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  #201  
Old 12-09-2018, 01:03 PM
SenorBeef SenorBeef is online now
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If the Browns win out they can still scrape by a barely winning season (8-7-1) which would be a pleasant surprise. I'm feeling pretty good about today.
  #202  
Old 12-09-2018, 04:34 PM
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Newton was obviously not on when it mattered. Weird pass choices on the attempt to win the game with 2:45ish to go. Some poor plays earlier in the 3rd quarter, too, when I was kinda paying attention for a bit.

Browns are definitely better than they have been for 2.5 seasons.
  #203  
Old 12-09-2018, 06:13 PM
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I'm feeling like Baker Mayfield is clearly the franchise QB the Browns have been waiting for. I'm also feeling like Sam Darnold is some guy the Jets still have no idea about whether he'll pan out or not.

So, uh, yeah, Beef, you may have to pry Mayfield out of my cold, dead hands in the Dynasty league.
  #204  
Old 12-09-2018, 11:33 PM
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Found this on reddit:

Quote:
Right now the Steelers are 7-5-1, Ravens are 7-6, and Browns are 5-7-1

The Steelers will likely be underdogs in their next two games vs New England and @ New Orleans

The Ravens will be favorites vs Tampa and underdogs vs LA

If the Browns win their next two games (@Denver and vs Cincinnati) and the favorite wins in the next two for the Ravens and Steelers, they will go into week 17 with:

Ravens 8-7

Steelers 7-7-1

Browns 7-7-1

A week 17 loss by the Steelers would mean the Browns @ Ravens game would be for the division title
Individually none of those things are unlikely at all. All together less so, but to even have a chance at this point is pretty cool.

Last edited by SenorBeef; 12-09-2018 at 11:34 PM.
  #205  
Old 12-10-2018, 10:29 AM
Barkis is Willin' Barkis is Willin' is offline
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What gets kind of glossed over there is that the week 17 Steelers loss would have to come at the hands of the Bengals. In Pittsburgh. Can't see it. Cincinnati is a train wreck now.
  #206  
Old 12-10-2018, 10:56 AM
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What gets kind of glossed over there is that the week 17 Steelers loss would have to come at the hands of the Bengals. In Pittsburgh. Can't see it. Cincinnati is a train wreck now.
Maybe the Steelers can lose twice to New Orleans in a single game, instead?
  #207  
Old 12-15-2018, 03:36 AM
SenorBeef SenorBeef is online now
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NFL rookie of the week:

Week 1: Denzel Ward
Week 3: Baker Mayfield
Week 4: Nick Chubb
Week 5: Denzel Ward
Week 7: Baker Mayfield
Week 9: Baker Mayfield
Week 10: Nick Chubb
Week 12: Baker Mayfield
Week 14: Baker Mayfield

3 Browns have won rookie of the week more than the rest of the NFL combined. That's pretty remarkable.
  #208  
Old 12-15-2018, 01:16 PM
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It’s about time those high draft picks finally pay off.

Last edited by Atamasama; 12-15-2018 at 01:16 PM.
  #209  
Old 12-16-2018, 12:57 PM
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Local (Cleveland) sports talk radio is getting a little overly giddy talking about the Brown's playoff chances but I'll be content for this year, that in mid December the Browns have playoff chances at all.
  #210  
Old 12-16-2018, 01:27 PM
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Lots of exploding heads in Baltimore and Pittsburgh if Browns take the division.

Browns fans must be torturing themselves about that OT tie against Pittsburgh and those other two narrow losses right now.
  #211  
Old 12-16-2018, 08:20 PM
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C'mon guys, let's not get too giddy here; odds are pretty good the Browns go 7-8-1, which compared to 1-15 and 0-16 is a massive improvement, with real hope for the future.

I'll mention the Denver game since others haven't; c'mom folks, when the coach called time out just as Denver was handing the game to him and then the failed 4th down play, didn't any of you have memories of "The Drive" and "The Fumble", both against Denver? But not this time...not this time. That 4th down sack renewed hope that just maybe, we have the makings of a contending team here.

Until something goes wrong--to be a true Browns fan is to take nothing for granted and to expect suffering.

But hope springs eternal...
  #212  
Old 12-17-2018, 01:25 AM
SenorBeef SenorBeef is online now
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That's pretty much it for our playoff chances, unfortunately. We needed the Steelers to lose here to get a shot at the division, or the Colts or Titans to lose to keep the wildcard dream alive. There's still technically a chance but it'd require the Colts and Titans tying among other things, so practically no.

