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  #1  
Old 11-21-2004, 12:33 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quick Lucid Dreaming Detail Question

I was watching Waking Life last night. And during a discussion on lucid dreaming, a character said two things that tend to give away the fact that your dreaming are 1) trying to read and it looks like gobbledegook on a page and 2) you have no control over light levels (flicking a switch will produce no effect.)

The former, I 've heard of before (although I have seen text in my dreams that was completely legible). But I've never heard the second.

So is that actually a common feature? That in dreams you can't control light levels so flicking a lightswitch will help you figure out if you're dreaming or not?
  #2  
Old 11-21-2004, 12:44 PM
Electronic Chaos Electronic Chaos is offline
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Keep in mind that all of this is generalization. While it's true the light switch doesn't ALWAYS work, it does sometimes. And I don't think it's that you can't control light levels, but that, in general, machines don't really work like they're supposed to.
Also, another fun trick when you're dreaming is to count your fingers. It sounds really weird, but it's one of the best tricks to realize if you're dreaming or not. Sometimes you'll actually have five, but often you'll have seven or six or some other weird number.
  #3  
Old 11-21-2004, 12:48 PM
PaulFitzroy PaulFitzroy is offline
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Master of Lucid Dreaming and Sleep Paralysis Tripping, reporting for duty!

I've never encountered the light switch. I've never even messed with a light switch in a dream.

The words on pages turning into gibberish happens all the time, though. Another telltale thing is people having names that don't make any sense: Merlin Minnozza, Fatso Crumb, etc (both real examples from my own experience.)

What I've generally found is that any sensory stimulation or physical feeling that you can have in real life can be accurately re-created by your brain during a dream...IF you have actually had it in real life. If you've been shocked, stung, cut or smacked, you will generally be able to feel those in a dream. If you've been stoned, your brain can recreate the sensation of being stoned in a dream (with 100% accuracy, complete with dry-mouth and the altered time perception that THC can trigger.) I think that every sensory experience you've ever had is recorded in your brain's "archives" and can be dredged up during dreams.

However, if you've NEVER experienced a certain stimulus and you find yourself experiencing it in a dream, but not feeling like it "should," that's a clue that you're dreaming.

Example: most people have never fallen off a cliff and hit the ground. This is why you usually wake up if you're falling in a dream before you actually hit. If you actually do hit, in the dream, you won't feel any pain; there is your cue that it is a dream. Likewise, most people have never had their hand chopped off. If you find your hand chopped off and it doesn't feel the way you'd imagine it to, you're probably dreaming. Your mind will create sensations to fill in for what you think should happen, but they're rarely accurate. I got shot in the head once, in a dream, and didn't feel a damn thing. It was at this point that I realized I was dreaming.

Etc, etc, etc.
  #4  
Old 11-21-2004, 12:50 PM
Tapioca Dextrin Tapioca Dextrin is offline
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In my case, the writing bit is spot on. I can nearly make out the words if I try really hard, but that's as far as it gets. And being able to fly. That's a dead give away. I can be walking along slowly and decide "this is boring and slow" and up I go.

Lucid dreaming is fun
  #5  
Old 11-21-2004, 12:51 PM
ThatGuy ThatGuy is offline
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Different dreams are presented in different levels of detail, so you can't really pick a single "trick" to figuring it out....Rather you need to develop a frame of mind to be able to identify the types of things that are most often inconsistant with reality. I find that looking at a clock of any kind, then turning away and glancing back will almost always weild a different time in dreams.
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Old 11-21-2004, 12:56 PM
PaulFitzroy PaulFitzroy is offline
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Lucid dreams are a great opportunity to experience the joys of rape and ultra-violence. Doing this stuff is usually a clue that you're dreaming (if it's stuff that you usually don't do.)
  #7  
Old 11-21-2004, 01:04 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xgxlx
Keep in mind that all of this is generalization. While it's true the light switch doesn't ALWAYS work, it does sometimes. And I don't think it's that you can't control light levels, but that, in general, machines don't really work like they're supposed to.
Ooooooh, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, if it sort of fits in the the general "things not working the way they're supposed to..." or the exaggerated control (e.g./ tyring to use a volume knob to slowly turn up the volume to modify it slightly but it just jumps to REALLYREALLYLOUD or silent.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by xgxlx
Also, another fun trick when you're dreaming is to count your fingers. It sounds really weird, but it's one of the best tricks to realize if you're dreaming or not. Sometimes you'll actually have five, but often you'll have seven or six or some other weird number.
Never had any additional digits, although when I have the "my teeth are falling out" dream I seem to have an infinite supply and can keep spitting them out one after the other.
  #8  
Old 11-21-2004, 01:07 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Originally Posted by PaulFitzroy
Lucid dreams are a great opportunity to experience the joys of rape and ultra-violence. Doing this stuff is usually a clue that you're dreaming (if it's stuff that you usually don't do.)
Uh... okay. Now, as a lucid dreamer I will wake myself up in those two cases because I find that to be quite wrong.

