Straight Dope Message Board

[tracer]

Originally Posted by don Jaime

Mrs. Butterworth is supposed to be white.

Then why is her face dark brown? Been spending too much time in the Bahamas?

[jayjay]

Originally Posted by voguevixen

Hallmark has "Rudolph" partyware this season. The dessert plates have Hermie on them - WOOT!

Now if only they'd have Heatmiser and Snowmiser. *sigh*

Just a note for those who love Rankin/Bass...ABC Family is going to be showing the Rankin/Bass Christmas classics all through December!

Here is the programming schedule for the month, and yes, Heatmiser and Snowmiser are on there. Can't remember exactly which one they were on, though...

[flodnak]

Originally Posted by jayjay

Heatmiser and Snowmiser are on there. Can't remember exactly which one they were on, though...

The Year Without a Santa Claus. Which is otherwise a pretty dumb show, but who cares! It has Heatmiser! And Snowmiser!

And Mrs Santa saying "EAT, PAPA! EAT!"

[Dolores Reborn]

Originally Posted by tracer

Then why is her face dark brown? Been spending too much time in the Bahamas?

Her face is clear, like the bottle. There's dark syrup behind it!

[mobo85]

Originally Posted by flodnak

The Year Without a Santa Claus. Which is otherwise a pretty dumb show, but who cares! It has Heatmiser! And Snowmiser!

And Mrs Santa saying "EAT, PAPA! EAT!"

Actually, the latter is from Rudolph. The Rankin-Bassiverse has so many Santas it's kind of hard to keep track of them.

[jayjay]

So which one had that frost wizard, who couldn't move because he'd frozen himself to the ground. The song went "You put one foot...in front...of the other..."

[DrFidelius]

That was the one with Mickey Rooney voicing Kris Kringle, and an absolutely hot younger Mrs. Claus...

I seem to recall Fred Astair doing the frame for that one as Santa's postal carrier...

[DrFidelius]

Short Google, and a website with a bilious green background which made my eyes bleed, give the titile as Santa Claus is Coming to Town, from 1970.

[wonky]

Originally Posted by jayjay

So which one had that frost wizard, who couldn't move because he'd frozen himself to the ground. The song went "You put one foot...in front...of the other..."

Santa Claus is Coming to Town.

Which I always remember because young Kris Kringle is a dead ringer for my brother-in-law. I like to point at Santa and inform BIL what he'll look like if he doesn't change his ways.

[Rainbowthief]

Just two nights ago my wife mentioned something about Hermey the elf and she slapped me when I told her I didn't know who or what she was talking about (I thought it was a Disney movie character). If I'd taken a guess I would've said Robby, so it's good to see I'm not the only one who didn't know the elf's name.

I'd always referred to him as "the elf who wanted to be a dentist."

[vd]

It's on tonight on CBS, going against Lost.

[Scumpup]

For all of you who expressed outrage at Santa's treatment of Rudolph, Rudolph's family, the elves, et. al., don't worry. The old bastard got his comeuppance.

[MovieMogul]

Originally Posted by DrFidelius

That was the one with Mickey Rooney voicing Kris Kringle, and an absolutely hot younger Mrs. Claus...

Actually, Year w/o a SC also has the Mickster as Mr. "Klause". And beyond the terrific Miser brothers, there are also some other terrific songs, including the very touching "I Believe in Santa Claus" :sniff:

[Steve MB]

Originally Posted by mobo85

The opening credits of the program read, in part, "©Videocraft Int'l Inc. MCLXIV."

Perhaps this serves as an explanation for the cynical and exploitive attitude of Santa and other characters -- they should be understood as creatures of their times, who failed to rise above their twelfth-century upbringing.

[BMalion]

And another thing, wasn't that Herbie the Elf that got killed at Helm's Deep?


Merry Kwanzamasnnaka!

[Sean Factotum]

Who did Santa shoot? When he left Elf Practice, he was pretty perturbed. He walked off camera, and you hear a gunshot (or a slamming door.) I know it wasn't the Mel Cooley elf, nor Hermie, but who was it?

And has anyone else counted the reindeer pulling the sled? Seven, counting Rudolph. C'mon, one of the easiest things to get right, and they screwed it up.

[Honey]

Does anybody else see the resemblance between The elf who wanted to be a dentist and Ken Jennings?

