviews I heard but I believe he has said that "Boot edge edge" is pretty close. When I hear him discussed on NPR they go with what sounds to me like "Buddha-judge."
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Old 03-14-2019, 05:32 PM
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While I don't think he's ready to be President, I think it'd probably be a good thing for him to be in the debates (at least the early ones, before the field winnows down). Get his ideas out there, get some attention on them, and hopefully get them adopted by one of the people who are ready to be President.
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Old 03-14-2019, 07:42 PM
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But given his location isn't a gradual upwards move - to senator or governor - blocked? So he really has to go for the big one, doesn't he?
Statewide Democrats since 1990:
Sen. Joe Donnelly 2013-2019
Sen. Evan Bayh 1999-2011
Gov. Joe Kernan 2003-2005
Gov. Frank O'Bannon 1997-2003
Gov. Evan Bayh 1989-1997

Current Democratic Congressmen:
Pete Visclosky, 1st District, 1985-current
Andre Carson, 7th District, 2008-current

Last 4 Presidential elections:
Trump 56.5% Clinton 37.4%
Romney 54.1% Obama 43.9%
Obama 50% McCain 48.9%
Bush 59.9% Kerry 39.3%

It IS red - but it's not Wyoming red. And his congressional district has been very purple for a few decades. If he wanted to run for Congress, he'd likely win.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:13 AM
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Ah... the name is Booty Judge, baby!

Maltese language is so interesting. It's the last surviving form of the Arabic spoken in Sicily a thousand years ago. It's basically North African Arabic dialect in Sicilian-Italian based orthography and loaded up with tons of Italian loanwords.

The name Buttiġieġ is definitely of Arabic origin, but because it's dialectal it's kind of opaque to my Classical Arabic learning.

I analyze it as Bu = father, plus a probable verbal noun *ittijāj derived from the root ’jj 'to burn, blaze, flame'. Father of Blazing, perhaps. I could be wrong, but that's the only Arabic root I've found that could result in the Maltese orthography -ttiġieġ. The ġ with a dot over it indicates the alveolopalatal affricate /dʒ/ and relates to the Italian g when it comes before e or i, as in Geppetto or Gina.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:20 AM
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I'm inclined to agree that this is a dry run for 2024, designed to raise his profile and move the Overton window on "gay President" in the necessary direction. But the way American politics has been going lately, for all we know he could end up winning.
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Old 03-15-2019, 11:17 AM
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Does he have a signature issue that he wants to push? He's gay, and young, and he served in Afghanistan. Anything else, to distinguish him from the crowd? What are his outstanding achievements as mayor?

Regards,
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Old 03-15-2019, 11:48 AM
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Does he have a signature issue that he wants to push? He's gay, and young, and he served in Afghanistan. Anything else, to distinguish him from the crowd?
Those already distinguish him from the crowd. Also a Rhodes Scholar and he earned a commendation for his counterterrorism work in Afghanistan.

Quote:
What are his outstanding achievements as mayor?
Apart from getting elected at 29 and then re-elected, which are achievements unto themselves? His website says "Under his leadership, South Bend has reimagined its role in the global economy with job growth and major investment in advanced industries, with a focus on data and technology." I don't know what that means specifically but I've found some references to success in bringing investment to the city and the business community seem to like him. Here's a quote from the President of the Chamber of Commerce:
Quote:
“We have been big fans from the time we first met him, when he threw his hat into the ring. We hosted a forum and he knocked people’s socks off,” said Jeff Rea, President of South Bend Chamber of Commerce.

“He impressed us right out of the gate. Pete is a regular guy even if he did go to Harvard and has all the academic credentials.

“Pete runs the city in a very businesslike way, making South Bend attractive to investors and he has had some success.

“Our city went through some tough times when the national economy imploded. He has made people think differently, getting them to look forward rather than back, reminiscing about when we built Studebakers.

“He connects well. He is the sort of guy you would want to watch a ball game or have a beer with.”

Tim Scott, a Democrat member of the city council, says Mr Buttigieg has ushered in exciting times in the city.

“Pete brought a spark to the city and jump-started it.

“He will contemplate a decision before he makes it. Sometimes it can take a little time for people to get to know him. But he is very personable and listens to people.

“He is not boisterous like our president, but very analytical.

