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Old 03-14-2020, 07:16 PM
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They aren't the only small group. Not every pandering to them is cost free in other groups.
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Old 03-14-2020, 07:19 PM
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I don't know what the Bernie-or-bust holdouts think they're going to accomplish. If they screw Joe out of an election, do they think we're going to vote for a bitch-ass socialist in 2024? I would commit the rest of my life to finishing off the communist element, purifying the progressive movement first. I mean if the country's going to end up in fascist hands anyway, fuck it - crush the traitors in your own ranks first. I would work with Trump voters to do this - jail the M4a people and what not.
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Old 03-14-2020, 07:21 PM
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Ok, I think it's beddy bye time now, asahi.
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Old 03-14-2020, 07:23 PM
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https://nypost.com/2020/03/14/moment...close-schools/

Scumbag Bernie Bro "man of the people" Mayor DeBlasio won't even close schools, exposing his teachers and students to COVID despite the fact there's a state of emergency.
  #255  
Old 03-14-2020, 09:18 PM
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In my state, which votes Tuesday, virtually all political ads for the past week have been Sanders ads---he's spending very big, here. The two I'm seeing most often: the 'fake Obama endorsement' one with sound bites of Obama saying nice things about Bernie, and one with scary music and graphics that asserts that Biden will DEFINITELY WITHOUT ANY DOUBT Take Away Your Social Security and Medicare.

Both are screamingly dishonest. But they are playing in such heavy rotation that I suppose they'll convince at least some voters to either vote for Sanders, or (more likely) use the unpleasantness as an excuse not to go out and vote. (And of course the c-virus will contribute to people staying away from the polls, too.)....
Wow, even after being called on his Bullshit about Biden and Socsec, Bernie is still running with that Big Lie? Amazing. That man has no shame and no ethics or morals.

We dodged a bullet there.
  #256  
Old 03-14-2020, 09:39 PM
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Wow, even after being called on his Bullshit about Biden and Socsec, Bernie is still running with that Big Lie? Amazing. That man has no shame and no ethics or morals.

We dodged a bullet there.
To be fair, we should now be used to no shame, ethics, or morals where the White House is concerned.
  #257  
Old 03-14-2020, 11:54 PM
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Biden is generally distrusted about his commitment to mainstream popular ideas like maintaining social security and providing Medicare for all because he has been weak on these issues.

Why not show Bernie has a different, more popular and elecable record on those issues.

https://socialsecurityworks.org/2020...e-for-concern/
  #258  
Old 03-15-2020, 02:06 AM
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Biden is generally distrusted about his commitment to mainstream popular ideas like maintaining social security and providing Medicare for all because he has been weak on these issues.

Why not show Bernie has a different, more popular and elecable record on those issues.

https://socialsecurityworks.org/2020...e-for-concern/
Even after Bernie has been constantly rejected by older voters? That dog ain’t hunting
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  #259  
Old 03-15-2020, 03:16 AM
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How Bernie can gain the Oval Office


He won't steal the nomination from Biden. He won't be elected US President. CoViD-19 is his friend. After the fever sweeps away enough GOP senators, Dem survivors elect the old guy as President Pro Tempore. Then when the virus disincorporates the current Prez, Veep, and Madame Speaker, Bernie succeeds... while he lasts.
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Old 03-15-2020, 03:59 AM
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Not sure what that all means Rio, but surely in this crisis, a leader who actually identifies problems and elucidates solutions is better than free market wafflers like Trump and Biden.

The difference is stark. Woukd you want to be K E of Biden's 10 millions uninsured right now?
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Old 03-15-2020, 02:05 PM
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Not sure what that all means Rio, but surely in this crisis, a leader who actually identifies problems and elucidates solutions is better than free market wafflers like Trump and Biden.

The difference is stark. Woukd you want to be K E of Biden's 10 millions uninsured right now?
Would you care to clarify that statement? Or are you just rehashing the same Bernie Bro nonsense?
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  #262  
Old 03-15-2020, 02:16 PM
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Big Sanders fan Shaun King on twitter is mad Biden is urging his people to vote. I predict many people will stay home but I don't have a problem with Biden telling people to vote
  #263  
Old 03-15-2020, 02:20 PM
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Biden is generally distrusted about his commitment to mainstream popular ideas like maintaining social security and providing Medicare for all because he has been weak on these issues.

