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Old 01-21-2018, 12:14 AM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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What is exactly is it with the left's obsession with intersectionality?

Hi! First thread aside from my introduction one in. As someone who's instigating in politics more than ever before, I am still trying to understand the big deal with intersectionality...


Where would I belong in a intersectionality pyramid???
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Old 01-21-2018, 12:19 AM
Wesley Clark Wesley Clark is offline
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I'm not sure why you feel only the left cares about it. The right has been running on racial, religious and ethnic tension, anti-feminism, classism, nativism, etc. for centuries. Read up on the southern strategy.

As a general rule of thumb the left is socially egalitarian, the right believes in social hierarchies. Both sides place value on identity politics.
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Old 01-21-2018, 12:19 AM
kenobi 65 kenobi 65 is online now
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I consider myself reasonably conversant in politics (at least in the US), and I'm a liberal. I have never even heard the term "intersectionality" before.
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Old 01-21-2018, 12:22 AM
Czarcasm Czarcasm is online now
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Originally Posted by Luciano700 View Post
Hi! First thread aside from my introduction one in. As someone who's instigating in politics more than ever before, I am still trying to understand the big deal with intersectionality...


Where would I belong in a intersectionality pyramid???
1. I'm not see any obsession with intersectionality on the left.
2. We don't know anything about you or which of many triangles you are referring to, so your guess is as good as mine. Up and a little to the left?
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Old 01-21-2018, 12:50 AM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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1. I'm not see any obsession with intersectionality on the left.
2. We don't know anything about you or which of many triangles you are referring to, so your guess is as good as mine. Up and a little to the left?
Well I am newbie so I am still trying to understand


I have autism[supposedly], struggle with weight issues and I am a Mexican dude of Argentine descent


As far bullying goes, 4th grade was the worst year in that case.
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Old 01-21-2018, 01:02 AM
Riemann Riemann is online now
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Originally Posted by kenobi 65 View Post
I consider myself reasonably conversant in politics (at least in the US), and I'm a liberal. I have never even heard the term "intersectionality" before.
I guess that's a data point in how out of touch traditional liberals are with the postmodern academic left. It doesn't really surprise me though. Most older liberals simply don't believe that (say) the events at Evergreen are not just a fringe aberration. Identity politics rule; anyone who grew up with rights-based liberalism in the 20th century would not recognize the modern academic left as liberalism at all. Indeed, it's not.

Last edited by Riemann; 01-21-2018 at 01:07 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 01:09 AM
Measure for Measure Measure for Measure is offline
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Wikipedia covers the issue:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersectionality

The concept is trendy among the multicultural left. It has its critics, many of them on the left.

(FTR, this liberal first heard of it and looked it up in Wikipedia last Summer/Fall. The underlying concept was a familiar one though, and I heard echoes of it from 1970s and 1980s writings.)

Last edited by Measure for Measure; 01-21-2018 at 01:11 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 01:42 AM
Kyomara Kyomara is offline
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Originally Posted by Luciano700 View Post
Hi! First thread aside from my introduction one in. As someone who's instigating in politics more than ever before, I am still trying to understand the big deal with intersectionality...


Where would I belong in a intersectionality pyramid???
Because it attempts to address a person's entire self and tries to be a comprehensive in addressing the ways different combinations of identities might affect the way various aspects of that person might interact with society at large. I guess people like it because it tries to be thorough.

What do you think about it?
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:06 AM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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Because it attempts to address a person's entire self and tries to be a comprehensive in addressing the ways different combinations of identities might affect the way various aspects of that person might interact with society at large. I guess people like it because it tries to be thorough.

What do you think about it?
Is an interesting, yet stupid concept at the same time.


Because you don't always have to obsess over implying you can get all advantages at once. Look at black men, you can't say black men have it better than their female counterparts.

-Incarceration rate
-Too much pressure to be tough
-Less likely to attend college
-Highest infant mortality rate
-Worst stereotype of all time yet
- Black men were also always the biggest targets of racists, to this day they still are technically...
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:18 AM
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Moved from Elections to IMHO.

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Old 01-21-2018, 02:20 AM
Measure for Measure Measure for Measure is offline
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I think the underlying point is you have to look at race, gender, class, sexual preferences, gender conforming, this, that, and the other at the same time.

