Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-17-2018, 03:52 PM
nightshadea nightshadea is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: a condo in hell 10th lvl
Posts: 3,854
bill maher manages to piss off millions yet again with stan lee coments

bill maher does it again this time its everyone who still reads comic books

https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebri...oks/ar-BBPOdwn

you know he was cool in politically correct and after

but I think hes getting old and cranky but for someone who allegedly has every playboy issue in a bound book and tried to get hefner sainthood

this screams get off my lawn and get a real job type of comments

Last edited by nightshadea; 11-17-2018 at 03:53 PM.
  #2  
Old 11-17-2018, 04:06 PM
k9bfriender k9bfriender is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,490
Yeah, I suppose he doesn't want anyone to give a shit when he dies either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by my parody of his words
"But then twenty years or so ago, something happened – adults decided they didn’t have to give up kid stuff," he said. "And so they pretended comedians were actually news pundits."

...

"I don’t think it’s a huge stretch to suggest that Donald Trump could only get elected in a country that thinks comedians are important," he wrote.
My changes in bold.
  #3  
Old 11-17-2018, 04:53 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo Snowboarder Bo is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 24,234
My fav reply:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack
I don't know and don't particularly care who Bill Maher is. I just know that anyone who pisses on people for mourning a man who helped make them happy is a titanic waste of space.
I generally like Bill Maher, but this was just dumb as rocks.
  #4  
Old 11-17-2018, 05:08 PM
jayjay jayjay is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Central Pennsylvania
Posts: 36,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
My fav reply:I generally like Bill Maher, but this was just dumb as rocks.
See, I'm just the opposite. I occasionally agree with him on some things, but generally consider him a smarmy libertoonian asshole.
  #5  
Old 11-17-2018, 05:31 PM
Fiddle Peghead's Avatar
Fiddle Peghead Fiddle Peghead is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Harlem, New York, NY
Posts: 3,524
He says he has nothing against comic books, he just doesn't think they equate to "sophisticated literature", which he says adults have labeled them in the past twenty years. I have no idea if adults have indeed done this, but assuming he is correct, what is wrong with this opinion?

To suggest that comic books aren't important, however, is a bit unnecessary. Things don't have to be sophisticated to be very important to people. Golf comes to mind. But there's nothing wrong with that.
  #6  
Old 11-17-2018, 05:37 PM
bobot's Avatar
bobot bobot is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Chicago-ish
Posts: 6,781
I will assume nothing, for he is not correct.
Maher: "But then twenty years or so ago, something happened – adults decided they didn’t have to give up kid stuff," he said. "And so they pretended comic books were actually sophisticated literature."

No, no one really did that.
  #7  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:08 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,922
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayjay View Post
See, I'm just the opposite. I occasionally agree with him on some things, but generally consider him a smarmy libertoonian asshole.
I liked him on Politically Incorrect, but I think he has degraded into a crazy old loser.

Embarassing, really.
  #8  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:09 PM
Loach's Avatar
Loach Loach is offline
The Central Scrutinizer
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Pork Roll/Taylor Ham
Posts: 24,555
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobot View Post
I will assume nothing, for he is not correct.
Maher: "But then twenty years or so ago, something happened – adults decided they didn’t have to give up kid stuff," he said. "And so they pretended comic books were actually sophisticated literature."

No, no one really did that.
And there is also sophisticated literature with illustrations that are not comic books. Stan Lee wasn't directly responsible for that but he is one very important link in the chain.

Bill is also ignoring one important point. People simply liked Stan Lee as a human and are sad to see him go. Like a beloved uncle.
  #9  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:12 PM
Loach's Avatar
Loach Loach is offline
The Central Scrutinizer
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Pork Roll/Taylor Ham
Posts: 24,555
I don't quite understand his Trump point. Using absolutely no scientific studies or hard data I would assume that most adult comic book nerds would be anti-Trump.
  #10  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:13 PM
k9bfriender k9bfriender is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loach View Post
People simply liked Stan Lee as a human and are sad to see him go. Like a beloved uncle.
I'm assuming that he has in his contract that he gets cameos in every MCU movie for as long as the franchise exists. Extra footage, CGI, animatronics, cloning, whatever it takes.
  #11  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:25 PM
Loach's Avatar
Loach Loach is offline
The Central Scrutinizer
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Pork Roll/Taylor Ham
Posts: 24,555
Quote:
Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post
I'm assuming that he has in his contract that he gets cameos in every MCU movie for as long as the franchise exists. Extra footage, CGI, animatronics, cloning, whatever it takes.
Or boil his bones and carry them on to every set like Edward Longshanks wanted.
  #12  
Old 11-17-2018, 06:38 PM
Left Hand of Dorkness's Avatar
Left Hand of Dorkness Left Hand of Dorkness is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: at the right hand of cool
Posts: 39,652
I've read Cormac McCarthy, and Alexander Dumas, and Barbara Kingsolver.

