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Old 06-05-2015, 02:52 PM
TopOfTheMorning TopOfTheMorning is offline
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Is the Star Bangled Banner an Illuminati chant?

I never thought so until today when I found this site which claims to have been created to fix public misconceptions about the Illuminati.

It was suggested that there is Illuminati symbolism in the Star Spangled Banner in a post titled: "Is the pyramid on the US dollar an Illuminati symbol?"

Okay here are the lyrics in case anyone forgot:

Oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watched were so gallantly streaming?
And the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.
Oh, say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?


I'm not sure I see it.

Any guesses?
  #2  
Old 06-05-2015, 02:55 PM
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There's Illuminati symbolism everywhere if you look hard enough.
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Old 06-05-2015, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by running coach View Post
There's Illuminati symbolism everywhere if you look hard enough.
See also confirmation bias


In answer to the question of the OP: No.

It is definitely true that many of the founding fathers were masons and that there is a lot of free mason symbolism in some of the things he points to (dollar bill, washington monument, seal)

but Freemason doesn't equal illuminati, which in turn is not a vast worldwide conspiracy.
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Old 06-05-2015, 04:51 PM
Simplicio Simplicio is offline
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It's a pretty literal description of what Keys saw, published less than a week after he saw it. Of all the things to look for secret messages in, the Star Spangled Banner seems a particularly poor choice.
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Old 06-05-2015, 05:23 PM
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fnord
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:08 PM
tomndebb tomndebb is offline
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The master speaks on the Illuminati:
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/...the-illuminati
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:14 PM
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fnord
QFT

fnord
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:17 PM
Jonathan Chance Jonathan Chance is offline
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:22 PM
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Everybody knows IMHO is really the Illuminati-Masonic-Hermetic-Occult forum.
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
I never thought so until today when I found this site which claims to have been created to fix public misconceptions about the Illuminati.
Gee, if it's on the internet then it must be true, right?
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Old 06-06-2015, 08:29 PM
TopOfTheMorning TopOfTheMorning is offline
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Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?

Armaggedon Conspiracy (Pythagorean Illuminati) has a site.
Discordianism has a site.
The OTO has a site.
The Golden Dawn has a site.

The website I cited didn't seem like it's coming from a goofball nut job. The information on there is a bit difficult to grasp, but this isn't some David Icke derivative nonsense telling me to seal my windows to prevent Reptilians from eating my children at night.
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Old 06-06-2015, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?

Armaggedon Conspiracy (Pythagorean Illuminati) has a site.
Discordianism has a site.
The OTO has a site.
The Golden Dawn has a site.

The website I cited didn't seem like it's coming from a goofball nut job. The information on there is a bit difficult to grasp, but this isn't some David Icke derivative nonsense telling me to seal my windows to prevent Reptilians from eating my children at night.
So? Any idiot can start a website, and many do. I took a look at that site you linked to, and noticed that it was long on claims and short on actual evidence. I'm suggesting that anyone who claims to have any information about the Illuminati - especially about the Illuminati existing today - had better have some damn good support. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof", as they say.
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Old 06-06-2015, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?

Armaggedon Conspiracy (Pythagorean Illuminati) has a site.
Discordianism has a site.
The OTO has a site.
The Golden Dawn has a site.

The website I cited didn't seem like it's coming from a goofball nut job. The information on there is a bit difficult to grasp, but this isn't some David Icke derivative nonsense telling me to seal my windows to prevent Reptilians from eating my children at night.
Your goofball nutjob detector is 180° out of calibration. Get it fixed.
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Old 06-07-2015, 03:12 AM
Gary T Gary T is offline
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Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?
In the sense you seem to be espousing, yeah.

Quote:
The information on there is a bit difficult to grasp, but this isn't some David Icke derivative nonsense telling me to seal my windows to prevent Reptilians from eating my children at night.
Pretty damn close, though.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?

Armaggedon Conspiracy (Pythagorean Illuminati) has a site.
Discordianism has a site.
The OTO has a site.
The Golden Dawn has a site.

The website I cited didn't seem like it's coming from a goofball nut job. The information on there is a bit difficult to grasp, but this isn't some David Icke derivative nonsense telling me to seal my windows to prevent Reptilians from eating my children at night.
The website you cited reads like it's creator took his "Illuminati" whole-cloth from Robert Anton Wilson and Robert Shea's fictional "The Illuminatus Trilogy". Nothing much original there at all.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:11 AM
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This is THE best source on actual historic Illuminati information. The author Terry Melanson wrote the book "Perfectabilists" on the Bavarian Order.

http://www.bavarian-illuminati.info

Btw, he has never found evidence that the Eye in the Triangle/Pyramid was used by the Illuminati, and indeed, the idea had never arisen until the 1950's writings of William Guy Carr.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:16 AM
Mr. Kobayashi Mr. Kobayashi is offline
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Funny, on the SDMB there are three triangles at the top next to 'Community', 'Search' and 'Quick Links'. Then at the top of a thread there are thee triangles, next to 'Thread Tools', 'Search this Thread' and 'Display Modes'. Then the 'Report Post' button is a triangle. All these hidden triangles mean only one thing; Illuminati confirmed.
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Old 06-07-2015, 09:39 AM
Bridget Burke Bridget Burke is offline
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Originally Posted by FriarTed View Post
This is THE best source on actual historic Illuminati information. The author Terry Melanson wrote the book "Perfectabilists" on the Bavarian Order.

http://www.bavarian-illuminati.info

Btw, he has never found evidence that the Eye in the Triangle/Pyramid was used by the Illuminati, and indeed, the idea had never arisen until the 1950's writings of William Guy Carr.
And for "further" studies, I recommend The Illuminatus! Trilogy by Robert Anton Wilson & Robert Shea. It's a hippie mindfuck that combines Secret Knowledge with lots of sex & drugs. The writers show you The Real Truth--which is then revealed to be a mask of The Realer Truth. But, wait! There's An Even Realer Truth to be revealed.

