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Old 11-01-2017, 03:01 PM
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It would appear that the DNC likes being in the minority


http://www.dailywire.com/news/22939/...liott-hamilton

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... Madeleine Leader announced that the Technology Department is looking to fill several positions and asked interested parties to forward the openings to their colleagues.

She included the following caveat:

Quote:
I personally would prefer that you not forward to cisgender straight white males, since they're already in the majority.
I'm curious if the Democrats among us have anything to say about their affiliation with a racist and bigoted organization? Will you be withholding donations to the DNC because of this? Is this mildly concerning? Or is everything hunkey-dorey here from your perspective?
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Old 11-01-2017, 03:38 PM
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She should be fired. End of story.
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Old 11-01-2017, 03:41 PM
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She should be fired. End of story.
First off, bravo for the decisiveness. Secondly, if she is not fired, would that inaction taint the DNC in your eyes?
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Old 11-01-2017, 03:46 PM
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I'm curious if the Democrats among us have anything to say about their affiliation with a racist and bigoted organization? Will you be withholding donations to the DNC because of this? Is this mildly concerning? Or is everything hunkey-dorey here from your perspective?
If one minor official in the RNC says something racist or otherwise not in line with your philosophy, do you withhold support from the entire organization? Do you halt contributions every time Trump (the nominal head of the party) attempts to smear ordinary citizens?
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Old 11-01-2017, 03:53 PM
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If one minor official in the RNC says something racist or otherwise not in line with your philosophy, do you withhold support from the entire organization? Do you halt contributions every time Trump (the nominal head of the party) attempts to smear ordinary citizens?
I don't contribute to the RNC, preferring instead to give to individual candidates that closely align with my political philosophy / beliefs. But if, for example, the campaign chief of one of these candidates sent out an email asking announcing some open positions in the campaign and said that they would prefer if we would only forward this email to straight white males, I'd ask the candidate what he thought about that and if some corrective action was not taken (firing seems appropriate to me too), I'd sever my ties and cease contributing time / money to the candidate and the campaign.

This is pretty damn egregious in my eyes, but I don't know if I'm an outlier here. I'd like to think not, but I guess we'll see.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:09 PM
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Seems egregious to me, too. If I contributed to the DNC, and they didn't fire this person pretty immediately, I would withdraw my support. On top of being bigoted and discriminatory, possibly illegally so, it's like a conservative caricature of a SJW.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:22 PM
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... it's like a conservative caricature of a SJW.
I'm finding that parody and caricatures of Democrats are becoming increasingly difficult, at least for me personally.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:28 PM
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Seems egregious to me, too. If I contributed to the DNC, and they didn't fire this person pretty immediately, I would withdraw my support. On top of being bigoted and discriminatory, possibly illegally so, it's like a conservative caricature of a SJW.
Now that I think about it, it's a little too on the nose. Is there any evidence that this woman exists apart from this story? I'm not saying for sure that she's fake, but my quick and lazy Googling didn't turn anything up besides a weird German LinkedIn page that doesn't really exist.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:28 PM
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This story apparently originated on The Daily Wire, which doesn't appear to be the most trustworthy source. The story has bounced around the conservative press but hasn't been picked up my any mainstream outlets as far as I can tell. The DNC has not commented as far as I can tell. I'd like to feel better about the authenticity of this email before I form any very strong opinions.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:29 PM
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Sure, fire her. But who is this person again, and why should I particularly care about her?
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:35 PM
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Sure, fire her. But who is this person again, and why should I particularly care about her?
Hillary Clinton in a mask.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:37 PM
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I'm curious if the Democrats among us have anything to say about their affiliation with a racist and bigoted organization? Will you be withholding donations to the DNC because of this? Is this mildly concerning? Or is everything hunkey-dorey here from your perspective?
I see what you mean. But I really must ask a question here. You seem to feel that liberals should all abandon the Democratic party because an obscure data services manager made a clumsy misguided attempt to promote diversity.

How do you reconcile that view with the position put forward by so many of your Republican compatriots -- including possibly even yourself (I don't remember) -- to elect as your goddam freaking President of the United States a raving racist bigot and pathological narcissist of staggering incompetence, and justify it by saying that it's OK because he's a Republican and you support many of his policies?
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:37 PM
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I'm finding that parody and caricatures of Democrats are becoming increasingly difficult, at least for me personally.
I've read one or two op-ed pieces from conservative writers bemoaning the fact that Republicans are becoming or have become the liberal caricature of a conservative, so I guess that goes both ways.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:38 PM
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I’m also curious as to why there’s no mention of the story anywhere else outside of conservative blogs. Not even picked up by The Hill or Politico.