But only the climactic scene in the Sandman graphic novel series made me tear up.

Maher, once again, spouts bullshit in a case he doesn't know anything about, and then prances around in the attention he gets like a 4chan reject.

Good for you, Bill.
  #13  
Old 11-17-2018, 07:24 PM
Muffin Muffin is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Great White North
Posts: 20,374
Coming from someone who has no interest in comic books and little interest in the movies that they spawned, I gotta say that it Maher was a dick by saying what he did when he did about Lee and the people who enjoyed Lee's work. May Stripperella piss on Maher.

Last edited by Muffin; 11-17-2018 at 07:26 PM.
  #14  
Old 11-17-2018, 07:30 PM
Blank Slate's Avatar
Blank Slate Blank Slate is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,911
I mean, so what if adults want to play video games, read comic books and watch South Park. Who are we to judge? snicker
  #15  
Old 11-17-2018, 07:54 PM
Asuka Asuka is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 891
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loach View Post
I don't quite understand his Trump point. Using absolutely no scientific studies or hard data I would assume that most adult comic book nerds would be anti-Trump.
Much like the straight dope message board, throwing in a random tenuous link to Donald Trump is how you get people to take your point seriously.
  #16  
Old 11-17-2018, 08:06 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller Miller is online now
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 43,331
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddle Peghead View Post
He says he has nothing against comic books, he just doesn't think they equate to "sophisticated literature", which he says adults have labeled them in the past twenty years. I have no idea if adults have indeed done this, but assuming he is correct, what is wrong with this opinion?
A comic book won a Pulitzer once.. So, yeah, some people definitely view some comic books as “sophisticated literature,” and with solid justification. Knobs like Maher think saying “comics can be serious literature” is the same as saying “Spider-Man is as good as The Brothers Karamazov,” but that’s an entirely different argument.
  #17  
Old 11-17-2018, 08:08 PM
Acsenray Acsenray is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 34,107
There’s no reason for anyone to be pissed off by an uninformed opinion like this from someone like Maher. It doesn’t matter to anyone what he thinks about comic books.
  #18  
Old 11-17-2018, 08:29 PM
dorvann dorvann is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 403
I wonder how much “sophisticated literature" Bill Maher has actually read. He has always struck me as a pretentious snob who thinks he's smarter than he actually is.
  #19  
Old 11-17-2018, 08:31 PM
iiandyiiii's Avatar
iiandyiiii iiandyiiii is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 31,593
I like Bill Maher's show, but god he's an idiotic snowflake sometimes. No one gets upset about silly things more than him -- and it's usually him claiming to be upset that others are getting upset about something he thinks is silly!
  #20  
Old 11-17-2018, 08:32 PM
salinqmind salinqmind is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Liverpool NY USA
Posts: 9,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorvann View Post
I wonder how much “sophisticated literature" Bill Maher has actually read. He has always struck me as a pretentious snob who thinks he's smarter than he actually is.
He's not unlike the similar, super-inflated, my-shit-don't-stink-like-the-common-rabble's, noisome Joe Queenan. That 'Red Lobster, White Trash, Blue Lagoon' book making fun of the ignorant peons, who most likely in sheer numbers elected tRump.

Last edited by salinqmind; 11-17-2018 at 08:36 PM.
  #21  
Old 11-17-2018, 09:02 PM
RickJay RickJay is offline
Charter Jays Fan
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Oakville, Canada
Posts: 40,235
I mean, I'm not a comic book fan and I still think his comments were imbecilic.
__________________
Providing useless posts since 1999!
  #22  
Old 11-17-2018, 09:23 PM
E-DUB's Avatar
E-DUB E-DUB is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,255
Even ignoring Lee's impact on current pop culture, he's been a driving force in the comic field for decades. If you're of a certain age, (as many of us here are) this is like having Captain Kangaroo, Mister rogers and Jim Henson all die at once.

