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Old 09-21-2018, 06:49 AM
elmwood elmwood is offline
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Millennials: does rock and pop from the 1970s and 1980s sound "old-timey" to you?

Think about this: about 35 years ago, in 1982, these songs were on the Billboard Top 100 chart.

*Joan Jett & The Blackhearts - I Love Rock 'n Roll
* John Cougar - Jack & Diane
* Tommy Tutone - 867-5309/Jenny
* The Go-Go's - We Got the Beat
* Journey - Don't Stop Believin'
* Van Halen - Pretty Woman

In 1982, I was in my early teens. Go back 35 years earlier, and these are among the Billboard top 100 for 1947.

* Tex Williams - Smoke, Smoke, Smoke That Cigarette
* Sammy Kaye - The Old Lamplighter
* Arthur Godfrey - Too Fat Polka
* Bing Crosby - The Whiffenpoof Song
* Freddy Martin - Managua, Nicaragua
* Guy Lombardo - Managua, Nicaragua

It wasn't uncommon to have multiple versions of the same song, by different artists, in that list. The Harmonicats, The Three Suns, and Art Lund all topped the chart with different versions of Peg O’ My Heart. That's like Katy Perry feat XXXTENTACION, Ariana Grande feat Quavo, and Alessia Cara feat Taylor Swift feat Drake feat Jason Aldean feat Big Sean feat Lil Uzi Vert feat Florida Georgia Line all topping the chart with different versions of Scars to Your Beautiful.

Anyhow, those songs from the 1940s sounded just as old-timey to my ears as ragtime, barbershop qurtet, and songs in a nasal falsetto voice about how merry they feel driving their Oldsmobile and going off to war to battle the Kaiser. To the Millennial crowd, does rock and pop from the 1970s and 1980s sound just as old fashioned to you, as if it's a relic from a long-past era?
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:14 AM
Ludovic Ludovic is online now
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I'd be more interested in hearing from post-millennials because rock music was still popular music in the late 90s. Whereas those born in the late-90s and afterward were not tweens by the time there was almost no rock music hitting the charts.

My sister is a millennial and she likes the Beatles for instance. I don't have a feeling that she likes them ironically because they're old-timey (excepting of course the ones that deliberately do sound like early 20th century songs.)

Last edited by Ludovic; 09-21-2018 at 07:15 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:22 AM
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Born in ‘84. Stuff my parents used to listen to on the mix tape in the car deck.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:22 AM
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I agree with Ludovic, about hearing from young’uns.

I will say that something big (obviously) happened around 1967-68. Stuff from before that — not just popular music, but in lots of cultural realms (e.g., John McWhorter wrote a book on how public speaking style changed) — is, by and large, objectively different than stuff since. So, music from before 1967-68 will tend to sound old-timey to someone of most any age, while most (not all) of stuff from the 50 years (!!) since will sound less old-timey to most (not all) ears.

Last edited by JKellyMap; 09-21-2018 at 07:23 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:25 AM
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Dangit for the typo correction, I was all set to compare how old timey Wreckless Eric sounded compared to Elvis Costello!
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:37 AM
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I don't understand all the "feat" in the OP?
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:45 AM
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I'm a millenial, no, it doesn't sound old-timey. I mean, it sounds period in that most of the music from those periods I can place via musical cues, but that's just musical knowledge. I'd say to get really "old-timey" sounding you have to go back at least before Sgt. Pepper's.

I'm leaving out a bit of nuance, though. Some subgenres that changed heavily or died out can sound a bit dated. Metal, prog, and some punk subgenres notably have changed significantly enough that they can sound dated in various ways depending on the band or song in question.

Still, even by the late '70s things sound very modern in many corners. I'd believe you if you told me Bat Outta Hell was from a few years ago.