It doesn't necessarily say one or another combo invariably has it the roughest.

That's not a defense btw - my gut responses vary from, "No kidding", to "Needless complication", depending upon the underlying question.
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:26 AM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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I think the underlying point is you have to look at race, gender, class, sexual preferences, gender conforming, this, that, and the other at the same time.

It doesn't necessarily say one or another combo invariably has it the roughest.

That's not a defense btw - my gut responses vary from, "No kidding", to "Needless complication", depending upon the underlying question.
Still, the obsession is migraine-inducing
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:56 AM
Jophiel Jophiel is online now
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Still, the obsession is migraine-inducing
Which is interesting because the reaction here is mainly a collective shrug. This feels like the "Obama as Messiah" thing where what I'm constantly told I'm obsessed with (per the conservative media) isn't remotely what I think about.

My sole dip into hearing the term used was while listening to The Awkward Thoughts of W. Kamau Bell where Bell relates how he used to tell a bit about a little white girl kissing everyone except him as a child and ending with the joke "And that little bitch was racist!" A few female friends told him that they didn't like how he attacked her gender as part of his comments on racism. He reflected on it and decided that they were right: when you're trying to end one form of social injustice, you don't do it by propagating another form and changed the ending. Which makes sense to me although I'm sure you can stretch that into things I'm less agreeable about.
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Old 01-21-2018, 03:08 AM
Dr. Strangelove Dr. Strangelove is online now
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Obsession would be a strong word even for modern run-of-the-mill liberals. I hang out with mostly (California) liberals and the topic has never come up. As Riemann says, I think it's pretty much limited to the academic left, though it leaks out a bit.

I think it's fairly silly but also self limiting, and the trend in thinking may ultimately be a good one. If you extend intersectionality to its logical conclusion, then every person on Earth becomes their own unique intersection of groups. In that case, the very concept of group membership becomes meaningless. There are no inferences to be made about an intersection with exactly one member, and so the exercise is worthless. Maybe then we can treat people as individuals and not as stereotypical members of whatever label they claim to be.
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Old 01-21-2018, 03:20 AM
Riemann Riemann is online now
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Which is interesting because the reaction here is mainly a collective shrug.
But that's a question of the audience. The typical older liberal on here isn't obsessed with identity politics. The academic left, and thus many "progressive" students and younger people, are obsessed with identity politics to the detriment of traditional rights-based liberal values. Free speech is under attack on college campuses. The phenomenon is widespread, and worth more than a shrug.

Last edited by Riemann; 01-21-2018 at 03:22 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 03:53 AM
Darren Garrison Darren Garrison is offline
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I consider myself reasonably conversant in politics (at least in the US), and I'm a liberal. I have never even heard the term "intersectionality" before.
You obviously don't read all of the sites that I do, because I see the term eleventy bazillion times a day. (For instance, on TheMarySue.)
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Old 01-21-2018, 04:06 AM
Riemann Riemann is online now
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There has, of course, been a laudable movement in the past few decades to give a voice to the experiences of oppressed groups, to tell those in privileged groups to shut up and listen.

However, this has been taken to severe and highly problematic extremes, confusing social identity with virtue, either in the sense of quality of character or quality of ideas. Listening to the subjective narrative of the oppressed, "naming one's own reality", is extremely important for social progress; but it goes too far when it completely displaces any dialog of ideas. To a postmodern leftist, the notion of testing ideas in the crucible of debate is of no value when all of reality is a social construct. Dissenting voices have no place in this scheme, with words deemed literal violence, so free speech comes under attack in the guise of protecting the oppressed: "safe spaces" and Orwellian "no-platforming".

All that matters in this worldview is intersectionality and the hierarchy of oppression, not principles or rights. Thus we see (for example) the bizarre phenomenon of LGBT groups uncritically supporting Islamic groups, because Muslims are seen oppressed allies, even if those groups are pro-Sharia and vehemently (or even violently) anti-LGBT; and bitter hostility toward Israel, a socially progressive and liberal nation, because Israel is deemed an oppressor.

