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Old 04-02-2020, 11:19 PM
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Venezuelan Navy ship shoots at and rams a cruise ship, sinks itself


A Venezuelan Navy ship tried to order a German cruise ship flying a Portuguese flag to follow it into a Venezuelan port. When the cruise ship's captain refused, claiming he was in international waters, the Venezuelan ship fired it and rammed it. But the cruise ship, the RCGS RESOLUTE, is designed to cut through Antarctic ice, and has a reinforced hull. The Venezuelan ship sank.
There were no passengers on board the cruise ship.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...uguese-cruise/
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:34 PM
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Idiots. Everyone knows that's what cruise missiles are for.
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:40 PM
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The OP's link is paywalled, so here is a lengthy one that isn't.
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Old 04-03-2020, 12:15 AM
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The OP's link is paywalled, so here is a lengthy one that isn't.
No it isnt.
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Old 04-03-2020, 12:50 AM
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No it isnt.
It won't let me read the entire article unless I sign up for a one-month free trial, and create an account on their site. Technically not a paywall, I suppose.
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Old 04-03-2020, 06:08 AM
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Try the article in Popular Mechanics

Or the one on FleetMon


This took place just off Tortuga... was Captain Jack Sparrow involved?
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Old 04-03-2020, 07:06 AM
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Sounds like either state-sanctioned piracy or an outright act of war to me.

In either instance, Venezuela's got some serious explaining to do.
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Old 04-03-2020, 07:18 AM
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Right now it seems like Venezuela and its Navy are being run by crazy, incompetent people, so I’m seeing this as a great Feel Good story. No one died, and the asshole who was trying to bully a big unaggressive guy punches himself in the face. And loses a 259’ warship.

Last edited by Baal Houtham; 04-03-2020 at 07:20 AM.
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:18 AM
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In either instance, Venezuela's got some serious explaining to do.
Yea it does. That evil capitalist cruise ship was really a disguised CIA spy ship that was intruding upon Venezuela's territory to steal their intelligence signals and toilet paper. The Venezuela's ship's captain bravely sacrificed his ship to send them packing!
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:44 AM
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This took place just off Tortuga... was Captain Jack Sparrow involved?
"You are without doubt the worst captain I've ever heard of."
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:49 AM
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And loses a 259’ warship.
That's an expensive asset. How deep is the water where this happened? Would they be likely to attempt a salvage operation?
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:51 AM
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"You are without doubt the worst captain I've ever heard of."
But you have heard of me!
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:55 AM
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The OP's link is paywalled, so here is a lengthy one that isn't.
That's a good link, with political background info and the Youtube promo video for the warship.

The site also has a story about Entire Crew Of A Russian Nuclear Submarine Is In Quarantine After COVID-19 Exposure.
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Old 04-03-2020, 09:30 AM
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But you have heard of me!
I knew I'd be beat to this response.
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Old 04-03-2020, 09:51 AM
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Gonna need a bigger boat.
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Old 04-03-2020, 10:02 AM
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That's an expensive asset. How deep is the water where this happened? Would they be likely to attempt a salvage operation?
There is a relatively shallow bank, only 100 meters deep or a bit shallower, to the WNW of Isla Tortuga. That is the shallowest area in the vicinity and would prove a difficult challenge if the ship sank there.

But there is a hole to the WSW of the island that drops to more than 1400 meters... WAY too deep for salvage.
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Old 04-03-2020, 10:33 AM
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Would they be likely to attempt a salvage operation?
They might try to salvage some items, but probably not the ship itself. Even in a few hundred feet of water, such an operation is likely to cost substantially more than the value of what it can retrieve.


I note that with the right kind of sonar the sunken ship ought to be fairly easy to locate, which would help establish whether the incident happened in international waters.
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Old 04-03-2020, 10:50 AM
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This is a Monty Pyton skit become reality. Next up, an expedition to the twin peaks of Mt. Kilimanjaro.

“I thought there was only one peak, sir?”