Never committed acts of ultra-violence, but after eating a lot of chocolate brownies one night dreamt I was witnessing ultra-violence until I said "Okay, enough! This is obscene. Wake up NOW!"
  #9  
Old 11-21-2004, 01:35 PM
Alectrona Alectrona is offline
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I have had a couple of lucid dreams and recently felt like experiencing them again. I read a book on how to lucid dream and one of the easy tips was, as ThatGuy says, to look at the time, glance away and look at it again. Or open a book to a random page, close it and open it again to the same page and the words will have changed. The times I did have lucid dreams, I had them because I suddenly realised I had had the same dream before.

The night after I read the book, in my dreams, I did the book thing only to find it completely normal for words to scramble around lol. Even if I'm flying it feels/seems completely normal in my world and not extraordinary. I've even said aloud to myself sometimes in a dream, "I'm in a dream" but I don't believe it and so I don't lucid dream dammit.
  #10  
Old 11-21-2004, 01:40 PM
moriah moriah is offline
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I used to not be able to read in dreams, but lately, I'm finding that I can.

I think my mind is trying to cope with the lack of reading, which I'm aware of in lucid dreaming, and so, it has tapped into my brain's reading processes.

"Hey, reading subroutine, get up."

"No. No. I'm sleeping, make up some gobbledygook."

<Pointing a big gun at the reading subroutine.> "I said, 'GET UP.'"

"OK, whatever you say."


Peace.
  #11  
Old 11-21-2004, 02:02 PM
Squink Squink is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xgxlx
Also, another fun trick when you're dreaming is to count your fingers. It sounds really weird, but it's one of the best tricks to realize if you're dreaming or not. Sometimes you'll actually have five, but often you'll have seven or six or some other weird number.
Does this trick also work on other appendages?
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Old 11-21-2004, 02:05 PM
aruvqan aruvqan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulFitzroy

Example: most people have never fallen off a cliff and hit the ground. This is why you usually wake up if you're falling in a dream before you actually hit. If you actually do hit, in the dream, you won't feel any pain; there is your cue that it is a dream. Likewise, most people have never had their hand chopped off. If you find your hand chopped off and it doesn't feel the way you'd imagine it to, you're probably dreaming. Your mind will create sensations to fill in for what you think should happen, but they're rarely accurate. I got shot in the head once, in a dream, and didn't feel a damn thing. It was at this point that I realized I was dreaming.

Etc, etc, etc.
I wish, I have been shot, stabbed, and strangled...they *all* hurt terribly=(

Some indications of a dream state to me are a total inability to dial a telephone, no matter how careful I am, I can't seem to *not* make a mistake on one or more numbers=(. I absolutely cant run, I can walk, sometimes I can fly, but I can't run. Also, guns don't work right, I shoot the bad guy and he keeps on coming like Michael Myers=(
  #13  
Old 11-21-2004, 02:06 PM
ouryL ouryL is offline
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When I lucid dream, I know I can fly, so heights in them never give me problems. Similarly with have sex, I know it will feel good and be satisfying, although I don't have an orgasm. I can hit monsters and they do fall down. I can run faster than anything usually. Don't ever remember lightswitches or reading. Things tend to just be. No need to read since you already know what it says.
  #14  
Old 11-21-2004, 02:07 PM
aruvqan aruvqan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eats_Crayons
Never had any additional digits, although when I have the "my teeth are falling out" dream I seem to have an infinite supply and can keep spitting them out one after the other.
Ever had bubble gum dreams? Where you have been chewing gum of some sort, and need to or want to get rid of it and you literally have to reach a finger in and dig it out a little stretchy bit at a time? And I also get the loose tooth dream [which I absolutely HATE =(]
  #15  
Old 11-21-2004, 02:56 PM
even sven even sven is offline
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I can read just fine in my dreams. In my MUDding days, I'd even have dreams in text.