Ah well, to turn a dumpster fire season in the making into an almost playoff run is pretty remarkable. Next year the Browns are going to the playoffs.
  #213  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:24 AM
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Ah well, to turn a dumpster fire season in the making into an almost playoff run is pretty remarkable. Next year the Browns are going to the playoffs.
I think Cleveland is a couple of good draft picks/trades and a stable head coach situation away from a playoff berth. Next season that could happen. The Browns have been a forgotten team for so long, it would be great to see them become a force in the AFC.
  #214  
Old 12-17-2018, 09:30 AM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is online now
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Speaking of the coaching situation, why would they not want to just hire Gregg Williams?
  #215  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:19 AM
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The Browns are still not mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, but they would need every other team chasing that last wild card spot to lose out, and for Tennessee and Indianapolis to tie in the final game of the season. So, it's all but over. But they can still finish with a winning record!

I think they should just keep Williams. Or at least hire someone that will keep him as DC.
  #216  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:37 AM
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Speaking of the coaching situation, why would they not want to just hire Gregg Williams?
Just going by their record since he took charge he seems like an upgrade. I don’t see why this would be a bad idea either.
  #217  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:40 AM
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You only keep him if you think that he's the coach to lead you to 13-3. Just because he's doing better than the prior coach, that's not enough.
  #218  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:58 AM
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If he has to go 13-3, you have to think he's one of the top 4 coaches in the NFL. I'm all for setting the bar high, but that might be a bit much. Since he took over Williams is 4-2. If he finishes at 6-2, I'd say that's pretty damn good and worth keeping around.
  #219  
Old 12-17-2018, 01:36 PM
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You only keep him if you think that he's the coach to lead you to 13-3. Just because he's doing better than the prior coach, that's not enough.
Who out there is more likely than Williams to take the team to 13-3? I mean, if Bill Belichik were looking for work then sure, sorry Gregg but we're moving on. But who is actually available? Mike McCarthy? You only hire someone else if you think he's actually an improvement. The last thing the Browns need to do is emulate the Raiders moves on coaching.
  #220  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:12 PM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is online now
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The worst thing they could do is to keep the carousel turning. That would only mess Mayfield up, perhaps permanently.
  #221  
Old 12-17-2018, 02:53 PM
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The worst thing they could do is to keep the carousel turning. That would only mess Mayfield up, perhaps permanently.
Agreed, that’s why I suggested they need a stable HC situation. Firing Jackson was the right move but they need to either commit to Williams or hire someone that will work in the long term.
  #222  
Old 12-17-2018, 07:08 PM
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Who out there is more likely than Williams to take the team to 13-3? I mean, if Bill Belichik were looking for work then sure, sorry Gregg but we're moving on. But who is actually available? Mike McCarthy? You only hire someone else if you think he's actually an improvement. The last thing the Browns need to do is emulate the Raiders moves on coaching.
I think there are plenty of offensive or defensive coordinators that could fill the bill, quite possibly better than Greg Williams. Williams has, as I recall, some baggage. And his resume is very hit and miss, at best.
  #223  
Old 12-17-2018, 10:44 PM
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I think there are plenty of offensive or defensive coordinators that could fill the bill, quite possibly better than Greg Williams. Williams has, as I recall, some baggage. And his resume is very hit and miss, at best.
But ride the hot hand though. And I think Mayfield has proven he can withstand a bizarre, crazy coaching change mid-stream and keep the team together (as a rookie!), as well as continue to be talented.

As much grief as Hue must be getting, his last two drafts were not terrible. Whether or not Hue gets sole or most of the credit for that is unknown though.
  #224  
Old 12-17-2018, 10:47 PM
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Hue had almost nothing to do with this last draft, that was all Dorsey, and not a big role in the previous drafts. His big plan at QB was AJ McCarron.
  #225  
Old 12-18-2018, 09:40 AM
ElvisL1ves ElvisL1ves is online now
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You only keep him if you think that he's the coach to lead you to 13-3.
First, the team has to get to the point where they can then get to 13-3. The coaching skills needed to make a bad team decent are different from the ones needed to make a decent team dominant, and they rarely co-exist in the same person. Same goes for GM skills, btw.
  #226  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:37 AM
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Hue had almost nothing to do with this last draft, that was all Dorsey, and not a big role in the previous drafts. His big plan at QB was AJ McCarron.
Listen to Hue and you'd think he had nothing to do with any draft. After all, he wanted Wentz, Watson, Mahomes, and every other QB who'd been decent.
  #227  
Old 12-19-2018, 11:54 AM
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First, the team has to get to the point where they can then get to 13-3.
According to a sports columnist in the Cleveland Plain Dealer yesterday, fans can expect a 12-4 record and division title next year.