Last edited by Jragon; 09-21-2018 at 07:47 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:47 AM
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My 20 year old post millennial (Gen Z, I think they're called) son loves classic rock/hard rock/heavy metal from the past. Color me suprised to find out a few years ago that his favorite band is Styx. So now, we've seen them several times in concert. This last time they were playing with Tesla (who we've seen a number of times) and Joan Jett and the Blackhearts. He only knew one or two of her songs, but by the end of the concert he was a fan.

Of the songs you mentioned, he knows and likes the ones that would be considered rock.

*Joan Jett & The Blackhearts - I Love Rock 'n Roll
* John Cougar - Jack & Diane
* Journey - Don't Stop Believin'
* Van Halen - Pretty Woman

These are pop songs, so I would guess if he heard them, he would think they were "meh". In fact, I think they "meh" because I don't appreciate most pop music.

* Tommy Tutone - 867-5309/Jenny
* The Go-Go's - We Got the Beat

I think it's more of genre thing. If you like a certain genre of music, you probably don't think the music sounds old timey. I am Gen X, and I think the early Beatles, Elvis, Beach Boys, etc sound old timey. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy hearing them from time to time, but they are pop songs from a past era, so they seem "past" to me. Rock music from the late 60's and forward all still seem relevant.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:54 AM
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Though there are some things that can make things sound... I'd use the word "dated" more than old-timey. Heavy reverb or synths immediately dates something. No rock has used that since the '80s unless it's deliberately trying to be a pastiche. (There is the synth and dream rock genre, but it has a lot of electronica influences and sounds very different).

Last edited by Jragon; 09-21-2018 at 07:55 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Leaffan View Post
I don't understand all the "feat" in the OP?
"featuring"

I believe the OP is making fun of the popularity of artists collaborating with each other. Not a brand-new concept at all, it's long been a way to prop up or attempt to increase the appeal of newer, lesser known artists, but the recent generations of pop music artists seemingly do nothing but collaborate with each other, especially for intended singles.


.

Last edited by DCnDC; 09-21-2018 at 07:56 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 07:56 AM
Elendil's Heir Elendil's Heir is offline
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My sons were born in 1996, 1999 and 2003. I've been surprised and pleased by how much of the music of my youth they like, as well - the Beatles, Electric Light Orchestra and Alan Parsons Project, in particular. They recommend new songs to me from time to time and I often add them to my playlists.

Last edited by Elendil's Heir; 09-21-2018 at 07:57 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:00 AM
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I'm also an older guy with a 20 year old son and he'll listen to a bunch of stuff from the 70s and 80s and just consider it "music". This doesn't apply to things like disco and hair metal but your basic rock/pop songs he'll include in his listening especially if it has good harmonies or vocals (he did a lot of choir/music in high school).

While a good part of this is just the prevalence of the music hanging around to entertain us Gen-Xers, I also think the surge of music games like Rock Band & Guitar Hero helped make a lot of the older stuff just "music" as it was included in the play lists along with more contemporary stuff.

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Originally Posted by DCnDC View Post
I believe the OP is making fun of the popularity of artists collaborating with each other. Not a brand-new concept at all, it's long been a way to prop up or attempt to increase the appeal of newer, lesser known artists, but the recent generations of pop music artists seemingly do nothing but collaborate with each other, especially for intended singles.
I feel like, "back in the day", they didn't make as big a deal out of it either. You'd have to check the liner notes to see who the guest vocalist was versus it being part of the song title.

Last edited by Jophiel; 09-21-2018 at 08:02 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:05 AM
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Keep in mind that millenials and post-millenials do live in the era of the internet and extremely niche bands and interests. We're also not largely at the mercy of radios, MTV, or record stores to dictate what's available to us. To us, in large part, a lot of music is kind of just music.

My playlist is a stream of nonsense, genre-wise, to experimental hip-hop, operatic metal, jazz, orchestral music, a mix of old and modern pop, punk, and a lot else. I'm not saying everyone has as varied musical tastes as I do, I'm definitely an outlier to some degree, but after the advent of digital music distribution (and especially streaming), peoples musical interests aren't as narrow, either genre-wise or time-wise, as they once were. I can listen to Youtube autoplay and hear a song from the '60s followed by a song from the '90s followed by a song from last week.

