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  #551  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:28 AM
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OP, you kind of fucked up. With only a single post, you created a multi page thread of incredible, and increasing stupidity. That was an accomplishment verging on award winning. But here you've returned, and ruined the whole shitty thing. Like an artist who knows when to stop painting, I thought you had a kind of remote control of this mess. But no.
  #552  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:30 AM
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Nobody says it’s an incestuous marriage. The issue is a sham marriage for fraudulent immigration purposes.

I didn't know this thread was about Trump.....

  #553  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:45 AM
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OP, you kind of fucked up. With only a single post, you created a multi page thread of incredible, and increasing stupidity. That was an accomplishment verging on award winning. But here you've returned, and ruined the whole shitty thing. Like an artist who knows when to stop painting, I thought you had a kind of remote control of this mess. But no.

Meh, I guess I was being kind of selfish, but I wanted to post and wanted the freedom to say motherfucker, so here I am.
  #554  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:48 AM
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Ah yes, the totally original, never-seen-before Trump deflection which is the pinnacle of cleverness.
  #555  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:07 PM
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Ah yes, the totally original, never-seen-before Trump deflection which is the pinnacle of cleverness.
YOu realize there is far more evidence to question Melania's immigration paperwork then there is for Ms. Omar -- or maybe you don't.

Last edited by simster; 09-11-2019 at 12:10 PM.
  #556  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:11 PM
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Don't argue with him - the man has extensive expertise in deflecting the conversation away from weak arguments.
  #557  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:17 PM
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....Says the angry person saying angry things.
Jesus. Could you be any more obviously a sock? 16 posts, 15 of them in this thread in the last day. Go peddle your garbage elsewhere.
  #558  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:18 PM
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YOu realize there is far more evidence to question Melania's immigration paperwork then there is for Ms. Omar -- or maybe you don't.
This should be good.

What aspect of Melanias “immigration paperwork” should we be questioning?
  #559  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:25 PM
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This should be good.

What aspect of Melanias “immigration paperwork” should we be questioning?
Read the link for yourself - its only a click away.
  #560  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:31 PM
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Jesus. Could you be any more obviously a sock? 16 posts, 15 of them in this thread in the last day. Go peddle your garbage elsewhere.
You know what the problem with small forums are?

People like you. I’m over here minding my own business passing time, and here you are dangling off my balls telling me to leave like you own the place, all angry & shit.

I’m very pleased to meet all of you, and you will be seeing more of me, so prepare yourself, or ignore me, but I’m not a “sock” and I’ve never posted on this forum before this OP.

Feel free to report me, or deal with it.

I guess I kinda feel like Omar. I’m like, a super DUPER victim surrounded by bigots.
  #561  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:34 PM
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Read the link for yourself - its only a click away.
Right back at ya. Post the relevant factual evidence from the article.
  #562  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:49 PM
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You know what the problem with small forums are?

People like you. I’m over here minding my own business passing time, and here you are dangling off my balls telling me to leave like you own the place, all angry & shit.

I’m very pleased to meet all of you, and you will be seeing more of me, so prepare yourself, or ignore me, but I’m not a “sock” and I’ve never posted on this forum before this OP.

Feel free to report me, or deal with it.

I guess I kinda feel like Omar. I’m like, a super DUPER victim surrounded by bigots.
Fuck off, victim, and go cry your bitter tears elsewhere. You're a joke.
  #563  
Old 09-11-2019, 12:56 PM
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Of course not.
If you don't believe the arguments you are posting, why should anyone else?
  #564  
Old 09-11-2019, 01:29 PM
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I’m very pleased to meet all of you, and you will be seeing more of me, so prepare yourself, or ignore me
Well, ok, if you insist.
  #565  
Old 09-11-2019, 02:14 PM
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Right back at ya. Post the relevant factual evidence from the article.
Do your own homework or kindly stfu.
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  #566  
Old 09-11-2019, 04:06 PM
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It's pretty easy to pretend to support someone.

To what end? Have you seen the amount of time I have spent on the Elections board “pretending”? It’s not just some pro forma comment I make occasionally. What would be the point of this “deep cover”? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, get a grip.

And Kimstu, I am surrounded constantly by people (including members of my own family) who make that Chomsky/Zinn critique of American foreign policy even under Democratic administrations. Of course people have the right to make it – you know I am a strong advocate of freedom of speech – but I don’t want them in my party. I believe in having a big tent, but not to the point of including people who casually characterize the mainstream of the party in such slanderous terms.
  #567  
Old 09-11-2019, 04:15 PM
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I am surrounded constantly by people (including members of my own family) who make that Chomsky/Zinn critique of American foreign policy even under Democratic administrations. Of course people have the right to make it – you know I am a strong advocate of freedom of speech – but I don’t want them in my party.
You can want or not want whatever you please. But that doesn't mean you're entitled to misrepresent Omar's remarks as a personal attack on Obama in particular, or to pretend that they're somehow "slanderous" against other Democrats.