Last edited by Riemann; 01-21-2018 at 04:11 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 06:27 AM
Alessan Alessan is online now
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At its worst, intersectionality is just another way of saying, "Everyone on my side is good, and can do no evil; everyone on the other side is evil, and can do no good." Of course, this attitude is hardly limited to the Left - in fact, I'd say it is one of the few beliefs shared by human beings of every conceivable group or background. It's tribalism, pure and simple; the only thing the Left does new is dress it with a postgraduate degree.
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Old 01-21-2018, 07:14 AM
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While I can easily understand how annoying this concept might be if forced to listen to an hour-long interview on NPR with a deadly earnest proponent who had zero sense of humor, that's not to say that the notion is useless.

It sounds to me like a kind of triangulation. Or possibly triangulation cubed. Surely if you are trying to picture someone else's perspective, the more data points, the better.

For instance, I am:

female/ poor/ white/ hetero/ middle-aged

A few things I have noticed about this combination is that everything's a lot easier when you're young and cute. And poverty definitely can make a big difference in whether you "look your age."
Also, people tend to assume I'm a Trump voter, even though you'd think either the punk gear or the Rick & Morty gear would be a tipoff otherwise.

As for the OP, Luciano700, since you asked about your own intersectionality, all I can say is that because we have a long-standing tradition of terrible puns here, I tried really hard to think of a clever one for you as a Mexican of Argentinian descent (possibly involving pampas and pupusas) but I'm pretty awkward myself and I did not succeed. Welcome to the Boards, though, and don't worry too much about the formal parsing of your identity experience. As someone else here said, once you factor in all those data points, it pretty much results in everyone's personal perspective being unique.
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Old 01-21-2018, 07:20 AM
Ramira Ramira is offline
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At its worst, intersectionality is just another way of saying, "Everyone on my side is good, and can do no evil; everyone on the other side is evil, and can do no good." Of course, this attitude is hardly limited to the Left - in fact, I'd say it is one of the few beliefs shared by human beings of every conceivable group or background. It's tribalism, pure and simple; the only thing the Left does new is dress it with a postgraduate degree.
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Old 01-21-2018, 08:35 AM
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I suppose that many mature leftists, in their younger years, were influenced by intersectionalist thought, but with a bit more analysis and real-world inspection, realized that society is more complex than such simplistic generalizations.
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:17 AM
Spice Weasel Spice Weasel is offline
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I suppose that many mature leftists, in their younger years, were influenced by intersectionalist thought, but with a bit more analysis and real-world inspection, realized that society is more complex than such simplistic generalizations.
That's funny, because as someone who uses the concept of intersectionality on a regular basis at work, I think the absolute purpose is to recognize complexity.

I work for a human services organization (domestic violence and sexual assault) and we can't effectively serve our clients without a recognition that depending on their identity, they may all have different needs and disadvantages. To be as straightforward as possible, let's say we have three shelter residents, all women who are exactly the same age:

1. a white, straight woman who is middle class
2. a Latina undocumented lesbian who is middle class
3. a trans woman who lives under the federal poverty line

1. Woman #1 is probably dealing with your standard set of issues: she's been physically threatened, perhaps strangled, maybe she doesn't have much of a job history because she hasn't been permitted to work. She needs help with safety planning, housing, maybe some budgeting skills. I'm not implying she's in an easy situation, but her race or sexual identity most likely don't factor significantly into her issues.

2. Women #2 is dealing with the issues as outlined in #1, only as a result of her undocumented status she's facing the additional threat of being turned in to the authorities if she leaves her partner. Maybe she does have a job, but her girlfriend is threatening to out her at her conservative place of business. Since she's a Latina, she's going to be at a disadvantage for finding work if she loses her job. In addition to the standard career and safety planning and wrap-around services, she's going to need to talk to a lawyer about obtaining a U-VISA. Because she's a lesbian in this locale, she may have difficulty finding a supportive social network, as this is the kind of area where ''everyone knows everyone'' in the LGBT circle. The social pressure to stay with her partner is likely to be very strong for this person.

3. Woman #3 has been abused and belittled by her partner for her trans status, there's a high chance that she's been forced into sex work, she's at threat of losing both her job and any future housing due to her trans status, and she's also going to likely need assistance obtaining her medication. This is a woman at a very high risk of homelessness.