Last edited by E-DUB; 11-17-2018 at 09:24 PM. Reason: darned backwards parenthesis
  #23  
Old 11-17-2018, 09:24 PM
Ambivalid's Avatar
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: In my head
Posts: 13,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
A comic book won a Pulitzer once.. So, yeah, some people definitely view some comic books as “sophisticated literature,” and with solid justification. Knobs like Maher think saying “comics can be serious literature” is the same as saying “Spider-Man is as good as The Brothers Karamazov,” but that’s an entirely different argument.
Not that I am defending Maher whatsoever, but Dr. Seuss also won a Pulitzer. Unless good children's books qualify as "sophisticated literature" (which they very well may), I'd say that the awarding of a Pulitzer, on it's own, isn't necessarily proof of sophisticated literature.

Now while the Pulitzer was awarded to Seuss for his entire body of work as a contribution to children's entertainment and education (rather than a specific book) I still think it qualifies as an instance of a Pulitzer prize being awarded for literature that doesn't quite rise to the description of "sophisticated".

ETA: Looking at your link, the book that earned the Pulitzer was a "graphic novel", which is specifically distinct from "comic books". So it may be bordering on slightly pendantic but no comic book has ever won a Pulitzer.

ETA II: But Maher is still an asshole.

Last edited by Ambivalid; 11-17-2018 at 09:27 PM.
  #24  
Old 11-17-2018, 09:34 PM
elbows elbows is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 13,889
Hmmm, I always thought all literature Pulitzer’s were for a body of work, not a specific book.
  #25  
Old 11-17-2018, 09:42 PM
Blank Slate's Avatar
Blank Slate Blank Slate is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,911
Quote:
Originally Posted by elbows View Post
Hmmm, I always thought all literature Pulitzer’s were for a body of work, not a specific book.
That's the Nobel prize for literature.
  #26  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:14 AM
Dale Sams Dale Sams is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,052
And then he connects comic-books to Trump.

Yeah, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that I'll bet 80% of adult comic-book readers didn't vote for Trump.
  #27  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:19 AM
thelurkinghorror thelurkinghorror is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Venial Sin City
Posts: 13,353
Maher is a trollish POS. This isn't new news. Ostensibly on "the left," but manages to piss off everyone. Piers Morgan is the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by E-DUB View Post
Even ignoring Lee's impact on current pop culture, he's been a driving force in the comic field for decades. If you're of a certain age, (as many of us here are) this is like having Captain Kangaroo, Mister rogers and Jim Henson all die at once.
Damn kids and their Elvis and Perry Como.
  #28  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:32 AM
Ambivalid's Avatar
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: In my head
Posts: 13,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by thelurkinghorror View Post
Maher is a trollish POS. This isn't new news. Ostensibly on "the left," but manages to piss off everyone. Piers Morgan is the same.

Damn kids and their Elvis and Perry Como.
I'm sorry but i won't go that far and put him on the same level as Piers Morgan. At least Maher is capable of delivering humor at times. Piers Morgan is just awful in every way.
  #29  
Old 11-18-2018, 01:45 AM
thelurkinghorror thelurkinghorror is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Venial Sin City
Posts: 13,353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
I'm sorry but i won't go that far and put him on the same level as Piers Morgan. At least Maher is capable of delivering humor at times. Piers Morgan is just awful in every way.
I guess there's some "I used to like Bill" in this thread. That's fair, I've never met anyone who actually liked Piers. We could deport him but every British person who has mentioned him has thanked us for taking him so it will be hard.

Despite Jeremy Clarkson's faults, I don't know anyone who disagrees with him socking Morgan.
  #30  
Old 11-18-2018, 10:25 AM
ftg's Avatar
ftg ftg is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Not the PNW :-(
Posts: 18,099
My thoughts on the topic which agree and disagree with Maher:

1. Comic books and their readership make up a really quite small percentage of the population. If no one every made a movie or TV show based on them you'd barely know about them.

I was a Silver Age DC fan. I grew up. Now that I have time and money I could read any comic I wanted. No interest. This is what usually happens. "Usually" means ... "usually". That's all. Extrapolating to "should"/"normal"/etc. is maybe not such a good idea.