I can tell when I'm dreaming because dream stuff starts happening. One thing is that I have trouble eating in dreams. Often I'll have this huge plate of food, but things keep happening whenever I try to take a bite (people will talk to me, or I'll drop my tray, or there will be a loud noise and I'll have to look over...sometimes it's different stupid stuff over and over again). These sorts of repetative rediculous things are what usually clues me in.
  #16  
Old 11-21-2004, 02:58 PM
ruadh ruadh is offline
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Originally Posted by Tapioca Dextrin
And being able to fly. That's a dead give away. I can be walking along slowly and decide "this is boring and slow" and up I go.
In my case, I'm usually trying to either get away from something or to get someplace quicker, and I decide to try to fly. I know I can't really fly, but I decide to try anyway. I climb up on something and jump off it and will myself to stay up. Then I'm like, of course I can make myself fly because it's a dream, dammit
  #17  
Old 11-21-2004, 04:14 PM
BMax BMax is offline
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Just a few nights ago I realized I was dreaming. It didn't involve beating the living hell out of someone and it not hurting them or being unable to run. Just some detail didn't work right, and aI realized Iw as dreaming. I went around asking people if they were were dreaming too, but nobody else seemed to get it.

Unfortunately there were no attractive young women around for me to grope. That's another thing I do in lucid dreams.
  #18  
Old 11-22-2004, 11:37 AM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aruvqan
Also, guns don't work right, I shoot the bad guy and he keeps on coming like Michael Myers
There's a trick to that. I used to get mighty pissed off as a kid when the Slow Walking Monster was coming to get me. I could hide in the best hiding place ever, but as soon as the monster comes into the room, my hiding place is the first place he looks!

Yeeeeaaars later, some said to me: "Well, duh! It your dream. You can't hide from yourself!" With that knowledge in mind, I was able to delay the Slow Walking Monster's "discovery" of my hiding place.

I've found that it works the same with any monster-delaying technique (shooting them, locking them out etc.)
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Old 11-22-2004, 12:07 PM
brane damaj brane damaj is offline
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Unless you're Dave Navarro, making out with Carment Electra is also a sure sign that you're dreaming.
  #20  
Old 11-22-2004, 12:14 PM
TellMeI'mNotCrazy TellMeI'mNotCrazy is offline
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I can read, but can't write; can hear over a phone but can't talk over it, and can fly but can't run. I also can't eat. Those are the obstacles that usually bring me to lucid dreaming - once I recognize them, I figure out that I'm dreaming.
  #21  
Old 11-22-2004, 12:14 PM
Turek Turek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aruvqan
Some indications of a dream state to me are a total inability to dial a telephone, no matter how careful I am, I can't seem to *not* make a mistake on one or more numbers=(. I absolutely cant run, I can walk, sometimes I can fly, but I can't run. Also, guns don't work right, I shoot the bad guy and he keeps on coming like Michael Myers=(
I have had the "can't dial" issue, too. It's frustrating.

As for guns, I can never seem to be able to squeeze the trigger hard enough to make it fire. Not that I'm too weak, just that the trigger won't move far enough back to fire the gun. Again, quite frustrating.
  #22  
Old 11-22-2004, 12:15 PM
Stainz Stainz is offline
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I have the experiences with reading and with the light switches.

In relation to the shooting of a gun - does anyone else have "fight" dreams where they're trying to punch someone but it's like your arm is moving in slow motion and you inflict no harm whatsoever? It's SO frustrating.

