Straight Dope Message Board

[Ann Hedonia]

I have to do this . I’ve really had it with the gaslighting in the thread in the Elections forum.

And I’d still like to have the same basic kind of civil discussion we are have over there, but I’d like to rant some. And I’d like to be able to call out the people that saying shit like “ It ridiculous to think Trumps fixation with Hunter Biden had anything to do with his father candidacy. It would have happened whoever Hunters father was”.

And we all know Hurricane Ditka is scared to come here. Let’s leave him over there to chat with Jim Peebles. And, as an aside, Ditka should change is name to Pussy Comitatus. 1

[Kolak of Twilo]

HD will show. But who really cares. I'm more likely to go off on any numbnuts who engages with his useless ass.

I posted these links in the other thread.

Nunes is here

Schiff is here

Closing statements to the hearings today. Schiff addresses the facts and evidence, recounting testimony given today.

Nunes bellyaches about how mistreated poor Donald has been for the last 3 three years by all the Democratic witches. And doesn't address any of the evidence that supports the case against the POTUS offered up by their own witnesses. Dumb ass. 2

[Ann Hedonia]

Oh, I’d LOVE it if HD showed, but he won’t play by the Pit rules. I’m pretty sure he has me blocked because I think I’m the only on to make him lose his temper in GD. He threw the “f” word at me and everything. He didn’t get a warning - I poked him good, but didn’t break any rules

But then he “self-suspended” for something like 7 weeks. I’m proud of that one.

As Euphonious Polemic mentioned in the other thread, Sondland’s testimony tomorrow will be interesting. Will he tell the truth or will he double down? Now I’m hearing speculation that he may plead the 5th.

Roger Stone’s verdict happened at an opportune time. If Sondland keeps up the lies he has freaking brass balls,

And I also wonder what tack the Republicans will take with their questions. Will they lob him softballs that let him wax poetic about what an honor it is to serve Trump? Will they try to get him to say that Trump didn’t do it? If Sondland goes the truthful route and confesses to his lies (Like who REALLY believes Trump told him to “go out there and tell the truth”), and Gym tries to make him recant his recanting.

And to think, the guy payed a million buck for this,

ETA Excuse my little typos, I can’t find my glasses 3

[smiling bandit]

I stay away from Elections. The Pit is so much more civil. However, I now wish that I had thought of the name Pussy Comitatus first.

I've grown disgusted with the majority of our political leadership in general, but I can in no way criticize any of the men or women leading the proceeding. I have no way to even conceive of how morally bankrupt you have to be in order to defend Trump at this point, given that the White House seems to have... proudly admitted everything. And is now engaged in a wild flailing motion which makes them looks absurdly guilty.

I am, frankly, confused, fascinated, and horrified. It's like watching a train conductor who is steaming full speed ahead towards a mountain. And the conductor is, I dunno, tearing off his speed regulators and saying it's the worst thing ever. 4

[Walken After Midnight]

RawStory: Even the Republican witnesses make Donald Trump look like a depraved criminal

The second half of Tuesday’s hearing offered something new in the Donald Trump impeachment inquiry: Witnesses called by the Republican minority on the House Intelligence Committee. It’s understandable why Republicans would want these two men.
...
But even though these two were Republican witnesses, they still made the case for impeachment stronger. Morrison even confirmed the central allegation against Trump — that the president was conditioning military aid on a public statement from Zelensky about “investigations” into Democrats.

5

[Kolak of Twilo]

Originally Posted by Kolak of Twilo

Nunes is here

Schiff is here

Seriously, check out the closing statements at both links. The contrast between bullshit and a clear prosecutor's closing statement couldn't be more clear. 6

[TruCelt]

I'm having to limit myself to three hours per day of these hearings. Otherwise blood will start spurting from my eyes and ears. Listening to these GOP nincompoops try to twist the words and deeds of decent, loyal Americans just boils me. 7

[Bumbershoot]

Originally Posted by TruCelt

I'm having to limit myself to three hours per day of these hearings. Otherwise blood will start spurting from my eyes and ears. Listening to these GOP nincompoops try to twist the words and deeds of decent, loyal Americans just boils me.

Especially egregious to me was when they questioned why Vindman was wearing his military uniform.