Why not show Bernie has a different, more popular and elecable record on those issues.
Actually, no, he hasn't, and Biden is not weak on those issues. I just pointed out that Biden is 100% behind SocSec and Sanders is lying thru his teeth, as Poltifact and other sources said. Yet, you go ahead and post it again, even after being disproved? Arent you reading the thread?

and it doesnt matter since Bernie has lost.
  #264  
Old 03-15-2020, 02:25 PM
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...

The difference is stark. Woukd you want to be K E of Biden's 10 millions uninsured right now?
Biden is proposing a workable plan to cover every American, one that could actually pass congress.


And it doesnt matter as Bernie has lost.
  #265  
Old 03-15-2020, 02:34 PM
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Big Sanders fan Shaun King on twitter is mad Biden is urging his people to vote. I predict many people will stay home but I don't have a problem with Biden telling people to vote
I think I finally blocked Shaun King, but I’ve certainly seen plenty of red rose twitter telling old people to stay home. Not sure how effective they’ll be, although I’m sure turnout will be depressed.

On the other hand, Bernie’s college students also are having their lives upended with campuses closing and students going home. So, that won’t work in Bernie’s favor. Of course, his revolutionary army seems to be more Twitter warriors than voters anyway.
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  #266  
Old 03-15-2020, 03:04 PM
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I expect Bernie to use the coronavirus pandemic to hammer Medicare for All as hard as he possibly can in tonight's debate. Hammer it like no tomorrow. His last life hopes for attaining the U.S. presidency will expire in a few hours if he doesn't.
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Old 03-15-2020, 03:37 PM
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I expect Bernie to use the coronavirus pandemic to hammer Medicare for All as hard as he possibly can in tonight's debate. Hammer it like no tomorrow. His last life hopes for attaining the U.S. presidency will expire in a few hours if he doesn't.
Oh really? What states do you think Bernie can win over the next week or so?
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Old 03-15-2020, 04:31 PM
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Oh really? What states do you think Bernie can win over the next week or so?
None, but you gotta throw Hail Mary passes.
  #269  
Old 03-15-2020, 04:38 PM
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He doesn't have possession, Biden can run out the clock.
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Old 03-15-2020, 04:44 PM
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And, it’ll depend on if the moderators allow him to always change the subject. How’s he going to deal with the mother of all recessions? This isn’t a financial crises, he can’t just blame big banks and Wall Street.
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  #271  
Old 03-15-2020, 05:34 PM
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I expect Bernie to use the coronavirus pandemic to hammer Medicare for All as hard as he possibly can in tonight's debate. Hammer it like no tomorrow. His last life hopes for attaining the U.S. presidency will expire in a few hours if he doesn't.

Yeah, well Bernies plan has exactly zero chance of passing congress. And Sanders plan has nothing whatsoever to do with Medicare.

Biden has plans that will cover all Americans- and could pass Congress. Uphill battle, yes, but possible.
  #272  
Old 03-15-2020, 06:02 PM
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And, it’ll depend on if the moderators allow him to always change the subject. How’s he going to deal with the mother of all recessions? This isn’t a financial crises, he can’t just blame big banks and Wall Street.
Sure he can.

Quote:
BS: We can't allow greedy billionaires and corporations to ruin our economy!

Moderator: But what would you DO?

BS: We are determined to take back our economy from the billionaires and corporations that are ruining it!

Moderator: How?

BS: On day one we will enact laws that will stop the billionaires and corporations from ruining our economy!

Moderator: What laws, specifically?

BS: Laws that will show the corporations and billionaires that their time is up. The American people have said, enough is enough! We will dramatically reduce wealth inequality. Let's be clear, the time is now to create an economy that works for all of us, not just the top 1%.

