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  #1  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:24 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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Fresh install of Windows XP can’t run updates (yes, Win XP)

I resurrected a Dell Inspiron 1501 laptop with a new HDD. I installed a retail copy of Windows XP, updated it with Dell drivers and SP 1 and 3 and Explorer 8 from a Flash drive. It has wireless capability and a functioning Ethernet port, but Windows Update refuses to run. I can’t figure out why, because the Fix it for Me link is just a .cab file that I can’t do anything with.

Is there an easy fix or should I just keep this thing off the internet? It’s only got 1GB of RAM in it, so an OS upgrade isn’t likely.

Also, I dragged this back from the dustheap to let the four-year-old Dudeling have some occasional fun (e.g. Reader the Hallucinogenic Rabbit, Thomas the Psychopathic Engine, etc.). If I turn off wireless networking and only use it to download a file here and there (i.e. no surfing), can I stop all this troubleshooting folderol and just leave it in its currently stable state? It’d only connect to the internet behind a router with a NAT. Small protection, but will the very occasional connection to safe sites mean that I don’t have to use precious resources on Windows Security Essentials or further troubleshooting?
  #2  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:30 PM
Kimballkid Kimballkid is offline
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I don't know if it has anything to do with it, but Microsoft ended mainstream support for XP on April 14, 2009 and the end of life date is April 8, 2014.
  #3  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:36 PM
PastTense PastTense is offline
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Here are some possibilities:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...windows-update

Note there won't be any more updates for XP after April 8, 2014 anyway as they are ending support then.
  #4  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:37 PM
Esox Lucius Esox Lucius is offline
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Originally Posted by Kimballkid View Post
I don't know if it has anything to do with it, but Microsoft ended mainstream support for XP on April 14, 2009 and the end of life date is April 8, 2014.
My Windows XP Media Edition still updates, and I reinstalled it last year, or two years ago at the most, and was able to get all the updates (a hellish lot of them), so I don't think that's the OP's problem.
  #5  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:45 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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So let's say that MS isn't even hosting the updates anymore. On the off chance that that is indeed the issue (odd, though), do I care? I just want the Dudeling to lop the heads of illiterate bunnies and grow up fully ensconced in the British class system so he'll be a Really Useful Engine.

Also, before the days of online validation, how did we get around having to insert the CD every time we wanted to play something. If he/we have to insert a disk each time, that's really cutting their life expectancy way down.
  #6  
Old 10-23-2013, 05:50 PM
Blakeyrat Blakeyrat is offline
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Windows 7 runs better on 1 GB of RAM than Windows XP does. (No, seriously. Try it.)
  #7  
Old 10-23-2013, 11:22 PM
Superhal Superhal is offline
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I was forced to buy win7 because win xp couldnt update.
  #8  
Old 10-23-2013, 11:40 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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Well, you have to be at least 13 years old to register here, so I guess I'll leave the install as-is and never connect it to the Internet.

If I do, say because some game requires a connection or some other reason I can't fathom, is there much risk of going online behind the router's NAT? When does it become risky? Surfing beyond established commercial sites? Just sitting there? We're absurdly wired in the house, so I can't think of a reason we'd just surf with it, but who knows what I'll think of tomorrow?
  #9  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:02 AM
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It's not that bad of a security risk, IMHO. Just make sure it has a good anti-virus on it, and if you do choose to surf on it, don't use IE. Use Firefox or Chrome with both an ad blocker and a script blocker. That is far more important than keeping XP itself up to date.

You can manually download the service packs from Microsoft's web site.

I have an XP box here that runs games. It's updated to SP3 and beyond that I have intentionally not installed any updates. I generally don't surf the net on it (I have a linux box for that) but I do happen to be typing on it right now, so I do use it to connect to a few known sites (the SDMB plus a few sites to download mods for the games I have installed on it).
  #10  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:31 AM
astro astro is offline
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If you have XP SP1 or SP2 it will not update per notes below. You will have to force an update to SP3.

Quote:
What does it mean if my version of Windows is no longer supported?