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Old 11-01-2017, 04:40 PM
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I've read one or two op-ed pieces from conservative writers bemoaning the fact that Republicans are becoming or have become the liberal caricature of a conservative, so I guess that goes both ways.
They've not only become the caricature of a conservative, they've lapped the caricature of a conservative and are pulling away.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:44 PM
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Now that I think about it, it's a little too on the nose. Is there any evidence that this woman exists apart from this story? I'm not saying for sure that she's fake, but my quick and lazy Googling didn't turn anything up besides a weird German LinkedIn page that doesn't really exist.
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Originally Posted by Bayard View Post
This story apparently originated on The Daily Wire, which doesn't appear to be the most trustworthy source. The story has bounced around the conservative press but hasn't been picked up my any mainstream outlets as far as I can tell. The DNC has not commented as far as I can tell. I'd like to feel better about the authenticity of this email before I form any very strong opinions.
FOX has a story about it with a DNC spokesman's response:

Quote:
“The email in question was not authorized by the DNC nor was it authorized by senior leadership," spokesman Michael Tyler told Fox News. "All hiring decisions at the DNC are made consistent with the DNC’s commitment to equal employment opportunity and hiring an inclusive and talented staff that reflects the coalition of the Democratic Party, because our diversity is our greatest strength.”
If Madeleine Leader or the email were a hoax, you'd think he'd have just said so, rather than saying it was "not authorized".

ETA: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...tech-jobs.html

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 11-01-2017 at 04:48 PM.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:44 PM
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I want to know why Robert Mueller isn't investigating this.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:44 PM
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Seems egregious to me, too. If I contributed to the DNC, and they didn't fire this person pretty immediately, I would withdraw my support. On top of being bigoted and discriminatory, possibly illegally so, it's like a conservative caricature of a SJW.
I'm not bothered by this at all. Maybe it would have been better to say "Please forward to women and minorities, as we're trying to increase our diversity."


As a straight, white guy, I understand what they're trying to do and don't resent it.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:45 PM
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Iím also curious as to why thereís no mention of the story anywhere else outside of conservative blogs. Not even picked up by The Hill or Politico.
Perhaps it's because left-leaning media is an actual thing?
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:47 PM
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Sure, fire her. But who is this person again, and why should I particularly care about her?
Because the DNC, or at least one department at the DNC, is apparently racist and sexist in their hiring practices. I don't know, maybe you're cool with that though?
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:48 PM
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Because the DNC, or at least one department at the DNC, is apparently racist and sexist in their hiring practices. I don't know, maybe you're cool with that though?
If I were, I'd be a republican.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:48 PM
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Perhaps it's because left-leaning media is an actual thing?
Oh, FFS.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:49 PM
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If she exists and this is real, she should be fired; in fact I have every confidence that the organization will actually do so for making them look bad (again, if she's is a real person and this isn't doctored.)

And while I generally hate whataboutism, I think it's fair in this case to note that we're talking about some minor functionary who no one's ever heard of, who will be smacked down, vs. an organization that's about to make Roy Moore a Senator, a position with actual power.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:50 PM
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Although her LinkedIn profile is down currently, Google cached her profile pic. She looks like a fairly young person.

Again, assuming this is true, some young, low-level person did something stupid and will probably lose her job over it. Post it in the SLIOTD thread. You'll be welcomed as a hero over there.

I don't contribute to the DNC, so this doesn't affect me. But I generally don't base
my support of an organization on the expectation that they ensure there are no idiots in low level roles. If they slap her wrist and let her keep her job, meh. Whatever. I don't have a zero-tolerance policy toward garden-variety idiocy. If this was someone with real authority and influence, I'd probably be more worked up about it.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:52 PM
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Oh, FFS.
It's just my personal theory. I'd welcome hearing yours on why it's "Not even picked up by The Hill or Politico."
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:54 PM
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FOX has a story about it with a DNC spokesman's response:



If Madeleine Leader or the email were a hoax, you'd think he'd have just said so, rather than saying it was "not authorized".

