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Old 04-08-2018, 11:50 AM
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MPSIMS political jabs and use of MPSIMS for op rants

Should the sticky of MPSIMS be removed?

It seems to be widely ignored, including by mods, and not enforced. I enjoy a clever political jab, and that one was well enough played, plus I agree with the perspective. But neither of those things are relevant, or at least I don't think should be.

My guess is that most, or at least the mods, would prefer to have jabs and rants be permissible in MPSIMS (at least if the rant is attached to something else) given that they have been handled as such. I have no objection, not sure that anyone would. Why just make that official and remove the guidance sticky? If not then one should expect that a mod would at least not ignore it.
  #2  
Old 04-08-2018, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
Should the sticky of MPSIMS be removed?
No.

Iím almost certain that sticky was added as a direct result of one of my OPís and the comments I made in that thread. Iím eternally grateful to Ed and the mod staff for adding/clarifying that rule.

Which means Iíd like to see the damn thing enforced. This Pit thread started in MPSIMS. As usual it immediately turned into a political rant, which is unfortunateóthereís enough of that crap on this board already. In that case I wish that the MPSIMS mods would have came in with their jackboots a-stompiní rather than simply move that thread to the pit. Some of us, amazingly enough, prefer to have civil conversations on this board. Moving a breaking news thread to the pit is a really shitty way of encouraging that.

I like political jabs as much as the next guyóhell, I used Colibriís line when discussing the Trump Tower fire on FB with a buddy of mine. However, it was inappropriate for that thread.

Christ. Is it really too much to ask that we leave Trump and guns out of these kinds of threads? Thereís the entire rest of the board for that kind of commentary.
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Old 04-08-2018, 12:18 PM
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It's enforced all the time--basically every shooting thread. Granted, it wasn't enforced that one time recently, but Loach admitted that was just because he wasn't around, and did enforce it by moving the thread to the Pit.

I suspect the issue is that this isn't being treated like a breaking news thread, despite technically being one.
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Old 04-08-2018, 12:23 PM
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NM

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  #5  
Old 04-08-2018, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by BigT View Post
... but Loach admitted that was just because he wasn't around, and did enforce it by moving the thread to the Pit. ...
You must be confusing this with some other thread. That has not happened in the particular example brought up.
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Old 04-08-2018, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
... including by mods, ...
That was a good one. The fire was in Trump tower. I don't see a political joke as a political jab, at least not a jab at another poster. That's my opinion. You can't keep politics entirely out of anything with Trump in the title or on the building.
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Old 04-08-2018, 02:40 PM
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If it isn't possible for posters and mods to stop themselves from taking shots at Trump, then the sticky needs to be amended. It's not fair or realistic to expect the impossible.

I would be interested in an explanation as to why self-control is not possible with Trump, but is with every other topic and conversation. But by all means, the mods ought to be up-front about it - no political digs in MPSIMS, except a little, and only if it is aimed at Trump.

Regards,
Shodan
  #8  
Old 04-08-2018, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
If it isn't possible for posters and mods to stop themselves from taking shots at Trump, then the sticky needs to be amended. It's not fair or realistic to expect the impossible.

I would be interested in an explanation as to why self-control is not possible with Trump, but is with every other topic and conversation. But by all means, the mods ought to be up-front about it - no political digs in MPSIMS, except a little, and only if it is aimed at Trump.

Regards,
Shodan
And the terrible thing they say about your boy too. I'm on your side here.
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Old 04-08-2018, 03:25 PM
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Absolutely agreed, we should all respect the rules. Know the limits and stay within them. Observe decorum. Be civil. Avoid petty partisan sniping. You know, act presidential.
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Old 04-08-2018, 04:03 PM
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I think the sticky explains the rules very well. Ed is certainly a much better writer than I could ever hope to be. I know this has been discussed multiple times but Iíll just try to hit the main points.

1. Hijacking or derailing a thread is against the rules pretty much in every forum. It is very strictly enforced in GQ. It is more loosely enforced in MPSIMS. A few off topic comments wonít be modded unless itís ruining the thread.

2. Political jabs, quips, one liners or other types of tomfoolery are not against the rules in MPSIMS. In a cat thread if someone says ďthat cat looks like TrumpĒ it wonít be modded unless the political discussion derails the thread. Derailling a thread for the purposes of putting out your political agenda can be modded. Context as always is important.

