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Old 09-13-2018, 01:52 AM
nightshadea nightshadea is online now
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is this dillards ad offensive?

heres the front page www.dillards.com ...scroll down under the makeup ad to the first sale link ………..

after the "hot chick " discussion it bothers me … what says the dope …….. am I overreacting or is" homecoming hottie" an appropriate term for an HS aged girl?

Last edited by nightshadea; 09-13-2018 at 01:55 AM.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:28 AM
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There are situations when women choose to emphasize their physical attractiveness and there's nothing wrong with that.

What's wrong is when other people take the choice away from the woman and judge her by her physical attractiveness in a situation where she isn't looking for that.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:58 AM
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It's not like they are advertising outfits for Supreme Court hotties.
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:25 AM
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is" homecoming hottie" an appropriate term for an HS aged girl?
nah, it's tacky and tasteless.
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:03 AM
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^
I'll agree only if you can come up with an equally good adjective to match "homecoming."
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:40 AM
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It's okay, next month they start the campaign for Vocational Virgin.
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:54 AM
UnwittingAmericans UnwittingAmericans is offline
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When in doubt, take offense.

There's like 20 offensive things about that if you're willing to put a little effort into it. Go back and keep looking at it until you come up with more.
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Old 09-13-2018, 06:16 AM
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They're not particularly hot, so that's offensive. But seriously the term would really only start to be offensive if they were candid pix of girls doing not-modeling stuff like just trying to make their way to class through a crowded hallway without someone brushing their tits.
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Old 09-13-2018, 07:31 AM
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When in doubt, take offense.

There's like 20 offensive things about that if you're willing to put a little effort into it. Go back and keep looking at it until you come up with more.
I choose the fact they are all wearing heels. Consider me OFFENDED!
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Old 09-13-2018, 07:45 AM
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If I saw the ad outside the context of this conversation, I'd think "hotties" was being used to describe the dresses. Dillard's spends millions on their advertising / branding and I wouldn't think they'd use that phrasing in that way.

That aside, I do agree it does have a vague ick factor. Not because it's pointing out the physical attributes of the wearer, but the term "hottie" just has skeevy connotations.
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Old 09-13-2018, 07:52 AM
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Not because it's pointing out the physical attributes of the wearer, but the term "hottie" just has skeevy connotations.
and then it exorts these young girls to "bring the heat". They are schoolgirls, not hookers. They don't have to bring heat anywhere.....
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Old 09-13-2018, 08:17 AM
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and then it exorts these young girls to "bring the heat". They are schoolgirls, not hookers. They don't have to bring heat anywhere.....
Agreed. Whether or not their inner desire is to be "hot", I don't know that that's something to be promoted. How about simply another adjective for beautiful that doesn't have overt sexual undertones.
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Old 09-13-2018, 08:45 AM
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As humorous as it might feel to make fun of this, there are some real "big questions/issues" involved here, that it would do us all some good to take seriously, instead of writing it off as a stupid question.

1. Words like "hot" or "sexy" are doing tripple-duty in the vernacular these days. Sometimes they can mean:
  • This person or thing excites my genitals, and makes me want to have sex.
  • This person or thing is cool, but also is edgy or rebelious/rule-breaking in some way. I'm going to refer to them as sexy not because they literally arouse me, but because their difference (or illusion of difference) is exciting.
  • This person or thing is appealing/attractive. There is no intended connotation of sex or sexual attraction.

. . . these meanings cover a lot of ground, and are not always mutually exclusive. Furthermore, people often use the words without thinking much or at all about the different shades of usage, and might not even really know what they mean exactly. And listeners or readers are going to bring their own assumptions.

Is it wrong to advertise clothing to teens using the phrase "homecoming hottie"? Is it wrong to talk about teens as "hotties"? I don't know if the answer to both of those questions are the same, but they are certainly connected.

2. Women are in (have always been in?) a struggle to gain agency over and control how they look (or more precisely how they feel about how they look) independently of the male gaze. This is a fraught, complicated and imperfect task, as we're all living in and are inheritors of a patriarchal society in which good looking and empowering aesthetics for women have generally been connected to the ways in which their looks make men feel (and of course, a part of this is not just about a patriarchy, but is about human social habits and the want for all of us to be liked and wanted by our peers. Which just makes it all even harder to untangle).