Seems a mite premature.

Playoffs (Playoffs?), OK.

Last edited by Jackmannii; 12-19-2018 at 11:55 AM.
  #228  
Old 12-19-2018, 12:52 PM
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Agreed, that’s why I suggested they need a stable HC situation. Firing Jackson was the right move but they need to either commit to Williams or hire someone that will work in the long term.
The problem if they stick with Williams and the offense does well, Kitchens is gone after next year. That's why the strategy seems to be Rookie QB + Offensive HC or Veteran QB + Defensive HC.
  #229  
Old 12-20-2018, 11:01 AM
Airman Doors, USAF Airman Doors, USAF is offline
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Still feel bad about Josh Gordon going to the Patriots? He’s about to be suspended for yet again another drug violation. This time, however, he’s not the Browns’ cancer, he’s the Patriots’.
  #230  
Old 12-20-2018, 12:55 PM
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Still feel bad about Josh Gordon going to the Patriots? He’s about to be suspended for yet again another drug violation. This time, however, he’s not the Browns’ cancer, he’s the Patriots’.
I get the feeling Bill won’t put up with those shenanigans, and Gordon’s not going to be on the team for long.
  #231  
Old 12-20-2018, 01:10 PM
Barkis is Willin' Barkis is Willin' is offline
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Colin Cowherd thinks the Browns should go hard after Jim Harbaugh. I completely disagree. He'd be more of a distraction than Cleveland needs.
  #232  
Old 12-20-2018, 01:39 PM
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Long time, no see Beef! I have to admit that with the Dorsey hiring you guys really have turned it around. Mayfield’s ability to read the defense and audible to smart plays is not a good sign for the rest of us. Damned shame it all comes after Joe Thomas is gone but congrats to you guys. I hope you’re always behind the Steelers of course but glad to see the turnaround.
  #233  
Old 12-20-2018, 04:04 PM
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Colin Cowherd thinks the Browns should go hard after Jim Harbaugh. I completely disagree. He'd be more of a distraction than Cleveland needs.
Yeah, drama seems to follow him everywhere he goes. He’s had success but it might not be worth it.
  #234  
Old 12-20-2018, 04:14 PM
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I grew up in NW Ohio. It was both Lions and Browns territory for coverage by the media.
Lesson number one - The "this is our year" turnaround bandwagon for both teams usually ends up burning in the ditch.

Be happy if the young players still look good when the games count and their opponents are trying to win. Hopefully those younger players show development. If the team is keeping games close enough to be interesting it's pretty awesome regardless of record. If they win enough of those close games to not be mathematically eliminated 8-10 games into the season it was a great turnaround to build on.
With the benefit of hindsight, it hasn't been a bad year in terms of realistic turnarounds. The rookie QB is performing well giving long term hope they can keep building around him. Some of the other young players show promise. The team is still not mathematically eliminated from the playoffs after 14 games. 6-7-1 isn't great but it is more wins than the last two seasons combined. Even two of the losses were from their 4 overtime games. They've kept it relatively close on average - 309 points scored against 348 given up over the season.

IMO that's a pretty good turnaround. It's just a longer trip than the bandwagon could expect to travel in a single season.
  #235  
Old 12-20-2018, 08:14 PM
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6-7-1 isn't great but it is more wins than the last two seasons combined.
Correction... Last three seasons combined. Here is their record from 2015-2017:

2015: 3-13-0
2016: 1-15-0
2017: 0-16-0

That’s a combined record of 4-44 over three years. That’s a pretty bad stretch. They weren’t as bad in 2014, when they went 7-9, and they’re only one win away from having a better record than that year. They next get the Bengals at home which you have to think is a winnable game.

Unfortunately for them to officially have a winning season they’d also need to beat the Ravens in Baltimore the final week which is a tall order. But since reforming in 1999, they’ve only had two winning seasons so even a 7-8-1 record would be a really good year for them historically, and something good to build off of next year. They’d also be finishing 3rd in their division with that record, because if they beat the Bengals this week the best record that Cincinnati could have by the end of the year would be 7-9. The last time the Browns finished in 3rd place was 2010.

So this next game is pretty important. I personally will be rooting for the Browns on Sunday because I love seeing a struggling team improve themselves. (At least in the AFC.)
  #236  
Old 12-20-2018, 08:55 PM
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My wife's family are Cleveland fans. I predicted they would get 6 wins at start of season primarily due to Baker Mayfield (and they had close losses last year). They all laughed at me.
  #237  
Old 12-21-2018, 05:37 PM
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They're not laughing now.
  #238  
Old 12-23-2018, 02:51 PM
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Well this is a solid beating, which is nice to see. Williams is not my dream coach, but if they win out I can't see replacing him. I wouldn't want to risk shaking things up if we can avoid it.