Being aware of the different issues that different types of oppression are likely to cause and acting accordingly when attempting to meet the needs of those people is the purpose of intersectionality. You are going to be asking different questions and exploring different issues in the case of all three women. It's not really clear from the OP how he would define intersectionality, and some of the posts here make me wonder how well it is really understood. All it really means, at bottom, is that we can't be defined by any one aspect of our identity, and our issues are going to vary in some likely predictable ways depending on who we are. Furthermore, when one identity intersects with another, it can create special problems that must also be addressed in order to provide the highest quality help to those people.

Last edited by Spice Weasel; 01-21-2018 at 09:22 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:25 AM
Spice Weasel Spice Weasel is offline
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An example that stands out in the latter - I was once a juror on a case in which a man who struggled with drug addiction was struck by a car and suffered a traumatic brain injury. His drug addiction made it impossible to treat the traumatic brain injury in the standard way. He had to go to a special out-of-state facility to receive treatment for both issues concurrently. He had more problems than a standard drug addict and more problems than a standard TBI, and those problems were unique to the intersection of those two characteristics. Intersectionality is recognizing that when two (or more) identities collide, special issues arise.
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:31 AM
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To the OP: What evidence do you have that "The Left" (whatever that is) is obsessed with the concept?
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:36 AM
Alessan Alessan is online now
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Excellent points, Spice Weasel.

Let me amend my earlier statement: intersectionality is an excellent social tool and a useful way of looking at the world in social science terms. It's only when it's carried over into politics that it becomes a problem - but then, politics makes everything stupid.

Last edited by Alessan; 01-21-2018 at 09:39 AM.
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:40 AM
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Still, the obsession is migraine-inducing
You're spending so much time on this you're getting a migraine, and it's the other people who are obsessed?
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:45 AM
Jophiel Jophiel is online now
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But that's a question of the audience. The typical older liberal on here isn't obsessed with identity politics. The academic left, and thus many "progressive" students and younger people, are obsessed
How does the Left feel about sugar on its porridge?
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Old 01-21-2018, 10:15 AM
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My understanding is that intersectionality helps to mitigate the blindness created by privilege.

For decades, feminism was defined solely by white, upper-middle class and middle-class women. They got to frame the discourse around issues that were important to them.

But there are a lot of different "woman experiences" out there. Rich white women shouldn't be absolute arbiters, because they can only speak to their experiences, not all the others out there.

For instance, are all sex workers oppressed victims? The traditional feminist would say yes, because OF COURSE no healthy, self-respecting woman would voluntarily choose to be a prostitute. SHE HAS OPTIONS, FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE. But an intersectional feminist would be able to appreciate that sex work is not inherently exploitative, or at least not any more exploitative than any other work that people engage in. Rather than tearing down the sex industry, let's make it safer and empower workers. And about those options? Those "other options" are not necessarily safer or better and can be difficult to attain for everyone. So stop with that privileged noise.
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Old 01-21-2018, 10:43 AM
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As a leftie who has often been at odds with peers who have always wanted (IMO) to sort people into two groups, one right and one wrong, I embrace intersectionality as the beginning of a paradigm shift away from simple in/out good/bad understanding of people towards a more compassionate, nuanced and complex appreciation of the whole person/society/nature/nurture system.
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:01 AM
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Here's a good TED talk on the subject, by the person who coined the term "intersectionality":

https://www.ted.com/talks/kimberle_c...ersectionality

She describes the case of a black woman who was denied employment by a company that allowed white women to work in the office and allowed black men to do physical labor. She brought suit and the court found against her, holding that the company hired women and hired blacks, and so was not discriminating. The point is that being a woman and being black at the same time barred this person from employment here, and that treating only one group membership at a time brought the court to an erroneous conclusion.
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:05 AM
Snowboarder Bo Snowboarder Bo is offline
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I consider myself reasonably conversant in politics (at least in the US), and I'm a liberal. I have never even heard the term "intersectionality" before.
Aye; same here.

It's nice to know that the OP is concerned tho, now that I know that intersectionality is a thing.
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:06 AM
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I guess that's a data point in how out of touch traditional liberals are with the postmodern academic left. It doesn't really surprise me though. Most older liberals simply don't believe that (say) the events at Evergreen are not just a fringe aberration. Identity politics rule; anyone who grew up with rights-based liberalism in the 20th century would not recognize the modern academic left as liberalism at all. Indeed, it's not.
Then maybe you guys should stop calling it that.
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:27 AM
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The feminist movement is a big example of how an appreciation of intersectionality matters.

