# 1/3 of Americans are absolute morons! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 7, 2013, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064 "2013-04-07T10:22:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/21 "2013-04-07T16:51:56Z")
Kinda fond of predestinarian Calvinists, myself. Premise: since God knows everything, and I do mean _everything_, He knew before you were born you were going to fuck up total and go straight to Hell. And did it anyway. Because God is a Total Dick. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/22 "2013-04-07T16:55:43Z")
> [@](#): > > The new survey finds that 34 percent of adults would favor establishing Christianity as the official state religion in their own state, while 47 percent would oppose doing so. I bet religious people will once again condemn those damned \*\*47 \*\*per-centers. 🙂 That one third minority seems to include all of the crazy people that are mentioned in the Crazification factor: > **[Crazification factor](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Crazification_factor)** > > Crazification factor (alternatively known as the "Keyes constant"\[1\]) is a neologism coined in 2005 by blogger and screenwriter John Rogers\[2\] to refer to the portion of the electorate comprising the nuttiest of the wingnuts and the batshit crazy, or... > [@](#): > > Crazification factor is a neologism coined by blogger John Rogers to refer to the portion of the electorate comprising the nuttiest of the wingnuts and the batshit crazy. In Rogers’ words: > > “”Obama vs. Alan Keyes. Keyes was from out of state, so you can eliminate any established political base; both candidates were black, so you can factor out racism; and Keyes was plainly, obviously, completely crazy. Batshit crazy. Head-trauma crazy. But 27% of the population of Illinois voted for him. They put party identification, personal prejudice, whatever ahead of rational judgement. Hell, even like 5% of Democrats voted for him. That’s crazy behaviour. I think you have to assume a 27% Crazification Factor in any population.[1] ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/23 "2013-04-07T17:09:03Z")
I’d like to see a poll of how many people think Obama wants to make Islam the official religion of the US. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/24 "2013-04-07T17:14:22Z")
> [@Uber\_the\_Goober](#): > > Because the idiots who would support this have absolutely no knowledge of the motivations of the people who fled England to come here in the first place, and no knowledge of one of the most fundamental aspects of the Constitution : separation of church and state. Huh. I thought the pilgrims fled England because they wanted a state religion that happened to be different from England’s state religion. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/25 "2013-04-07T17:14:44Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Thiss may be alarming, or it may not. If people thought the question was asking if Christianity should be the official religion in a way that would make Christian law state law one and the same, that’s very scary. If, on the other hand, they simply want it to be the “official” religion to give a nod to our founding sentiments, then it’s not nearly as big a deal. My guess it’s the latter. I don’t think many Christians would favor a Christain-law based Sharia-like adherence like you see in some Muslim countries. I’m not saying the number is zero. Just very, very low. I suspect they represent all sorts of different notions of what it would mean for Christianity to be the official religion. Some of them may want the government run along “Christian” lines (according to their varying notions of what that would be), some may have been thinking of the way the Church of England is England’s “official religion,” and some may have thought that they were just hitting a “Like” button for Christianity. In any case, I think the thread title is inaccurate, simply because people who are not absolute morons all too often do or support things that are absolutely moronic. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/26 "2013-04-07T17:26:29Z")
OK. they are provisional morons. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/27 "2013-04-07T17:43:46Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I don’t really see where stupidity enters into this, just evil and would-be oppression. The stupidity enters into in it when ignorant and stupid gets equated with evil, that’s where. I think that 1/3 of Americans probably are very provincial and very unaware of things outside of their very small geographic area and circle of people- if all they know is their little crowd of equally ignorant religious people and stay in their little area, then they may have no idea that it’s a bad idea to impose that sort of thing on everyone- as far as they know, everyone’s just like them so what’s the issue? Of course, that doesn’t make it right, but it hardly makes it evil. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/28 "2013-04-07T18:13:31Z")
I hate to hear what Monty thinks of most Europeans since many if not most European countries have state religions. He must think virtually all Swedes are complete morons. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/29 "2013-04-07T18:18:57Z")
[The Swedes are a pretty sharp bunch.](http://www.adherents.com/largecom/com_sweden.html) (Now those Danes, on the other hand…) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/30 "2013-04-07T18:54:16Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I hate to hear what Monty thinks of most Europeans since many if not most European countries have state religions. > > He must think virtually all Swedes are complete morons. I was wondering this too. I doubt we’ll get an answer. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/31 "2013-04-07T19:20:45Z")
