Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:42 AM
bionic_man is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 108

Sinatra as Dirty Harry?


Orgriginaly Old blue eyes was going to play dirty harry.do you think th
is would of worked?
  #2  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:51 AM
Banksiaman is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,140
Cranky Harry? Frankly, no.

While I enjoyed Sinatra in Manchurian Candidate and other stuff and have no problems with him as an actor, I think Clint gave Harry Callaghan an easy physicality. He'd already built his reputation through the spaghetti westerns and brought parts of that taciturn delivery, toughness and slightly mystical prescience to Dirt Harry. While Sinatra would have just done it differently, I'm not sure it would not have become an iconic character, and a multi-movie saga.
  #3  
Old 01-07-2020, 10:09 AM
Chefguy's Avatar
Chefguy is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portlandia
Posts: 43,156
Sinatra was 56 years old when that movie was made, and he was already starting to look jowly and soft by then. Eastwood was 41 and in good physical shape. As a rogue cop with a bad attitude, he was perfect. Sinatra was more of the smooth operator type in that genre of films. It wouldn't have worked nearly as well.
  #4  
Old 01-07-2020, 10:14 AM
BrotherCadfael is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Vermont
Posts: 10,400
Ten years earlier? Maybe.
  #5  
Old 01-07-2020, 11:10 AM
Dendarii Dame is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 15,417
In a related anecdote, Bing Crosby was offered the part of Columbo, but turned it down. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbo
  #6  
Old 01-07-2020, 11:31 AM
puddleglum's Avatar
puddleglum is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: a van down by the river
Posts: 6,809
John Wayne, Robert Mitchum, Burt Lancaster, George C Scott, Robert Mitchum, and Paul Newman also passed on the role. Most because the movie was considered right wing and too filled with violence.
  #7  
Old 01-07-2020, 12:41 PM
dasmoocher is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Posts: 3,540
Quote:
Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
John Wayne, Robert Mitchum, Burt Lancaster, George C Scott, Robert Mitchum, and Paul Newman also passed on the role. Most because the movie was considered right wing and too filled with violence.
Too right-wing for John Wayne? Although I could see Wayne objecting to a cop who breaks the rules like torturing the suspect (stepping on his wound in the Keyser Stadium scene).

By chance I recently saw a clip of Kirk Douglas on the Dick Cavett show talking about working with Wayne, he basically said they were good friends but never talked politics.

Last edited by dasmoocher; 01-07-2020 at 12:43 PM.
  #8  
Old 01-07-2020, 03:47 PM
bionic_man is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 108
John Wayne appeared in a copy cat dirty harry film.in the 70s
  #9  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:05 PM
Bryan Ekers's Avatar
Bryan Ekers is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 59,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by bionic_man View Post
John Wayne appeared in a copy cat dirty harry film.in the 70s
You mean Brannigan ? Here's a clip of him of him asking Baldrick if he feels lucky.