3. MPSIMS became the go to forum to report breaking news items. Often those news items involved hot button issues like gun violence. It became clear that those wishing to find out factual information would get drowned out by those who wanted to argue the politics of overall issue rather than the particulars of the breaking news.

4. Having one thread on a subject that is only there to provide facts to an incident is beneficial. We have posters from all over. They are able to provide local information the rest of us donít have. Or they can check in to say they are ok. Or posters can link to information that the rest havenít seen.

5. No one is being stopped from discussing politics or the big debates involving an issue. They are just asked to do it in another thread.

6. It was decided that the rule about hijacking a thread would be more strictly enforced when itís a breaking news story. In the past many of those threads had to be moved to the Pit because they devolved into shouting matches and the news item was no longer being discussed. It wasnít a new rule it was the decision to enforce the existing rule more strictly. Breaking news threads often move very quickly and can turn into a mess before a mod even arrives.

7. Lately it seems that the breaking news threads are dealing with gun violence. We want those threads to stay on topic and not turn into a gun control debate. Just in that one thread. Gun control discussions can be found all over the board. Although thatís what has been happening lately it goes for other topics. Terrorist attacks and arguments about Islam. Natural disasters and debates about the merits of various politicians. Any breaking news story that has a hot button issue attached. Discuss away but if someone opens a thread to talk about the factual information coming in then donít derail their thread.
  #11  
Old 04-08-2018, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
If it isn't possible for posters and mods to stop themselves from taking shots at Trump, then the sticky needs to be amended. It's not fair or realistic to expect the impossible.

I would be interested in an explanation as to why self-control is not possible with Trump, but is with every other topic and conversation. But by all means, the mods ought to be up-front about it - no political digs in MPSIMS, except a little, and only if it is aimed at Trump.

Regards,
Shodan
There is no rule saying no political digs in MPSIMS.
  #12  
Old 04-08-2018, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Lancia View Post

Which means Iíd like to see the damn thing enforced. This Pit thread started in MPSIMS. As usual it immediately turned into a political rant, which is unfortunateóthereís enough of that crap on this board already. In that case I wish that the MPSIMS mods would have came in with their jackboots a-stompiní rather than simply move that thread to the pit. Some of us, amazingly enough, prefer to have civil conversations on this board. Moving a breaking news thread to the pit is a really shitty way of encouraging that.
Unfortunately sometimes when there is a big news story Iím busy and I donít have the immediate response of jumping on the board and seeing if everyone is behaving. I didnít see that thread until it was over 100 posts in and had been completely ruined for factual discussion. It happens. The reason for the rules clarification and stricter enforcement was to keep threads like that in MPSIMS and to keep them from turning into a Pit thread. I think it has worked better than before.
  #13  
Old 04-08-2018, 04:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
You must be confusing this with some other thread. That has not happened in the particular example brought up.
He was referring to the thread linked in post #2.
  #14  
Old 04-08-2018, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loach View Post
There is no rule saying no political digs in MPSIMS.
The sticky is linked to in the OP. If you are asserting that a thread about a fire is not a thread about a news item, or that calling Trump a liar is not a political dig,
:shrugs:

Regards,
Shodan
  #15  
Old 04-08-2018, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
...or that calling Trump a liar is not a political dig,
Just out of (genuine) curiosity, how many times would a politician have to lie before calling them a liar is merely a statement of fact rather than a political dig? Because while I agree with the statement in general, there are current politicians whose lying is on an absolutely unprecedented scale; orders of magnitude greater than anyone who has held their office before: they've been caught making explicitly factually incorrect statements (not just stating unpopular opinions) literally thousands of times. I think at some point a boundary has been crossed, and "liar" is merely a description, not even a partisan comment.

Last edited by TimeWinder; 04-08-2018 at 05:19 PM.
  #16  
Old 04-08-2018, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
The sticky is linked to in the OP. If you are asserting that a thread about a fire is not a thread about a news item, or that calling Trump a liar is not a political dig,
:shrugs:

Regards,
Shodan
I said there is no rule against political jabs.

Hijacking a breaking news thread to make political jabs is going to be strictly enforced.

Every news item is not going to be ďbreaking news.Ē Sometimes the story as presented is all there is. Sometimes there isnít going to be a lot of different information and viewpoints coming in. Those threads wonít be viewed as breaking news threads and will not be modded as strictly. Hijacks and derailments are still against the rules. What constitute a breaking news thread will be context driven and in the eye of the (mod) beholder.