[BMalion]

Originally Posted by Bean Counter

But then you get to the Misfit Toys and things change! They are given an unbrella, a boot on the rump and they are gone! The fat bastard does not even slow the sleigh down. He probably learn that from his Mafioso connections. Not to mention the fact that numerous people have ON TAPE one of his henchmen chucking that poor, flightless bird over the sleigh to plumet to an early, gruesome death. Does anyone else smell organized crime here?!?

That elf-lover should be doing hard time in Marion.

I remember seeing film evidence of his accomplice, SANTA HIMSELF! escaping the scene of the crime on a huge Norelco Razor.

We are through the looking glass.

[singular1]

Originally Posted by mobo85

Also, the original airing had animated ads for the sponsor, General Electric, featuring the singing elves. It was GE's head who did not like "We're a Couple of Misfits," which had them remove it and replace it with "Fame and Fortune" from 1965 (1065?) to 1997.

What!?!?!?
I was just singing this song to Mr. singular a few weeks and he was really sorry he didn't know it. You mean if I watch it now, I won't hear

"Why am I such a Misfit?
I am not such a nitwit.
You can't fire me, I quit!" ?

Man, it's been a long time since I saw this thing, but I still remember that song. Have they reinstated it?

[BMalion]

Originally Posted by singular1

What!?!?!?
I was just singing this song to Mr. singular a few weeks and he was really sorry he didn't know it. You mean if I watch it now, I won't hear

"Why am I such a Misfit?
I am not such a nitwit.
You can't fire me, I quit!" ?

Man, it's been a long time since I saw this thing, but I still remember that song. Have they reinstated it?

I believe that it's still in there, but the reprise was removed. Or my memories are also conflated.

I did not watch it last night but I can hear it now!

[Sean Factotum]

Originally Posted by singular1

What!?!?!?
I was just singing this song to Mr. singular a few weeks and he was really sorry he didn't know it. You mean if I watch it now, I won't hear

"Why am I such a Misfit?
I am not such a nitwit.
You can't fire me, I quit!" ?

Man, it's been a long time since I saw this thing, but I still remember that song. Have they reinstated it?

It was in last night's showing. Hermie sung the "I quit" part, but still worked for mean Mr. Suck-up Elf after that - he only left after getting yelled at for putting teeth into dolls.

[beagledave]

For those who didn't catch it, NPR covered the 40th Anniversary of Rudolph..with some info about the creation

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...toryId=4193235

[interface2x]

This may be in the existing nine million posts above that I'm too lazy to search through, but does anyone know why the "elves singing" scene (i.e. Elf Practice) was cut when I was a little kid? It was reinstated in the early 90's (I think) and remains in the show now.

[BwanaBob]

I hadn't watched this show in years, but bought it on DVD last year for my son.
He has no sense of seasons and I've probably watched the damn thing 25 times in the past year (last showing the night before the CBS airing!)

The DVD is purported to be the 1964 version (with Misfit song). As a bonus feature they also give you the Fame and Fortune song.

Is the sequel any good?

[Jeep's Phoenix]

My dad says that Rudolph's nose used to have a little GE logo on it. Is he thinking of the original commercials that aired with the program?

[mobo85]

Thots:

I'm no Rankin-Bassologist, but let me attempt to answer some of the questions that have been put up.

As I later corrected, I was 100 years off in the year Rudolph originally aired as quoted in singular1's post. Although I had originally said it was 1064, I had misremembered the Roman numerals in the copyright notice. Rudolph was actually produced in 1164. (In actuality, this is an oversight, of course. The opening sequence features a copyright notice "©Videocraft Int'l Inc. MCLXIV." They forgot the second "M.")

Rick Goldschmidt, a real Rankin-Bassologist, who was interviewed in the NPR clip beagledave linked to, and is the curator of a Rankin-Bass website, has answered some of these questions, and I'll add my knowledge to what he had to say.

From 1965 (1165?) to 1997, the short number Fame and Fortune replaced We're A Couple of Misfits. A GE executive wasn't fond of Misfits, apparently. Some dopers seem to be confusing the longer number with two short numbers Rudolph and Hermey sing to themselves, asking, "Why am I such a misfit?" (The tune is the same.) These two little numbers have been in the show since it premiered. It's the Misfit reprise, that features Rudolph and Hermey romping in the snow and Hermey punching a snowman made to look like his boss, that hadn't been seen again until 1998. According to Goldschmidt, there's also one more tiny scene that doesn't appear in the CBS broadcast (presumably due to time contraints), but does appear on home video: a quick gag in which Yukon Cornelius, who's been striking with his pickaxe for the entire show looking for some sort of metal (he keeps changing his mind on what is is), finally hits what he was really hunting for:

SPOILER:

peppermint!