Gosh, there I go again, unrealistically expecting you to abide by any criteria of truth or fairness in what you say about Omar. You have declared openly that because you oppose some of her positions you're going to try to tarnish her reputation, by fair means and/or foul.

Of course you're going to keep lying about what she said and meant, and about anything else that could possibly be used to discredit her, no matter how many times you're corrected on the facts.

Last edited by Kimstu; 09-11-2019 at 04:16 PM.
  #568  
Old 09-11-2019, 04:46 PM
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I’m very pleased to meet all of you, and you will be seeing more of me, so prepare yourself, or ignore me, but I’m not a “sock” and I’ve never posted on this forum before this OP.
Well, ok, if you insist.
Already done, for my part. I'm getting too cranky to deal with these shitfuckers.
  #569  
Old 09-11-2019, 05:17 PM
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To what end? Have you seen the amount of time I have spent on the Elections board “pretending”? It’s not just some pro forma comment I make occasionally. What would be the point of this “deep cover”? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, get a grip.



And Kimstu, I am surrounded constantly by people (including members of my own family) who make that Chomsky/Zinn critique of American foreign policy even under Democratic administrations. Of course people have the right to make it – you know I am a strong advocate of freedom of speech – but I don’t want them in my party. I believe in having a big tent, but not to the point of including people who casually characterize the mainstream of the party in such slanderous terms.
I don't really care why you keep wrapping piles of shit in tobacco leaves, but you can't trick me into smoking one.
  #570  
Old 09-11-2019, 05:38 PM
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If you don't believe the arguments you are posting, why should anyone else?
My argument was not that King was happy or that he loved black people.

My argument was that the people on the same side of the political spectrum as King look at evidence like Congressional rebukes and having associations with known and generally accepted racists, and dismiss it all as hearsay and nonsense.

My assumption would be that you look at King and at the evidence that he made racist statements, that he was rebuked, and that he associates with known racists and find it reasonable to assume, from that genuine and obvious evidence that he's a racist. You see that because you have no political blindfold that steers your brain away from considering these things in an impartial light.

But my assumption would also be that you acknowledge that there are partisans on the right who are blindfolded and who are steered away from being able to consider those pieces of evidence honestly.

Omar has tweeted exactly these words, "Israel has hypnotized the world, may Allah awaken the people and help them see the evil doings of Israel." She has been rebuked by Congress for antisemitism. She associates with known and generally accepted antisemites.

...

I always say that there's a difference between knowing that something is true and believing that something is true.

Every smoker knows, for example, that they're killing themselves. But then when they get cancer or their dad dies of lung cancer or whatever, suddenly it dawns on them, "HOLY SHIT! THIS STUFF IS KILLING ME!", and they stop smoking.

There's a step beyond simply being aware that something is possible and will personally affect you, where you recognize that you were just deluding yourself and imagining that somehow you were the special one who wouldn't be affected.

You know that partisans can blind themselves to evidence.

If it's all the same evidence on the right for King as we see for Omar, why is King guilty and Omar is innocent?

Last edited by Sage Rat; 09-11-2019 at 05:40 PM.
  #571  
Old 09-11-2019, 06:06 PM
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She was not rebuked for antisemitism. Faux outrage over her comments was channeled into congress condemning both antisemitism and anti-Muslim bigotry (and a bunch of other stuff). She voted for it. All Dems voted for it. Most Republicans voted for it.

Some of the Republicans who didn't vote for it, didn't vote for because they wanted it to be a rebuke of Ilhan Omar and this wasn't one. They specifically said they voted against it because it didn't name Omar.

“This is a sham cover vote designed to avoid dealing with a rogue member.” - Rep. Chip Roy (Tex.)

Here's some other quotes...

“It’s not about her. It’s about these forms of hatred.” - Nancy Pelosi

“I feel confident that her words were not based on any anti-Semitic attitude.” - Nancy Pelosi

"We are tremendously proud to be part of a body that has put forth a condemnation of all forms of bigotry including anti-Semitism, racism and, white supremacy. Our nation is having a difficult conversation and we believe that is great progress." - Ilhan Omar, et. al.
  #572  
Old 09-11-2019, 06:10 PM
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If it's all the same evidence on the right for King as we see for Omar, why is King guilty and Omar is innocent?
Also, this is bullshit.