2. Comic book-based movies and TV shows on the other hand ... . Wow, just wow. A big part of the culture. A lot of people see them. Etc.

But they are part of a larger group of such material a lot of which don't come from comic books.

There's a ton and then some of mindless action movies out there. Due to the growing influence of the overseas markets the more mindless the better.

The last comic book-based movie that I thought was really well done was Batman Returns. I've seen fewer and fewer of them since the ones I've seen have been generally poor to really rotten. The Dark Knight was superbly idiotic and poorly produced. Gave up on that series, X-Men, Spiderman, etc.

I am not the least bit happy about the dumbing down of the culture with these being leading examples.

3. Bread and Circuses. If you're a Roman Emporer and want to distract the masses from all the problems you've caused: bread and circuses.

So, most of us have bread. The issue is circuses. Entertainment. Low level, action oriented, nothing highbrow like theater allowed.

And this is what we are getting at the movies. Good indie films rarely have a significant theatrical release now. You can watch them on Netflix, etc., but not very many people do. The masses just won't even hear of them let alone watch them.

So you get the increasing complaints that the Oscars don't go to movies that people have seen. The OTA networks hardly get a prime time Emmy any more.

Mass entertainment is dominated by crap. There's good stuff out there, but most people don't see it.

4. The worst of the worst: So-called reality shows. Heavily stage and scripted shows that bring out the worst in people. Shouting, tears, etc. I have no idea why people watch this crap.

5. Put it all together and you get Trump. A reality show star who understands bread and circuses and the dumbing down of people who gets elected President and ruins everything.

How can you not get pissed??????

Yeah, he phrased it poorly. (Stan Lee hardly had anything to do with the consequences of the above.) Even worse he timed it poorly. But there is a point there.
  #31  
Old 11-18-2018, 10:43 AM
Miller's Avatar
Miller Miller is online now
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 43,331
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post

ETA: Looking at your link, the book that earned the Pulitzer was a "graphic novel", which is specifically distinct from "comic books".
It’s really not.
  #32  
Old 11-18-2018, 10:47 AM
Acsenray Acsenray is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 34,107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
Not that I am defending Maher whatsoever, but Dr. Seuss also won a Pulitzer. Unless good children's books qualify as "sophisticated literature" (which they very well may), I'd say that the awarding of a Pulitzer, on it's own, isn't necessarily proof of sophisticated literature.

Now while the Pulitzer was awarded to Seuss for his entire body of work as a contribution to children's entertainment and education (rather than a specific book) I still think it qualifies as an instance of a Pulitzer prize being awarded for literature that doesn't quite rise to the description of "sophisticated".

ETA: Looking at your link, the book that earned the Pulitzer was a "graphic novel", which is specifically distinct from "comic books". So it may be bordering on slightly pendantic but no comic book has ever won a Pulitzer.

ETA II: But Maher is still an asshole.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
It’s really not.
Miller’s right. They’re exactly the same thing.
  #33  
Old 11-18-2018, 11:33 AM
Slow Moving Vehicle's Avatar
Slow Moving Vehicle Slow Moving Vehicle is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 3,304
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobot View Post
I will assume nothing, for he is not correct.
Maher: "But then twenty years or so ago, something happened – adults decided they didn’t have to give up kid stuff," he said. "And so they pretended comic books were actually sophisticated literature."

No, no one really did that.
Twenty, or thirty, or however many years ago, people started writing comic books that were sophisticated literature.
  #34  
Old 11-18-2018, 11:56 AM
drad dog's Avatar
drad dog drad dog is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 5,764
Whenever I see someone say something in public, and it's a little outrageous, but not the end of the world, and people can get nice and frothy and post about it, I have to conclude that it is actually famous people and/or their agents who are contriving to appear on news aggregators the next day. It's clickbait and it's the cost of doing business for these people.
  #35  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:00 PM
JRDelirious JRDelirious is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Displaced
Posts: 15,517
I believe this quote is appropriate...

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
  #36  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:05 PM
Czarcasm's Avatar
Czarcasm Czarcasm is online now
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 58,371
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRDelirious View Post
I believe this quote is appropriate...