“Pete would be a definite voice for the fly-over section of the US, which can be ignored from time to time.”
It's all a promising start, although I'd be reluctant to say this is remotely sufficient for a White House bid. But as I said, we live in odd times politically and given that Republicans have pretty much forfeited the right to accuse any other presidential candidate of inadequate experience, who know what may happen.
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Old 03-15-2019, 11:51 AM
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BTW - the best bit of that Telegraph article:
Quote:
Enter Mr Buttigieg, whose name is of Maltese origin, pronounced bootedgedge, which translates as Lord of the poultry.
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Old 03-15-2019, 12:35 PM
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BTW - the best bit of that Telegraph article:
Well, it beats Horshack: "the cattle are dying."
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:05 PM
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OK, yes, getting elected mayor twice is an accomplishment. Every one of the Democratic candidates has an accomplishment of at least that magnitude.
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Old 03-15-2019, 04:14 PM
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Well, not Yang. He's apparently qualified for the debates, so I guess we hsve to count him as a real candidate now
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:30 PM
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For weeks, I have been very confused as to why anyone gave any credence to a presidential run by the mayor of the fourth largest city in Indiana. But then today I heard on the 538 podcast that he is openly gay, and that was a lightbulb moment.

Last edited by SlackerInc; 03-15-2019 at 05:31 PM.
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Old 03-15-2019, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by The President of the Chamber of Commerce of South Bend
“Our city went through some tough times when the national economy imploded. He has made people think differently, getting them to look forward rather than back, reminiscing about when we built Studebakers."
He should use a Studebaker as his official campaign vehicle. Not one of the old 40s ones but like an Avanti. It should have a Maltese Falcon as the hood ornament also.
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Old 03-15-2019, 08:55 PM
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Ah... the name is Booty Judge, baby!

Maltese language is so interesting. It's the last surviving form of the Arabic spoken in Sicily a thousand years ago. It's basically North African Arabic dialect in Sicilian-Italian based orthography and loaded up with tons of Italian loanwords.

The name Buttiġieġ is definitely of Arabic origin, but because it's dialectal it's kind of opaque to my Classical Arabic learning.

I analyze it as Bu = father, plus a probable verbal noun *ittijāj derived from the root ’jj 'to burn, blaze, flame'. Father of Blazing, perhaps. I could be wrong, but that's the only Arabic root I've found that could result in the Maltese orthography -ttiġieġ. The ġ with a dot over it indicates the alveolopalatal affricate /dʒ/ and relates to the Italian g when it comes before e or i, as in Geppetto or Gina.
Thank you.
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Old 03-16-2019, 12:04 AM
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For weeks, I have been very confused as to why anyone gave any credence to a presidential run by the mayor of the fourth largest city in Indiana. But then today I heard on the 538 podcast that he is openly gay, and that was a lightbulb moment.
This sounds really dismissive and makes me wonder if you have read what others have posted in this thread: Rhodes scholar, decorated veteran of the war in Afghanistan, held in high regard by Democratic Party regulars AND the local Chamber of Commerce, turned around the local economy, young, charismatic speaker and comes across very well on television and interviews. Most of those are things that would give credence to a run for president even if he wasn't gay. Odd that's the only part of his story you picked up on.
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Old 03-16-2019, 10:59 AM
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Those already distinguish him from the crowd. Also a Rhodes Scholar and he earned a commendation for his counterterrorism work in Afghanistan.
Those are fine achievements, especially the military service, but does he have a signature issue that he wants to enact if elected? And especially something that distinguishes him from the dozens of other Democrats, many of whom are equally academically accomplished and some of which have military experience.
Quote:
Apart from getting elected at 29 and then re-elected, which are achievements unto themselves? His website says "Under his leadership, South Bend has reimagined its role in the global economy with job growth and major investment in advanced industries, with a focus on data and technology." I don't know what that means...
That's kind of what I mean - his own website doesn't say anything specific that couldn't be said about many other mayors.
Quote:
But as I said, we live in odd times politically and given that Republicans have pretty much forfeited the right to accuse any other presidential candidate of inadequate experience, who know what may happen.
I wasn't thinking about Republicans - is there anything about him that would tend to work against accusations of inexperience from other Democrats? Or would tend to attract votes, more than for other candidates?

IOW he should be nominated by the Democrats because
  • he's young,
  • he's a veteran,
  • he is openly gay
  • he got elected mayor of South Bend twice, AND
  • fill in the blank here.

Regards,
Shodan
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Old 03-16-2019, 11:32 AM
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IOW he should be nominated by the Democrats because
  • he's young,
  • he's a veteran,
  • he is openly gay
  • he got elected mayor of South Bend twice, AND
  • fill in the blank here.

Regards,
Shodan
Your lack of a clearer picture of his candidacy is not surprising, and I’m not taking a swipe at you there, Shodan — he’s a bottom-of-the-second-tier candidate at best, and hasn’t gotten a lot of coverage. (He’s still fundraising on the “give me $3 so I can qualify to get in the debates” message, I believe.)
Here are some reasons he’s near the top of my list, and that I gave him that three bucks this morning:
1) he sounds smart and honest when he speaks, especially when interviewed. (Low bar? Maybe, but people have trouble clearing it.) He’s a natural born vote-winner in the way Obama was, IMHO. Shallow reason? Sure.
2) He’s thoughtful and open-minded in discussing policy. Vox interviewed him at SXSW — Apple link here https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/...=1000431633038 or look for The Weeds podcast on your platform. Answers on policy questions seem nuanced, not programmatic or calculated.
3) He’s future-oriented. Concerned about automation->job loss and climate change.
4) He’s willing to look at bold solutions. For example, he and Warren are (I believe) the strongest anti-filibuster voices in the field — which, if you’re serious about making big policy, is the right stance to take.
5) he seems like a fundamentally decent person. See his letter to local Muslims after Christchurch: https://twitter.com/petebuttigieg/st...501042177?s=21
6) if he gets the VP nod, I’d love to see him debate Pence.