Moderator: How? ......oh, never mind. *sigh*


(Fictional transcript. Emphasis in quotation, mine.)
  #273  
Old 03-16-2020, 12:31 AM
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None, but you gotta throw Hail Mary passes.
You know what happens when you throw a pass but there's nobody downfield to catch it?
  #274  
Old 03-16-2020, 12:38 AM
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None, but you gotta throw Hail Mary passes.
This isn't a football game. There are real world consequences here.

Sanders can't beat Biden at this point. But he can help Trump beat Biden.

Sanders is in a kingmaker position. He needs to decide who he'd rather see as President for the next four years; Joe Biden or Donald Trump?

And Sanders supporters need to ask themselves the same question. If they feel better about it, they can tell themselves that Sanders is choosing who will be President.
  #275  
Old 03-16-2020, 01:22 AM
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I was legitimately buying into the hype that Bernie was going to give an airing to his issues but not really attack Biden, maybe even work toward transitioning to unity. Instead, he attacked Biden on decades-old votes and statements that have fuck-all to do with anything coming up in the immediate future. What a chump I was, to imagine that Bernie could see anything beyond himself, ever.
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  #276  
Old 03-16-2020, 01:38 AM
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Actually, no, he hasn't, and Biden is not weak on those issues. I just pointed out that Biden is 100% behind SocSec and Sanders is lying thru his teeth, as Poltifact and other sources said. Yet, you go ahead and post it again, even after being disproved? Arent you reading the thread?

and it doesnt matter since Bernie has lost.
PolitiFact doesn't say that, they say it depends which parts of Biden's record you look at. Sanders doesn't have any history of wanting to weaken SocSec.

Did you read the article from the Intercept? It doesn't try to give some one word or phrase summary, it discusses the issue in detail. I don't get the obsession with taking one narrow reading of a statement and scoring a number of Pinocchio's without any context or use of common sense. This isn't high school debate.

I'm not bringing this up because Bernie deserves some magic points for good past deeds. It shows he has consistently backed good ideas and can show leadership, even when ideas aren't yet popular. It means he'd be a good leader now and has good moral judgement and the strength to assert good ideas.
  #277  
Old 03-16-2020, 11:57 AM
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PolitiFact doesn't say that, they say it depends which parts of Biden's record you look at. Sanders doesn't have any history of wanting to weaken SocSec. ...
It rates it as Mostly False.


Yes, Sanders does.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...-guide-claims/
In one case — 1983 — Sanders attacks Biden for supporting a deal that Sanders himself had praised. That’s rich.
  #278  
Old 03-21-2020, 06:08 AM
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Maybe you have been reading different bits of your website but even your website says Bernie has a point about Biden's record on Social Security.

https://www.politifact.com/article/2...nders-over-so/


" Biden co-sponsored an amendment to freeze military and domestic spending for a year, which included some built-in-adjustments for Social Security benefits — tantamount to cutting the program."

In the 1995 speech, Biden was more explicit: He bragged about advocating for cuts to Social Security. “I’m up for reelection this year and I’m gonna remind everybody what I did at home, which is gonna cost me politically,” Biden said, removing his glasses. “When I argued if we should freeze federal spending, I meant Social Security as well. I meant Medicare and Medicaid. I meant veterans’ bene— I meant every single solitary thing in the government. And I not only tried it once, I tried it twice, I tried it a third time, and I tried it a fourth time.”

I mean, Biden is attachable on Social Security because of his record. It's important to read these websites more deeply and see what different potential candidates have said and done.
  #279  
Old 03-21-2020, 06:41 AM
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I mean, Biden is attachable on Social Security because of his record. It's important to read these websites more deeply and see what different potential candidates have said and done.
Agreed. We really need to examine the records of Michael Dukakis, Adlai Stevenson, Daffy Duck, Evo Morales, and all the other “potential candidates.”
  #280  
Old 03-21-2020, 06:54 AM
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Biden did say that stuff about Social Security. And Bernie ran ads with audio clips of him saying it. And the Democratic primary electorate shrugged and gave Biden big wins anyway. To win the nomination now, Bernie would have to start winning every primary by at least 30 points, even though he is nearly 30 points down in national polls. It’s just not happening.
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Old 03-21-2020, 07:11 AM
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Sanders did a video last night with guest speakers and he certainly does not look like he's quitting any time soon.
  #282  
Old 03-21-2020, 08:03 AM
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Sanders did a video last night with guest speakers and he certainly does not look like he's quitting any time soon.
What a fucking asshole. I hereby take back all the nice things I’ve said about him over the last 35 years.