I'm not too worried about him being bad at his first HC job. It was 15(?) years ago, and he's probably learned a lot since then. There are a decent amount of success stories for HCs their second time around.

Last edited by SenorBeef; 12-23-2018 at 02:51 PM.
  #239  
Old 12-23-2018, 03:44 PM
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Wouldn't it be the most Browns thing to blow a 23-0 lead and lose.
  #240  
Old 12-23-2018, 03:51 PM
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There was never a serious risk of losing. It was clearly just some garbage time scoring.
  #241  
Old 12-23-2018, 04:26 PM
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I hope the Browns continue this next year. The AFC North is more fun when Cleveland is reasonably good.
  #242  
Old 12-23-2018, 05:51 PM
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Well this is a solid beating, which is nice to see. Williams is not my dream coach, but if they win out I can't see replacing him. I wouldn't want to risk shaking things up if we can avoid it.

I'm not too worried about him being bad at his first HC job. It was 15(?) years ago, and he's probably learned a lot since then. There are a decent amount of success stories for HCs their second time around.
Belichik most notably. But yeah, were I a Browns fan I'd be seriously wondering about how that's going to play out.

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There was never a serious risk of losing. It was clearly just some garbage time scoring.
Truth. You beat a disinterested, heavily injured and poorly coached (and owned!) NFL team that has mailed it in. The fact that the Browns are as equally eliminated from playoff contention as the Bengals yet continue to play such spirited ball speaks volumes, and would make me think the HC decision over very carefully if I owned and/or ran the Browns. I have a hunch the players on the roster would respond positively to William's hiring.

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I hope the Browns continue this next year. The AFC North is more fun when Cleveland is reasonably good.
I actually agree. I became a Bengals fan by default in 1993 simply by moving to the area and being a huge NFL fan (grew up a Redskins fan as an Army brat stationed on and off a few times in the DC area) when the Bengals and the Browns were both in serious decline, the Browns 1994 season notwithstanding. The interweaving of the state of Ohio, Paul Brown, Art Modell, Mike Brown, etc is also interesting. Then the Browns lost their team and became the Ravens. I always felt that was a prime example of corporate greed over some bullshit.

But Cleveland is good again, and the Bengals suck again. I guess life really is a wheel. I knew we should have drafted Lamar Jackson.
  #243  
Old 12-23-2018, 09:49 PM
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Mayfield hates the shit out of Hue Jackson. He gave him a staredown in the middle of crushing his team.

Given we know what a slimeball Hue is, I suspect that Mayfield is probably entirely justified in whatever hard feelings there are.

Also, Mayfield has a huge dick.

If Hue really does become the Bengals HC, Mayfield is going to enjoy owning the shit out of him for as long as he can manage to stay HC.
  #244  
Old 12-23-2018, 09:57 PM
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Saw the following exchange on reddit:

"Is this the only time a coach has been fired by one team, and then beaten twice by his former team in the same year?"

"It has to be"

Last edited by SenorBeef; 12-23-2018 at 09:57 PM.
  #245  
Old 12-23-2018, 11:00 PM
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Browns making it to 7 wins made me a ton of money, so I'm glad. Now if only they could be sold by their douchenozzle owner and fire their douchenozzle head coach, I could actually root for them.
  #246  
Old 12-23-2018, 11:13 PM
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This season has already been a huge upgrade from last year. If the Browns win next week and finish with a winning season, that’ll be incredible. I have to root for them in that game.
  #247  
Old 12-24-2018, 12:33 AM
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Please Lord, bring Mike Zimmer back to the Bengals.
  #248  
Old 12-24-2018, 01:44 AM
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Please Lord, bring Mike Zimmer back to the Bengals.
I concur. Take Nagy too!

Last edited by Chisquirrel; 12-24-2018 at 01:44 AM. Reason: Added a nut
  #249  
Old 12-24-2018, 09:32 AM
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As an aside, how cool is it that a Browns thread has 20+ more replies than the annual Steeler one.
  #250  
Old 12-24-2018, 10:02 AM
Airman Doors, USAF Airman Doors, USAF is offline
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As an aside, how cool is it that a Browns thread has 20+ more replies than the annual Steeler one.
Everyone loves an underdog. I’ve certainly enjoyed watching the Browns this year.
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