Well... asking a pre-Blackadder Tony Robinson if he can swim, but same thing.
__________________
Don't worry about the end of Inception. We have top men working on it right now. Top. Men.
  #10  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:25 PM
Hypno-Toad is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: By the Caloosahatchee
Posts: 11,901
Was that also Richard Bucket (Boo-kay) in that clip?
  #11  
Old 01-07-2020, 04:49 PM
Chefguy's Avatar
Chefguy is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portlandia
Posts: 43,156
Quote:
Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
John Wayne, Robert Mitchum, Burt Lancaster, George C Scott, Robert Mitchum, and Paul Newman also passed on the role. Most because the movie was considered right wing and too filled with violence.
Of those, I could only see Mitchum pulling it off.
  #12  
Old 01-07-2020, 06:44 PM
bonzer is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: NW5
Posts: 3,205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypno-Toad View Post
Was that also Richard Bucket (Boo-kay) in that clip?
Nope - Richard Attenborough.
  #13  
Old 01-08-2020, 06:31 AM
Smapti is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,552
Well, we did kinda-sorta get Sinatra as John McClane.
  #14  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:26 AM
Dale Sams is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Well, we did kinda-sorta get Sinatra as John McClane.
I was going to say....Sinatra could have made Dirty Harry work.
  #15  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:55 AM
Wendell Wagner is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Greenbelt, Maryland
Posts: 14,454
I've talked about the John McClane films before, so let me just repeat what I said. These movies were cobbled together from spare parts. The Detective was a 1968 film made from a 1966 novel of the same name. By the time the sequel (Nothing Lasts Forever) to the novel came out in 1979, Frank Sinatra was too old really to play the lead again. The script made from that novel bounced around Hollywood for years. Finally they decided to change the main character's name, change some things in the plot, make no reference to the film The Detective, and rename the film Die Hard. It finally came out in 1988 with Bruce Willis in the lead and was a major hit. Then the filmmakers took another script that had been bouncing around Hollywood for a while which was based on a novel called 58 Minutes by a different novelist that had no relationship to the first film. They changed things in the plot and made Bruce Willis's character the lead in the new film, which was called Die Hard 2 when it came out in 1990. It was again a big hit. They then took another script that had been bouncing around Hollywood for a while called Simon Says with no relation to the first two John McClane films. They again rewrote this in the same way as the first two films into a 1995 film called Die Hard with a Vengeance, and it was once more a big hit. They then took another script that had been bouncing around Hollywood called WW3.com and again rewrote it as a John McClane film. It came out in 2007 and was called Live Free or Die Hard and was, yes, you guessed it, a hit. They then had someone write an original script for the next movie. The new film came out in 2013 and was called A Good Day to Die Hard. This film, the only one in the series which had a script originally written to be a John McClane film, is sometimes considered the poorest one in the series.
  #16  
Old 01-08-2020, 01:26 PM
NDP's Avatar
NDP is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: PNW USA
Posts: 9,324
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Sams View Post
I was going to say....Sinatra could have made Dirty Harry work.
He might have but it would've changed the movie's story considerably. Instead of a cowboy cop bucking the system and bending the rules to clean up the streets it would be about an aging veteran police detective who can't adjust to the changes in law enforcement and society in general in the post-Miranda era.
__________________
Can also be seen at:

Last FM Library Thing
  #17  
Old 01-08-2020, 01:35 PM
puddleglum's Avatar
puddleglum is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: a van down by the river
Posts: 6,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by bionic_man View Post
John Wayne appeared in a copy cat dirty harry film.in the 70s
The John Wayne casting is disputed by IMDB but he appeared in two knockoffs, McQ and Brannigan.
  #18  
Old 01-08-2020, 05:18 PM
Dale Sams is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 5,327
Quote:
Originally Posted by NDP View Post
He might have but it would've changed the movie's story considerably. Instead of a cowboy cop bucking the system and bending the rules to clean up the streets it would be about an aging veteran police detective who can't adjust to the changes in law enforcement and society in general in the post-Miranda era.
Damn good assessment

Similarly Walter Matthau makes "Charley Varrick" work. Even if he didn't understand it
  #19  
Old 01-09-2020, 08:39 PM
fedman is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 287
if Sinatra sounds unwise, how about Ian Fleming wanting David Niven as 007?
  #20  
Old 01-09-2020, 08:58 PM
longhair75 is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: omaha, ne
Posts: 3,133
The man who introduced "Some Like it Hot" on TCM last night said that Frank SInatra was the first choice for Daphne, played by Jack Lemmon. The movie would have tanked.
__________________
longhair75
  #21  
Old 01-09-2020, 09:29 PM
Banksiaman is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,140
Quote:
Originally Posted by fedman View Post
if Sinatra sounds unwise, how about Ian Fleming wanting David Niven as 007?
The suave ladies man, film star and high-ranking Commando officer in WWII? He also probably knew one end of a cocktail onion from the other, and could tie a proper bow-tie.
  #22  
Old 01-09-2020, 09:37 PM
Wendell Wagner is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Greenbelt, Maryland
Posts: 14,454
Ian Fleming said that he imagined James Bond as looking like Hoagie Carmichael:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bond
  #23  
Old 01-11-2020, 05:57 PM
fedman is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banksiaman View Post
The suave ladies man, film star and high-ranking Commando officer in WWII? He also probably knew one end of a cocktail onion from the other, and could tie a proper bow-tie.
I get the suave part, but he doesn't project the dangerous persona to me
  #24  
Old 01-11-2020, 06:58 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 17,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by fedman View Post
I get the suave part, but he doesn't project the dangerous persona to me
Why, it’s almost as if he seems more like a well-dressed company representative, as per his business card from Universal Exports, than a secret agent.
  #25  
Old 01-11-2020, 06:58 PM
Tim R. Mortiss's Avatar
Tim R. Mortiss is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Lincoln Park, Chicago
Posts: 7,264
Quote:
Originally Posted by NDP View Post
He might have but it would've changed the movie's story considerably. Instead of a cowboy cop bucking the system and bending the rules to clean up the streets it would be about an aging veteran police detective who can't adjust to the changes in law enforcement and society in general in the post-Miranda era.
Sinatra did play a retired cop who broke all the rules to find the killer of his granddaughter (I think - it's been awhile). This was as a guest star on an episode of Magnum, P.I. He was pretty good, and definitely seemed like an aging Dirty Harry type. He was supposed to reprise the role in a later episode, but he died before they could get around to making it.
  #26  
Old 01-11-2020, 10:02 PM
Lumpy's Avatar
Lumpy is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota US
Posts: 16,751
In an older thread it was argued http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/...3&postcount=14 that around this time following the Manson murders Hollywood rebounded from the hippy-era "cops are pigs" meme and rehabilitated the image of cops as smart and tough enough to take down the psychopaths out there. Eastwood worked in this role, Sinatra was too last-generation.
  #27  
Old 01-12-2020, 01:55 PM
DesertDog is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mesa, Ariz.
Posts: 6,058
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell Wagner View Post
Ian Fleming said that he imagined James Bond as looking like Hoagie Carmichael:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Bond
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banksiaman View Post
The suave ladies man, film star and high-ranking Commando officer in WWII? He also probably knew one end of a cocktail onion from the other, and could tie a proper bow-tie.
In the Bond movie nobody ever saw, Casino Royale (1967), Niven was James Bond. Peter Sellers and Woody Allen were as well, but Niven was the original, called out of retirement. It was all part of a clever plan to confuse SMERSH.