Something like a clothing ad, even if it doesn't have a tag line that used intentionally or unintentionally sexually charged language (see point #1), is going to sit right in the middle of this knot. Wear what makes you feel good! Feeling attractive makes you feel good! But is feeling attractive at least in part conforming to some version of what you imagine will make other people approve of how you look? And how much of what makes you feel attractive comes from unhealthy and dis-empowering social pressures? And so if I feel good about how I look, am I just reinforcing the patriarchy? Am I setting a good example by doing what I want, or a bad example because what I want is shaped by the patriarchy? Is encouraging other women to feel sexy (whatever that means, again, see point #1) a net good or a net evil?

Too often questions of "is this offensive?" are short hand for "unless you can explain exactly what the rules are, and how they apply to this situation and how they also apply to every other possible permutation of this situation, you're just getting irrationally upset" (note, I'm not accusing the OP of this).

The thing is, there are no rules; we're trying to draft new rules (well, more like guidelines) right now. And they will likely never be set in stone. But unless you're open to thinking about all aspects of this complicated series of questions, you're not ready to enter into the conversation. And, any time you feel like lack of clarity or precision means that there is no value in a position, think again about how insanely complex our human interactions are, and how often (always) good/bad right/wrong fail us as universal guides to behavior.

And, I'll add that, if you're a man and are truly interested in a world where women get to shape this stuff for themselves (or even if you think we're already there and women already have control), then you need to be committed to embracing the ambiguity of living in a space where things are in flux, and where you have less control over where they are going than you used to.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:08 AM
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As the father of a 16yo, it is my experience that the girls refer to each other as hotties, so honestly, I don't really see a problem with this.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:21 AM
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As humorous as it might feel to make fun of this, there are some real "big questions/issues" involved here, that it would do us all some good to take seriously, instead of writing it off as a stupid question.
This is a wonderful post that deserves so much thought. I wanted to respond just to thank you for posting it.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:24 AM
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As humorous as it might feel to make fun of this, there are some real "big questions/issues" involved here, that it would do us all some good to take seriously, instead of writing it off as a stupid question.

1. Words like "hot" or "sexy" are doing tripple-duty in the vernacular these days. Sometimes they can mean:
  • This person or thing excites my genitals, and makes me want to have sex.
  • This person or thing is cool, but also is edgy or rebelious/rule-breaking in some way. I'm going to refer to them as sexy not because they literally arouse me, but because their difference (or illusion of difference) is exciting.
  • This person or thing is appealing/attractive. There is no intended connotation of sex or sexual attraction.

. . . these meanings cover a lot of ground, and are not always mutually exclusive. Furthermore, people often use the words without thinking much or at all about the different shades of usage, and might not even really know what they mean exactly. And listeners or readers are going to bring their own assumptions.

Is it wrong to advertise clothing to teens using the phrase "homecoming hottie"? Is it wrong to talk about teens as "hotties"? I don't know if the answer to both of those questions are the same, but they are certainly connected.

2. Women are in (have always been in?) a struggle to gain agency over and control how they look (or more precisely how they feel about how they look) independently of the male gaze. This is a fraught, complicated and imperfect task, as we're all living in and are inheritors of a patriarchal society in which good looking and empowering aesthetics for women have generally been connected to the ways in which their looks make men feel (and of course, a part of this is not just about a patriarchy, but is about human social habits and the want for all of us to be liked and wanted by our peers. Which just makes it all even harder to untangle).

Something like a clothing ad, even if it doesn't have a tag line that used intentionally or unintentionally sexually charged language (see point #1), is going to sit right in the middle of this knot. Wear what makes you feel good! Feeling attractive makes you feel good! But is feeling attractive at least in part conforming to some version of what you imagine will make other people approve of how you look? And how much of what makes you feel attractive comes from unhealthy and dis-empowering social pressures? And so if I feel good about how I look, am I just reinforcing the patriarchy? Am I setting a good example by doing what I want, or a bad example because what I want is shaped by the patriarchy? Is encouraging other women to feel sexy (whatever that means, again, see point #1) a net good or a net evil?