I don't have to go to the record store and hope they stock music from that era while also being in the mood to hear music from them, I don't have to intentionally tune into a radio station playing "old music", and so on.

Last edited by Jragon; 09-21-2018 at 08:06 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:20 AM
Boozahol Squid, P.I. Boozahol Squid, P.I. is offline
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I was born in 82, the year these songs came out, and none of them seem old timey to me. They were on MTV when I was growing up, or at least on VH1. The latest song that comes to my mind that sounds legitimately "old-timey" was 1971's Brand New Key, but I think that was a bit of a callback to early 60's pop even when it came out.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by AK84 View Post
Born in ‘84. Stuff my parents used to listen to on the mix tape in the car deck.
Thanks for your input. Now, what's your reaction to the Beatles and other bands from that era? Do you think "Whoa, old but still cool." Or does it sound alien? As a kid I'd listen to my parents' music and think "Wabash Cannonball? Is this stuff even music?"

Yes, if you turned on the radio, that was one of the big hits. As was Mood Indigo, which after the opening piano flourish (by The King Of All Sir Duke), mellows so low I'd again say "Whaaaat?"

Hey, here's a Top 40 hit from when I was in grade school. If this came up in a road trip playlist today, I'd pull the car over and say "Okay, what's going on here?" (Charlie Brown by the Coasters)
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:28 AM
pulykamell pulykamell is online now
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My 20 year old post millennial (Gen Z, I think they're called)
That's one of the names for them. Seems to be most popular at the moment, but there are a couple other competing names out there like the Homeland Generation, iGeneration and simply, post-Millennials. I'm not sure there's quite a consensus yet, though. Generation X took a few years to settle (I remember being called Baby Busters and simply 13th Gen for a spell--it wasn't until Copeland's book of the same name that Generation X became popular), and Millennials were "Generation Y" back in the 90s, and it was really until the 00s that the name "Millennials" stuck (although it was coined earlier by Strauss and Howe, though they also went with "13th Gen" for Generation X, and that didn't stick.)

Last edited by pulykamell; 09-21-2018 at 08:29 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:43 AM
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In 1982, I was in my early teens. Go back 35 years earlier, and these are among the Billboard top 100 for 1947.
1947 was what, two decades before you were born? 1982 is when or just before when a lot of millennials were born. It's not a good comparison.

I would look at whatever the "oldies" stations were playing in the late 80s.
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by DCnDC View Post
"featuring"

I believe the OP is making fun of the popularity of artists collaborating with each other. Not a brand-new concept at all, it's long been a way to prop up or attempt to increase the appeal of newer, lesser known artists, but the recent generations of pop music artists seemingly do nothing but collaborate with each other, especially for intended singles.
Yes, but when did "feat." start getting included in song credits?

IIRC it used to be that guest artists on a track were credited in the liner notes but not in the actual "Artist Name" (e.g. "Money for Nothing" is by Dire Straits, not "Dire Straits feat. Sting"); and duets/collaborations were simply "and" (e.g. "Say Say Say" by Paul McCartney & Michael Jackson").
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Old 09-21-2018, 08:58 AM
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Yes, but when did "feat." start getting included in song credits?
I don't know exactly, but personally I first started noticing it in the early 90s, almost exclusively on hip-hop albums. It makes sense, as it's easy for a rapper to just come in to the studio, drop a verse, and move on, and hip-hop is a music genre where boasting and self-promotion are practically obligatory, thus the insistence of having their name included on the track. And again, it's also an easy way to introduce and promote a lesser known artist, or that artist's protégé, or extended crew.
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Old 09-21-2018, 09:02 AM
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E: Yeah, hip-hop was definitely where it started in the '90s, my post is a bit more for mainstream use.

It's a pretty transparent move for marketing singles or a new artist. You slap a "feat. Whoever" on the new single by a known artist and people are flocking to check out Whoever (as long as they did a decent job). Conversely, you slap a "feat. Popular Artist" on a newcomer and people buy the track just to hear their favorite singer and maybe check out the new person after.