(maybe it's because I'm an out-of-shape chick and I always worry that in any kind of physical confrontation I would be totally helpless)

Anyway, that usually clues me in that I'm dreaming. As for the reading, I always think "wow this is an amazing story - I'll have to write it down when I wake up - it will be a BESTSELLER!"
  #23  
Old 11-22-2004, 12:49 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stainz
In relation to the shooting of a gun - does anyone else have "fight" dreams where they're trying to punch someone but it's like your arm is moving in slow motion and you inflict no harm whatsoever? It's SO frustrating.
I have actually speculated in the past that this may be a result of sleep paralysis. Or at least a vague awareness that your brain is suppressing the movement functions so you don't beat the snot out of your spouse who's sleeping next to you. The function that prevents you from sleep walking.

I've surmized that in dreamworld you think "Swing a punch!", paralysis responds with "Oh, no you don't!", so you feel the "resistance" in dreamworld.

It only seems to happen with imperative functions like "run away" or "defend yourself". I don't have problems moving when I need to open a dreamdoor, turn a dreamsteering wheel, or walk around looking for clothes because I've gone to dreamschool naked again. It only seems to happen when there is some urgency.

Hence my theory: Your instinct to fight or flee tries to override the paralysis, but fails. So you feel the "resistance" in dreamworld as your brain tries to resolve the conflicting data of "I'm punching. / No I'm not."

I figured that out as a kid too when I had nightmares. In the dream I tried reeeeaaaly hard to open my eyes, with the idea that if I was dreaming, I could open my eyes and peek at my bedroom. In dreamworld, I would have to physically reach up and try to force my eyelids open "extra-wide" with my fingers -- in realworld I would eventually overcome enough of the sleep paralysis to get a sliver of a peek, see my room and tell myself: "Told ya, so. Just a nightmare, sit back and enjoy." Then the dream would continue, just as scary, but this time I new for sure it was a dream, so it was okay.
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Old 11-22-2004, 01:02 PM
Yllaria Yllaria is offline
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Now I'm a little odd in that I almost never don't know that I'm dreaming. When I found out that other people thought they were awake, I was shocked. I can agree with:

Quote:
Things tend to just be. No need to read since you already know what it says.
Also people and things are often shaped differently. Buildings in particular look nothing like what they look like awake, I just know which building that odd shape is supposed to represent. And I tend to remember what's about to happen. I don't always have time to change things, sometimes I have to replay a scene several times in order to get it to come out the way I want.

A lot of information comes without specific dialog. Like the books mentioned above, if you already know what's being said, the actual words aren't really necessary. But the biggest givaway is just that I'm dreaming. Seriously, it feels totally different than being awake.
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Old 11-22-2004, 01:27 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yllaria
Now I'm a little odd in that I almost never don't know that I'm dreaming. When I found out that other people thought they were awake, I was shocked.
I was shcoked to find out that most people don't dream in colour. I've always dreamt in vivid super-saturated colour.

And how could you possibly NOT know you're dreaming if the world is suddenly black and white?

Oh, and in dreams I can breathe underwater if I breathe just a teensy-weensy bit, veeeery slowly. Note: Do not forget that this only works in dreamland. I hurt my sinuses when I snorted a noseful of water in a pool one day. Ow.
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Old 11-22-2004, 01:30 PM
aerodave aerodave is offline
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This whole thread is making me very depressed. Because I never, ever, EVER dream without thinking it's real. And the very instant I put it all together, and take notice of the inconsistencies, and realize that I'm dreaming... *poof*... I wake up.

Have never really had a lucid dream because of this. And the worst part isn't that I can't figure out I'm dreaming. It's that this realization ends the dream. i don't see how I could get around that.
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Old 11-22-2004, 01:39 PM
ruadh ruadh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eats_Crayons
I was shcoked to find out that most people don't dream in colour. I've always dreamt in vivid super-saturated colour.
Same here.
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Old 11-22-2004, 02:04 PM
TellMeI'mNotCrazy TellMeI'mNotCrazy is offline
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Same here.