Too often questions of "is this offensive?" are short hand for "unless you can explain exactly what the rules are, and how they apply to this situation and how they also apply to every other possible permutation of this situation, you're just getting irrationally upset" (note, I'm not accusing the OP of this).

The thing is, there are no rules; we're trying to draft new rules (well, more like guidelines) right now. And they will likely never be set in stone. But unless you're open to thinking about all aspects of this complicated series of questions, you're not ready to enter into the conversation. And, any time you feel like lack of clarity or precision means that there is no value in a position, think again about how insanely complex our human interactions are, and how often (always) good/bad right/wrong fail us as universal guides to behavior.

And, I'll add that, if you're a man and are truly interested in a world where women get to shape this stuff for themselves (or even if you think we're already there and women already have control), then you need to be committed to embracing the ambiguity of living in a space where things are in flux, and where you have less control over where they are going than you used to.
Very thoughtful and well said. I'd disagree that "hot" ever doesn't include some shade of sexual connotation, or at least in any context that I can think of at the moment.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:29 AM
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Very thoughtful and well said. I'd disagree that "hot" ever doesn't include some shade of sexual connotation, or at least in any context that I can think of at the moment.
I feel like "hot" is following "sexy" in starting out as something sexual, then moving into something closer to just "popular" or "intriguing" (like "the new hotness"), which can then come back around to applying to people in an almost impersonal way. I don't know that it has exactly happened, but I think it's happening. So I agree with you though I think it's changing.

Last edited by wonky; 09-13-2018 at 09:31 AM.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:44 AM
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When people said that Tickle Me Elmo was hot, I didn't take that to mean that they found the doll sexually arousing. Just that it sold well. Hot can just mean "popular" or "trendy." Usually you can tell by context.

However, "hottie" is always sexual, as far as I know. It may be wanted or unwanted, but it's about looking sexually attractive. Even when straight girls say it to themselves, it basically means "guys would [or should] find you attractive."

At least in my opinion.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:53 AM
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When people said that Tickle Me Elmo was hot, I didn't take that to mean that they found the doll sexually arousing.
That's how I always meant it
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Old 09-13-2018, 10:02 AM
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When people said that Tickle Me Elmo was hot, I didn't take that to mean that they found the doll sexually arousing. Just that it sold well. Hot can just mean "popular" or "trendy." Usually you can tell by context.

However, "hottie" is always sexual, as far as I know. It may be wanted or unwanted, but it's about looking sexually attractive. Even when straight girls say it to themselves, it basically means "guys would [or should] find you attractive."

At least in my opinion.
Yes, I think that's actually what I meant. Of course we've all heard "such and such are hot sellers" and things like that but in regards to people, to me there's a degree of sexiness to it.
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Old 09-13-2018, 11:12 AM
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Ehh I dunno. I mean, my main issue is the fact that homecoming is a specifically high school event. And thus the girls attending it are going to be more or less minors. So referring to them as hotties, just on that point alone, is creepy. There's definitely some sexual undertones in the wording of the ad and that shouldn't be included in an ad aimed at underage girls.
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Old 09-13-2018, 11:33 AM
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I agree that "homecoming hotties" is kind of inappropriate for an ad about high school girls. (It also seems rather unsuitable as a marketing device aimed at an audience of the girls themselves and their parents, who presumably are the ones buying the prom dresses they're advertising. If someone was marketing a male grooming product to high school boys with promises that it would bring all the "homecoming hotties", I would still think that was kind of inappropriate socially, but it would make more sense to me commercially.)

Following up Eonwe's excellent discussion of various underlying issues by quoting myself from the concurrent thread about the problems of comparing standards of behavior for art/advertising with those for individuals:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimstu
[...] We all agree that in general, art and advertising aren't always governed by exactly the same rules as individual behavior, right?

For instance, it's almost universally agreed that it's inappropriate (not to mention illegal) for people to walk around naked in busy urban areas. But it's generally (although not unanimously) agreed that it's okay to display sculptures of nude human figures in busy urban areas (at least in western societies strongly influenced by the arts traditions of classical antiquity). Public display of an artist's depiction of some behavior is not exactly the same thing as real-life individuals voluntarily choosing to engage in that behavior themselves.