Yes, 35 years — I remember my high school history teacher (who had recently graduated from a small liberal arts college in New England) telling us about this socialist mayor of a city in Vermont, and we talked about what that meant and why it was a good thing to see.

Last edited by JKellyMap; 03-21-2020 at 08:03 AM.
  #283  
Old 03-21-2020, 08:10 AM
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Sanders did a video last night with guest speakers and he certainly does not look like he's quitting any time soon.
What did he say in the video? I'm not going to condemn him for making a video unless I know what's in it and it's inappropriate.
  #284  
Old 03-21-2020, 08:12 AM
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What did he say in the video? I'm not going to condemn him for making a video unless I know what's in it and it's inappropriate.
Why do you need to know any more than that he failed to say “I AM quitting, now (or very soon)”?
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Old 03-21-2020, 09:27 AM
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video was pretty much all about the pandemic and what should be done about it . I only watched the first part so he might have covered other stuff later.

Here it is, does not work for me but maybe it will for others

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBstcJ2GjGQ

Last edited by Bijou Drains; 03-21-2020 at 09:30 AM.
  #286  
Old 03-21-2020, 09:37 AM
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Thanks for your detailed report.
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Old 03-21-2020, 09:41 AM
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Why do you need to know any more than that he failed to say “I AM quitting, now (or very soon)”?
Because staying in the race right now and talking about the pandemic isn't hurting Biden or anyone else.
  #288  
Old 03-21-2020, 09:47 AM
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Meanwhile, his campaign manager sent out this:
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No sugarcoating it, last night did not go the way we wanted.

And while our campaign has won the battle of ideas, we are losing the battle over electability to Joe Biden.

So we wanted to give you an update on what is next for Bernie and for our campaign:

First, Bernie will likely have a vote on the coronavirus in the Senate today. He’ll take that vote, and you can expect him to continue his fight to ensure we are protecting working people, low-income people, and the most vulnerable communities, not just giant corporations and Wall Street in any response to the virus.

Then after this vote today, Bernie and Jane are going to get on a plane back to Vermont. Once there, they’ll begin holding conversations with supporters to get input and assess the path forward for our campaign. We will keep you updated as those conversations progress.

In the meantime, please continue to stay safe, and thank you for everything you’ve done so far. It means the world to Bernie and Jane.
Sounds like suspending the campaign is nigh.
  #289  
Old 03-21-2020, 10:01 AM
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I can relate. Every time I land in Vermont, the last thing I want to do is continue to campaign, or ever leave for that matter.
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Old 03-21-2020, 10:46 AM
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I guess he thinks with no primaries for a while he doesn't need to drop out . The next big state is Wisconsin April 7th. After that no more primaries until April 28th when NY and Penn vote, assuming they don't delay the vote. Makes no sense for him to stay past 4/28.
  #291  
Old 03-21-2020, 12:14 PM
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Biden did a press briefing via call with the former Surgeon General with him so it seems he's already pivoting to GE mode. Also expected to start running his own shadow briefings daily from Monday although I am personally sceptical about that being a good idea. He doesn't currently hold office and the airwaves would be better to be reserved for governors and mayors who are leading the charge now. Biden doing it would appear political because what can he say or do that pushes the envelope into direct action. It would be like Obama turning up to hold a press conference. Might make people feel good and better about the situation but ultimately he holds no power.
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Old 03-21-2020, 01:42 PM
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Because staying in the race right now and talking about the pandemic isn't hurting Biden or anyone else.
Well, that is certainly untrue and would be for any pair of candidates in this situation at this point in a nomination contest. For example every dollar a candidate spends fighting for the nomination is a dollar less for fighting the general election.