It's meant to compactly and subtly convey this information in something as immediate as glancing at the info for the Spotify track or Youtube vid or Soundhound ID. I think it really took off around 2008 or a little later, at least that's when I started noticing it all the time, which would be around the real boom of digital distribution, which fits that idea.

I think the slightly less cynical but related idea is that it has to do with MP3 metadata. While you can tag MP3s with any number of arbitrary things, most players only really use or display artist, album, and title (maybe "album artist" for sorting). If you want to convey the information on an MP3 at all, you've gotta stuff it in one of those fields, because you no longer have anywhere else like a CD or Record case to hold the info.

Last edited by Jragon; 09-21-2018 at 09:03 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 09:37 AM
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1947 was what, two decades before you were born? 1982 is when or just before when a lot of millennials were born. It's not a good comparison.

I would look at whatever the "oldies" stations were playing in the late 80s.
The would have been songs of the early rock era. I was a big oldies station listener when I was 12-14 (1987-1989), and the music at that time spanned from about 1955 ("Rock Around the Clock"--heck, I dedicated the song "Only You" by the Platters on the oldies station to my 8th grade sweetheart in 1988) to about 1969 or so (I remember "Age of Aquarius/Let the Sunshine In" being about the most recent music they would play. After that, you'd have to switch to the "classic rock" station, although "classic rock" overlapped a little bit of the oldies station, starting in the 60s and going through the 70s. The oldies station would play more the pop hits of the 60s, while the rock station would play, well, the rock hits.)
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Old 09-21-2018, 09:53 AM
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I'd be more interested in hearing from post-millennials because rock music was still popular music in the late 90s. Whereas those born in the late-90s and afterward were not tweens by the time there was almost no rock music hitting the charts.

My sister is a millennial and she likes the Beatles for instance. I don't have a feeling that she likes them ironically because they're old-timey (excepting of course the ones that deliberately do sound like early 20th century songs.)
I'm 40, of that lost not Millenial not X generation. 80s and 70s stuff does sound old timey to me, even though I grew up in the 80s. 70s rock was the stuff of war movies.
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Old 09-21-2018, 09:57 AM
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I'm 40, of that lost not Millenial not X generation.
Ah, a Xennial! That said, I was born in '75 and my wife is '77 and my brother is '81 and they all feel like Xers to me.
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Old 09-21-2018, 10:03 AM
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Still, even by the late '70s things sound very modern in many corners. I'd believe you if you told me Bat Outta Hell was from a few years ago.
Anecdote:

A few years ago, I was having dinner at Culver's, and there was a group of teenagers (probably about 14 or 15 years old) in the restaurant. Among that group was a young couple, arm in arm -- he was wearing a Led Zeppelin t-shirt, and she was wearing a Bob Marley t-shirt.

The first thing I thought was, "that's cool, they're into old-school music!" And, then, I thought about it a little more.

They were wearing shirts for artists who had peaked 35 years or so earlier...and, yet, those artists were still relevant to these teens. When I was 15, it was 1980, and had I, at that time, been wearing a t-shirt for an artist from 35 years prior, it would have been a Benny Goodman or Les Paul t-shirt, which would have been pretty much unheard of among kids in my generation.

I suspect that there's a definite pre-post divide for music; whether that's currently in the 1950s (i.e., pre-rock-and-roll), the 1960s, or the 1970s, is an interesting question.
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Old 09-21-2018, 10:33 AM
Elendil's Heir Elendil's Heir is offline
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...They were wearing shirts for artists who had peaked 35 years or so earlier...and, yet, those artists were still relevant to these teens....
Or the T-shirts are being worn ironically, or because they're retro-cool - not necessarily because the wearer digs their music.
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Old 09-21-2018, 10:52 AM
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Or the T-shirts are being worn ironically, or because they're retro-cool - not necessarily because the wearer digs their music.
Entirely possible. In any case, it wouldn't have even occurred to 15-year-old me to have worn a shirt from a 1940s musician, for any reason.