So, Shodan, I look forward to not hearing about how he’s just an identity politics candidate anymore. (NB: in the DemocratIC Party, “gay white man” is not an identity that is going to swing the biggest vote blocs.)

Last edited by snoe; 03-16-2019 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 03-16-2019, 11:51 AM
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Those are fine achievements, especially the military service, but does he have a signature issue that he wants to enact if elected? And especially something that distinguishes him from the dozens of other Democrats, many of whom are equally academically accomplished and some of which have military experience....

Regards,
Shodan
Emphasis mine.
Among declared candidates, you are talking about Tulsi Gabbard and no one else. Seth Moulton is also a veteran, and might run. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...andidates.html

Did I miss somebody? Because both Gabbard and Moilton would be running anti-DemocratIC Party candidacies (in different ways).

PS: how many “dozens” of Democrats do you think will run? It looks to be about two, at most, and that’s including people like Andrew Yang and Marianne Williamson.
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Old 03-16-2019, 12:46 PM
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BTW - the best bit of that Telegraph article:
OK! Thanks, Gyrate! The hidden d of dajāj explains it! Dajāj means poultry in Classical Arabic. Please cancel what I said above.

Maltese has somehow devoiced the initial d- into a t-. That was the piece of the puzzle I'd been missing. So Classical Arabic أبو الدجاج Abū al-dajāj 'Father of poultry' becomes Maltese Bu-t-tiġieġ.
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Old 03-16-2019, 12:54 PM
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So it's just the Maltese for 'Chicken-farmer'?
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Old 03-16-2019, 01:25 PM
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Your lack of a clearer picture of his candidacy is not surprising, and I’m not taking a swipe at you there, Shodan — he’s a bottom-of-the-second-tier candidate at best, and hasn’t gotten a lot of coverage. (He’s still fundraising on the “give me $3 so I can qualify to get in the debates” message, I believe.)
Here are some reasons he’s near the top of my list, and that I gave him that three bucks this morning:
1) he sounds smart and honest when he speaks, especially when interviewed. (Low bar? Maybe, but people have trouble clearing it.) He’s a natural born vote-winner in the way Obama was, IMHO. Shallow reason? Sure.
2) He’s thoughtful and open-minded in discussing policy. Vox interviewed him at SXSW — Apple link here https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/...=1000431633038 or look for The Weeds podcast on your platform. Answers on policy questions seem nuanced, not programmatic or calculated.
3) He’s future-oriented. Concerned about automation->job loss and climate change.
4) He’s willing to look at bold solutions. For example, he and Warren are (I believe) the strongest anti-filibuster voices in the field — which, if you’re serious about making big policy, is the right stance to take.
5) he seems like a fundamentally decent person. See his letter to local Muslims after Christchurch: https://twitter.com/petebuttigieg/st...501042177?s=21
6) if he gets the VP nod, I’d love to see him debate Pence.

So, Shodan, I look forward to not hearing about how he’s just an identity politics candidate anymore. (NB: in the DemocratIC Party, “gay white man” is not an identity that is going to swing the biggest vote blocs.)
A week or so ago I turned on the radio in the car and heard an interview in progress, not knowing who it was talking.

Dang, I thought, who is this guy? Impressive! Then I found out that yes it was Mayor Pete.

Again, dang, I thought. This time about the shame that he has no chance.
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Old 03-16-2019, 01:25 PM
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For what it's worth, Google Translate does have Maltese, but it can't do anything with "Buttigieg". In fact, it considers it English, no doubt due to most instances of the word being on English-language pages.
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Old 03-16-2019, 01:42 PM
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Again, dang, I thought. This time about the shame that he has no chance.
Really? Could he not be the American Trudeau? He's older than Pitt the Younger when the latter became Prime Minister.
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Old 03-16-2019, 02:48 PM
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Again, dang, I thought. This time about the shame that he has no chance.
My two cents? If you like him, support him (just by talking about him as a good candidate).
And don’t get committed to him (or anyone else) to a degree where you’ll be devastated that they don’t get the nom.
Moderation in all things.
PS: according to his Twitter account, he has enough small-dollar donations, as of today, to get in the debates. I don’t expect him to win, but I’m glad he’ll be there, because he brings a lot to the table.
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