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Old 04-03-2020, 10:54 AM
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It won't let me read the entire article unless I sign up for a one-month free trial, and create an account on their site. Technically not a paywall, I suppose.
It didnt ask me anything except whether it could use cookies.
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Old 04-03-2020, 11:06 AM
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Columbia Cruise Services says Resolute remained in the area until it was clear its services were not required to help in the rescue of the 44 crew members. It then continued on, as planned, to the Port of Willemstad in Curaçao.
Well, that was classy.
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Old 04-03-2020, 11:12 AM
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It didnt ask me anything except whether it could use cookies.
I got that, as well, but then couldn't read past the first few paragraphs without creating an account.
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Old 04-03-2020, 11:12 AM
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A Venezuelan Navy ship tried to order a German cruise ship flying a Portuguese flag to follow it into a Venezuelan port. When the cruise ship's captain refused, claiming he was in international waters, the Venezuelan ship fired it and rammed it. But the cruise ship, the RCGS RESOLUTE, is designed to cut through Antarctic ice, and has a reinforced hull. The Venezuelan ship sank.
There were no passengers on board the cruise ship.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...uguese-cruise/
Any chance The Navy commander was trained at the Moreno School of Naval Warfare?
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Old 04-03-2020, 11:20 AM
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Well, that was classy.
It would have made the story so much more fun if the cruse ship crew would have had to fish everyone out of the water.
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Old 04-03-2020, 11:45 AM
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I don't know if Hilarious is what the OP was going for with the thread title, but it was certainly achieved.
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Old 04-03-2020, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Kitchen View Post
A Venezuelan Navy ship tried to order a German cruise ship flying a Portuguese flag to follow it into a Venezuelan port. When the cruise ship's captain refused, claiming he was in international waters, the Venezuelan ship fired it and rammed it. But the cruise ship, the RCGS RESOLUTE, is designed to cut through Antarctic ice, and has a reinforced hull. The Venezuelan ship sank.
There were no passengers on board the cruise ship.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...uguese-cruise/
I've had a few embarrassing bicycle wrecks in front of others, but this takes the cake. AWKWARD!
  #26  
Old 04-03-2020, 12:57 PM
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... the cruise ship, the RCGS RESOLUTE, is designed to cut through Antarctic ice, and has a reinforced hull.
More specifically (according to this statement from the company that owns it), it has an "ice-strengthened bulbous bow" - probably much of the hull is more or less normal. But that strong bulbous underwater projection makes this ship a notably poor choice for a ramming attack. Presumably, it was damage caused by this that sunk the Venezuelan ship.

In contrast to Venezuelan claims that the RESOLUTE abandoned the shipwrecked sailors, the company claims:
Quote:
... the RCGS RESOLUTE remained for over one hour in vicinity of the scene and reached out to the Maritime Rescue Coordination Centre (MRCC) Curaçao.
...
Only after receiving the order to resume passage full ahead by the MRCC and that further assistance is not required, the RCGS RESOLUTE, currently safely moored in the port of Willemstad, continued sailing towards her destination at Curaçao.
This claim should be verifiable in the records of the MRCC.
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Old 04-03-2020, 01:15 PM
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In contrast to Venezuelan claims that the RESOLUTE abandoned the shipwrecked sailors, the company claims:
Sounds like the Venzuelan Navy is trying to cover it's ass.
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Last edited by Baker; 04-03-2020 at 01:15 PM.
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Old 04-03-2020, 01:31 PM
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As Sancho says in Man of La Mancha "if the pitcher hits the rock or the rock hits the pitcher, the pitcher loses." (From memory from over 50 years ago, I might be wrong.)

Venezuela is in such bad shape they can hardly afford a navy - this might save them money.
Assuming they aren't still making payments on the ship.
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Old 04-03-2020, 02:11 PM
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As Sancho says in Man of La Mancha "if the pitcher hits the rock or the rock hits the pitcher, the pitcher loses." (From memory from over 50 years ago, I might be wrong.)