As for a GE commercial featuring their logo on Rudolph's nose, I haven't read anything about that, but it's likely. And Ken Jennings himself has commented on Jeopardy! about his resemblance to Hermey.

[Annie-Xmas]

Originally Posted by Sean Factotum

Who did Santa shoot? When he left Elf Practice, he was pretty perturbed. He walked off camera, and you hear a gunshot (or a slamming door.) I know it wasn't the Mel Cooley elf, nor Hermie, but who was it?

And has anyone else counted the reindeer pulling the sled? Seven, counting Rudolph. C'mon, one of the easiest things to get right, and they screwed it up.

First you ask "Who did Santa shoot," then you comment on the missing reindeer. I thnk you answered your own question.

[Sean Factotum]

Originally Posted by Annie-Xmas

First you ask "Who did Santa shoot," then you comment on the missing reindeer. I thnk you answered your own question.

Yes, it is obvious in retrospective, isn't it? Thank you.

[BMalion]

Originally Posted by Scupper

if you do a frame-by-frame analysis of the scene, that the toy bird was preparing to attack the poor elf, no doubt due to psychological imbalance stemming from it's mistreatment as a misfit toy.

I have seen video of Santa himself escaping the scene through the snow on a giant electric shaver!

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Originally Posted by BMalion

I have seen video of Santa himself escaping the scene through the snow on a giant electric shaver!

A Noëlco, of course.

[mobo85]

Since C K Dexter Haven allowed the bumping of this thread last year, and it has become a Christmas tradtion for this board, I think it's time to bring this thread back for a 5th consecutive year. I am dedicating it to the memory of its originator, the late poopah chalupa.

Since C K also says "don't resurrect a new thread unless you have something to add," I'll add this:

The 41st annual showing of Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer will be tonight at 8:00 Eastern on CBS.

[Khadaji]

Originally Posted by mobo85

Since [i]C K Dexter Haven[/b] allowed the bumping of this thread last year, and it has become a Christmas tradtion for this board, I think it's time to bring this thread back for a 5th consecutive year. I am dedicating it to the memory of its originator, the late poopah chalupa.

Since C K also says "don't resurrect a new thread unless you have something to add," I'll add this:

The 41st annual showing of Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer will be tonight at 8:00 Eastern on CBS.

Thanks for letting us know. I have the DVD, but I'll probably watch anyway.

[kaylasdad99]

Thanks, mobo. I just called home and instructed Michaela to set the TiVo.

[gotpasswords]

Someone did a nice job on restoring the film for this year. Last time I saw Rudolph, it was fuzzy and spotted. I thought it was funny that they presented it in HDTV - after all, it's made on probably old 16mm film. Previously, it looked like Super8.

[RumMunkey]

Yeah, about that HD version: To get it widescreen, wouldn't they have to stretch it or crop it? I mean, it was made for TV, so 4:3 is it's native aspect ratio is it not?

[mojave66]

@#!%#@!!! I missed it. Off to the DVD store...

[kingpengvin]

I dunno about a high def clean claer version of the show. It was designed with the old fashioned fuzzy small monitors and their tinny mono speakers in mind. They cheated a lot of things knowing they wouldn't be caught on the old sets. Now we can see the strings on the puppets and the string of lights that represent stars. I prefer a little bit of fuzzier picture.

[Sampiro]

I found this channel surfing last night and watched it for the first time since I was a wee bairn. When I was a kid I thought it was scary and disturbing. Last night I thought it was scary and disturbing. I don't know why, but it's one of those "just freaks me out" things. And Santa doesn't come off as very likable in it ("Shame about that nose or I'd put him on my sleigh"- listen you elf exploiting lard ass, Rudolph can't help the fact he has a red nose! And how do you think it makes him feel hearing the man all the Pole looks on as George Washington/Solomon/and God rolled into one trashing him for what he's already sensitive about, been rejected by his father because of and is powerless to change? And just how would you feel if you lived in a world where everybody around you wanted to celebrate Hannukkah or Kwanzaa but in your heart you knew you were only meant to celebrate Christmas and those you loved rejected you, how would you feel Mama? The fact that I'm gay has nothing to do wit...