This also pertains to, say, public performance or broadcasting of rap music songs with obscene lyrics. Would it be appropriate for an individual to stand on a street corner and shout at specific passersby obscene invitations taken from rap songs? Definitely not. Is it equally inappropriate for a store to be playing a selection of canned music which includes some rap songs with similarly obscene lyrics? Most people would probably say no, even if they think that such a commercial soundtrack is still somewhat inappropriate in its own right.

Similarly with advertising. As a society, we seem to have accepted that it's okay to depict at least some behaviors in advertising media that would be inappropriate for individuals to imitate in the same circumstances. E.g., underwear-ad posters showing women or men standing around in their skivvies, which would definitely not be considered appropriate behavior from real individuals in the places where the ads are displayed. Or, say, perfume ads where the models may not even have reached the skivvy-wearing stage.

So I think that's the context we've got to consider when we ask if it's okay to show, for instance, a prom-dress ad containing the word "hotties" or a billboard for Hooters. I'm not arguing that advertising media can never be inappropriate---on the contrary---but I think it's pretty obvious that the appropriateness standards for advertising media are not identical to those for the behavior of individuals.
Even by those comparatively relaxed standards, though, I still think that describing high school girls, who are mostly underage, as "hotties" is a bit too sexualized for my taste.
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Old 09-13-2018, 11:39 AM
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Anybody who is not offended many times over by that ad is a bigot, a racist, a sexist, a neo-Nazi, and an animal abuser. Anybody who sees that ad and continues to shop Dillards is all those things AND a Trump-sucking greedhead.
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Old 09-13-2018, 12:00 PM
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Ok.

Anyway, asked my daughter and her response (via text):

"Uhhhhhh, a little. Just kinda uncomfortable because they're minors and the people writing the ads are adults, lol. Not really offensive, but uncomfortable."
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Old 09-13-2018, 12:16 PM
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At this point the discussion is about the term "hotties" as applied to teenage girls but I really do think even more than I initially did that they're referring to the dresses themselves. If you look at the pictures below them, the captions for the evening gowns and the shoes are talking about the merchandise. Not that it has any bearing on what we're discussing; just saying.
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Old 09-13-2018, 01:14 PM
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At this point the discussion is about the term "hotties" as applied to teenage girls but I really do think even more than I initially did that they're referring to the dresses themselves. If you look at the pictures below them, the captions for the evening gowns and the shoes are talking about the merchandise. Not that it has any bearing on what we're discussing; just saying.
I think you're right, especially comparing the parallel captions "Homecoming Hotties", "Special Occasion Stunners", and "Entrance-Making Gowns". The pattern does seem to be one catchy phrase per merchandise category.

But that just leaves me even more baffled, since I've never encountered the term "hottie" used to refer to a thing rather than a person. Either their usage is a little idiosyncratic or I am just totally out of touch with cool slang, which is a very plausible explanation.
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Old 09-13-2018, 01:26 PM
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I think you're right, especially comparing the parallel captions "Homecoming Hotties", "Special Occasion Stunners", and "Entrance-Making Gowns". The pattern does seem to be one catchy phrase per merchandise category.

But that just leaves me even more baffled, since I've never encountered the term "hottie" used to refer to a thing rather than a person. Either their usage is a little idiosyncratic or I am just totally out of touch with cool slang, which is a very plausible explanation.
I have visions of middle aged ad execs going "what's the word the kids are using these days. . . Hotties! Yeah, that'll grab 'em!"
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Old 09-13-2018, 01:52 PM
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FWIW, I don't think any of them are hotties, so ring me up for teen model-shaming or whatever the fuck applies.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:00 PM
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FWIW, I don't think any of them are hotties, so ring me up for teen model-shaming or whatever the fuck applies.
I want to check out their older sisters for hotness.

Possibly their moms.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:02 PM
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Ok.

Anyway, asked my daughter and her response (via text):

"Uhhhhhh, a little. Just kinda uncomfortable because they're minors and the people writing the ads are adults, lol. Not really offensive, but uncomfortable."
Update: in her opinion, the ad is referring to the girls as hotties.

You heard it here first!
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:07 PM
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Certainly no high school girl wants to be thought of as a hottie.

Take the ad down.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:11 PM
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... well, they are fine with having other High Schoolers thinking of them as a hottie, Bricker.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:11 PM
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When in doubt, take offense.