ETA: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...tech-jobs.html
OK, I didn't see that. So the official word from the organization is that this was a random dumbass who wasn't acting in accordance with policy or with the authorization of senior leadership. That happens. Random dumbasses exist and sometimes get jobs in political organizations. When they act like random dumbasses they get disciplined or fired. What Democrats tend not to do, however, is elect them to powerful positions.
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Old 11-01-2017, 04:56 PM
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Maybe because it's breaking news?

ETA: to HD's rhetorical question above.

Last edited by RitterSport; 11-01-2017 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:01 PM
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It's just my personal theory. I'd welcome hearing yours on why it's "Not even picked up by The Hill or Politico."
It's hardly major news. We had special counsel indictments and a terrorist attack this week.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:01 PM
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Apparently, the DNC sometimes hires idiots.
  #30  
Old 11-01-2017, 05:03 PM
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Maybe because it's breaking news?

ETA: to HD's rhetorical question above.
This is probably correct. It looks like it just hit the Hill a few minutes ago:

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign...re-over-job-ad
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:07 PM
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Apparently, the DNC sometimes hires idiots.
The question remains if they fire them or not. Several posters have expressed certitude that Leader's time at the DNC is drawing to a close. I'm not as certain, but would certainly welcome her firing and the message it would send to other DNC employees about the importance of avoiding race- or gender-based discrimination in hiring.
  #32  
Old 11-01-2017, 05:07 PM
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Thats a dumb opinion she made. But I don't agree with the trend of firing and ostracizing people over controversy (at least I'd like to think I don't).

I didn't think Don Imus deserved all the blowback he got for saying 'nappy headed hoes' either.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:11 PM
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Thats a dumb opinion she made. But I don't agree with the trend of firing and ostracizing people over controversy (at least I'd like to think I don't).
If the DNC fires her, it won't really be on any principle other than political organizations should fire anyone who massively embarrasses and harms them politically. That's not really any trend other than people who greatly harm the organizations they work for typically get fired.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:52 PM
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It's just my personal theory. I'd welcome hearing yours on why it's "Not even picked up by The Hill or Politico."


Probably because they were looking to verify that the story was actually true. The Hill doesn’t do long form writing, they specialize in posting small stories about everything in US politics. I found it odd that I couldn’t quickly verify the name of a DNC staff member that would have responsibility for staff hiring.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:57 PM
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Probably because they were looking to verify that the story was actually true. The Hill doesnít do long form writing, they specialize in posting small stories about everything in US politics. I found it odd that I couldnít quickly verify the name of a DNC staff member that would have responsibility for staff hiring.
I don't know what a Data Services Manager is, but I doubt she has hiring authority for all -- or any -- of the roles in that email. She's probably not the hiring manager for the CSO, for example. She said she was a "bit more than just the messenger". Sounds like she might have input on some of the roles. Maybe she's the hiring manager for some of them
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Old 11-01-2017, 08:23 PM
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If the DNC fires her, it won't really be on any principle other than political organizations should fire anyone who massively embarrasses and harms them politically. That's not really any trend other than people who greatly harm the organizations they work for typically get fired.
Are political organizations such as the DNC covered by hiring discrimination laws?
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Old 11-01-2017, 10:35 PM
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Are political organizations such as the DNC covered by hiring discrimination laws?
Yes, AFAIK.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employ...tes#Exceptions
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Old 11-01-2017, 11:09 PM
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Wow, this is the daily talking point from Moscow? They're really scraping the bottom of the barrel here. Not gonna distract anyone from the indictments with this quality of material, guys. Sad.
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Old 11-01-2017, 11:28 PM
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I see what you mean. But I really must ask a question here. You seem to feel that liberals should all abandon the Democratic party because an obscure data services manager made a clumsy misguided attempt to promote diversity.