Sorry, what were we talking about?

Oh yeah, I liked the song better. Just because Rudolph's nose was red wouldn't mean it would light up- that part stretched credibility. Orlando Bloom as an elf would have helped a lot too.

[Revtim]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

And Santa doesn't come off as very likable in it

He's a damn red-nose hating bigot in this movie. In the director's cut, there's a scene of him burning a cross on Donner's lawn.

[Sampiro]

Originally Posted by Revtim

He's a damn red-nose hating bigot in this movie. In the director's cut, there's a scene of him burning a cross on Donner's lawn.

Which being on a glacier was particularly stupid. And the way they treated the Abominable Snow Creature- pulling his teeth without anesthesia? Where's PETA at times like this? Damn, just cut off his scrotum and make him wear a tutu why don't you? I half expected Abominable to wake up and find Hermey and his dental tools standing over him asking in a German accent "Is it safe?"

[What Exit?]

I watch it with my daughter last night. When it came to the scene with the Jelly shooting gun, I immediately said,

Homer would love that

I got a good laugh. Easy audience.
We both enjoyed the bumbles bounce scene. The show is dated but yet still appeals to kids so that’s pretty cool.

Jim

[What Exit?]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Which being on a glacier was particularly stupid. And the way they treated the Abominable Snow Creature- pulling his teeth without anesthesia? Where's PETA at times like this? Damn, just cut off his scrotum and make him wear a tutu why don't you? I half expected Abominable to wake up and find Hermey and his dental tools standing over him asking in a German accent "Is it safe?"

Abominable is a meat eating humanoid so PETA probably give Hermey a lifetime membership.

Jim

[ivylass]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Orlando Bloom as an elf would have helped a lot too.

Oh, please. You'd take Orlando Bloom as Clarice if you could get him, complete with pink polka-dotted bow on his head.

Anyone get a "quality" from Charlie-in-the-Box? And did King Moonracer evoke the Lion of Narnia for anyone?

Yeah, Santa was a bit of a jerk in this. And how could he eat so much to get fat in one evening? He cancelled Christmas because of the weather report, then Rudolph lights his nose, and Mrs. Santa starts shoving food down his throat, and then it's Ho-Ho-Ho hook up the sleigh and get ready to stop at the Isle of Misfit Toys.

Boy, a lot of stuff sails right over our heads when we're kids.

[caveman]

In all this time, noone has mentioned the other un-misfitish toy on the IoMT: the yellow scooter! Just what was wrong with it?

[What Exit?]

Originally Posted by caveman

In all this time, noone has mentioned the other un-misfitish toy on the IoMT: the yellow scooter! Just what was wrong with it?

It was yellow, who ever heard of a scooter that was Yellow. My gosh, the horror.

[ladybug]

I watched Rudolph again last night and started wondering: do all of the toys created in Santa's warehouse become self-aware, sentient beings like the inhabitants of the IoMT? If so, why didn't that one doll object when Hermie was hammering away at her teeth?

I've given this show way too much thought.

[ladybug]

And by "warehouse," of course, I mean "workshop."

[jsc1953]

Originally Posted by ladybug

I watched Rudolph again last night and started wondering: do all of the toys created in Santa's warehouse become self-aware, sentient beings like the inhabitants of the IoMT? If so, why didn't that one doll object when Hermie was hammering away at her teeth?

I've given this show way too much thought.

Toys receive the spark of sentience upon arriving at the IoMT, so they are immediately and constantly tormented night and day with thoughts of their own inadequacies. Once they're distributed as presents, they revert to blissful nothingness.

Kinda creepy.

[What Exit?]

Originally Posted by jsc1953

Toys receive the spark of sentience upon arriving at the IoMT, so they are immediately and constantly tormented night and day with thoughts of their own inadequacies. Once they're distributed as presents, they revert to blissful nothingness.

Kinda creepy.

That finally explains Chucky.

[mobo85]

Originally Posted by Sampiro

Oh yeah, I liked the song better. Just because Rudolph's nose was red wouldn't mean it would light up- that part stretched credibility.

According to Sam the Snowman, Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer had a very shiny nose. In fact, if you ever saw it, you might even say it glows. Whether or not it actually glows or if the glowing is a figment of your imagination, I'm not sure. Not sure why it squeaks, either.