The aim of the sticky is to allow certain threads to exist not to protect you from seeing Trump being insulted. For that particular thread it has 16 replies in 24 hours and a couple of links to factual information. Itís not a rapidly developing situation. No discussion is being derailed. I didnít see a need for any modding. Another mod might see it differently.
  #17  
Old 04-08-2018, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
The sticky is linked to in the OP. If you are asserting that a thread about a fire is not a thread about a news item, or that calling Trump a liar is not a political dig,
:shrugs:

Regards,
Shodan
Not about a fire as much as where the fire was. At dumpster towers. But yes, calling trump a liar is so over the top and unfounded.
  #18  
Old 04-08-2018, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
If it isn't possible for posters and mods to stop themselves from taking shots at Trump, then the sticky needs to be amended. It's not fair or realistic to expect the impossible.
That would require them to exercise self-control. Don't hold your breath.
  #19  
Old 04-08-2018, 09:27 PM
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That would require them to exercise self-control. Don't hold your breath.
This is one of the most ironically hilarious things I've ever read. You should write for SNL. Bravo!
  #20  
Old 04-08-2018, 10:14 PM
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IvoryTowerDenizen IvoryTowerDenizen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loach View Post
I said there is no rule against political jabs.



Hijacking a breaking news thread to make political jabs is going to be strictly enforced.



Every news item is not going to be “breaking news.” Sometimes the story as presented is all there is. Sometimes there isn’t going to be a lot of different information and viewpoints coming in. Those threads won’t be viewed as breaking news threads and will not be modded as strictly. Hijacks and derailments are still against the rules. What constitute a breaking news thread will be context driven and in the eye of the (mod) beholder.



The aim of the sticky is to allow certain threads to exist not to protect you from seeing Trump being insulted. For that particular thread it has 16 replies in 24 hours and a couple of links to factual information. It’s not a rapidly developing situation. No discussion is being derailed. I didn’t see a need for any modding. Another mod might see it differently.


This MPSIMS mod sees it exactly the same way.
  #21  
Old 04-09-2018, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by IvoryTowerDenizen View Post
This MPSIMS mod sees it exactly the same way.

For fearlessly locking 3 nonsense threads in 5 minutes, your intrepidity and dedication to duty has earned you a nominated for the Morgenstern Excellence in Modding award. Awarded once every year, the MEM Award brings the recipient fame, fortune and Faux-fur jackboots (PETA approved). You were second only to Spicey, but she wised up retired leaving you the obvious choice.

Congratulations. (I would have given you your own thread, but I was afraid of angering one of the monster mods)
  #22  
Old 04-09-2018, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Morgenstern View Post
For fearlessly locking 3 nonsense threads in 5 minutes, your intrepidity and dedication to duty has earned you a nominated for the Morgenstern Excellence in Modding award. Awarded once every year, the MEM Award brings the recipient fame, fortune and Faux-fur jackboots (PETA approved). You were second only to Spicey, but she wised up retired leaving you the obvious choice.

Congratulations. (I would have given you your own thread, but I was afraid of angering one of the monster mods)
If I knew thatís all it took I would lock 5.
  #23  
Old 04-09-2018, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Morgenstern View Post
For fearlessly locking 3 nonsense threads in 5 minutes, your intrepidity and dedication to duty has earned you a nominated for the Morgenstern Excellence in Modding award. Awarded once every year, the MEM Award brings the recipient fame, fortune and Faux-fur jackboots (PETA approved). You were second only to Spicey, but she wised up retired leaving you the obvious choice.

Congratulations. (I would have given you your own thread, but I was afraid of angering one of the monster mods)
I would like to thank the Academy, the Teeming Millions, and most of all Cecil, from whom all blessing and personalized mugs flow, for this honor.

ETA: Note my new custom title

Last edited by IvoryTowerDenizen; 04-09-2018 at 02:29 PM.
  #24  
Old 04-09-2018, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by DSeid View Post
You must be confusing this with some other thread. That has not happened in the particular example brought up.
No, it's just that you seem to have misunderstood me. I was talking about the previous time the rule was enforced--the February shooting thread. It's the only other time I can think of where the hijacks were allowed to stand. I assumed you were familiar with it, given your accusation that the rule is never enforced.

The only thing I said about this thread was that the mods must not see it as a "breaking news" thread. Because, otherwise, they have been enforcing the rule.

And my apologies for interrupting the mod awards. I also think highly of ITD's modding.