It’s undeniable that sexism has historically been meted out to women, but race and class have largely shaped its effects. Post-WWII housewives, for instance, whose disillusionment with life became the leading narrative of feminisim as most of us know it, were not representative of all women. Rather, the Feminine Mystique story was born out of the experiences of white, middle-class women. Not poor women who could never afford to not work. And not African-American women, whose socioeconomic background also largely made employment an expectation for them. And then there’s racism.

In a society that regards your race as ugly, dirty, and animalistic, sexism takes on a different flavor when applied to you. While white women were patronizingly regarded as these dainty vessels of purity and child-like vulnerability to reinforce notions of strength and competence in the white male establishment, black women were largely regarded as the opposite of these romanticized properties. They were treated like brutish, undignified things, unworthy of chilvarous protection that white women deserved.

So decades ago, a white woman talking about her right to self-determination might merit a patronizing pat on the head, as if to say “aww, isn’t it cute when they get mad” or “you silly little girl, if you only knew what the real world is really like.”. But a black women saying the same thing? She might have been labeled a trouble maker and threatened with violence. Not just by white men, but black men too. Both women were being harmed no doubt, but the difference in treatment signals differences in how the two are oppressed.

This matters because when feministic activists talk about women’s experiences with sexism as if they all look like white middle-class experiences, they will alienate women whose experience with sexism has been shaped by racism and classism.

Last edited by you with the face; 01-21-2018 at 11:30 AM.
  #34  
Old 01-21-2018, 11:43 AM
Joey P Joey P is offline
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That's funny, because as someone who uses the concept of intersectionality on a regular basis at work, I think the absolute purpose is to recognize complexity.

I work for a human services organization (domestic violence and sexual assault) and we can't effectively serve our clients without a recognition that depending on their identity, they may all have different needs and disadvantages. To be as straightforward as possible, let's say we have three shelter residents, all women who are exactly the same age:

1. a white, straight woman who is middle class
2. a Latina undocumented lesbian who is middle class
3. a trans woman who lives under the federal poverty line

1. Woman #1 is probably dealing with your standard set of issues: she's been physically threatened, perhaps strangled, maybe she doesn't have much of a job history because she hasn't been permitted to work. She needs help with safety planning, housing, maybe some budgeting skills. I'm not implying she's in an easy situation, but her race or sexual identity most likely don't factor significantly into her issues.

2. Women #2 is dealing with the issues as outlined in #1, only as a result of her undocumented status she's facing the additional threat of being turned in to the authorities if she leaves her partner. Maybe she does have a job, but her girlfriend is threatening to out her at her conservative place of business. Since she's a Latina, she's going to be at a disadvantage for finding work if she loses her job. In addition to the standard career and safety planning and wrap-around services, she's going to need to talk to a lawyer about obtaining a U-VISA. Because she's a lesbian in this locale, she may have difficulty finding a supportive social network, as this is the kind of area where ''everyone knows everyone'' in the LGBT circle. The social pressure to stay with her partner is likely to be very strong for this person.

3. Woman #3 has been abused and belittled by her partner for her trans status, there's a high chance that she's been forced into sex work, she's at threat of losing both her job and any future housing due to her trans status, and she's also going to likely need assistance obtaining her medication. This is a woman at a very high risk of homelessness.