I'll add that, last month, my wife and I went to see Electric Light Orchestra in concert, and we were accompanied by my niece (age 26) and her husband (age 30), both of whom love ELO. (My niece's other favorite artist is Stevie Nicks.)

Last edited by kenobi 65; 09-21-2018 at 10:54 AM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 11:11 AM
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My 19 year old daughter loves The Beatles, and has seen McCartney twice in concert. She also loves The Doors, The Who, Led Zeppelin, and Bob Dylan.

My 15 year old son loves Jethro Tull. A couple weeks ago I took him to a Jethro Tull concert in Huber Heights, OH, and he loved it. He also loves Zappa/MoI, Black Sabbath, and The Velvet Underground. He wears a Zeppelin shirt everywhere he goes.
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Old 09-21-2018, 11:29 AM
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Yes, but when did "feat." start getting included in song credits?

IIRC it used to be that guest artists on a track were credited in the liner notes but not in the actual "Artist Name" (e.g. "Money for Nothing" is by Dire Straits, not "Dire Straits feat. Sting"); and duets/collaborations were simply "and" (e.g. "Say Say Say" by Paul McCartney & Michael Jackson").
Get Back by THE BEATLES with Billy Preston.
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Old 09-21-2018, 12:11 PM
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Born in 82, Rock and Roll from the 50s and doowop sounds old timey to me. 60s and on not so much. Even stuff I dig like Elvis has an unmistakable old timey sound. But I grew up with the Beatles all around. I grew up with Bowie and Led Zeplin and The Doors and Stones and the Who played everywhere all the time. "classic rock" was HUGE in the mid to late 90s when I was in middle and High School. That's the reason why the garage rock of the mid 2000s became a thing. Kids my age who grew up on late 60s rock wanted to make rock that sounded like that. So you get the Strokes and the White Stripes.

Kids in their 20s now grew up, it seems, with the 80s being similarly fashionable so synthesizer sounds are back. It's a cyclical until someone actually breaks the mold and makes something really brand new.

Last edited by NAF1138; 09-21-2018 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 12:46 PM
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I have a 16yo daughter (so not a "millennial") and to her it's all just "music". Yeah, she understands that some songs are "old" but her approach to music and her sense of identity with it is far more about "here's what I like which is a reflection of who I am" and not "here's what I like as a means of setting myself in opposition to anybody else".

For example, on her playlist are Celtic songs, Frank Sinatra, Ariana Grande, Mozart, One Direction (and Harry Styles, always Harry Styles), Tom Rosenthal, Harry Connick Jr, her Rockabilly phase, her "moody girl" phase, Led Zeppelin, movie soundtracks ranging from Disney Tunes to Guardian of the Galaxy 70s compilations to the Avengers soundtracks, Rhianna, Alanis Morissette, The Beatles, The Who, Benny Goodman & Glenn Miller, etc etc etc.

The kid knows more music... and knows more about music... than I ever had the chance growing up in the late 70s/early 80s, and it's all because of YouTube. Yeah, Pandora/Spotify helped, but YouTube is the primary driver of musical tastes for her generation as it is ubiquitous, free, easily accessed, easily shared, and did I mention free? You can find, for almost any song ever, the original, the original with lyrics, the original set for karaoke, covers, instructional "how to play" videos, etc.

She and her friends spent years sharing new songs with each other, learning the lyrics, more... and they all did it via YouTube.

And it leads to surprises like that time I was listening to the oldies station with her and 2 friends in the back seat (about 12yo at the time), when Chicago's "Hard to Say I'm Sorry" came on... and all three of them got really excited and started belting out the song as it was playing. The song was released in 1982, this happened in 2013, so it would have been the equivalent of 1979 me singing along to a 1948 hit my Dad had on the radio. Never would've happened. But with my kid and her friends? Totally normal.

So I am positive that Sophia knows if a song is "old", but I am also positive it doesn't really matter to her.