How do you reconcile that view with the position put forward by so many of your Republican compatriots -- including possibly even yourself (I don't remember) -- to elect as your goddam freaking President of the United States a raving racist bigot and pathological narcissist of staggering incompetence, and justify it by saying that it's OK because he's a Republican and you support many of his policies?
Yeah, I'm not expecting an answer to this either.
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Old 11-01-2017, 11:38 PM
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Yeah, I'm not expecting an answer to this either.
I considered it off-topic for this thread, and didn't want to see it get derailed, so I ignored it. If you think it's important to start yet another 'how can anyone support Trump / Republicans?' thread, be my guest and I'll pop in and try to explain my motives / reasoning.
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Old 11-01-2017, 11:39 PM
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Wow, this is the daily talking point from Moscow? They're really scraping the bottom of the barrel here. Not gonna distract anyone from the indictments with this quality of material, guys. Sad.
There are threads to discuss those things. If you want to discuss them rather than this, go post there, but please don't threadshit here.
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Old 11-01-2017, 11:42 PM
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I considered it off-topic for this thread, and didn't want to see it get derailed, so I ignored it. If you think it's important to start yet another 'how can anyone support Trump / Republicans?' thread, be my guest and I'll pop in and try to explain my motives / reasoning.
Nice dodge. Since that's the question you asked in the OP, I don't see how it's off-topic.
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Old 11-02-2017, 12:09 AM
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I'm curious if the Democrats among us have anything to say about their affiliation with a racist and bigoted organization?
You have poisoned the well here. Why does this person who you've never heard of represent the Democratic party or the DNC? It's a common tactic used by your side, to treat individuals on the other side as representatives of the whole group. You should cut it out, because it's divisive and destructive. If your arguments were sound, you wouldn't need to pretend that a middle manager of an I.T. sub-department who said something ridiculously bigoted actually represents Democrats in general, and you wouldn't pretend that the DNC hasn't already publicly denounced her statements.

Here's a question for you. If it turns out that this person ends up being fired for her statements, will you take back what you said above, and admit that it's not evidence that the DNC is racist or bigoted?

Quote:
Will you be withholding donations to the DNC because of this?
No.

Quote:
Is this mildly concerning?
Yes, but not in the way you're implying.

Quote:
Or is everything hunkey-dorey here from your perspective?
No. We're exhausted. Work has a funny way of doing that to people.
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Old 11-02-2017, 12:34 AM
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I think she should be reprimanded, and punished, up to and including termination. First, though, I'd try to figure out the motivation for such a request. Is this an isolated incident and a bad choice of words? Is it indicative of a particular bias of hers?

A poor choice of words can be easily rectified, and not grounds for termination. We all mispeak sometimes. And things sometimes sound better in our heads than when we attempt to articulate them.

The DNC has taken the right first step, saying that her words are not representative of the organization.
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Old 11-02-2017, 05:32 AM
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Having someone in the DNC who is an idiot is about as rare as having someone in the RNC who isn't. I'll gladly accept the fallout of having someone in my party drummed out of the national committee if I get to see the leader of your party led out of the White House in handcuffs.
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Old 11-02-2017, 05:40 AM
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It does seem a stupid piece of political incompetence. I don't know about usual hiring practices in the US, but over here it's quite common to see adverts offering warm words about diversity and deliberately setting out to encourage the under-represented (however defined) to apply, and to make sure adverts appear in a range of outlets to focus on the under-represented groups, or in other words, to present it positively rather than negatively, which you'd have thought a basic skill in someone working for a political organisation.
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Old 11-02-2017, 05:54 AM
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What do I think? Well, God knows I'm not a religious man, but what I think is of a lesson I remember from Sunday School back in the early eighties, turns out to be Matthew 7:3-5.
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Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
[Please understand that while I share the sentiment, I don't countenance Jesus's namecalling, certainly not outside of the Pit; I left it in there not to endorse it but so as not to butcher the quote]

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Old 11-02-2017, 07:11 AM
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I'm finding that parody and caricatures of Democrats are becoming increasingly difficult, at least for me personally.
That's okay. The important thing is to keep practicing daily, and with time your skills are bound to improve.
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Old 11-02-2017, 07:21 AM
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Sure, fire her. But who is this person again, and why should I particularly care about her?
When a no name Dem does something bad it means all Dems are bad. When the GOP president of the United States praises Nazis it means you're a racist for noticing.

Please do try to keep up.
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Old 11-02-2017, 07:22 AM
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I considered it off-topic for this thread, and didn't want to see it get derailed, so I ignored it. If you think it's important to start yet another 'how can anyone support Trump / Republicans?' thread, be my guest and I'll pop in and try to explain my motives / reasoning.
As several have pointed out, since this is exactly the question you ask in the OP, considering it off-topic is pretty funny, in a sad kind of way.
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