There's like 20 offensive things about that if you're willing to put a little effort into it. Go back and keep looking at it until you come up with more.
Or just claim that somebody else will take offense and then complain about what those imaginary people are saying.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:29 PM
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When in doubt, take offense.

There's like 20 offensive things about that if you're willing to put a little effort into it. Go back and keep looking at it until you come up with more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scumpup
Anybody who is not offended many times over by that ad is a bigot, a racist, a sexist, a neo-Nazi, and an animal abuser.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bricker
Certainly no high school girl wants to be thought of as a hottie.

Take the ad down.
This illustrates how divorced from reality the self-described "anti-PC" crowd is on these issues: they're reduced to mocking straw opponents for outrageously silly views that nobody here actually endorsed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Nemo
Or just claim that somebody else will take offense and then complain about what those imaginary people are saying.
Yep.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:33 PM
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When in doubt, say "straw man."
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:34 PM
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When in doubt, say "straw man."
Except that there's no doubt at all about the strawman nature of your arguments.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:56 PM
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Except that there's no doubt at all about the strawman nature of your arguments.
My argument is not a strawman. It's merely lazy and sarcastic.

But, lazy though it is, it is directly responsive to:

Quote:
Women are in (have always been in?) a struggle to gain agency over and control how they look (or more precisely how they feel about how they look) independently of the male gaze.
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:14 PM
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Well, if you feel like (and are capable of) making an argument on the issue that's not lazy, I'd be happy to discuss it with you.
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:19 PM
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This illustrates how divorced from reality the self-described "anti-PC" crowd is on these issues: they're reduced to mocking straw opponents for outrageously silly views that nobody here actually endorsed.


Yep.
I'm not anti-PC. I don't think I've ever complained about it or, if I have, certainly not often enough for me to be part of a "crowd." What I definitely am, though, is anti-shrill self-righteous smug jackass. That brings us to you...
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:33 PM
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I'm not anti-PC. I don't think I've ever complained about it or, if I have, certainly not often enough for me to be part of a "crowd."
There's a minimum frequency requirement for being part of a "crowd" now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scumpup
What I definitely am, though, is anti-shrill self-righteous smug jackass.
The guy who strawmanned a calm and rational discussion of whether and how the word "hottie" might be considered objectionable in a prom dress ad with attention-seeking hyperbole as melodramatic as "Anybody who is not offended many times over by that ad is a bigot, a racist, a sexist, a neo-Nazi, and an animal abuser" really has no business accusing anybody else of being a shrill self-righteous smug jackass.
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Old 09-13-2018, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Kimstu View Post
There's a minimum frequency requirement for being part of a "crowd" now?


The guy who strawmanned a calm and rational discussion of whether and how the word "hottie" might be considered objectionable in a prom dress ad with attention-seeking hyperbole as melodramatic as "Anybody who is not offended many times over by that ad is a bigot, a racist, a sexist, a neo-Nazi, and an animal abuser" really has no business accusing anybody else of being a shrill self-righteous smug jackass.
Oh, go fuck a food processor. You're outraged and you like being outraged. You look for stuff over which to be outraged. If you can couple that to a sense of moral superiority over some individual, well that's just cheesecake! Ask yourself this question: Does my opinion of you matter to you? Now why should yours matter to me?
  #42  
Old 09-13-2018, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scumpup View Post
Oh, go fuck a food processor. You're outraged and you like being outraged. You look for stuff over which to be outraged. If you can couple that to a sense of moral superiority over some individual, well that's just cheesecake! Ask yourself this question: Does my opinion of you matter to you? Now why should yours matter to me?
"No u" would have been shorter.

(I am not seeing any outrage in this thread.)
  #43  
Old 09-13-2018, 03:49 PM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scumpup View Post
Oh, go fuck a food processor. You're outraged and you like being outraged. You look for stuff over which to be outraged. If you can couple that to a sense of moral superiority over some individual, well that's just cheesecake!
The outrage and sense of moral superiority here is all yours. All I said was that I thought the wording of the ad was "kind of inappropriate" and a "bit too sexualized for my taste".