Venezuela is in such bad shape they can hardly afford a navy - this might save them money.
Assuming they aren't still making payments on the ship.
Near as I can tell, the boat was a lightly-outfitted version of the Spanish Avante 2200 corvette surface combatant, called the POZVEE class. Only the Venezuelans operated this particular version. Basically a big Coast Guard cutter with a 76mm gun, and a pretty high tech 35mm CIWS.

A more lavishly equipped set of five boats was to be built for the Saudis for 1.8 billion Euros in 2018. http://www.navyrecognition.com/index...-navantia.html

I doubt they have the money for salvage. It's very worrisome if the Venezuelan Navy is having units reduced to piracy, though LOL upon LOL at how this turned out.
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:10 AM
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I've heard Germans have a reputation for lacking humor, but even they have to be laughing their heads (and other body parts) off at this one.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:51 AM
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Near as I can tell, the boat was a lightly-outfitted version of the Spanish Avante 2200 corvette surface combatant, called the POZVEE class. Only the Venezuelans operated this particular version. Basically a big Coast Guard cutter with a 76mm gun, and a pretty high tech 35mm CIWS.

A more lavishly equipped set of five boats was to be built for the Saudis for 1.8 billion Euros in 2018. http://www.navyrecognition.com/index...-navantia.html

I doubt they have the money for salvage. It's very worrisome if the Venezuelan Navy is having units reduced to piracy, though LOL upon LOL at how this turned out.
This is the ship that scored the own-goal, GC-23 Naiguata. One of three in that class.

There was supposed to be a fourth one to join that ship class but it was cancelled, named Comandante Eterno Hugo Chavez, "Eternal Commander Hugo Chavez", which goes to answer the question of what sort of navy would ram a cruise ship like?, the kind that wants to put a name like that on one of their ships, that sort.
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:09 AM
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It would have made the story so much more fun if the cruse ship crew would have had to fish everyone out of the water.
The crew offered to help, but they were refused.
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:49 AM
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I don't know if Hilarious is what the OP was going for with the thread title, but it was certainly achieved.
Or more famously

Sighted ship sank self

Last edited by Just Asking Questions; 04-04-2020 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:36 PM
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Now i gotta check if Harpoon2k is on steam or GoG, now that one of the oscar myer wieners is out of commish
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Old 04-04-2020, 10:04 PM
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This is the ship that scored the own-goal, GC-23 Naiguata. One of three in that class.

There was supposed to be a fourth one to join that ship class but it was cancelled, named Comandante Eterno Hugo Chavez, "Eternal Commander Hugo Chavez", which goes to answer the question of what sort of navy would ram a cruise ship like?, the kind that wants to put a name like that on one of their ships, that sort.
As I understand it it hasn't actually been canceled, it's been more or less finished for years but for officially unspecified reasons never is actually ready for deployment. For un-official reasons, it's probably because unlike the others it was built locally instead of by Spain and from what I've heard elsewhere is a piece of garbage:

Quote:
For what I understand the ship isn't anywhere close to seaworthy, the first three ships were built in Spain while The Joke was build here and the big reason that there was the fight with the company was because the Government stole everything and then blamed the company.

And for what the people in the steel industry have told me* the odds are that the hull is complete garbage.

*They got a lot rebar from Sidor, the government owned foundry and only working foundry since the 80's, and one of them broke under its own weight and one of them bended like a noodle, and they were supposed to be of the same lot.

Last edited by Der Trihs; 04-04-2020 at 10:05 PM.
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Old 04-06-2020, 11:22 AM
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Only the Venezuelans operated this particular version. Basically a big Coast Guard cutter with a 76mm gun, and a pretty high tech 35mm CIWS.
So they had a 76 mm gun, the cruise ship had a propeller or two, and Captain Venezuela decides ramming is the way to bring it under control?