And so it goes. At the end, I decided that all those conspiracies were interesting (people have believed some weird shit throughout history) but that skepticism & a sense of humor were the best defenses.
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Old 06-07-2015, 11:59 AM
FriarTed FriarTed is offline
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And for "further" studies, I recommend The Illuminatus! Trilogy by Robert Anton Wilson & Robert Shea. It's a hippie mindfuck that combines Secret Knowledge with lots of sex & drugs. The writers show you The Real Truth--which is then revealed to be a mask of The Realer Truth. But, wait! There's An Even Realer Truth to be revealed.

And so it goes. At the end, I decided that all those conspiracies were interesting (people have believed some weird shit throughout history) but that skepticism & a sense of humor were the best defenses.
The Trilogy was a great send-up of Illuminati Conspiracy Theory as it existed in the early 70's, tho even then, it neglected a lot of materials, and invented some conspiracy theories that no one but Shea & Wilson thought of (Weishaupt killing & taking the place of George Washington?) But after the Trilogy came the rise of "ex-Illuminati defectors" like John Todd, Alberto Rivera, & William Schoenbelen; Lyndon LaRouche's own brand of Conspiracy theory; the exposure of Skull & Bones; and the development of groups like the Trilateral Commission.
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Old 06-07-2015, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopOfTheMorning View Post
Are you suggesting that there is no reliable information on the Illuminati on the internet?

[...]

The OTO has a site.
The Golden Dawn has a site.
There is no connection between the OTO and the Illuminati, or between the Golden Dawn and the Illuminati.
  #21  
Old 06-07-2015, 01:14 PM
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You are just all in on it!
  #22  
Old 06-07-2015, 07:52 PM
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I thought it was a British drinking song.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:30 PM
Trinopus Trinopus is offline
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I like the part about Momus and his risible phiz.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Simplicio View Post
It's a pretty literal description of what Keys saw, published less than a week after he saw it. Of all the things to look for secret messages in, the Star Spangled Banner seems a particularly poor choice.
Pretty much this, with the nitpick that it's Key not Keys.
  #25  
Old 06-08-2015, 10:02 AM
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Indeed, they did.
  #26  
Old 06-08-2015, 10:59 AM
Just Asking Questions Just Asking Questions is offline
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fnord
I see what you did there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck Godot View Post
but Freemason doesn't equal illuminati, which in turn is not a vast worldwide conspiracy.
That's exactly what they want you to think!
  #27  
Old 06-08-2015, 11:15 AM
Jackmannii Jackmannii is offline
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And the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air
This is an early allusion to chemtrails, which first were spread by balloons under the guise of munitions and fireworks.
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Old 06-08-2015, 11:52 AM
Kimballkid Kimballkid is offline
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I thought it was a British drinking song.
The tune is from a British drinking song.
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Old 06-08-2015, 01:38 PM
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The tune is from a British drinking song.
I prefer to describe it as a "club song", a genre that doesn't have a precise equivalent today. (A college alma mater might come close.) John Stafford Smith composed To Anacreon in Heaven as the song of the Anacreontic Society, a London gentleman's club, to be performed at club banquets and concerts. The banquets certainly involved drinking, but the song was written to be performed by glee club and orchestra, not inebriated diners.

Over time the song somewhat slipped its moorings, and tavern patrons on both sides of the Atlantic, having nothing to do with Anacreon, did belt it out--badly. They would sometimes substitute locally appropriate and/or bawdy lyrics. But in origin the tune was a club song, not a bar song, and that is reflected in the sophistication and difficulty of the music.
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Old 06-08-2015, 02:39 PM
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Oh, wait! The OP's talking about the Star-BANGLED Banner!

Oh, yeah. Totally an Illuminati chant. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise...
  #31  
Old 06-09-2015, 11:38 AM
TopOfTheMorning TopOfTheMorning is offline
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Oh, wait! The OP's talking about the Star-BANGLED Banner!

Oh, yeah. Totally an Illuminati chant. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise...
Indeed it has been Bangled
  #32  
Old 06-09-2015, 01:16 PM
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So? Any idiot can start a website, and many do. . . .
I have three. That makes me three times more authoritative. I say the song means: Yay us! We Rock!

All four original verses provided online by the Smithsonian. I like the bit that goes:

What is that which the breeze, o’er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning’s first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream,


Modern poets wouldn't convolute the sentence structure like that in order to make the rhymes, but that was the style back then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxgoddess View Post
I thought it was a British drinking song.
That's what they want you to think.
  #33  
Old 06-09-2015, 01:50 PM
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I thought it was a British drinking song.
Yep: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_Anacreon_in_Heaven
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Old 06-09-2015, 04:50 PM
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There's Illuminati symbolism everywhere if you look hard enough.
Please, quit looking-it's making us very uncomfortable.
  #35  
Old 07-06-2015, 11:50 PM
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Since the OP is no longer with us, let's close this.
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