Nothing breeds apathy and antipathy among the religious as much a state church. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/32 "2013-04-07T19:22:24Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > I was wondering this too. I doubt we’ll get an answer. I would bet you will get an answer from Monty sooner or later, but just on the off chance he does not come back, allow me. The melting pot that is the United States is not the homogeneous country that is Sweden. Anybody who tries to make arguments about state religions being good for one and thus being good for the other (or vice versa) is firmly in the 33% that Monty was highlighting. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/33 "2013-04-07T20:11:27Z")
No one asked me about this. The only time I’ve participated in any poll is on The Straight Dope. Where did they ask these alleged Americans? Probably exiting churches and in nursing homes. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/34 "2013-04-07T20:18:04Z")
> [@L. G. Butts](#): > > I would bet you will get an answer from Monty sooner or later, but just on the off chance he does not come back, allow me. The melting pot that is the United States is not the homogeneous country that is Sweden. Anybody who tries to make arguments about state religions being good for one and thus being good for the other (or vice versa) is firmly in the 33% that Monty was highlighting. I wasn’t making the argument that they were better and as most would gather from my user name I’m a fan of the idea of a secular state. I was merely pointing out that the US with it’s belief in separation of Church and State is in the minority, not the majority of both the world and the west and that most Western countries, including countries like the UK, Australia, Canada and most of Europe have some level of the mixing of government and religion. By Monty’s logic, if the people of North Carolina who want Christianity to be the official religion of their state are complete morons then so are the people of Norway who actually have an established Church. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/35 "2013-04-07T20:22:14Z")
Simple, really. Just amend the constitution to state that an official religion may be established if a specific denomination of a specific faith wins a majority on a public referendum offering all the possible options and that a 5% minority of the voters call for a new referendum at any time when there is an official established religion (if there is no official religion, the referendum will require 25% to get on the ballot). ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/36 "2013-04-07T20:49:09Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I hate to hear what Monty thinks of most Europeans since many if not most European countries have state religions. > > He must think virtually all Swedes are complete morons. Many? Maybe. Most? No. from **MEBuckner** ’s link: > [@](#): > > By delaying the change until 2000, Sweden was one of the last countries in Western Europe to sever the connection between the state and an officially sanctioned church. Although many European countries subsidize churches and religious schools, most long ago did away with the concept of an “established church.” ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/37 "2013-04-07T20:49:21Z")
> [@Gukumatz](#): > > Nothing breeds apathy and antipathy among the religious as much a state church. So it’s a good thing, then? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/38 "2013-04-07T20:56:02Z")
I’m a Christian, fairly devout too. And I adamantly oppose prayer in schools and “a state religion”. the problem with prayer is, whose prayer is it going to be? Even if it’s given by a Christian, what is they throw in some doctrinal quibble I disagree with? Even if I \*had \*kids I want to be teaching them religion, not someone else. And what if someone wanted “In the name of Allah, the Merciful and Compassionate?” Wouldn’t the fundamentalists go absolutely **insane**? Or, “hear, O Israel, the Lord our God is one!” \*That \*wouldn’t sit to well with fundies, now, would it? The problem with the people who support prayer in schools is that they want it to be _ **their** _ version of prayer, not some _heathen_ prayer!😃 Same thing goes for state religion. I’m glad to be Episcopalian. As the rector said when I was taking classes “Being Episcopal means you don’t have to check your brains at the door.” Ask swampbear, I think he’ll agree with me!😛 ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/39 "2013-04-07T20:57:13Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > By Monty’s logic, if the people of North Carolina who want Christianity to be the official religion of their state are complete morons then so are the people of Norway who actually have an established Church. Nah. You’re ignoring context. Monty made no claim that any nation anywhere in which people wanted a state religion was populated by morons. His specific claim was in regard to the U.S. where there is a long history both of separation of church and state and of state persecution of various religious groups. A nation such as Norway where the state support of a specific denomination happens to extend back several hundred years and where the society has become mostly secular while leaving the state/religion entanglements as a cultural artifact that harms no one is a separate situation that provides significantly different context. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2013, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064/40 "2013-04-07T20:58:47Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > So it’s a good thing, then? > > 😃 Maybe. One hypothesis about why Europeans are so much less religious than Americans is that having a state sanctioned Church makes one more suspicious of organized religion than when there are literally dozens of churches to choose from, none any more official than another. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1-3-of-americans-are-absolute-morons/655064.md?page=3)