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
Thank you for my new signature.
__________________
"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
  #37  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:05 PM
asahi's Avatar
asahi asahi is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 7,445
Bill Maher is just as much of a shock jock asshole "comedian" as Gavin McInnes. I happen to find most of Maher's ideas agreeable and McInnes' repulsive, but they're quite similar in terms of tone.

I confess sometimes watch Real Time for the reason that he frequently has interesting guests, although he doesn't necessarily get the mileage out of those guests that he should. He frequently wants to be the smartest guy in the room and too often cuts people off before they finish their thoughts.
  #38  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:08 PM
Ambivalid's Avatar
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: In my head
Posts: 13,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acsenray View Post
Miller’s right. They’re exactly the same thing.
Keep in mind i prefaced that comment with an acknowledgement that my point was leaning in the direction of the pendantic. That being said, graphic novels are simply not "exactly the same" as comic books.

Quote:
Although the word "novel" normally refers to long fictional works, the term "graphic novel" is applied broadly and includes fiction, non-fiction, and anthologized work. It is distinguished from the term "comic book", which is generally used for comics periodicals.
But this is not a hill worth dying on so I will say no more.
  #39  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:20 PM
Fiddle Peghead's Avatar
Fiddle Peghead Fiddle Peghead is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Harlem, New York, NY
Posts: 3,524
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobot View Post
I will assume nothing, for he is not correct.
Maher: "But then twenty years or so ago, something happened – adults decided they didn’t have to give up kid stuff," he said. "And so they pretended comic books were actually sophisticated literature."

No, no one really did that.
A quick perusal online shows that clearly some did.
  #40  
Old 11-18-2018, 12:50 PM
Penfeather's Avatar
Penfeather Penfeather is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,043
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRDelirious View Post
I believe this quote is appropriate...

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
Or, as the Fourth Doctor put it, "There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes".
  #41  
Old 11-18-2018, 01:16 PM
drad dog's Avatar
drad dog drad dog is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 5,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by asahi View Post
Bill Maher is just as much of a shock jock asshole "comedian" as Gavin McInnes. I happen to find most of Maher's ideas agreeable and McInnes' repulsive, but they're quite similar in terms of tone.

I confess sometimes watch Real Time for the reason that he frequently has interesting guests, although he doesn't necessarily get the mileage out of those guests that he should. He frequently wants to be the smartest guy in the room and too often cuts people off before they finish their thoughts.
Fascism isn't "political commentary" to me. It's in another sphere.

Is this an "Everyone does it" thing?
  #42  
Old 11-18-2018, 01:37 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller Miller is online now
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 43,331
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambivalid View Post
Keep in mind i prefaced that comment with an acknowledgement that my point was leaning in the direction of the pendantic. That being said, graphic novels are simply not "exactly the same" as comic books.
One of the first books to be marketed as a “graphic novel” was the trade paperback collection of the twelve issues of Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons’ Watchmen. It’s a marketing term that means “serious comic book.” Maus itself was first serialized in the magazine Raw.

There is, in fairness, a distinction, in that a single issue, one-shot comic would not be called a graphic novel. But it’s not a distinction that’s relevant to the question of comic books as serious art, or one that warrants considering Maus as something other than a comic book. All graphic novels are comic books, even if not all comic books are graphic novels.
  #43  
Old 11-18-2018, 01:44 PM
asahi's Avatar
asahi asahi is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 7,445
Quote:
Originally Posted by drad dog View Post
Fascism isn't "political commentary" to me. It's in another sphere.

Is this an "Everyone does it" thing?
I'm not sure what part of the post you're referring to - elaborate, please.

I'm not aware of Maher espousing fascism
  #44  
Old 11-18-2018, 02:04 PM
John Mace's Avatar
John Mace John Mace is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: South Bay
Posts: 85,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by iiandyiiii View Post
I like Bill Maher's show, but god he's an idiotic snowflake sometimes. No one gets upset about silly things more than him -- and it's usually him claiming to be upset that others are getting upset about something he thinks is silly!
I'm with you there. He can be fantastic at times, and he can be a real ass, too. As he gets older, he gets a lot more cranky and less likable. Don't get me wrong-- I like the guy. But he gets a bit less likable each year. I assume that his comment about "twenty years ago..." is referring to the rise of Graphic Novels. I can't say I'm familiar with the genre at all, but on the surface they seem like glorified comic books.