Last edited by JohnT; 09-21-2018 at 12:48 PM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 01:13 PM
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I spoke to some of my relatives that are millenials and post-millenials; for most part they said they enjoyed listening to a lot of the music from the 70s and 80s. I bolded listening because quite a few of them said watching music videos of songs from the 70s and 80s really dated them more than the music itself.
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Old 09-21-2018, 01:28 PM
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Even if the music sounds old-timey to millenials, the 70's are still a huge influence for all sorts of music, especially hip-hop and electronic/dance.
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Old 09-21-2018, 01:40 PM
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I have a 16yo daughter (so not a "millennial") and to her it's all just "music". Yeah, she understands that some songs are "old" but her approach to music and her sense of identity with it is far more about "here's what I like which is a reflection of who I am" and not "here's what I like as a means of setting myself in opposition to anybody else".
Yeah, I definitely get the sense that post-Gen X, into the Millennial generation, and now beyond, music became more "democratic" and less cliquish than it was when I was growing up in the 80s and in high school in the very early 90s. Certainly, IME, by the late 90s, early 00s, the answer to "what kind of music do you listen to" became less X and Y genres and more "I listen to all kinds of music" (and first with the caveat "except country and rap" to now even without that caveat.)
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Old 09-21-2018, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Jragon View Post
Heavy reverb or synths immediately dates something. No rock has used that since the '80s unless it's deliberately trying to be a pastiche. (There is the synth and dream rock genre, but it has a lot of electronica influences and sounds very different).
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Originally Posted by NAF1138 View Post
Kids in their 20s now grew up, it seems, with the 80s being similarly fashionable so synthesizer sounds are back. It's a cyclical until someone actually breaks the mold and makes something really brand new.
A lot of the "indie rock" that has been out in the past 5 or so years, to me, is like the 80s synth pop but without the synths. The rhythm, and the heavy emphasis on same, immediately makes me think of Duran Duran. That's why bands that sound like this (and not all bands labelled as "indie rock" do so) I classify as "pop rock" instead since they remind me of 80s pop. Although I understand that "pop rock" could mean the complete opposite as well to some people, such as bands like Imagine Dragons that use pop techniques and instruments but with more of a rock rhythm.
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Old 09-21-2018, 02:08 PM
Clawdio Clawdio is offline
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Born in '80

Early Beatles (think: I Wanna Hold Your Hand) sounds old timey.
Later Beatles and other 60's bands like the Rolling Stones, The Doors, Bob Dylan, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath are all modern. So for the most part I'd say the 60's and forward sounds modern to my ear, and before that it's old timey. Even 80's synth sounds are modern sounding to me (and seem to be coming back en vogue in certain circles)

Exceptions/Special:
Motown - sounds both old timey and timeless/modern at the same time. To me, Motown is like the great uniter, in that you take any cross-section of people from various race/gender/economic status/whatever... and everyone can groove to it.

Disco- its like... it's own thing, man.

Last edited by Clawdio; 09-21-2018 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 02:10 PM
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There's a big new trend on YouTube of millennials reacting to music from the 60s/70s/80s. It's suddenly become a very popular thing.
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Old 09-21-2018, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen View Post
There's a big new trend on YouTube of millennials reacting to music from the 60s/70s/80s. It's suddenly become a very popular thing.
I've not seen these but I've seen ones where older people listen to current music. The older people actually liked much of it because much of it was sampling from music they already knew and liked, and I'm guessing the millennials have a similar reaction, but the other way.
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Old 09-21-2018, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Ludovic View Post
A lot of the "indie rock" that has been out in the past 5 or so years, to me, is like the 80s synth pop but without the synths. The rhythm, and the heavy emphasis on same, immediately makes me think of Duran Duran. That's why bands that sound like this (and not all bands labelled as "indie rock" do so) I classify as "pop rock" instead since they remind me of 80s pop. Although I understand that "pop rock" could mean the complete opposite as well to some people, such as bands like Imagine Dragons that use pop techniques and instruments but with more of a rock rhythm.
Mainstream pop too. My daughter is crazy about Taylor Swift so I'm extremely familiar with her most recent album, and it could be a Madonna or Debbie Gibson record. It's not exactly 1:1 but it's pretty darn close. Also all of the trap stuff that is hot with kids right now is all deeply influenced by the synthesizer music of the 80s. Migos, Khalid, Lil Pump, etc. Kanye West has been riding that train for years.