However, it has renewed my respect for those who make a career of (non-elected) civil service. I've been impressed by the competence, intelligence and dedication of the witnesses. 8

[Bumbershoot]

Here is a very good op-ed piece from the New York Times, mostly about Vindman and Jennifer Williams (I hope it's not paywalled; I was able to read the whole thing). 9

[QuickSilver]

Originally Posted by Kolak of Twilo

HD will show. But who really cares. I'm more likely to go off on any numbnuts who engages with his useless ass.

I posted these links in the other thread.

Nunes is here

Schiff is here

Closing statements to the hearings today. Schiff addresses the facts and evidence, recounting testimony given today.

Nunes bellyaches about how mistreated poor Donald has been for the last 3 three years by all the Democratic witches. And doesn't address any of the evidence that supports the case against the POTUS offered up by their own witnesses. Dumb ass.

I'm disappointed that there is to date no mooooing in these hearing. My $1000 campaign donation offer stands to any democrat who calls out every point Nunes tries to make, "Moooooooot".

Another $1000 if they can make Nunes cry or storm off. 10

[septimus]

Obviously, neither Nunes nor anyone smart enough to be a Congressperson can possibly swallow the horseshit that Nunes is dishing out. I suppose it's targeted at Shodan and Ditka and their ilk, but are even they stupid enough to lap up such shit? Or, like underpaid whores, do they just feel obligated to swallow when their master wants to cum in their mouths?

Originally Posted by smiling bandit

I stay away from Elections. The Pit is so much more civil....

I've grown disgusted with the majority of our political leadership in general, but I can in no way criticize any of the men or women leading the proceeding. I have no way to even conceive of how morally bankrupt you have to be in order to defend Trump at this point....

Do I misremember, or did you use to be a right-wing idiot yourself? If so, welcome back to the Land of the Sane! 11

[Calavera]

I don't have anything substantive to add, but I'm curious why PEACH is capltalised. A ssume there's some joke or reference I'm not getting. 12

[iiandyiiii]

Originally Posted by Calavera

I don't have anything substantive to add, but I'm curious why PEACH is capltalised. A ssume there's some joke or reference I'm not getting.

"Peach pit" pun, I'm pretty sure. 13

[Calavera]

Originally Posted by iiandyiiii

"Peach pit" pun, I'm pretty sure.

cheers 14

[Ann Hedonia]

Originally Posted by iiandyiiii

"Peach pit" pun, I'm pretty sure.

Peach pit pun. Inspired by Beckdawreck’s pies. I probably should’ve capitalized PIT as well. 15

[El_Kabong]

Originally Posted by septimus

Obviously, neither Nunes nor anyone smart enough to be a Congressperson can possibly swallow the horseshit that Nunes is dishing out. I suppose it's targeted at Shodan and Ditka and their ilk, but are even they stupid enough to lap up such shit? Or, like underpaid whores, do they just feel obligated to swallow when their master wants to cum in their mouths?

Something I've seen again and again with these mooks is that any old response in opposition is OK, no matter how implausible, ridiculous or irrelevant. The mere action of coming up with some sort of response is somehow deemed to be "winning". 16

[Ann Hedonia]

It looks like Sondland’s opening statement just dropped. Seems like he went the “full honesty” route in order to avoid being the next Roger Stone.

Can’t find it online yet, but it’s going to be an interesting day. The folks at MSNBC can barely contain themselves. 17

[QuickSilver]

I bet the Naval Hospital Cardiac unit is all hands on deck and the helicopter is warmed up on the WH lawn. 18

[Gatopescado]

Originally Posted by smiling bandit

I am, frankly, confused, fascinated, and horrified.

This kind of sums it up for me, but with disgusted ala mode.

And the coverage pre-empts Wayne Fuckin' Brady! 19

[El_Kabong]

Nunes, in his opening remarks today, just actually said that if the Democrats had been around in the 1790s they would have impeached George Washington. There aren't enough . 20

[madmonk28]

I have to say, using the pit as a HD free zone is brilliant. It's an elegant workaround to the feckless moderation of him.