And here. I can't even conceive of dreaming in black and white all the time (I had a dream once in black and white, but it was truly bizarre, and took place in the 1400s or so.)
  #29  
Old 11-22-2004, 02:43 PM
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Pleonast Pleonast is offline
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Hasn't this thread ventured into IMHO?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eats_Crayons
two things that tend to give away the fact that your dreaming are 1) trying to read and it looks like gobbledegook on a page and 2) you have no control over light levels (flicking a switch will produce no effect.)
I've never had trouble reading while dreaming. I've done calculus in a dream! It kind of surprised me because I remembered (while in the dream) the one isn't supposed to be able to read while dreaming. Yet I looked at the integral and figured out the value (it was some simple polynomial).

I can't remember ever trying to change the light levels while dreaming. I also don't have trouble with machinery while dreaming because I never really use machinery. For instance I never dream-shoot a gun because I Force-choke the monsters instead. (You know you're weird when you've integrated Jedi powers into your dream-self.)

My main cues thats I'm dreaming are 1) I know things without looking at them, 2) I realize I'm floating/flying instead of walking/running, 3) things happen because I will them too.

As for dreaming in color vs monochrome, I'd say I don't do either. I don't dream images as much as I dream things.
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Old 11-22-2004, 03:47 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleonast
Hasn't this thread ventured into IMHO?
I was thinking the same thing. My original question was fact-based because I thought it was factual in the sense that there are statistics on dreaming in B&W vs. color. And the "not being able to read" stuff has been described as a common phenomenon in research-type stuff.

But we're having fun chitchatting about some pretty cool personal experiences and hypotheses.

I'll ask Xash or someone to nudge it over to IMHO.
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Old 11-22-2004, 04:23 PM
Alectrona Alectrona is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stainz
I have the experiences with reading and with the light switches.

In relation to the shooting of a gun - does anyone else have "fight" dreams where they're trying to punch someone but it's like your arm is moving in slow motion and you inflict no harm whatsoever? It's SO frustrating.
Omg, tell me about it! It really is bloody annoying when that happens, there has only been like 2 times in which I can properly punch someone.

And also, even if there are loads of inconsistencies in my dream, and am about quarter-lucid, I still feel scared that I might hurt myself in my dream world!
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Old 11-22-2004, 04:47 PM
KGS KGS is offline
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Aren't people in your dreams required to tell you you're dreaming, if you ask them? That's how it always works in my dreams, although most of the time, I don't think to ask them.

I can read fine, and the light switch thing never occured to me. (I'm more apt to think, "Aw drat, the power's out," or something along those lines.) Severe bodily injuries never clue me in either, because in the dream world I always forget those rules don't apply to the real world -- "Oh, my arm's been cut off? Whatever, happens all the time. Just stick it in my pocket."
  #33  
Old 11-22-2004, 04:53 PM
TellMeI'mNotCrazy TellMeI'mNotCrazy is offline
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Originally Posted by KGS
Aren't people in your dreams required to tell you you're dreaming, if you ask them? That's how it always works in my dreams, although most of the time, I don't think to ask them.

I can read fine, and the light switch thing never occured to me. (I'm more apt to think, "Aw drat, the power's out," or something along those lines.) Severe bodily injuries never clue me in either, because in the dream world I always forget those rules don't apply to the real world -- "Oh, my arm's been cut off? Whatever, happens all the time. Just stick it in my pocket."

The only times I've asked someone in my dream if I was dreaming, I was met with the kind of look you'd expect to get if you asked someone in waking life if you were dreaming.

...

::nominates the above sentence for "Worst Sentence of the Year".
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Old 11-22-2004, 04:59 PM
JasonFin JasonFin is offline
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In my experience memory is the key to figuring out that you're dreaming. Events usually seem to basically make sense as you go along, but if you try and recall what was happening a few moments ago you'll realize that everything you weren't actually focused on was a vague blur.

As an aside, I get the feeling that a lot of you have more detailed dreams than I do. Dreams with characters with actual names? My dreams rarely even include any kind of intelligible language. I can understand the gist of what I or other people are saying, but if I ever try to focus on the actual words they turn out to be nonsense or gibberish. The same goes for anything that would require precise mental activity, even just counting my fingers.
  #35  
Old 11-22-2004, 05:24 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonFin
As an aside, I get the feeling that a lot of you have more detailed dreams than I do. Dreams with characters with actual names? My dreams rarely even include any kind of intelligible language.
Oh, yeah I've had intelligible language.