Not necessarily new wave sounds, but the sounds of Michael Jackson and Madonna.

Last edited by NAF1138; 09-21-2018 at 02:18 PM.
  #39  
Old 09-21-2018, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Clawdio View Post
Born in '80

Early Beatles (think: I Wanna Hold Your Hand) sounds old timey.
Later Beatles and other 60's bands like the Rolling Stones, The Doors, Bob Dylan, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath are all modern. So for the most part I'd say the 60's and forward sounds modern to my ear, and before that it's old timey....
Right! See post #4.
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Old 09-21-2018, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by NAF1138 View Post
Mainstream pop too. My daughter is crazy about Taylor Swift so I'm extremely familiar with her most recent album, and it could be a Madonna or Debbie Gibson record. It's not exactly 1:1 but it's pretty darn close. Also all of the trap stuff that is hot with kids right now is all deeply influenced by the synthesizer music of the 80s. Migos, Khalid, Lil Pump, etc. Kanye West has been riding that train for years.

Not necessarily new wave sounds, but the sounds of Michael Jackson and Madonna.
When I was 12 I was part of the "Death to Disco!/Rock 'n Roll will never die!" crowd.

Wrong on both parts!

I once called Lady Gaga "evolutionary Madonna", which I still hold to be true.

Last edited by JohnT; 09-21-2018 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 09-21-2018, 03:12 PM
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There's a big new trend on YouTube of millennials reacting to music from the 60s/70s/80s. It's suddenly become a very popular thing.
I've only seen these with kids, not millennials.
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Old 09-21-2018, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Ruken View Post
I've only seen these with kids, not millennials.
There are lots of them.
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Old 09-21-2018, 03:38 PM
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I agree with Ludovic, about hearing from young’uns.

I will say that something big (obviously) happened around 1967-68. Stuff from before that — not just popular music, but in lots of cultural realms (e.g., John McWhorter wrote a book on how public speaking style changed) — is, by and large, objectively different than stuff since. So, music from before 1967-68 will tend to sound old-timey to someone of most any age, while most (not all) of stuff from the 50 years (!!) since will sound less old-timey to most (not all) ears.
I read a Slate article on this that I can't find. But here are some links anyway.

March 1965! http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/c..._and_more.html

1965! https://smile.amazon.com/dp/12500596...ag=slatmaga-20

1966! https://smile.amazon.com/1966-Decade...WYGW3BFZMWHH7P

So what happened then? This deserves a longform article.
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Old 09-21-2018, 04:27 PM
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Remember the "Generation Gap"? Like, it was suddenly discovered in the 50s and 60s that kids today were nothing like their parents. They wore different clothes, listened to different music, used different slang, took different drugs.

The parents of those kids grew up in the fucking Depression, capped off by World War II. The generation gap kids grew up in the prosperity of the 50s and 60s. There was a generation gap because the world had changed radically in the 20 years between 1938 and 1958.

But there has been no such cultural, economic, and political revolution in the 20 years between 1998 and 2018. Yeah, the internet, blah blah blah. Things have changed. But they haven't changed like the radical changes of the past.

The 50s are when pop culture started to be invented. Before then there wasn't a differentiation between "music the kids listen to" and "music grown ups listen to". There was just music, it wasn't age stratified. Along came the 50s and 60s and there are all these new kinds of music that the kids listen to but the adults don't. The generation gap. Except all that ended because all the people who used to listen to "music for old people" died. I remember back in 1983, when this ended. James Watt thought he could score points by complaining about The Beach Boys and rock and roll. And everyone rolled their eyes. Rock music was no longer "music for kids" but just music.