BTW, he and I are almost exactly the same age.

Last edited by John Mace; 11-18-2018 at 02:06 PM.
  #45  
Old 11-18-2018, 02:08 PM
Ellis Dee Ellis Dee is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New England
Posts: 13,728
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRDelirious View Post
"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis
It's a good quote, but referencing it has always struck me as a defense of enjoying childish things. A hypothetical person described by the quote wouldn't need to defend themselves about enjoying childish things because they simply wouldn't care about such a criticism. They would likely respond more along the lines of "Isn't it awesome?"

(I remember a Far Side comic or something similar where a grown-up has filled their apartment with balls like in a ball pit, and when called out about it being childish, they respond "Isn't it awesome?" I couldn't find it with google, but I did find a related article about Simon Pegg.)

As far as Bill Maher's point, agreed that it was poorly worded and poorly times. Simon Pegg said something similar back in 2015, and reading his words now I can sort of see how a dumbing down of society in general could lead to the Trump era.

Not to say I completely agree with Maher (and Pegg), but I understand the point they're trying to make.
  #46  
Old 11-18-2018, 02:16 PM
Ambivalid's Avatar
Ambivalid Ambivalid is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: In my head
Posts: 13,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
One of the first books to be marketed as a “graphic novel” was the trade paperback collection of the twelve issues of Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons’ Watchmen. It’s a marketing term that means “serious comic book.” Maus itself was first serialized in the magazine Raw.

There is, in fairness, a distinction, in that a single issue, one-shot comic would not be called a graphic novel. But it’s not a distinction that’s relevant to the question of comic books as serious art, or one that warrants considering Maus as something other than a comic book. All graphic novels are comic books, even if not all comic books are graphic novels.
Fair enough. I cede to your greater knowledge of the subject matter.
  #47  
Old 11-18-2018, 03:13 PM
JRDelirious JRDelirious is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Displaced
Posts: 15,517
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Dee View Post



(I remember a Far Side comic or something similar where a grown-up has filled their apartment with balls like in a ball pit, and when called out about it being childish, they respond "Isn't it awesome?" I couldn't find it with google, but I did find a related article about Simon Pegg.)

.

XKCD: https://xkcd.com/150/
  #48  
Old 11-18-2018, 07:47 PM
dorvann dorvann is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 403
I think Maher's attempt to link Stan Lee and the comic book industry with the rise of Donald Trump to be very tenuous. One of the biggest backers of Trump have been the Christian conservative movement and they have never been fans of the comic book industry. In fact, I've heard at some conservatives claim that the entire idea of "superheroes" is blasphemous. So at least in that regard I think Maher is entirely full of crap.
  #49  
Old 11-18-2018, 08:31 PM
Kamino Neko's Avatar
Kamino Neko Kamino Neko is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Alternate 230
Posts: 15,060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
It’s a marketing term that means “serious comic book.”
More accurately...it's a fan and marketing term that sometimes means 'serious comic book'.

It's also a fan and marketing term that sometimes means 'a long form (serialized or otherwise) comic book with a distinct beginning, middle, and end'. And a fan and marketing term that sometimes means 'a comic book presented in a single volume significantly longer than a standard monthly* issue (even if it's not a single coherent work, or was originally serialized in SMIs)'. And a fan and marketing term that sometimes means 'a comic book that I (and/or you, to whom I am trying to sell it) am far too grown up to call a comic book'.

* Or weekly, twice monthly, bimonthly or quarterly.

Of course, no matter which definition is being used, titles like Maus, Watchmen, or A Contract with God (probably the first title to use the term Graphic Novel in its marketing, though not the first one called such) will almost always be called graphic novels, because they meet every one of them. They are serious, long form stories with distinct beginnings, middles, and ends, that anyone who's talking about them would want to avoid the juvenile connotations some people (such as Maher) attach to the term 'comic book', and, while Maus and Watchmen were initially serialized, the collected editions were basically inevitable, even back when they were new (due to being serious, long form stories with distinct beginnings, middles, and ends).
  #50  
Old 11-18-2018, 09:57 PM
Darren Garrison's Avatar
Darren Garrison Darren Garrison is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 8,836
Here is an article (on the "graphic novel" issue) that is coincidentally from two years ago yesterday. (I should have searched sooner!)
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:29 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017