An unsupported version of Windows will no longer receive software updates from Windows Update. These include security updates that can help protect your PC from harmful viruses, spyware, and other malicious software, which can steal your personal information. Windows Update also installs the latest software updates to improve the reliability of Windows—new drivers for your hardware and more.

You should always install the latest service packs for Windows. You can download and install these through Windows Update.
• For information about using Windows Update in Windows XP, see Stay up to date automatically.

• For information about using Windows Update in Windows Vista, see Install Windows updates.

• For information about using Windows Update in Windows 7, see Install Windows updates.

Support end dates
Here are the dates when support will end for PCs running Windows XP and Windows Vista without the latest service packs:
• Support for Windows XP is ending on April 8, 2014.
• Support for Windows Vista Service Pack 1 (SP1) ended on July 12, 2011. To continue support, make sure you've installed Windows Vista Service Pack 2 (SP2).
• Support for Windows Vista without any service packs ended on April 13, 2010. To continue support, make sure you've installed Windows Vista SP2.
• Support for Windows XP SP2 ended on July 13, 2010. To continue support, make sure you've installed Windows XP Service Pack 3 (SP3). For more information, see Learn how to install Windows XP Service Pack 3 (SP3).
  #11  
Old 10-24-2013, 10:30 AM
Fortyfold Fortyfold is offline
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I had this problem when I reinstalled my netbook recently.

It seem this might due to the changes to Windows Update some months ago, IIRC I got it updated by setting it to automatic updates and leaving it to do its thing. Might need to manually update Windows Update first.
  #12  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:11 PM
DJ Motorbike DJ Motorbike is offline
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Originally Posted by Superhal View Post
I was forced to buy win7
Linux
  #13  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:28 PM
Fear Itself Fear Itself is offline
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Originally Posted by astro View Post
If you have XP SP1 or SP2 it will not update per notes below. You will have to force an update to SP3.
That doesn't fix it either. I recently did a fresh install of XP, installed SP3 from disk, and it still won't update, either through automatic updates, or on the Windows update website. What's worse, automatic updates runs an svchost process that consumes 99% of the CPU time, rendering the PC unusable unless automatic updates is turned off.
  #14  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:41 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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I got a little farther. It seems this is a recent hiccup---I was surprised to find that most of the threads on it were from the past few months. Conjecture is that MS is screwing around with their servers in advance of the EOL.

Anyway, I found a few solutions by Googling "0x8024d001 windows update." The solution that seems to have gotten me to the next stage was downloading/running WindowsUpdateAgent30-x86.exe. Now at least it runs.

But that’s all it’s doing. It’s hanging on “windows is checking for updates...” I have yet to try any of the fixes out there (e.g. re-registering some dlls), so can’t say if it’s out of the woods.

I’d love to install Linux on it (I do most of my surfing on a Linux VM on my office machine), but most games for the Dudeling are PC only.
  #15  
Old 10-24-2013, 12:55 PM
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I have reinstalled WinXP recently and had some trouble updating at first. After some tinkering and maybe updating the Windows Update Agent the computer updates just fine.

I use and maintaing a few computers which are running WinXP Pro SP3 and for now they all update just fine.

I intend to keep using them well beyond April 2014. So what if XP is not updated by MS? I expect to get at least a couple years more out of them.
  #16  
Old 10-24-2013, 01:57 PM
Fortyfold Fortyfold is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl View Post
...It’s hanging on “windows is checking for updates...” I have yet to try any of the fixes out there (e.g. re-registering some dlls), so can’t say if it’s out of the woods.
Now try setting it to automatically update and set the system clock to one minute before whatever time it's set to update, and see what happens.