I guess you'll still see some Republicans railing against Hip-Hop, but that's not because it's music for kids, but because it's music for Negroes. The musical generation gap has been over for so long that people don't even remember what it was about, other than a vague sense that kids don't like old music.
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Old 09-21-2018, 09:34 PM
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I always tell my (college) students "Man, what a great time to be alive." And having a depth of music to choose from is a big part of it for me.

My dad and I would've never listened to the same music... or even called it music. I put one of "those kid stations" on in the car, once, and he barked "What is this crap? You canNOT call this music! Do you really LIKE this? Do you honestly think it's MUSIC?!?"*

It was a song by ... America.
Folksy Lite Rock at its most harmless.

Fast forward a generation and my Late Millenial kid's filling up his phone with some new music and he says "Just realized, all of my favorite bands are missing people." "Whadya mean?" "Half of the best bands are dead. The Who? Half dead. Beatles? Same. Zeppelin, Cream, Dead, AC/DC, Ramones, none of 'em are all there."

I'd love to say somebody raised that kid right. But he's raised himself, and just knows good music. With ZERO generation gap.



*Keep in mind, this was Southeastern Wisconsin in the 70s, so if you heard that growled by Red Foreman you're spot on.
  #47  
Old 09-21-2018, 09:54 PM
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As a Gen X-er, beyond the early 60s I can't listen to any tune with singing without keeping how old it is at least a little in the back of my head. Instrumental classical and jazz is another story, because aside from production values and obscure techniques that weren't invented until a certain decade and which I wouldn't be able to identify anyway, it can sometimes be hard to tell when a piece was written.

To me the freshest-sounding stuff from the 50s is chicago blues and to a lesser extent jump blues because I wasn't exposed to them growing up so I don't automatically place them in a time period, and the former is a direct progenitor of rock music, bypassing rock and roll to give rock a direct infusion of great blues-based guitar.
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Old 09-22-2018, 06:32 AM
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I think that circa-1966 threshold still in the minds of even young people today (even if some of them can’t pinpoint the date explicitly) is reinforced a little by how, coincidentally, that’s right when television switched from mostly-black-and-white to mostly-color. So, when we hear music from since that time, we associate it with real-live color — be it 1970 or 2010. Even if we’ve never seen a video clip of that particular song, we’ve seen enough of them from both sides of the black-and-white/color divide to subliminally associate musical styles with one or the other.
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Old 09-22-2018, 12:55 PM
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My son is 21, And he and all his friends listen to music from the 60's to the 1990's, with only a smattering of new songs in the mix.

I believe it's because new music sucks. And I know every older person has been saying that for a hundred years, but now it's true. Pop music is now completely dominated by formula music sung by engineered artists of marginal talent, with the songs being written by a handful of professional songwriters you've probably never heard of. The music is intentionally designed to sound similar, it's compressed as hell to raise the average volume at the expense of nuance, and it's totally devoid of anything approaching artistry or individuality. There are exceptions, but they are few and far between.

No wonder young people are discovering music from a time when individual artistry was still a thing.

Last edited by Sam Stone; 09-22-2018 at 12:55 PM.
  #50  
Old 09-23-2018, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by pulykamell View Post
Yeah, I definitely get the sense that post-Gen X, into the Millennial generation, and now beyond, music became more "democratic" and less cliquish than it was when I was growing up in the 80s and in high school in the very early 90s. Certainly, IME, by the late 90s, early 00s, the answer to "what kind of music do you listen to" became less X and Y genres and more "I listen to all kinds of music" (and first with the caveat "except country and rap" to now even without that caveat.)
Yeah. Kids today (and really the past decade or two) are far more open minded about music than previous generations. More so than mine for sure. Not only about different generations fo music, about different genres too. I applaud them for that.

Millennials and post millennial are pretty cool as far as I'm concerned. Definitely no worse than my generation and quite possibly better.
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