# 10 Commandments **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 4, 2012, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736 "2012-02-04T05:19:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/21 "2012-02-04T06:07:17Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > I am not debating whether they are God’s laws or not. They are good rules to live by, no matter where they came from. PS Killing is illegal, whether your are a believer or not! No, they aren’t good rules to live byu. Well, some of them are: no killing, no stealing, no perjury, and no adultery. Those are great, but that’s only four out of ten. 40% is failing in my courses. The others can be dumped or improved: I’d rather have a weekend than one day off in seven, thank you very much. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/22 "2012-02-04T06:07:53Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Now, to the OP, can you clarify? Are you asking if the world would be a better place if all nations instituted Mosaic law, or are you asking if the world would be a better place if each individual human, of their own will, chose to follow the ten commandments? Miller…I just think if the individual obeyed the mosaic law, then it would commute to all aspects of our society, and in general the world would be a better place. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/23 "2012-02-04T06:09:10Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > This is not about YOU, honey. It is about humanity since the beginning. Actually, sorry, I don’t usually get that way (jeepers, it’s like I was suddenly possessed by **der Trihs** or something), but your OP comes off just a teensy bit presumptuous. I’ll stay out of the rest of this discussion, but I should point out, regarding your concern about this thread being deleted, if fifty pages of extremely detailed discussion of the mechanics of butt-raping a ten-year-old boy doesn’t get deleted on this board, you probably don’t have too much to worry about. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/24 "2012-02-04T06:09:17Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Please explain why, exactly, we shouldn’t make graven images. Ok, Colibri…God does not want us to make graven images because he does not want us to worship IDOLS. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/25 "2012-02-04T06:11:54Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Actually, sorry, I don’t usually get that way (jeepers, it’s like I was suddenly possessed by **der Trihs** or something), but your OP comes off just a teensy bit presumptuous. > > I’ll stay out of the rest of this discussion, but I should point out, regarding your concern about this thread being deleted, if fifty pages of extremely detailed discussion of the mechanics of butt-raping a ten-year-old boy doesn’t get deleted, I’d say you don’t have too much to worry about here. El…I do not read the threads I find too disturbing. I respect your opinion, and wish the troubles of this world could be as succintly dealt with, I hope things turn out for the ten-year-old. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/26 "2012-02-04T06:14:24Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > No, they aren’t good rules to live byu. Well, some of them are: no killing, no stealing, no perjury, and no adultery. Those are great, but that’s only four out of ten. 40% is failing in my courses. The others can be dumped or improved: I’d rather have a weekend than one day off in seven, thank you very much. Dr…you need to read what the Word really says instead of what you think it says. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/27 "2012-02-04T06:15:19Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > Ok, Colibri…God does not want us to make graven images because he does not want us to worship IDOLS. So what? Explain why that would make the world a better place if everyone followed it. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/28 "2012-02-04T06:17:13Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > . . . if we had obeyed God’s basic rules . . . Whose God? Yours? What about people who worship a different God? What about people who don’t worship any God? Have them all killed? Oh, I forgot, you’re not allowed to do that anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/29 "2012-02-04T06:17:32Z")
Like I said in another recent thread, some of them are good ideas, and the good ideas were around before the 10 Commandments, of course. Lying is usually a bad thing, although there are circumstances where it can be a kindness or the least-worst option. Depending on how you read the commandment in question, killing is almost always bad or murder is essentially always bad. There are very few exceptions to that one. Stealing is wrong but occasionally excusable because of necessity. Adultery is wrong, and about all you can say there is that affairs of the heart can get very complicated. Coveting is a mixed bag. Wanting something does no harm in and of itself and can be beneficial as a motivation, and as George Carlin said, it keeps the economy going. Taken to extremes, jealousy can certainly be harmful. (Many versions of that commandment can be interpreted as implying that a man’s wife is his property and that’s a horrendous teaching.) Honoring your parents is a decent principle but there are serious pitfalls because “honor” is very up for interpretation - unquestioning obedience to parents or anyone else is an awful idea - and some parents are terrible. Assuming the parents aren’t terrible and the demands aren’t unreasonable, this is OK. So there you have some rules that are obvious, but generally good - ones that a society is likely to develop