Being aware of the different issues that different types of oppression are likely to cause and acting accordingly when attempting to meet the needs of those people is the purpose of intersectionality. You are going to be asking different questions and exploring different issues in the case of all three women. It's not really clear from the OP how he would define intersectionality, and some of the posts here make me wonder how well it is really understood. All it really means, at bottom, is that we can't be defined by any one aspect of our identity, and our issues are going to vary in some likely predictable ways depending on who we are. Furthermore, when one identity intersects with another, it can create special problems that must also be addressed in order to provide the highest quality help to those people.
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Originally Posted by Spice Weasel View Post
An example that stands out in the latter - I was once a juror on a case in which a man who struggled with drug addiction was struck by a car and suffered a traumatic brain injury. His drug addiction made it impossible to treat the traumatic brain injury in the standard way. He had to go to a special out-of-state facility to receive treatment for both issues concurrently. He had more problems than a standard drug addict and more problems than a standard TBI, and those problems were unique to the intersection of those two characteristics. Intersectionality is recognizing that when two (or more) identities collide, special issues arise.
These two posts are the best way I've ever seen it written. I ran across the term a year or so ago from some ultra-left SJW facebook friends and tried to understand it. Even with wiki and some other links (provided by them, natch) I had no idea what I was reading. Honestly, their links were so awful I couldn't tell if they were saying 'you have to understand intersectionality or you're a terrible person' or 'you're a terrible person because intersectionality is something you do'..yes some of those links were so bad I didn't even know what part of speech the word was.

I came away from it with the honest belief that some of them were purposely trying to muddy the waters to find more things to be oppressed [for others] about.
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Old 01-21-2018, 12:35 PM
Ludovic Ludovic is offline
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Many people mean many different things by "The Left": the conservative half of the country sometimes uses it to mean the liberal half. It wouldn't surprise me if the use of "intersectionality" was more prevalent from The Left in the way that liberals use the phrase on the other hand, even though I've never heard it used in seriousness.

I've only seen it used by conservative snowflakes obsessing over some vague "Left". Even by what I would consider representatives of The Left which is social rights involved people on NPR programs who seem vaguely to the right of Cornel West.

So either the use of the term is so rare that "The Left" is those to the left of those social justice folk who are acceptable to NPR, and thus small and powerless, or "The Left" is anyone who votes for the Democratic Party and mostly don't use the term "intersectionality". So not even possibly a problem in either case, even if the term is somehow objectionable.
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Old 01-21-2018, 01:40 PM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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I mean the only civil issue I purely heard of back then was racism, to me a patriarchy is still something newly learned.



So then I got another question regarding the dynamic



Would people who are bullied in school be qualified enough to enter the oppression olympics? Geeks, nerds, losers, beta males, wussies and dumbasses for example...


Who really is more obsessed with the dynamic???[Conservatives or liberals]


In this case, would a white rapper or a male model still be on the top of the ladder despite the people who dominate both areas?


Thnx, in advance.

Last edited by Luciano700; 01-21-2018 at 01:41 PM.
  #37  
Old 01-21-2018, 01:45 PM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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The feminist movement is a big example of how an appreciation of intersectionality matters.

It’s undeniable that sexism has historically been meted out to women, but race and class have largely shaped its effects. Post-WWII housewives, for instance, whose disillusionment with life became the leading narrative of feminisim as most of us know it, were not representative of all women. Rather, the Feminine Mystique story was born out of the experiences of white, middle-class women. Not poor women who could never afford to not work. And not African-American women, whose socioeconomic background also largely made employment an expectation for them. And then there’s racism.

In a society that regards your race as ugly, dirty, and animalistic, sexism takes on a different flavor when applied to you. While white women were patronizingly regarded as these dainty vessels of purity and child-like vulnerability to reinforce notions of strength and competence in the white male establishment, black women were largely regarded as the opposite of these romanticized properties. They were treated like brutish, undignified things, unworthy of chilvarous protection that white women deserved.

So decades ago, a white woman talking about her right to self-determination might merit a patronizing pat on the head, as if to say “aww, isn’t it cute when they get mad” or “you silly little girl, if you only knew what the real world is really like.”. But a black women saying the same thing? She might have been labeled a trouble maker and threatened with violence. Not just by white men, but black men too. Both women were being harmed no doubt, but the difference in treatment signals differences in how the two are oppressed.

This matters because when feministic activists talk about women’s experiences with sexism as if they all look like white middle-class experiences, they will alienate women whose experience with sexism has been shaped by racism and classism.
So then what about women with disabilities, underage girls[Cuz you know youth rights], lesbians and female animals. Would they be included anytime soon?
  #38  
Old 01-21-2018, 01:53 PM
dalej42 dalej42 is offline
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I first encountered the term in this thread. If you'd asked me about intersectionality prior to this thread, I'd think it was something I forgot from geometry class.

