Having read threads on here over the years accusing people of being alcoholic/having problems I’m wondering how the culture of drinking alcohol varies world wide. In the UK where I am from, pubs open at 11am and bars close anything up to 4am (tecnically they can open 24h) I have always been a heavy drinker from the age of 18, I worked in pubs and I am now a sailor so my views may be somewhat biased. Having read a thread on here about someone getting breathalised and sacked, then people saying he was an alcoholic i thought it seemed a tad harsh, being hung over on a morning in the UK is pretty normal. A one off event wouldnt raise eyebrows, especially as he was under the DUI limit… when I have been in the USA it didnt seem a particularly anti drink country, maybe the board is a bit extreme in its views…
I’ve shown up at work hungover many times, but I’m self employed. I’m guessing I’m in the minority here though. Cheers, mate!
I think the US view is highly colored by AA-think, which is as absolutist as any fundamentalist religion. You are broken, you are diseased, you must cure yourself in programmed stages, you can never, ever backslide even a drop’s worth or you’ve undone all the progress… very black or white, which leads to the usual dichotomy of a lot of people loosely believing it all while “sinning” profusely.
Not only is AA pervasive in social/cultural ways but it’s the go-to for both the legal system (“get probation if you go to meetings”)… and for Hollywood. Far too many people have no idea that there are other ways to deal with addiction and alcohol abuse, and that while AA is a proven approach, it is not the only one, it has no lock on the truth of the matter (it is, in fact, more pre-scientific folk medicine and amateur psych than anything else) and it most certainly does not work for everyone. But you could brace a hundred USians about “how a problem drinker should cope with his/her issues” and what you’d get is 99 people who suggest AA and probably 50 who have no other idea.
AA is the cultural legacy of the temperance extremists, who spent fifty years convincing everyone of the Utter Moral Degradation of Demon Rum.
So… you can put all the self-flagellation and condemnation pretty much at that doorstep. IMVHO.
The UK is far more of a drinking culture than the US, though there is still too much drinking in the US for me. I don’t drink except on very, very rare occasions and really do not understand the appeal of getting drunk. I can’t see the point of doing anything that impairs my thinking process.
Culturally AA seems a big thing in America, I dont know anyone in the UK who has been to an AA meeting, it does seem almost like a religion… Nomad, you say there is too much drinking in America, I mean no offense but how does it have an impact on you? would you bring back prohibition? If somone can still work have a happy life and likes to get drunk why the hell not if he isnt harming anyone?
Exactly. Come around the pub sometime and I’ll buy you a pint.
I understand what the OP means. The US is very, very uptight WRT alcohol consumption.
As a kid, I was allowed a little wine (like a couple of tablespoons-worth) with Sunday/holiday dinners. As a teenager, I was allowed to drink at family gatherings. I don’t remember ever getting drunk. But these days, that kind of permissiveness would get parents arrested!
I see nothing wrong with drinking. (I don’t enjoy sloppy drunks, but hey, who does?) If it’s enjoyable to you and you aren’t doing anything to hurt anyone, then who cares, and whose business is it?
My current employer has random “happy hours” where people go around handing out beer and wine to employees. It’s pretty cool to be finishing up your work with a glass nearby, then going into a conference room to chat and have some snacks.
I had a cousin who worked in the mills for like 12 years before he got sacked for showing up at work dead sober. It wasn’t until that point that his boss realized he had been half or better drunk the rest of the time. I know bars that open as early as 6am and don’t close until 1. Officially. Then the owner will just lock in the regulars until they let themselves out. I also know a couple joints that aren’t legally allowed to be open Sundays ------- unless you knock on the back door. And while PA has always been pretty strict about the 21 drinking age, having a full beard in High School let me get over at a lot of places from about 15 or 16 on.
We are seriously over-concerned about consumption but --------- like all our laws and/or causes we always seem to find a way around it.
“Putting the fun back in ‘functional alcoholic’!”
functional alcoholic: anyone who drinks but doesn’t f*ck up their life over it.
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- Big Book of AA Decrees*
dry drunk: anyone who doesn’t drink but f*cks up their life anyway.
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- ibid.*
It’s all so easy, you see, when you get to make up your own definitions for behavior you don’t like, yours and everyone else’s.
[QUOTE=Albert Collins]
Every day, baby
When the sun go down
I get with my friends
And I begin to clown
I don’t care
What the people are thinkin’
I ain’t drunk
I’m just drinkin’
[/QUOTE]
I forget the comedian, but somebody has a line: “In the U.S. I’m an alcoholic, in Canada I’m a drinker, in England I fit right in and in Ireland I’m a pussy”.
Steken: fun in functional, thats the point, its fun. I have travelled the world, have a good job, loving family and as Churchill once said i have taken more from Alcohol than it has taken from me.
In America the awareness of the strong association of getting drunk often and a wide variety of health problems, early death, the association with car accidents that kill other people, and so on makes the assumption of “isn’t harming anyone” a pretty meaningless one.
Getting drunk often is viewed by much of America like smoking. It’s legal. And people who do it are viewed as likely impairing their health and possibly the health of others around them. It is recognized as a major cause of premature death and of cost to us all.
cost to us all? really? I presume you live the life of a healthy vegan? no salt, sugar, fat? I will go out on a limb and say no nicotine either… ever heard of live and let live? I am not sure how getting drunk can impare the health of anyone other than me?
In case anyone wants documentation of the magnitude of the problem, this from the MMWR.
In the U.K.? Huge impact. Small country but still over a quarter million years of life lost attributable to alcohol over-use.
I would wager that the unhealthy diet costs the NHS more than drinking… cost to us all is a vialble argument in the UK as we have a state funded health service, not so much in America. Again even if you did have a humanitarian approach to health care I would imagine obesity is more of a problem… Where is the vitriolic hate of fat people, do you have AA for that?
Alcohol consumption is higher in the UK than in the US, but not all that much higher: List of countries by alcohol consumption per capita - Wikipedia
Binge drinking may be more prevalent: Epidemiology of binge drinking - Wikipedia
Alcoholism is poorly defined. That said, showing up to work impaired, either under the influence of a drug or suffering the physiological effects of having partaken the night before (or that morning), certainly points one in that direction.
In the spirit of fighting ignorance:
Lost workplace productivity, healthcare expenses (yes, those affect other people here too), law enforcement costs, vehicle crashes. It’s only a few hundred billion USD, so not too bad.
LMGTFY: http://www.oa.org/
Is there anything else you’d like to share with the class?
Fair play on a good come back, thats why I love the dope, I just dont get the demonisation of drink, there are much worse things in the world… I have never cost our law enforcement any money due to my drinking. Ae those figures British or US billions 
Oh yes the U.S. that puritanical backwater where alcohol is so hated…
…you are virtually everywhere in the country just a few blocks away from where alcohol is sold, almost all non-fast food restaurants provide it, there is a wildly thriving minibrew/wine culture, drinking alcohol gets referenced approvingly in any radio/TV show besides the “700 Club”, you are blanketed with beer/wine/liquor ads, there are no high profile prohibitionist movements…
The funny thing is people are we should tolerate non-destructive drunkeness. Yet when somebody timidly mentions they think there’s too much drinking in the U.S. he’s slammed as a prohibitionist. And AA, an organization that has saved the lives of millions while not advocating prohibition, is the Great Satan because it doesn’t think the millions who can’t handle alcohol should avoid it.
I drink. I enjoy drinking. But I don’t think anyone who doesn’t enjoy it, or only enjoys it under certain circumstances, is the enemy.