Made up fake bullshit is not the same as real, actual, white supremacism out in the open over the course of years.
  #573  
Old 09-11-2019, 06:52 PM
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but I don’t want them in my party.
Funny, I would guess there's more than a few people that think the same way about you...
  #574  
Old 09-11-2019, 07:04 PM
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....Says the angry person saying angry things.
Hello. Non-angry person here with some questions.
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Some quickie questions you might want to ask yourself:

1) Considering Omar has been the focus of so much news, and the focus of so many attacks of late, why do you think this story hasn't gained more traction in the mainstream media?
Not juicy enough? Conspiratorial coverup? Disinterest in the private lives of public figures?

2) Does Omar actually have a brother named Elmi?

3) Does Elmi now have US citizenship?

4) If Elmi were her brother, wouldn't he already be eligible for US citizenship?

5) What, if anything, do you mean by "among other things"? And If you don't actually have anything else to suggest, why did you feel the need to vaguely imply other nefarious deeds?

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/il...marry-brother/
Thanks.
  #575  
Old 09-11-2019, 07:06 PM
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Steve King Quotes...

"I would ask you to go back through history and figure out where are these contributions that have been made by these other categories of people that you are talking about, where did any other subgroup of people contribute more to civilization? Than — than western civilization itself that's rooted in western Europe, eastern Europe and the United States of America, and every place where Christianity settled the world."

"We can't restore our civilization with somebody else's babies."

"I’d like to see an America that’s just so homogenous that we look a lot the same."

"I guess I’m going to have to go get some dirt from Mexico to grow the next batch. Well, yeah, there’s plenty of dirt. And it’s coming from the West Coast, too, and a lot of other places, besides. This is the most dirt we’ve ever seen."

"White nationalist, white supremacist, Western civilization — how did that language become offensive?"
  #576  
Old 09-11-2019, 07:09 PM
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... why is King guilty and Omar is innocent?
Probably has something to do with them being two different people and all.
Quote:
If it's all the same evidence on the right for King as we see for Omar,...
Ah. There's your problem.
  #577  
Old 09-11-2019, 08:11 PM
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Funny, I would guess there's more than a few people that think the same way about you...

I support mainstream DFLers/Democrats. I don’t attack them.
  #578  
Old 09-11-2019, 08:52 PM
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Well, ok, if you insist.
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Already done, for my part. I'm getting too cranky to deal with these shitfuckers.
And that makes three, that I’m aware of, who have weak childish constitutions.
  #579  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:06 PM
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Steve King Quotes...
Any chance that one of them is older than the other by a bit?
  #580  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:10 PM
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Any chance that one of them is older than the other by a bit?
Maybe, but I think they're all pretty recent. They're all more recent than Omar's 'hypnotize' Tweet as far as I know.

Is this in any way relevant? If so, why?

I feel like you're getting at something. Could you just come out and post it?
  #581  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:17 PM
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Maybe, but I think they're all pretty recent. They're all more recent than Omar's 'hypnotize' Tweet as far as I know.

Is this in any way relevant? If so, why?

I feel like you're getting at something. Could you just come out and post it?
If they are recent, then that would be a fair rebuttal.

So, returning to the previous point, I would propose that you are human and that you are a Democrat who supports Ilhan Omar, by fiat of being part of the same team.

Do you have any particular reason to believe that you would somehow be immune to the same human condition which we both agree exists on the other side and have no reason to believe doesn't exist in both sides?
  #582  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:23 PM
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Also, this is bullshit.

Made up fake bullshit is not the same as real, actual, white supremacism out in the open over the course of years.
So, Ilhan Omar is not friendly with an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI and at least one Liberal news organization (Medium)?
  #583  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:51 PM
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So, Ilhan Omar is not friendly with an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI and at least one Liberal news organization (Medium)?
It is not as simple as that.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/w...tisemitic.html

One should ask here what peaceful pressure against Israel's penchant to grab more territory from Palestine could be applied. In any case, B.D.S. is not really as important or influential as many opponents to it paints it to be for propaganda reasons, but this time it is propaganda against anyone that does think that what Netanyahu and buddies think it would be a good idea.

Last edited by GIGObuster; 09-11-2019 at 10:52 PM.
  #584  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:02 PM
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I meant to say: but this time it is propaganda against anyone that does think that Netanyahu and buddies grabbing more territory would not be a good idea.

Last edited by GIGObuster; 09-11-2019 at 11:04 PM.
  #585  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:16 PM
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{...} an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI {...}
Got a link for that?