And since nobody else is doing it: [Nelson Muntz]HA ha![/NM]
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Old 04-06-2020, 11:50 AM
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Looking at the Resolute's Wikipedia page, it's a durable mo-fo. It's been grounded three times and caught fire while in dry dock.
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Old 04-06-2020, 02:09 PM
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If I misunderstand correctly, the cruise ship has a reinforced bow, but the sides and bottom are only reinforced a bit to handle ice, so being rammed from the side would be a real problem? So just where did the Venezuelan ship ram the cruise ship? Even with an ordinary ship, ramming the bow is not a good idea.
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Old 04-06-2020, 03:32 PM
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So just where did the Venezuelan ship ram the cruise ship? Even with an ordinary ship, ramming the bow is not a good idea.
Ram of the bow, from a starboard 135-degree approaching vector.
The cruise ship has some *severe* damage.......to its paint job.

Last edited by MarvinKitFox; 04-06-2020 at 03:33 PM.
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Old 04-06-2020, 03:45 PM
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Is there any speculation as to what their intent was if they had gotten the ship to Venezuelan port? Maybe make up a bunch of violations and require "fines" to be paid to return the ship?
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Old 04-06-2020, 03:57 PM
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Is there any speculation as to what their intent was if they had gotten the ship to Venezuelan port? Maybe make up a bunch of violations and require "fines" to be paid to return the ship?
Or outright confiscate the ship and sell it, they've apparently been known to do that.
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Old 04-06-2020, 04:31 PM
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So they had a 76 mm gun, the cruise ship had a propeller or two, and Captain Venezuela decides ramming is the way to bring it under control?
It says there were "warning shots" which were probably a couple of bursts across the bow of tracers from the .50-cals. Heavier ammunition's expensive.

But it would not look good to be holding for ransom demanding fines under threat of confiscation if it's got burnt out holes and a few dead citizens of other countries in it.

Last edited by JRDelirious; 04-06-2020 at 04:33 PM.
  #43  
Old 04-06-2020, 05:42 PM
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And here's the Venezuelan explanation via wikipedia:

Nicolás Maduro accused the captain of the cruise ship of "piracy" and "terrorism," adding later that he did not rule out that RCGS Resolute was "carrying mercenaries to attack onshore military bases." The Venezuelan minister of defence said RCGS Resolute's action was an act of "imperial aggression."

Right. Maybe they also can't "rule out" that the cruise ship was carrying shape-shifting lizard people! The Venezuelan Navy were just trying to save the planet!

Good job Maduro. Most pathetic excuse of the year.
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Old 04-06-2020, 10:32 PM
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I've heard Germans have a reputation for lacking humor,
Oh they have a sense of humor all right, anything to do with defecation for example. They think the phrase "trolls hiding under outhouses with red-hot pokers" is knee-slappingly hilarious.
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:05 PM
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The crew offered to help, but they were refused.
Given they were deliberately rammed, I don't know if I'd willingly take any of the crew on board, as there's a risk of them trying to commandeer the ship.
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Old 05-06-2020, 02:29 PM
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In a dramatic turnaround in the world's most embarrassing war, Venezuelan farmers defeat the Green Berets.
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Old 05-07-2020, 03:23 AM
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Given they were deliberately rammed, I don't know if I'd willingly take any of the crew on board, as there's a risk of them trying to commandeer the ship.
Drop them enough life rafts and some medical supplies. I would be surprised if there isn't a set of complete video and audio recordings of the entire event that can be drawn upon in court ... complete with them refusing help.
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  #48  
Old 05-07-2020, 06:16 PM
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In a dramatic turnaround in the world's most embarrassing war, Venezuelan farmers defeat the Green Berets.
Fishermen, not farmers, but close enough. The mercs were lured by a multi-megabuck reward offered by Pompeo but where did their backing come from? A QAnon GoFundMe? A sanitized Trump fund? The merc filibusteros leaders had been Trump security. Is this yet more proof that everything this POTUS touches, dies?
  #49  
Old 05-07-2020, 06:52 PM
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Well, these idiots might. All the Presidential pardons in the world won't save your ass in a South American prison. Although I can see Venezuela keeping them around until after Jan. 20, 2021, when they can free them as a good-will gesture or a bribe, depending.
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