Last edited by BigT; 04-09-2018 at 05:38 PM.
  #25  
Old 04-09-2018, 10:12 PM
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As a non-partisan political person, I think it's high time we dispense with the usual political courtesies, etc associated with the man whom currently (but hopefully not much longer) holds the title of President. His lies and so forth have become so egregious that they're a joke, so therefore we should joke about them in the hopes that his 3AM Twitter rants somehow stumbles across the SDMB so he can send the FBI after us (not to worry, by the time that happens, there will be someone else in charge of the FBI, and with any hope and a golden Willy Wonka ticket, the Presidency too.)
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Old 04-10-2018, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by FoieGrasIsEvil View Post
As a non-partisan political person, I think it's high time we dispense with the usual political courtesies, etc associated with the man whom currently (but hopefully not much longer) holds the title of President. His lies and so forth have become so egregious that they're a joke, so therefore we should joke about them in the hopes that his 3AM Twitter rants somehow stumbles across the SDMB so he can send the FBI after us (not to worry, by the time that happens, there will be someone else in charge of the FBI, and with any hope and a golden Willy Wonka ticket, the Presidency too.)
Do you really think your ability to speak unflatteringly about Trump is being stifled here?
  #27  
Old 04-10-2018, 12:44 PM
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And a thread about a MPSIMS thread being hijacked by political jabs is now teetering on the edge of the same fate.
  #28  
Old 04-10-2018, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by don't mind me View Post
And a thread about a MPSIMS thread being hijacked by political jabs is now teetering on the edge of the same fate.
This is 2018. There's a punch line in everything Washington does. So we laugh because laughing beats the other option.

Last edited by Morgenstern; 04-10-2018 at 12:48 PM.
  #29  
Old 04-10-2018, 02:42 PM
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Do you really think your ability to speak unflatteringly about Trump is being stifled here?
No sir. It was a poor excuse for a joke.
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  #30  
Old 04-10-2018, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clothahump View Post
That would require them to exercise self-control. Don't hold your breath.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post
This is one of the most ironically hilarious things I've ever read. You should write for SNL. Bravo!
Indeed. ATMB, home of the mods. Oh, what the hell, I'll just lob a little insult over the fence and see what happens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgenstern View Post
For fearlessly locking 3 nonsense threads in 5 minutes, your intrepidity and dedication to duty has earned you a nominated for the Morgenstern Excellence in Modding award. Awarded once every year, the MEM Award brings the recipient fame, fortune and Faux-fur jackboots (PETA approved). You were second only to Spicey, but she wised up retired leaving you the obvious choice.

Congratulations. (I would have given you your own thread, but I was afraid of angering one of the monster mods)
You're putting pressure on the rest of us, you know.

For excellence in dispatching trolls, spammers, and other Internet filth, Colibri you have been awarded the Monster Hunter Award for 2018. This achievement earns you fame, fortune, yada, yada, yada, and the beverage of your choice should we ever be in the same approximate geographical area. I'd offer you a mace or cross bow, but I assume that you're all geared up. Thank you for your service.
  #31  
Old 04-14-2018, 01:42 PM
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After killing this thread, I do have one other thought on the matter at hand: would it be reasonable to add "Breaking News" to the title of the thread that is meant to be the Breaking News thread? I'm suggesting this as a guideline only. I don't see the need for another rule. If Breaking News is in the title, it would be easier to tell which thread is the Breaking News thread and which thread is the heated debate thread.
  #32  
Old 04-15-2018, 05:28 PM
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After killing this thread, I do have one other thought on the matter at hand: would it be reasonable to add "Breaking News" to the title of the thread that is meant to be the Breaking News thread? I'm suggesting this as a guideline only. I don't see the need for another rule. If Breaking News is in the title, it would be easier to tell which thread is the Breaking News thread and which thread is the heated debate thread.

That ain't a bad idea although it isn't like I start that many threads anywhere. But I am making note of it just in case that changes.
  #33  
Old 04-16-2018, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Sunny Daze View Post
After killing this thread, I do have one other thought on the matter at hand: would it be reasonable to add "Breaking News" to the title of the thread that is meant to be the Breaking News thread? I'm suggesting this as a guideline only. I don't see the need for another rule. If Breaking News is in the title, it would be easier to tell which thread is the Breaking News thread and which thread is the heated debate thread.

If you go back and read the sticky you will see that Ed says the same thing. If my faulty memory is correct there was some discussion to make it mandatory but that was decided against pretty quickly.
  #34  
Old 04-16-2018, 04:15 PM
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Oh, that sticky.
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