The movie has only a faint resemblance to the Saltzman/Broccoli produced films and even fainter to the book.
  #28  
Old 01-12-2020, 02:18 PM
Guest-starring: Id!'s Avatar
Guest-starring: Id! is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 4,493
I spose it wouldn't sound as good goin, "Go ahead, make it - myyyyyyyyyy daaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyy...."

Last edited by Guest-starring: Id!; 01-12-2020 at 02:19 PM.
  #29  
Old 01-12-2020, 03:07 PM
Wendell Wagner is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Greenbelt, Maryland
Posts: 14,454
If you think the 1967 Casino Royale has little resemblance to the book or the rest of the movies, then what about the 1954 version of it?:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casino_Royale_(Climax!)
  #30  
Old 01-12-2020, 08:19 PM
RioRico is offline
Suspended
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: beyond cell service
Posts: 1,377
Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertDog View Post
In the Bond movie nobody ever saw, Casino Royale (1967), Niven was James Bond. Peter Sellers and Woody Allen were as well, but Niven was the original, called out of retirement. It was all part of a clever plan to confuse SMERSH.
That's my favorite Bond film. Parachuting Indians, bunches of seals (ork! ork!), Ursula Andress - what's not to love? And the explosive LSD cloud. But I want to see the LEGO version.
  #31  
Old 01-12-2020, 10:28 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 17,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by RioRico View Post
That's my favorite Bond film. Parachuting Indians, bunches of seals (ork! ork!), Ursula Andress - what's not to love? And the explosive LSD cloud. But I want to see the LEGO version.
“You’re crazy! You are absolutely crazy!”
“They called EINSTEIN crazy!”
“...that’s not true; no one ever called Einstein crazy.”
“Well, they WOULD have, if he’d CARRIED ON LIKE THIS!”
  #32  
Old 01-13-2020, 04:30 PM
Hoopy Frood is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 4,856
Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertDog View Post
In the Bond movie nobody ever saw, Casino Royale (1967), Niven was James Bond. Peter Sellers and Woody Allen were as well, but Niven was the original, called out of retirement. It was all part of a clever plan to confuse SMERSH.

The movie has only a faint resemblance to the Saltzman/Broccoli produced films and even fainter to the book.
There were seven people dubbed James Bond in that movie, none of whom were played by Woody Allen. All were MI-6 agents (well, I guess Moneypenny's daughter wasn't technically an agent) of some stripe. Not all were 007 designated either.

Allen played "Jimmy Bond" who was the original 007's (i.e. Niven's) nephew. He was not MI-6

Last edited by Hoopy Frood; 01-13-2020 at 04:32 PM.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:57 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2019 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017