I'm sure this may be a thing among liberal arts majors at private schools, but it certainly isn't a thing among the mainstream left of center USA, of which I consider myself.
  #39  
Old 01-21-2018, 01:58 PM
you with the face you with the face is offline
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So then what about women with disabilities, underage girls[Cuz you know youth rights], lesbians and female animals. Would they be included anytime soon?
Do you think this clever?
  #40  
Old 01-21-2018, 01:59 PM
monstro monstro is online now
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So then what about women with disabilities, underage girls[Cuz you know youth rights], lesbians and female animals. Would they be included anytime soon?
What makes you think they aren't included?
  #41  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:02 PM
Chronos Chronos is online now
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I suppose that many mature leftists, in their younger years, were influenced by intersectionalist thought, but with a bit more analysis and real-world inspection, realized that society is more complex than such simplistic generalizations.
But realizing that society is more complex than simplistic generalizations is exactly what intersectionalism is. You start off by criticizing it, and then end by saying that it's exactly what we should be doing.

Quote:
Quoth Luciano700:

So then what about women with disabilities, underage girls[Cuz you know youth rights], lesbians and female animals. Would they be included anytime soon?
Yes, now you're catching on to the idea. Well, aside from animals; that's a whole different issue.
  #42  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:02 PM
elfkin477 elfkin477 is online now
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I consider myself reasonably conversant in politics (at least in the US), and I'm a liberal. I have never even heard the term "intersectionality" before.
I find this strange. I'm not any type of liberal and typically only stumble across things written from a liberal point of view, and yet have seen articles talking about intersectionality at least once a month for the past two or three years.
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:09 PM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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For some reason the quoting isn't working


The fact that I never heard them be mentioned

Yeah I guess I do think in such a very clever way, thanks...


Nobody answered my other 2 questions.
  #44  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:10 PM
Jophiel Jophiel is online now
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I find this strange. I'm not any type of liberal and typically only stumble across things written from a liberal point of view, and yet have seen articles talking about intersectionality at least once a month for the past two or three years.
If anything, it's a lesson in anecdotes, data and confirmation bias.
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Old 01-21-2018, 02:13 PM
monstro monstro is online now
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The fact that I never heard them be mentioned
The world is big, and you are only aware of a tiny sliver of it.
  #46  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:17 PM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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But realizing that society is more complex than simplistic generalizations is exactly what intersectionalism is. You start off by criticizing it, and then end by saying that it's exactly what we should be doing.


Yes, now you're catching on to the idea. Well, aside from animals; that's a whole different issue.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_rights
  #47  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:32 PM
chappachula chappachula is offline
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Here's the head of the Democratic Party (Keith Ellison) declaring that the Democrats must enthusiastically embrace intersectionality.

And here's how the commentator in that article refutes Ellison's claims:
"intersectionality means that once you've accepted that everything is racist, consistency demands that you also accept everything is sexist, everything is transphobic, everything is Islamophobic, and so on and so forth. Think of it as the grand unified theory of victimhood."

The key word here is "Victimhood".
As [b]Alessan[/]b said upthread--intersectionality may be a decent concept for professional sociologists to discuss.
But when the concept gets used in political discussions, it becomes a very,very dangerous issue. Because it always turns into a discussion of victimhood.
It is identity politics gone crazy.
  #48  
Old 01-21-2018, 02:58 PM
Jophiel Jophiel is online now
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Here's the head of the Democratic Party (Keith Ellison) declaring that the Democrats must enthusiastically embrace intersectionality.
Why does that column include a video where he never uses the word and fail to provide a link or any additional context?

Oh, because it's written by a conservative opinion writer who wants to work in terms like "brand of progressive radicalism". Never mind.

I don't even refute the notion that Ellison has ever used the term or spoke about it but it's a huge leap from "Here's a time he said a few lines" and "OMG OBSESSION"
  #49  
Old 01-21-2018, 03:14 PM
Czarcasm Czarcasm is online now
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So then what about women with disabilities, underage girls[Cuz you know youth rights], lesbians and female animals. Would they be included anytime soon?
I think I understand where you are coming from now.

Bye.
  #50  
Old 01-21-2018, 03:19 PM
Luciano700 Luciano700 is offline
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I think I understand where you are coming from now.

Bye.
lol
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