Last edited by Fortyfold; 10-24-2013 at 01:58 PM.
  #17  
Old 10-24-2013, 05:24 PM
lurcio lurcio is offline
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Once you have SP3 installed, try installing IE8 and then doing windows update.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/i...downloads/ie-8
  #18  
Old 10-24-2013, 05:37 PM
Fear Itself Fear Itself is offline
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Once you have SP3 installed, try installing IE8 and then doing windows update.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/i...downloads/ie-8
Yep, tried that. No joy.
  #19  
Old 10-24-2013, 07:42 PM
sailor sailor is offline
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Make sure you have the latest version of Windows Update and that Automatic Updates Service is running. It should be able to update manually, no need to use "automatic" setting.
  #20  
Old 10-24-2013, 07:48 PM
Fear Itself Fear Itself is offline
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I ran the Windows Update Fixit, with no success.
  #21  
Old 10-24-2013, 08:19 PM
sailor sailor is offline
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Originally Posted by Rhythmdvl View Post
It’s hanging on “windows is checking for updates...”
take into account that the first time you run the update it will take quite a while to check the whole need for updates, doubly so if it is a slower computer. Let it run for a long time before stopping it.
  #22  
Old 10-25-2013, 12:11 PM
Lips_Obsession Lips_Obsession is offline
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We have a whole office full of WinXP SP3 PCs here and they all update just fine. Unfortunately we are stuck with XP for the time being as we have software that is required by everyone that won't run on anything beyond XP....
  #23  
Old 10-25-2013, 11:03 PM
Binkley Binkley is offline
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Had the exact same issue with a fresh install of XP and tried everything to resolve it mentioned above. Was able to get Windows Update working by the using the fix in this thread.

http://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/11...did-something/

Still updating my computer now. I only installed the IE6 cumulative security update to fix it, but I am assuming that when i upgrade to IE8, Windows Update will break again until I install the IE8 Cumulative update.
  #24  
Old 10-26-2013, 04:08 PM
Nanoda Nanoda is offline
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I wasn't in a hurry last month, so as per some online threads, I left my new XP SP3 VM running with updates in "Install updates automatically" mode. I didn't pay much attention to it, just rebooting it anytime it looked like it managed to get an update, and it finally started working as expected 2 days later.

So if you don't need answer fast, I'd say just do that.
  #25  
Old 10-28-2013, 04:18 AM
md2000 md2000 is offline
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Yeah, the windows update "check what's on the MS Servers against what's installed, build a list" is going to take a very long time (LONG list) with a fresh install. You can skip a few iterations if you can find and download SP3.

A few years ago I had to install a fresh Win2000 server. The internet no longer worked, because almost nothing supported IE5, even MS Windows Updates site. Fortunately, for some bizarre reason, I had an IE6 install disk. Once I did that, I could download the fixes required including the Windows update software. (Can't now I think...)
  #26  
Old 10-28-2013, 04:27 PM
Fortyfold Fortyfold is offline
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Unfortunately it isn't just a problem of it taking a long time, no matter how long I left update running, it would just fail with an error message saying it couldn't connect to the update service.
  #27  
Old 10-28-2013, 09:43 PM
md2000 md2000 is offline
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http://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/downl...ils.aspx?id=24

I googled "download XP SP3"
I think you can download the newest Service pack here, and then run it. It should incorporate a lot of the updates up to that point.
What happens if you try that?
  #28  
Old 10-29-2013, 01:51 AM
md2000 md2000 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by md2000 View Post
http://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/downl...ils.aspx?id=24

I googled "download XP SP3"
I think you can download the newest Service pack here, and then run it. It should incorporate a lot of the updates up to that point.
What happens if you try that?
Oops. I see you tried that.

Must be a new glitch. I've installed fresh (virtual) XP within a year ago and they update just fine,

Plenty of existing XP all work fine, I've never had an update issue.
  #29  
Old 10-29-2013, 04:49 AM
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The factory install on mine is already on SP3 so it couldn't have been that. I think the explanation in the link Binkley provided sounds as if it could be right.