I even had a serial dream once -- way cool! Spanned four nights! The funniest part was that the second night rehashed the first dream in a more condensed verision, kind of like two-parter on TV: "Previously, on Crayons the Vampire Slayer...."

There are also a couple "locales" that make regular appearances in my dreams. So the characters and dream plots are different, but it's the same haunted house, or catacombs, or what have you. I had a really scarey nightmare once when I went to the same old haunted house that I'd seen for years in my dreams... to find that the dreamworld house had been renovated, a famly was living in it, and the baby's room was The Most-Haunted-Possessed-by-Evil room in the place! Freaked me right out because it was as if someone had altered my dream -- like there was external intereference.

Scary I tell ya!
  #36  
Old 11-22-2004, 05:39 PM
samclem samclem is offline
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This one probably lends itself more to IMHO than GQ, where we're looking for a nice, neat, factual answer.

Moved to IMHO.

samclem GQ moderator
  #37  
Old 11-22-2004, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audilover
This whole thread is making me very depressed. Because I never, ever, EVER dream without thinking it's real. And the very instant I put it all together, and take notice of the inconsistencies, and realize that I'm dreaming... *poof*... I wake up.

Have never really had a lucid dream because of this. And the worst part isn't that I can't figure out I'm dreaming. It's that this realization ends the dream. i don't see how I could get around that.
Usually the problem is getting over excited. I don't know if you are doing Reality Checks during the day but if you are then add this bit: Imagine what you would do at that moment if you realized you were lucid. eg "If I was lucid I would jump on that branch and grab that leaf" or "I'd ask that old guy for directions to a good restaurant" or something simple "Count how many of those people over there are wearing hats". Imagine/remember the surprise of realization you've had in previous dreams. Try and build up a comfort with recognizing and moving into lucidity through these "dry runs". GL


I don't personally try for LD's much at the moment but went whole hog years before. I get maybe 1-2/month by accident nowadays.(I'll psyche myself up for a couple of days to have one every couple of months-that's current effort level).
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Old 11-22-2004, 08:47 PM
klintypooh klintypooh is offline
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I'm not sure if I mentioned this in a different thread but a cpl of weeks ago I had a nightmare which I kept 'waking' from

Everytime I was sure I had really woke up and when I actually did wake up I apparently told my gf I didn't know if I was awake or not and thought I might be trapped in my dream still.
  #39  
Old 11-22-2004, 09:18 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alectrona
And also, even if there are loads of inconsistencies in my dream, and am about quarter-lucid,
I've come to realize that there are different degrees to lucid dreaming. Like last night, I dreamt I was bakc in college and for some reason (I can remember) I had to run back to the apartment I shared with assorted roomates (dream creations no one I knew.)

I got stuck in slow -motion running mode. Gah! So right there and then, I knew I was dreaming, I knew that running in dreamtime sucks, but for some reason it never occured to me to take control. So I had to resort to sort of running on all fours, using my arms to scrabble at the ground to help propel me forward.

The whole time I was thinking "Gah! This must looks so STUPID. I hate it when I have to do this dream running shit. I'm teh only dream person that has to do this. It's embarassing!" Since I knew I was dreaming, I could have flown or done whatever I wanted, but noooooooo, I just kept running on all fours like an idiot.
  #40  
Old 11-22-2004, 09:32 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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BTW - Anyone ever get a nugget of information in dreams that they did know they knew? I almost started a thread about this last week. As "I didn't know I knew that."

Sometime last week, I had a dream and there was some accident and a younger person was badly burned. I had stripped of my shirt and tackled the kid to snuff out the flames with my shirt and force the kid into a stop-drop-and-roll. All things considered, the teen (?) didn't have extensive burns, but the back of his/her head was severely burnt -- charred black and cracked. Not a lot of surface was burnt, maybe just the size of my hand, but it was a third degree burn.

Some other dream person came running up with water and I said "No, no! That will cool her down too fast, that would be worse. This is a third degree burn. Don't do it."