I was talking about the hearings with a colleague today. Everyday there is are astounding revelations on the depravity of this administration and the transparent disregard the GOP has for democracy and the rule of law. Yesterday, the GOP did their best to besmirch the reputation of a uniformed officer. What's truly astounding is how blasé we all are to it, his base won't abandon him no matter what he does and the decent people are just numb to it all. 21

[Ann Hedonia]

Sondland just spoke about being the son of an immigrant. Want to bet that the next talking point, based on Sondland and Vindman, is that immigrants are conspiring against Trump. And, that they aren’t REAL Americans 22

[Red Wiggler]

Also, fuck Shodan. 23

[steronz]

This Sondland opening statement is really something, isn't it? Confirms the overheard phone call, confirms the quid pro quo, confirms that it was for security assistance, confirms that all of this was bad. The only line he hasn't been willing to cross is anything that makes him look bad -- he wants to make clear that he wasn't part of the "irregular" channel except as much as the president asked him to, that he kept State informed at all times. But this all feels very different from his previous testimony. 24

[madmonk28]

What's amazing on Sondland's statement is that it confirms ever damning fact, but in a "gee whiz guys" tone. "Well yeah Charlie asked me and the gang to pop over to the Tate mansion and kill them all, I'm pretty sure I told you guys all that stuff..." 25

[Railer13]

Originally Posted by Ann Hedonia

It looks like Sondland’s opening statement just dropped. Seems like he went the “full honesty” route in order to avoid being the next Roger Stone.

Can’t find it online yet, but it’s going to be an interesting day. The folks at MSNBC can barely contain themselves.

Here is one place where the opening statement can be found. I haven't read it all, but I did find this juicy tidbit:

Fourth, as I testified previously, Mr. Giuliani’s requests were a quid pro quo for arranging a White House visit for President Zelensky. Mr. Giuliani demanded that Ukraine make a public statement announcing investigations of the 2016 election/DNC server and Burisma. Mr. Giuliani was expressing the desires of the President of the United States, and we knew that these investigations were important to the President.

So now that a witness has called it a 'quid pro quo', can the Pubs drop that talking point? 26

[madmonk28]

Originally Posted by Railer13

...So now that a witness has called it a 'quid pro quo', can the Pubs drop that talking point?

Have you met Republicans?

So does Trump now claim that he didn't know Sondland and that Sondland was a never Trumper? 27

[Euphonious Polemic]

Originally Posted by Railer13

So now that a witness has called it a 'quid pro quo', can the Pubs drop that talking point?

Nah. They've moved on to "Nobody said the word bribery"

And "Witch hunt! Witch hunt! Look at all the witches!" 28

[septimus]

I'm late to the party and rewound to watch Sondland's opening statement just now.

Hey Gordo! You're not on trial (yet). Quit wasting time covering your own ass. We're here for testimony against DJT; don't you even know that much? 29

[CurtC]

Originally Posted by Railer13

So now that a witness has called it a 'quid pro quo', can the Pubs drop that talking point?

They've moved on from that, and are now saying that "quid pro quo" just means that you're getting something in return, and everyone does that all the time. That started with Mulvaney's disaster of a press conference, and I've seen it a few times since. 30

[Bryan Ekers]

Ultimately, all Trump really has is "yeah, I did it, what you gonna do about it?" though he'll try to keep claiming he didn't do it for a few more days at least. 31

[madmonk28]

Originally Posted by CurtC

They've moved on from that, and are now saying that "quid pro quo" just means that you're getting something in return, and everyone does that all the time. That started with Mulvaney's disaster of a press conference, and I've seen it a few times since.

Yeah, they're employing the throw it at a wall and see what sticks approach. They also are arguing that no one has used the word bribery. They seem to think that crimes are not crimes if you don't use the magic words; it's not murder unless you say murder during the shooting. They're fortunate in that their base are so uninformed. 32

[OttoDaFe]

Well, we all know Sondland can't be trusted. Look how he's changed his testimony!

Also, we never got to the bottom of Hilary's emails. And where is the server in Ukraine???

ETA:

Originally Posted by madmonk28

Yeah, they're employing the throw it at a wall and see what sticks approach. They also are arguing that no one has used the word bribery. They seem to think that crimes are not crimes if you don't use the magic words; it's not murder unless you say murder during the shooting. They're fortunate in that their base are so uninformed.