Wonder if the OP has got his fixed yet.
  #30  
Old 10-29-2013, 06:41 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Binkley View Post
Had the exact same issue with a fresh install of XP and tried everything to resolve it mentioned above. Was able to get Windows Update working by the using the fix in this thread.

http://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/11...did-something/

Still updating my computer now. I only installed the IE6 cumulative security update to fix it, but I am assuming that when i upgrade to IE8, Windows Update will break again until I install the IE8 Cumulative update.
I think that was it! When I downloaded SP3 (I actually have an SP2 disk) I was given the "you may also want" dialogue and ended up with IE8. Following Binkley's link, as soon as I manually updated IE8, Windows Update began working. It's hanging up on upgrading .NET, but I think I'm getting around that by manually updating it to v.4.

The only other thing I can't get past is the bad battery notice. I found a lot of threads talking about how it's a known Inspiron 1501 problem, but I've flashed the BIOS to the latest version and it's still giving me the warning. That's a separate issue, though (mentioning it here in case it sparks anyone's memory) and will re-post if necessary.


Thanks!!!!
  #31  
Old 10-30-2013, 05:12 AM
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It's hanging up on upgrading .NET, but I think I'm getting around that by manually updating it to v.4.
.NET updates always take a long time, much longer than other updates.

Also note that later versions of .NET framework do not replace or remove the previous .NET frameworks but install and run side by side.
  #32  
Old 10-30-2013, 08:36 AM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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Thanks. I shouldn't have said 'hanging', as that implies it's dragging along. Rather, the updates are all failing. I've tried a handful of things, the most nuclear (can you have a 'most nuclear'?) was using a 3rd-party cleanup utility to uninstall all of the .NET frameworks, then manually installing them and their service packs. I may have missed a step somewhere, because updates pretend to run, then I get a failure notice. Funny thing is, even when I run a non-.NET update I get a failure notice, so maybe I'm barking up a wrong .NET with my attempts at solving it.

You know, you'd think I would have had all this XP nonsense down by now.
  #33  
Old 01-02-2014, 01:42 PM
jmfridey jmfridey is offline
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It took me a while to cut this one down. I created a blog post on my website with detailed instructions and links to the updates you'll need to download. It'll take you about 10 minutes and you should have Windows Updates working again.
http://www.geekallday.com/windows-xp-sp3-update-issues/

I'll also list the updates here that are required.
•Microsoft .NET Framework 3.5
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/downl...ils.aspx?id=21
•Internet Explorer 8
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/w...e-your-browser
•Update for Windows XP (KB927891)
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/927891
•Windows Update Agent 3.0
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l.../bb932139.aspx
•Security Update for Windows XP (KB2510531)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/downl....aspx?id=10367
•Security Update for Internet Explorer 8 for Windows XP (KB2797052)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/downl....aspx?id=36574
•Security Update for Internet Explorer for Windows XP (KB2799329)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/downl....aspx?id=36418
•Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer 8 for Windows XP (KB2898785)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/downl....aspx?id=41404
  #34  
Old 01-02-2014, 02:46 PM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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Wow, great list, thanks!

It's been pretty stable and non-networked (also worried about Cylon attack) so far. Still has that bad battery issue (and not fixed by flashing to the latest version).

Now I need to find a good supply of cheap, educational (or fun) XP games....
  #35  
Old 01-03-2014, 11:19 AM
What the .... ?!?! What the .... ?!?! is offline
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I understand very little of this thread but I get the impression that on certain computers that run XP there is no option to install a dif Windows operating system.

My main home computer is an HP Mini netbook that I'd love to keep going as long as I can. I've heard that Windows XP won't update but don't really know how that will affect me. My latest "problem" is not being able to run Chrome so that I can utilize my Chromecast.

What options do I have if any?
  #36  
Old 01-03-2014, 11:53 AM
Rhythmdvl Rhythmdvl is offline
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I'm running XP on this laptop because it matches the requirements of the software I have (lots of hand-me-down kid's games and the like).

I've heard of, but never encountered (or heard specifics), hardware that looks for a particular OS before it will continue booting.

You're definitely going to get a lot of Linux! Linux! Linux! replies, and they're right. It's mature, runs a lot of everyday software, can be very easy (and intuitively familiar) to use, and can have a very small footprint.