So I woke up wondering...Really? I kinda thought that you always want to try to cool the person down. Why would dreamCrayons believe otherwise? Did it make the infection risk worse? What?

So I finally looked it up. Sure enough. First aid books recommend avoiding cooling off third degree burns (well, they mostly mean immsersing, I think) with water because it might cool the person down too fast and they'll are more likely to go into shock. And that you can do it if you really have to, but in moderation -- not too much.

So either a) weird coincidence or b) I had read it in a First Aid book a long time ago and had forgotten until dreamtime jarred that little factoid out of whatever long-lost mental filing cabinet it found.
  #41  
Old 11-22-2004, 10:30 PM
Hostile Dialect Hostile Dialect is offline
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I used to dream lucidly all the time, without any special effort--at the time I didn't know there was anything to it. Loads of fun; I would fly around and change aspects of dreams I didn't like. Now that I know all the cool stuff you can do with lucid dreaming if you know what you're doing, I wish I could bring it back. It doesn't really get me down or anything; I'm sure it'll happen again someday. If not, oh well.

I agree with PaulFitzroy that the brain must record all states of mind experienced, because I've been honest-to-God stoned, drunk and popped on DXM without benefit of actual drug ingestion in dreams. When this happens, I usually wake up and still feel the effects of the drug for 20 minutes. I was prepared for this with weed, because sometimes if you smoke right before bed you'll still be a little high in the morning. So being high when I woke up wasn't a new thing. But I really wasn't ready for being drunk in the morning. That was odd.

As far as the lightswitch thing goes, in the research I did on lucid dreaming last year I found that that was an extremely common theme (nonworking light-switches, that is). One of the sites I read literally proclaimed that "lightswitches never work in dreams, ever" and suggested flicking the light switch as a foolproof reality check.
  #42  
Old 11-22-2004, 10:52 PM
Oregon sunshine Oregon sunshine is offline
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Quote:
most people don't dream in colour
MOST PEOPLE DON'T DREAM IN COLOR!?!?!?
  #43  
Old 11-22-2004, 10:53 PM
Hostile Dialect Hostile Dialect is offline
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Originally Posted by KGS
...and the light switch thing never occured to me. (I'm more apt to think, "Aw drat, the power's out," or something along those lines.)
Actually, the reason it's supposed to work for inducing lucidity is because the light can be on and the lightswitch won't turn it off. There is no logical explanation for this in the real world, unless you know your house has faulty wiring or somesuch.

Of course, your mind could trick you into still thinking you're dreaming, by convincing you that your house does have faulty wiring. IANAneurologist/psychologist/otherwise-qualified-professional, but I'm not sure if minds in dream-state can comprehend that sort of thing. It probably varies from person to person; I imagine that an electrical engineer might be so well-versed in home wiring systems on an academic level that his/her brain knows the basics on an almost instinctual level. For most of us, though, I would imagine that the furthest we could get without invoking some waking-life brainpower is probably something among the lines of "light switches are supposed to turn lights off; although this thing appears to be a switch, it must not be a switch because it cannot turn off a light; ergo, things are not as they seem".
  #44  
Old 11-22-2004, 11:00 PM
Hostile Dialect Hostile Dialect is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yllaria
Now I'm a little odd in that I almost never don't know that I'm dreaming. When I found out that other people thought they were awake, I was shocked. I can agree with:



Also people and things are often shaped differently. Buildings in particular look nothing like what they look like awake, I just know which building that odd shape is supposed to represent. And I tend to remember what's about to happen. I don't always have time to change things, sometimes I have to replay a scene several times in order to get it to come out the way I want.