Have they brought up gold fringes on flags yet? 33

[Euphonious Polemic]

Here on the SDMB, the only Trump defense being offered at the moment is:

"Well maybe there was a super secret FBI investigation going on about Biden in Ukraine, and it's UP TO THE DEMOCRATS to prove that this secret investigation did not exist."

Stupid? Yes.

But that's all there is so far. Otherwise? Crickets. Until Fox News tells the resident apologists what to say. They don't appear to be able to come up with the talking points by themselves. 34

[Euphonious Polemic]

Republicans turn. Let's see if they spend 45 minutes attacking Sondland's character. 35

[El_Kabong]

Nunes once again misdirecting to Hunter Biden. Yawn. 36

[Machine Elf]

Originally Posted by madmonk28

They're fortunate in that their base are so uninformed.

All your base are belong to us. 37

[Tamerlane]

Originally Posted by septimus

Do I misremember, or did you use to be a right-wing idiot yourself? If so, welcome back to the Land of the Sane!

I see your charm school education didn't take very well. 38

[Aspenglow]

Originally Posted by El_Kabong

Nunes once again misdirecting to Hunter Biden. Yawn.

Hunter Biden is sooooo guilty, Trump Republicans can't even find any probable cause with all the levers of government they control to go out and arrest him and haul him up on charges. That wiley son of a Biden!! 39

[madmonk28]

Originally Posted by Machine Elf

All your base are belong to us.

You can have them, they're pretty worthless. 40

[margin]

Originally Posted by madmonk28

Have you met Republicans?

So does Trump now claim that he didn't know Sondland and that Sondland was a never Trumper?

Haha, he was a coffee boy, at best. A million-dollar-donating coffee boy. 41

[Aspenglow]

Originally Posted by margin

Haha, he was a coffee boy, at best. A million-dollar-donating coffee boy.

Good one. 42

[margin]

Originally Posted by madmonk28

Yeah, they're employing the throw it at a wall and see what sticks approach. They also are arguing that no one has used the word bribery. They seem to think that crimes are not crimes if you don't use the magic words; it's not murder unless you say murder during the shooting. They're fortunate in that their base are so uninformed.

This is so striking, because it's so deeply held. Kavanaugh can't be a rapist, he denied it. Trump isn't a pussygrabber, he....oh. Wait. Well, um, not her.

If a white dude does not proclaim, "I hereby confirm and proclaim that it was my intent and ambition to commit: murder, arson, rape, etc., etc.., and that I did in fact commit murder, arson, rape, (fill in the blanks)", plus there are pictures, video from all angles with excellent lighting, DNA matches, fingerprints, etc., then you cannot convict the guy. 43

[Euphonious Polemic]

Has anyone else seen the pathetic sharpie note that Trump just read from? Huge letters in black sharpie, filling the page:

""I want nothing. I want nothing. I want no quid pro quo. Tell Zellinsky to do the right thing. This is the final word from the Pres. of the U.S." 44

[Telemark]

Originally Posted by margin

If a white dude does not proclaim, "I hereby confirm and proclaim that it was my intent and ambition to commit: murder, arson, rape, etc., etc.., and that I did in fact commit murder, arson, rape, (fill in the blanks)", plus there are pictures, video from all angles with excellent lighting, DNA matches, fingerprints, etc., then you cannot convict the guy.

"If the glove don't fit, you must acquit" is much catchier. It has a nice beat, you can dance to it. 45

[QuickSilver]

Originally Posted by Euphonious Polemic

"... This is the final word from the Pres. of the U.S."

God, I fucking hope so. 46

[Mundane Super Hero]

Originally Posted by madmonk28

Have you met Republicans?

No, I didn't go to Gym Jordan's Ohio State. Also I'm both lactose and Devin Nunes intolerant.


Moo. 47

[madmonk28]

This time next week, Trump's approval rating at fivethirtyeight will be right where it is today. We are seeing egregious abuse of power and his supporters straight up don't care. 48

[QuickSilver]

Originally Posted by madmonk28

We are seeing egregious abuse of power and his supporters straight up don't care.

Their lips say they don't care. But their eyes say, "YES!". 49

[madmonk28]

Yeah, maybe don't care isn't the right description, they don't disapprove which is more alarming. 50