In general I don't have a problem with Sanders using his bully pulpit to shift the Overton window a bit - that is frankly why most candidates run, because most never have a shot at landing the nomination to begin with. But there comes a time when it is probably best to withdraw and let the winning candidate campaign without having to play defense with his own party. I had no issues with Sanders continuing through this last week, but his theoretical path to the nomination is now almost certainly nil barring a medical emergency or a live boy/dead girl scenario. It's probably time to stop wasting money and hang it up.
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Old 03-21-2020, 01:44 PM
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I don't think Biden is going to spend very much on ads from now to the convention. He may run a few TV ads right before the primaries that are coming up
  #294  
Old 03-21-2020, 02:26 PM
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Biden did a press briefing via call with the former Surgeon General with him so it seems he's already pivoting to GE mode. Also expected to start running his own shadow briefings daily from Monday although I am personally sceptical about that being a good idea. He doesn't currently hold office and the airwaves would be better to be reserved for governors and mayors who are leading the charge now. Biden doing it would appear political because what can he say or do that pushes the envelope into direct action. It would be like Obama turning up to hold a press conference. Might make people feel good and better about the situation but ultimately he holds no power.
It's general election campaigning. The more Biden looks competent and has a plan for public health, compared to Trump who talks about how well, financially, Walmart is doing in this crisis, the better for Biden.
  #295  
Old 03-21-2020, 03:56 PM
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Well, that is certainly untrue and would be for any pair of candidates in this situation at this point in a nomination contest. For example every dollar a candidate spends fighting for the nomination is a dollar less for fighting the general election.

In general I don't have a problem with Sanders using his bully pulpit to shift the Overton window a bit - that is frankly why most candidates run, because most never have a shot at landing the nomination to begin with. But there comes a time when it is probably best to withdraw and let the winning candidate campaign without having to play defense with his own party. I had no issues with Sanders continuing through this last week, but his theoretical path to the nomination is now almost certainly nil barring a medical emergency or a live boy/dead girl scenario. It's probably time to stop wasting money and hang it up.
Is there really any appetite for moving that damn window now? Bernie’s been running his mouth for 5 years, we know his message. Now all he’s got is a twitter troll army. There won’t be any primaries for a while, there’s no appetite for his massive rallies and finger waggling, no reason for another debate. All politicians have an ego, Bernie’s is larger than most but it’s time to throw in the towel. He’s still a senator.
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  #296  
Old 03-21-2020, 05:44 PM
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Is there really any appetite for moving that damn window now? Bernie’s been running his mouth for 5 years, we know his message. Now all he’s got is a twitter troll army. There won’t be any primaries for a while, there’s no appetite for his massive rallies and finger waggling, no reason for another debate. All politicians have an ego, Bernie’s is larger than most but it’s time to throw in the towel. He’s still a senator.
I was going to say the same. The Overton window isn't going anymore leftward at this point. Bernie Sanders is a known quantity, and what actual ideas he has (as opposed to outrage/spleen) are well-trodden ground. Let him "assess" with his family and apparatchiks for a few days and then GTFO of this race. (Please.)
  #297  
Old 03-21-2020, 09:39 PM
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With Biden out of the picture, this has been a great chance for Bernie to show his leadership and the advantage of healthcare for all USA people.

Imagine losing your job now or being a gig worker with no health care under your unique first world yet cruel system.

Hopefully Biden drops out of the race now his policies have been laid bare as feeble.
  #298  
Old 03-21-2020, 09:53 PM
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You're always good for a laugh, Manwich. Or a chuckle at least.
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  #299  
Old 03-21-2020, 11:20 PM
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Another possible attack for Sanders would be to investigate Biden under 18 U.S. Code § 599 for Biden's offer of a cabinet position for Yang in exchange for Yang's endorsement.
  #300  
Old 03-21-2020, 11:27 PM
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With Biden out of the picture, this has been a great chance for Bernie to show his leadership and the advantage of healthcare for all USA people.

Imagine losing your job now or being a gig worker with no health care under your unique first world yet cruel system.

Hopefully Biden drops out of the race now his policies have been laid bare as feeble.
Reported.

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