A lot of information comes without specific dialog. Like the books mentioned above, if you already know what's being said, the actual words aren't really necessary. But the biggest givaway is just that I'm dreaming. Seriously, it feels totally different than being awake.
Yup, I used to be just like this. I was truly surprised to hear that it was unique that I could control my dreams and that I always knew I was dreaming. Dreams were dreams because they were dreams, and that was it; there was no confusion to be had, in my mind. Some time in middle or early high school I stopped dreaming lucidly, and although there have been times that I thought it'd be cool to have a lucid dream again, I don't mind this new way at all. I didn't really even notice the difference; seemed perfectly natural to me. Also, now that I'm used to it, it seems like it's a good thing for me because dream time is a time where I can relax and just let what happens happen; this reflects a similar change in my attitude towards life, from trying to control everything and getting all worked up when I couldn't, to just letting things flow and taking life as it comes. (Perhaps that's why I switched to nonlucid dreaming, actually; the change in my attitude in waking life may have subconsciously induced a change in my dreaming life.)
  #45  
Old 11-22-2004, 11:04 PM
Hostile Dialect Hostile Dialect is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ggurl
MOST PEOPLE DON'T DREAM IN COLOR!?!?!?
From my experience with this and what I've heard from everyone else ("Most people don't dream in color? That's weird, I've always dreamed in color.") it must not be true or must manifest itself differently. I would ask this: How was it originally determined that most people don't dream in color? If it was anything other than subjective waking-life commentary ("I dream in black and white"), perhaps it's the reality that we don't have color in our dreams but, looking back on them in waking life, we don't realize it. Or perhaps color (or "black and white") means something different in the dream world. Either way, I can't accept "most people don't dream in color" at face value, because whenever I hear this I see everyone responding: "What?! That's so weird! I dream in color!"
  #46  
Old 11-23-2004, 12:17 PM
Alectrona Alectrona is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fetus
Of course, your mind could trick you into still thinking you're dreaming, by convincing you that your house does have faulty wiring. IANAneurologist/psychologist/otherwise-qualified-professional, but I'm not sure if minds in dream-state can comprehend that sort of thing.
Mmm, my mind seems to be able to comprehend it... if I flicked a switch and it didn't work, I'de immediately think "Oh, must be something wrong with the bulb." No way would I think it was weird or something. In real life, I'm a very logical person so that is probably why I try to think everything out so rationally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fetus
Also, now that I'm used to it, it seems like it's a good thing for me because dream time is a time where I can relax and just let what happens happen; this reflects a similar change in my attitude towards life, from trying to control everything and getting all worked up when I couldn't, to just letting things flow and taking life as it comes. (Perhaps that's why I switched to nonlucid dreaming, actually; the change in my attitude in waking life may have subconsciously induced a change in my dreaming life.)
Same here, with dreams, I know that I can take several paths in the dream, but I like to see what happens when I just go with the flow, dreaming like that feels really effortless and flowy to me. I really want to lucid dream again but I guess subconsciously my brain doesn't want to jump over that big barrier of lucidity. Other than that, I love lucid dreaming.

Also, does tiredness affect lucid dreaming at all?
  #47  
Old 11-23-2004, 12:57 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fetus
From my experience with this and what I've heard from everyone else it must not be true or must manifest itself differently. I would ask this: How was it originally determined that most people don't dream in color?
I think it came about as a statistic. I've also read some study (oh, so long ago that I porbably coldn't find a cite for it on line) which also found that a lot of people said the dream had been in colour, but washed out -- like an old film reel, just not as vibrant.

I confess I have experience the later, but usually it's super saturated.

IIRC, it kind fo goes hand in hand with the nubmer of people who report "I don't dream" when in fact they do, theyare just incapable of recollecting it at all, and others who report that they dream for forget everything about it within seconds of waking.

<wild speculation>
So maybe there's some kind of statistical crossover: When you remember your dream you're also more likely to have dreamt in colour. Like maybe if the whole dream is more realistic (colour, tactile stuff, smells) your brain gets tricked into thinking it's real so you remember more and therefore remember it had colour and all the elements of realism.
</speculation>
  #48  
Old 11-23-2004, 01:05 PM
Eats_Crayons Eats_Crayons is offline
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CORRECTION:

Neato. Looked up a more recent study. Apparently, newer research indicates we dream in colour 75%-83% of the time. Previous studies had it as low as only 25%-30%.

BUT the more recent studies say that it is more likely an issue of recall.

So when we are more conscious of the dream state (like lucid dreaming) we're more likley to recall there were colours. Whereas if the memory recall is too vague we can't so they are rememberd as "colourless".

Smurfy.
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