CMC fnord!
  #586  
Old 09-12-2019, 12:04 AM
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Got a link for that?
I too would like to see a cite for the claim that Omar is "friendly with an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI", partly because I honestly have no idea what "organization" is being referred to.

If it's meant to indicate the BDS movement, I think "organization" is an odd choice of term. There are various formally constituted organizations that support the BDS movement, such as the Palestinian BDS National Committee, but I wouldn't describe the BDS movement itself as an "organization". So yeah, cite please.
  #587  
Old 09-12-2019, 12:22 AM
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I too would like to see a cite {...}
I've a feeling that 'FBI designated anti-Semitic organization' is going to turn out to have a very loose definition.

CMC fnord!
  #588  
Old 09-12-2019, 12:26 AM
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If Omar dislikes the kind of secular and mostly progressive Jews you find in the US and on the Israeli left, that would truly be ugly anti-Semitism. But if she dislikes the genocidal ultra-orthodox Jews who wield a great deal of power in the current Israeli government, who could blame her?

I am happy to see Omar get tripped up by her fishy actions regarding her various marriages even if I don’t care about them on the merits, but I’m not willing to even obliquely seem to support Benjamin Netanyahu and his coalition of Iron Age theocrats.
  #589  
Old 09-12-2019, 01:21 AM
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It is not as simple as that.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/w...tisemitic.html

One should ask here what peaceful pressure against Israel's penchant to grab more territory from Palestine could be applied. In any case, B.D.S. is not really as important or influential as many opponents to it paints it to be for propaganda reasons, but this time it is propaganda against anyone that does think that what Netanyahu and buddies think it would be a good idea.
BDS is not the organization of which I spoke.

Also not what I was referring to but...

https://twitter.com/Ilhan/status/1113171033689874433

https://twitter.com/Jkbadawy

Translation of the "about" for Jkbadawy, according to Google, "The street that Mustafa and the palace of the emirate did not # glory_for martyrs".

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/voice-of-america/

https://www.voanews.com/africa/somal...tion-militants

https://www.un.org/press/en/2012/sc10545.doc.htm

Quote:
Jim’ale also controls Hormuud Telecommunications (“Hormuud”). Hormuud Telecommunications is a company identified as being one of the single largest financiers of Al-Shabaab, which includes large lump-sum payments to Al-Shabaab in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and these payments to Al-Shabaab were facilitated by Jim’ale.


Hormuud is operated by several former large shareholders of Al-Barakaat with Jim’ale being the largest shareholder. Hormuud Telecommunications was created by the former leaders of Al-Barakaat in an attempt to re-establish themselves as a dominant telecom provider in Somalia. In addition, Hormuud managers have provided Al-Shabaab leaders such as Hassan al-Turki, an Al-Shabaab-aligned military leader who was also listed by the Somalia/Eritrea Sanctions Committee, with personal communication networks.


In addition to providing funding, Hormuud Telecommunications has provided key material and logistical support to Al-Shabaab to include weapons, private fighters and ammunition. Spokespersons for moderate Somali groups have warned the Somali people not to use Hormuud Telecommunications Company, because Hormuud personnel listen in on conversations for Al-Shabaab. Additionally, Hormuud has cut off telephone service during Al-Shabaab attacks against pro-Somali Government forces.
https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1165688109176172544
  #590  
Old 09-12-2019, 01:33 AM
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Got a link for that?

CMC fnord!
https://www.investigativeproject.org...s/misc/265.pdf

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Originally Posted by crowmanyclouds View Post
I've a feeling that 'FBI designated anti-Semitic organization' is going to turn out to have a very loose definition.

CMC fnord!
It's not a Terrorist Organization designation, but my read would be that they are saying that it's a likely financial front for one (which targets Israelis) but outside of their legal reach. All they can do is warn people like Chuck Schumer to tell people to avoid them.
  #591  
Old 09-12-2019, 01:54 AM
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Um, that link is a letter from an FBI official in 2009---when Ilhan Omar was a 26-year-old college student---reporting that the FBI had severed its liaison relationship with the Council on American-Islamic Relations due to connections between CAIR and the "Palestine Committee", and between the latter organization and Hamas. The author notes:
Quote:
The FBI's decision to suspend formal contacts was not intended to reflect a wholesale judgment of the organization and its entire membership. Nevertheless, until we can resolve whether there continues to be a connection between CAIR or its executives and HAMAS, the FBI does not view CAIR as an appropriate liaison partner. It is important to note, however, that although the FBI has suspended all formal outreach activities with CAIR at this time, CAIR, its officers, and members have been encouraged to report any hate crime, violation of federal civil rights or suspicious activity to the FBI.
More recently,
Quote:
In 2011, The New York Times said that while the FBI and CAIR had no "formal relationship", CAIR officials and chapters worked regularly with FBI officials. [...]