one way or another if it’s going to stick together. The other commandments have no moral value at all, and it’s easy to interpret them as a negative because they reinforce superstition or a hidebound authoritarian viewpoint or just because they don’t do anything and there’s no reason to follow them. Not working on the Sabbath doesn’t make you a better person, neither does having or not having idols, believing in the Biblical God, or taking God’s name in vain. That’s another one that’s interpreted in a variety of ways, but if “don’t take the Lord’s name in vain” means people should refrain from religious blustering, I’m all for it. If it’s understood to be about blasphemy, then screw that - I don’t believe in the things being blasphemed, and blasphemy and profanity are very good ways to get certain points across. With all of that said, no, we still wouldn’t have a perfect world (or a world that didn’t need police or whatever) if people stuck to the commandments that matter. Life gets complicated and people fail to do these things for a reason. But for the most part they’re good things to do. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/30 "2012-02-04T06:20:41Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > Dr…you need to read what the Word really says instead of what you think it says. I’m not quite sure how you propose I do that. I had a quick look at the text of the ten commandments (both versions, copied right there in Wikipedia) before I posted. I’ll admit that my summation was a bit more succint than the Word’s, but the text is quite clear. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/31 "2012-02-04T06:23:09Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > Whose God? Yours? What about people who worship a different God? What about people who don’t worship any God? > > Have them all killed? Oh, I forgot, you’re not allowed to do that anymore. NO I never said that, and I am not pushing any religious agenda. I am merely saying IF we all obeyed a set of rules…for the good of the world.. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/32 "2012-02-04T06:23:42Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > (I might still get deleted) Butt..All of you people that think you are so modern, intelligent, informed…don’t you think if the 10 commandments had been obeyed thru out humanity’s existence, there would be hardly any of the troubles we see today? No. For one thing, they are Christian rules and following them implies an acceptance of Christianity; one of the greatest evils in human history. Especially of course the specifically Christian rules. A Christian society is going to be an overwhelmingly evil society; the social and moral progress of the West is based on a rejection of Christian values in favor of moral values. For another, “thou shalt not kill” as Christians often point out when defending executions and wars doesn’t prohibit killing, only murder. Unauthorized killing. So you can pile up bodies in heaps as long as someone in authority tells you to; or for that matter if you convince yourself God wants you to kill someone. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/33 "2012-02-04T06:27:02Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Like I said in another recent thread, some of them are good ideas, and the good ideas were around before the 10 Commandments, of course. Lying is usually a bad thing, although there are circumstances where it can be a kindness or the least-worst option. Depending on how you read the commandment in question, killing is almost always bad or murder is essentially always bad. There are very few exceptions to that one. Stealing is wrong but occasionally excusable because of necessity. Adultery is wrong, and about all you can say there is that affairs of the heart can get very complicated. Coveting is a mixed bag. Wanting something does no harm in and of itself and can be beneficial as a motivation, and as George Carlin said, it keeps the economy going. Taken to extremes, jealousy can certainly be harmful. (Many versions of that commandment can be interpreted as implying that a man’s wife is his property and that’s a horrendous teaching.) Honoring your parents is a decent principle but there are serious pitfalls because “honor” is very up for interpretation - unquestioning obedience to parents or anyone else is an awful idea - and some parents are terrible. Assuming the parents aren’t terrible and the demands aren’t unreasonable, this is OK. So there you have some rules that are obvious, but generally good - ones that a society is likely to develop one way or another if it’s going to stick together. > > The other commandments have no moral value at all, and it’s easy to interpret them as a negative because they reinforce superstition or a hidebound authoritarian viewpoint or just because they don’t do anything and there’s no reason to follow them. Not working on the Sabbath doesn’t make you a better person, neither does having or not having idols, believing in the Biblical God, or taking God’s name in vain. That’s another one that’s interpreted in a variety of ways, but if “don’t take the Lord’s name in vain” means people should refrain from religious blustering, I’m all for it. If it’s understood to be about blasphemy, then screw that - I don’t believe in the things being blasphemed, and blasphemy and profanity are very good ways to get certain points across. > > With all of that said, no, we still wouldn’t have a perfect world (or a world that didn’t need police or whatever) if people stuck to the commandments that matter. Life gets complicated and people fail to do these things for a reason. But for the most part they’re good things to do. Good pooints, Marley. I did not mean to open a flood of “religious” opinions. I merely asked if we “WE” meaning all of humanity, followed a basic set of rules if the world as we know it NOW, would be a better place. ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/34 "2012-02-04T06:28:09Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > (I might still get deleted) Butt..All of you people that think you are so modern, intelligent, informed…don’t you think if the 10 commandments had been obeyed thru out humanity’s existence, there would be hardly any of the troubles we see today? How right you are! If only humanity had simply _refused_ to boil baby goats in their mother’s milk – the **“official”** , rather than the popular _but superseded_ 10’th commandment (Exodus 34:26) – we’d all live in a state of permanent peace and bliss! Hell, my Mom used to do such “kid-seething” (goat-boiling) for just about every meal, but did she desist when I read the **official** Decalogue to her and warned her of the eternal peril to her soul resulting from this forbidden act? **She did not!** And so it’s absolutely no _wonder_ that Israel is now threatening to attack Iran! How could it have turned out otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/35 "2012-02-04T06:29:28Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > No. For one thing, they are Christian rules and following them implies an acceptance of Christianity; one of the greatest evils in human history. Especially of course the specifically Christian rules. A Christian society is going to be an overwhelmingly evil society; the social and moral progress of the West is based on a rejection of Christian values in favor of moral values. > > For another, “thou shalt not kill” as Christians often point out when defending executions and wars doesn’t prohibit killing, only murder. Unauthorized killing. So you can pile up bodies in heaps as long as someone in authority tells you to; or for that matter if you convince yourself God wants you to kill someone. Der Tris…this is not about religion or christian values…its merely a question about human behaviour. ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/36 "2012-02-04T06:31:53Z")
> [@ambushed](#): > > How right you are! > > If only humanity had simply _refused_ to boil baby goats in their mother’s milk – the **“official”** , rather than the popular _but superseded_ 10’th commandment (Exodus 34:26) – we’d all live in a state of permanent peace and bliss! > > Hell, my Mom used to do such “kid-seething” (goat-boiling) for just about every meal, but did she desist when I read the **official** Decalogue to her and warned her of the eternal peril to her soul resulting from this forbidden act? **She did not!** And so it’s absolutely no _wonder_ that Israel is now threatening to attack Iran! How could it have turned out otherwise? I am not attacking any particlar person or behaviour…I just asked a question and expected some thought on it. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_the\_Immortal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Max\_the\_Immortal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_the_Immortal)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/37 "2012-02-04T06:32:18Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > Ok, Colibri…God does not want us to make graven images because he does not want us to worship IDOLS. What’s an idol? ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/38 "2012-02-04T06:34:33Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > Good pooints, Marley. I did not mean to open a flood of “religious” opinions. I merely asked if we “WE” meaning all of humanity, followed a basic set of rules if the world as we know it NOW, would be a better place. If this is about human behavior and not religion then who decides on the basic set of rules to be followed by all of humanity? ---
**Author:** ![Granny\_Rainbow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85e7bf/32.png) [@Granny\_Rainbow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Granny_Rainbow)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/39 "2012-02-04T06:36:20Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > No. For one thing, they are Christian rules and following them implies an acceptance of Christianity; one of the greatest evils in human history. Especially of course the specifically Christian rules. A Christian society is going to be an overwhelmingly evil society; the social and moral progress of the West is based on a rejection of Christian values in favor of moral values. > > For another, “thou shalt not kill” as Christians often point out when defending executions and wars doesn’t prohibit killing, only murder. Unauthorized killing. So you can pile up bodies in heaps as long as someone in authority tells you to; or for that matter if you convince yourself God wants you to kill someone. Human interpretation is not perfect, nor any human religion. There have been many interpretations of “Christiainity” some wrong and some right in some ways. I am not asking for a theological or atheistic slant on my question. I merely asked if things would not be simpler today if we had followed some laws laid down long ago. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2012, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736/40 "2012-02-04T06:36:41Z")
> [@Granny\_Rainbow](#): > > Der Tris…this is not about religion or christian values…its merely a question about human behaviour. No, it is very much a Christian issue, since you are speaking of several rules that are specifically Christian. That in fact demand adherence to Christianity. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-commandments/611736.md?page=3)