Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #351  
Old 05-16-2019, 12:27 PM
wolfpup's Avatar
wolfpup is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
Actually the murder and non-negligent homicide rate per 100,000 in 1999 was 5.7, and in 2014 was 4.5. I for one would rather not see that stop. Unless you think whether or not someone is murdered is less important than how they were murdered. Which I don't think is a well-thought out position.
No, what I think is that you're failing to realize a rather ironic fact: that the failure of gun violence rates to track falling rates of general violent crime, and gun violence rates even substantially increasing in years when other crimes rates were falling, indicates that guns are a special problem, and totally obliterates whatever argument you thought you were making.
  #352  
Old 05-16-2019, 01:32 PM
Shodan is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Milky Way Galaxy
Posts: 39,640
So if today 1000 people are murdered, 300 by guns, and ten years from now 500 people are murdered, 400 by guns, we need to change the way things are going? I don't agree.

Regards,
Shodan
  #353  
Old 05-16-2019, 02:27 PM
wolfpup's Avatar
wolfpup is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
So if today 1000 people are murdered, 300 by guns, and ten years from now 500 people are murdered, 400 by guns, we need to change the way things are going? I don't agree.
You started a discussion about "the way things are going" with respect to gun violence. From that perspective:

1. If the above situation is occurring, you need to understand that you have a serious gun problem.

2. If all other economically and culturally similar countries have a population-adjusted average of, say, 10 murders by guns instead of 400, you need to understand that you have a serious gun problem.

3. And if the above facts are actually true in reality, with different numbers but exhibiting that same pattern, you need to understand that you have a serious gun problem, and it isn't hypothetical.
  #354  
Old 05-16-2019, 03:30 PM
Cheesesteak's Avatar
Cheesesteak is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Lovely Montclair, NJ
Posts: 13,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
So if today 1000 people are murdered, 300 by guns, and ten years from now 500 people are murdered, 400 by guns, we need to change the way things are going? I don't agree.

Regards,
Shodan
Well, let's put it this way... I'd want to be REALLY sure that those guns were the cause of the reduction in non-gun murders from 700 to 100. Because, if they weren't, then guns are seriously reducing the effectiveness of whatever program made non-gun murders drop by so much, and maybe we need to rethink whatever is going on with guns.

Whatever other programs get implemented to reduce violence, you can reduce the impact of guns on violence at the same time.
  #355  
Old 05-16-2019, 03:34 PM
Cheesesteak's Avatar
Cheesesteak is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Lovely Montclair, NJ
Posts: 13,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone View Post
You will still have some non-insignificant amount of people who refuse to comply.
You mis-spelled something there. What you mean to say is that some non-insignificant amount of people are felons who continue to break the law with impunity.

I agree, it's a conundrum... what do you do with people like that 20 years after the law was implemented? Can't treat them like criminals... a bunch of them are white, religious and conservative. There must be something else we can do, maybe ignore their crimes completely and pretend that it's an unworkable law?
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:35 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017