And then I poked a little mild fun at a few posters who were trying to satirize ridiculously overblown levels of outrage that didn't come close to actually existing in any of the views actually expressed by other posters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scumpup
Ask yourself this question: Does my opinion of you matter to you? Now why should yours matter to me?
Nobody's opinion of anybody else needs to matter in the least to anybody here. But if you can't take the occasional unflattering comment without getting all furious about it, well, at least you're in the right forum.

Last edited by Kimstu; 09-13-2018 at 03:50 PM.
  #44  
Old 09-13-2018, 04:30 PM
Scumpup Scumpup is offline
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Originally Posted by wonky View Post
"No u" would have been shorter.

(I am not seeing any outrage in this thread.)
You're right about the "no u."
  #45  
Old 09-13-2018, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Scumpup View Post
Does my opinion of you matter to you? Now why should yours matter to me?
This is the 'go to' rejoinder from thread-shitters and trolls when they get called on their antics, particularly by any calm and accurate accuser. It's particularly stupid because it's an appeal to the accuser to join into a fiction that, whatever the subject of discussion, any objection to a particular comment is meaningless, that all such objections are merely ad hominem distractions and that therefore any slur they themselves throw is on equal footing with all rebukes of their asshattery.

Perhaps other posters have the same experience as I do: in this exchange, I find myself attending to Kimstu's opinion of another poster with interest, due to her history of careful and cordial posting on any number of subjects here. She, I've noted, is neither prone to undue bellicosity nor given to careless critique of others.

Scumpup, OTOH... Its posting history commends to me that zero fucks be given for its opinion on anyone or anything.
  #46  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:14 PM
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AngelSoft AngelSoft is offline
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Originally Posted by The Bad Ideas View Post
Students in high schools age ranges from 14-19. Age of consent in the US ranges from 16-18 so your statement that the ad is aimed at underage girls is while perhaps not quite an outright lie, dubious at best. same thing goes with your assertion that all of the girls who will attend homecoming or going to be "more or less minors."

In fact more upperclassmen, and thus those of legal age when it comes to sexual activity attend homecoming dances these days.
Just because they're legally able to consent to sex doesn't make it any less disconcerting. They're still legally children until 18. I don't like the idea of our culture sexualizing girls like this. I do realize this is my opinion though and there's no law against such things.

And admittedly I haven't been to any homecoming dances recently, but I'm fairly certain at least one of the two people (couple) attending needs to attend that high school. Which means, chances are higher that they're under 18. Correct me if I'm wrong because, with a young daughter nearing that time in her life, I'd really like to know if schools are allowing just anyone to show up to these things.
  #47  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bad Ideas View Post
Except neither you nor your daughter have any idea whether the models in that ad are minors or what their actual ages are, do you?

Didn't think so.
What a bizarre (and bizarrely antagonistic) response.

1. It's a homecoming dance, a high school thing.
2. It's an ad aimed for teens.
3. The ages of the models is irrelevant, especially given 20-somethings portray high school-aged kids all the time.
4. The ad isn't for, or about, the models in the ad.

Drop the asshole act and come back when you're not feeling so personally defensive.

Last edited by JohnT; 09-13-2018 at 05:22 PM.
  #48  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by xenophon41 View Post

Scumpup, OTOH... Its posting history commends to me that zero fucks be given for its opinion on anyone or anything.
Gosh, another person I don't know says bad things about me about which I don't give a shit. So, since we are all on the same page here, i.e. none of us care about what any of the others think about us, why don't we let that particular fiction go? Frankly, I seldom bother to read most of the spittle sprayed in my direction by the shrill and self-righteous set, let alone respond to it.
  #49  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:36 PM
begbert2 begbert2 is offline
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Calling a teenage girl a "hottie" is about the most watered-down form of sexualizing I've ever heard. I'm a bleeding-heart liberal but I've got better things to worry about.
  #50  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:40 PM
Kimstu Kimstu is offline
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Well, thank heavens we've at least managed to rescue this thread from its originally intended purpose of talking about some debatable aspects of sexualizing descriptions of women and redirect it to the perennially top-priority issue of whether a male poster is possibly being criticized unfairly. I was afraid for a while there that we were going to be stuck in a calm rational interesting discussion forever.


ETA: And now begbert2 had to go and ruin it by dragging us back to the calm rational interesting discussion. Dammit begbert2.

Last edited by Kimstu; 09-13-2018 at 05:41 PM.
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