The United States government has not listed CAIR as a terrorist organization.
Given that CAIR (whatever the possible connections of some of its members or leaders with Muslim Brotherhood network organizations) is extremely active in advocating for civil rights of Muslim Americans, which is a valid area of common cause with Muslim Americans and civil-rights supporters in general, I think your trying to spin this as Ilhan Omar being "friendly with an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI" is a ludicrously weak accusation.

Last edited by Kimstu; 09-12-2019 at 01:54 AM.
  #592  
Old 09-12-2019, 02:01 AM
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A fun retweet from Jkbadawy (translated to English by Google):

Quote:
Jihad Khaled Retweeted
ب .كّار
@Bakkar_74
·
Sep 8
The death of Palestinian prisoner Bassam al-Sayeh, one of the perpetrators of the heroic "Itamar" operation before the Jerusalem Intifada as a result of medical negligence in the prisons of the Zionists
# Sayeh_ martyr # Azem_ martyr
Bassam al-Sayeh planned and funded the drive-by shooting of an (former) American Jewish couple, who were in their car with their children.

https://www.jta.org/2015/10/06/israe...israeli-couple
  #593  
Old 09-12-2019, 02:01 AM
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So, umm, no link to the official FBI webpage that lists 'anti-Semitic organizations as designated by the FBI' then?

CMC fnord!
  #594  
Old 09-12-2019, 03:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Sage Rat View Post
Any chance that one of them is older than the other by a bit?
Given that ALL of those quotes come from the last two years, and don't even include anything with the interview with Unzensuriert (a white supremacist website founded by an SS officer), I don't see your point.
  #595  
Old 09-12-2019, 03:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Kimstu View Post
Um, that link is a letter from an FBI official in 2009
https://oig.justice.gov/reports/2013/e0707r-summary.pdf

That said, having looked into the matter further, while I think it's relatively likely that the FBI is still suspicious of the organization (at the highest level) and that this isn't unfounded, it does seem to be the case that a whole slew of Democratic congress members (including, for example, Cory Booker) have all signed letters of endorsement for the group.

It also seems to be the case that the only real accusation against CAIR (that its founders specifically created it to raise money for Hamas) has a fairly easy-to-find defense statement circulated around the Internet, saying that this was in 1994, before Hamas turned radical and started to kill people. That argument doesn't hold, since the discussion of Hamas by the founders has them referencing the organization by a codeword, "Samah", which seems completely unnecessary if the group didn't intend to commit crimes. Also, Hamas was founded with an explicit covenant of Jihad and started to kill people by no later than 1989. But, I could easily see someone buying the defense if they didn't dig into the question deeper.

It is unreasonable, given how successful the group has been with courting Democratic congress members and given how easy it is to find the one defense, to attach Omar uniquely to the group minus any evidence that she has a particular relationship with the founders of the organization. I retract that particular concern.
  #596  
Old 09-12-2019, 03:28 AM
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On the one hand, YAYYYYYYYYYYY!!!! On the other, Jesus fuck what loon is going to have the job next? Still though, YAYYYYYYYYYYY!!!! We are, for the moment, *slightly* less likely to end up in a shooting war.

Which is about as good as it gets with this Administration.

Regards,
-Bouncer-
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  #597  
Old 09-12-2019, 04:03 AM
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Just to be crystal clear, this,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sage Rat View Post
{...} an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI {...}
is something you pulled out of your ass, correct?

CMC fnord!
  #598  
Old 09-12-2019, 04:41 AM
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Originally Posted by crowmanyclouds View Post
Just to be crystal clear, this,is something you pulled out of your ass, correct?

CMC fnord!

Along with post #595. But at least he put some code weasel words in there for everyone to see the caliber of his, let's call it, thinking.
  #599  
Old 09-12-2019, 05:08 AM
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I predict that the part before the comma
an anti-Semitic organization, as designated by the FBI
gets focused on, while the part after is ignored.

IOW, I still want link to the official FBI webpage that lists 'anti-Semitic organizations as designated by the FBI'.

I'll just note, this is one of those times that a 'Well, I guess I was wrong about that.' ain't gonna cut it.

CMC fnord!

Last edited by crowmanyclouds; 09-12-2019 at 05:09 AM.
  #600  
Old 09-12-2019, 07:58 AM
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CAIR is a bullshit organization, but not because of anti-Semitism.
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