I love using Ubuntu. You can put it on a 'live' CD or USB stick to double check that your computer will run it without a hitch. You can then explore built-in software and search the net for what's missing.

As for Chromecast, here's this from support.google: "The Google Cast extension is available on all platforms, including Chrome OS, Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux."
  #37  
Old 01-03-2014, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by What the .... ?!?! View Post
My main home computer is an HP Mini netbook that I'd love to keep going as long as I can. I've heard that Windows XP won't update but don't really know how that will affect me. My latest "problem" is not being able to run Chrome so that I can utilize my Chromecast.
Google says it's supporing Chrome on XP until April 2015. Are you sure you have updated to SP3? Also check if you have the right version of .Net.
  #38  
Old 01-03-2014, 06:48 PM
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Thanks. I shouldn't have said 'hanging', as that implies it's dragging along. Rather, the updates are all failing. .
The main cause of that would be a problem with the windows installer.
You might find the windows installer update and do that one manually.
  #39  
Old 01-04-2014, 09:38 AM
Myglaren Myglaren is offline
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I have had this with an old (very old) NEC laptop.
Refused to update IE to 8 from 6. Would install no updates - it had never been updated beyond service pack 1.
I would have put Linux on it but the CD-ROM wouldn't work, nor the floppy drive, and it was too old to boot from USB although I did install PLOP to try that, failed miserably.
Gave it back, more trouble than it was worth.

I have here a Toshiba rescued from the skip. Decent model, crap spec.
This also has Windows XP SP1 IE6.
It has taken around 50 hours up to now but by general buggering around - I couldn't posssibly recall all the attempts that were made, it has, bit buy bit, managed to install SP3, IE8, MSE and is in the process of finalising the updates.
This one won't boot from USB - it is a 2004 model and the last time it was used was 2006.
The sound has failed and it wasn't reading the CD-ROM either or it would have had Linux on it ages ago (been lurking here for six months, just left it plugged in and running for a month to see if it would 'fix' itself but it did nothing at all.
The CD-ROM is now working, there was a game in the drive that had clearly failed to load so the owner had abandoned it and forgotten the CD.

It is kind of a shame that XP is now running 'cause it's going to be wiped and Ubuntued.

That said, it might be worthwhile to keep tinkering with it in the hope that it will eventually be up to date.
  #40  
Old 01-04-2014, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Myglaren View Post
I have had this with an old (very old) NEC laptop.
Refused to update IE to 8 from 6. Would install no updates - it had never been updated beyond service pack 1.
I would have put Linux on it but the CD-ROM wouldn't work, nor the floppy drive, and it was too old to boot from USB although I did install PLOP to try that, failed miserably.
Gave it back, more trouble than it was worth.
Step one of updating any old XP system is to put SP3 on it. (Maybe step 2, according to jmfridey. See that post for direct download links.)

To install Debian Linux from Windows directly, I have (very recently) used Debian-Installer Loader. Runs from Windows 95 up. Does a net install so you need a fastish connection.

There are some "gotchas" in the install. I would recommend first setting up the Linux partitions using any of the usual free/free to try partition programs. It also needs to know the archive site like ftp.us.debian.org to download from. It may also mess up booting from the old Windows partition so you need to know how to do Grub stuff if you want to fix that. (I actually set it up so the Windows boot loader gives me the boot option page. No Grub!)

Don't know if Ubuntu has something similar.
  #41  
Old 01-04-2014, 11:36 AM
Myglaren Myglaren is offline
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Both Linux Mint (on this laptop) and Ubuntu are incredibly simple to install and retain Windows if you wish.

I have dumped Windows (7) from this machine, didn't want it in the first place.

Have Ubuntu on my main computer, bought as bare metal.

Xubuntu on another slightly disastrous 'fixer' that previously had virused-to-death XP install, way beyond repair and no recovery option, recovery partition corrupt too.

It takes around twenty minutes to install either Mint or Ubuntu. Installed while online so it pulls in most of the most recent files rather than the ones from the distribution release, then maybe another ten minutes to perform the security updates.
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