# 10 years after the "looming crisis in human genetics" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 1, 2019, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236 "2019-12-01T14:16:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/21 "2019-12-02T18:00:05Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > The 0.1-0.3 % comes from [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decaffeination#Caffeine_content_of_decaffeinated_coffee). Note that % caffeine and % compared to regular are two different things. Duuuuhhh. See below. > [@MrDibble](#): > > I wouldn’t characterise 0.1-0.3 % as “a fair amount” of anything. Should I assume you also think atmospheric CO2 is unimportant? _ **“CO2 Makes Up Just 0.04% of Earth’s Atmosphere”** _ I do not consider our dialogue to be … the finest specimen of intelligent discourse. If you “need” to continue this … whatever-it-is, please take it to the Pit. ETA: TL;DR. I stand by my summary \*\*The only scenario in which 2% isn’t significantly more than 0.5% is one where it seems appropriate to approximate both numbers as Zero. \*\* Your remarkable observation that regular coffee is not 100% caffeine does not change this. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/22 "2019-12-02T18:49:45Z")
There is alot of new findings about genetics and intelligence. In [2017](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/22/science/52-genes-human-intelligence.html)they found 52 genes linked to intelligence, in [2018](https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/06/hundreds-new-genes-may-underlie-intelligence-also-autism-and-depression)they found 939 genes linked to intelligence. Together these genes account for almost half the inheritability of intelligence. Given the number of genes and the complex interactions of genes, it now seems naive to think that understanding the role of specific genes in intelligence without the huge databases of genetic profiles that have only been available in recent years. Even with that there is still much yet to uncover. In the journal Intelligence there was a recent [paper](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289619301886?via%3Dihub)on a survey conducted of intelligence experts in 2013-2014. It found that 17% thought that the gap between white and black people in measured intelligence had no genetic component. The modal response was that 50% of the gap was due to genetics. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/23 "2019-12-02T18:57:31Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > There is alot of new findings about genetics and intelligence. In [2017](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/22/science/52-genes-human-intelligence.html)they found 52 genes linked to intelligence, in [2018](https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/06/hundreds-new-genes-may-underlie-intelligence-also-autism-and-depression)they found 939 genes linked to intelligence. Together these genes account for almost half the inheritability of intelligence. > > Given the number of genes and the complex interactions of genes, it now seems naive to think that understanding the role of specific genes in intelligence without the huge databases of genetic profiles that have only been available in recent years. Even with that there is still much yet to uncover. > > In the journal Intelligence there was a recent [paper](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289619301886?via%3Dihub)on a survey conducted of intelligence experts in 2013-2014. It found that 17% thought that the gap between white and black people in measured intelligence had no genetic component. The modal response was that 50% of the gap was due to genetics. Just to be clear, is it your opinion that black people are probably inherently genetically inferior, on average, to white people, in terms of intelligence? If this isn’t what you’re saying, then what are you trying to say? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/24 "2019-12-02T19:49:47Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Duuuuhhh. See below. > Should I assume you also think atmospheric CO2 is unimportant? No. But I also wouldn’t characterise CO[sub]2[/sub] as making up a “fair amount” of the atmosphere. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/25 "2019-12-02T20:02:37Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > No. > > But I also wouldn’t characterise CO[sub]2[/sub] as making up a “fair amount” of the atmosphere. 😕 I know that decaf contains a “fair amount” of caffeine because it keeps me awake if I drink too much of it. _ **But what does any of this have to do with the fact that 2.0% is four times as large as 0.5%?** _ Methinks you would happily concede this painfully simple arithmetic fact … were it not for a fear that some might think it implies some politically incorrect conclusion. :smack: Your talk of a “cline” suggests you “need” your debate opponents to concede that 0.5% is more than zero. 🙂 Hilarity reigns. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/26 "2019-12-02T20:07:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’ve heard some racists claim that it’s the admixture of Neanderthal genes that makes white people superior. No matter what the facts are, racists are going to find some way to spin them to match their preconceived notions. Might as well publish the true facts, rather than letting them make up their own. That’s the hallmark of any pseudoscience, quackery or woo : start with a conclusion, then look for anything you can spin to justify the conclusion no matter how tangential, silly or downright wrong (ignore anything that you can’t use to support it). ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/27 "2019-12-02T20:28:03Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > 😕 I know that decaf contains a “fair amount” of caffeine because it keeps me awake if I drink too much of it. > > _ **But what does any of this have to do with the fact that 2.0% is four times as large as 0.5%?** _ If I might interject, I don’t understand what point you’re trying to make here by going on and on with this? **MrDibble** never said 2.0% wasn’t more than 0.5% In fact, he acknowledged the obvious point you, for some reason, think needs emphasizing. I mean, this is what you responded to, man: > [@MrDibble](#): > > Harris is nevertheless wrong, since Neanderthal admixture does occur in Africa-limited lineages.\*\* Not as much, but that’s to be expected given locuses of H. sapiens/Neanderthal interaction. \*\*The notion of pre-colonial genetic separation of Africa from the rest of the world doesn’t hold up. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/28 "2019-12-02T21:10:05Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Just to be clear, is it your opinion that black people are probably inherently genetically inferior, on average, to white people, in terms of intelligence? If this isn’t what you’re saying, then what are you trying to say? I don’t know enough about the science to say. In 1996 the APA’s Intelligence task force had this to say “The differential between the mean intelligence test scores of Blacks and Whites (about one standard deviation, although it may be diminishing) does not result from any obvious biases in test construction and administration, nor does it simply reflect differences in socio-economic status. Explanations based on factors of caste and culture may be appropriate, but so far have little direct empirical support. There is certainly no such support for a genetic interpretation. At present, no one knows what causes this differential.” My reading of the survey is that intelligence professionals seem to be leaning toward an explanation that is at least somewhat genetic. However research in this area seems to be getting more definitive so there is no need to speculate at this time. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/29 "2019-12-02T22:01:58Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I don’t know enough about the science to say. In 1996 the APA’s Intelligence task force had this to say > > “The differential between the mean intelligence test scores of Blacks and Whites (about one standard deviation, although it may be diminishing) does not result from any obvious biases in test construction and administration, nor does it simply reflect differences in socio-economic status. Explanations based on factors of caste and culture may be appropriate, but so far have little direct empirical support. There is certainly no such support for a genetic interpretation. At present, no one knows what causes this differential.” > > My reading of the survey is that intelligence professionals seem to be leaning toward an explanation that is at least somewhat genetic. However research in this area seems to be getting more definitive so there is no need to speculate at this time. Not so clear about genes still, as the Brooklyn Institute reported in 1998: > **[The Black-White Test Score Gap: Why It Persists and What Can Be Done | Brookings](https://www.brookings.edu/articles/the-black-white-test-score-gap-why-it-persists-and-what-can-be-done/)** > > Brookings Review article by Christopher Jencks and Meredith Phillips (Spring 1998) > [@](#): > > The three most common “conservative” explanations for the black-white gap-genes, the culture of poverty, and single motherhood-are also hard to reconcile with the available evidence. There is no direct genetic evidence for or against the theory that the black-white gap is innate, because we have not yet identified the genes that affect skills like reading, math, and abstract reasoning. Studies of mixed-race children and black children adopted by white parents suggest, however, that racial differences in test performance are largely if not entirely environmental in origin. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/30 "2019-12-03T01:06:27Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > If I might interject, I don’t understand what point you’re trying to make here by going on and on with this? **MrDibble** never said 2.0% wasn’t more than 0.5% In fact, he acknowledged the obvious point you, for some reason, think needs emphasizing. Consider three possible pairings of two parameters: a — (2.0, 2.0) b — (2.0, 0.5) c — (2.0, 0.) If forced to choose, I might say that (b) is more similar to (c) than it is to (a). **MrDibble** prefers to cluster (b) with (a). We’re each entitled to our opinion, as are you. Resolving this conflict may be non-trivial; but I see no particular reason to uphold **MrDibble** ’s view over my mine. I made a “throwaway” point about caffeine to express a point colorfully. I’m sure his confused response to that wasn’t due to any innumeracy, but I did want to keep the record straight. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/31 "2019-12-03T01:25:22Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’ve heard some racists claim that it’s the admixture of Neanderthal genes that makes white people superior. No matter what the facts are, racists are going to find some way to spin them to match their preconceived notions. Might as well publish the true facts, rather than letting them make up their own. Funnily enough, it wasn’t but weeks after the Neanderthal gene admixture studies started to be published that a race-realist poster used it against me ([in my initial thread 9 n’ 1/2 years ago](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=566582)) as vindicating proof of African mental inferiority. He even threatened that it was an “initial shot” that would bring down our “egalitarian blank slatism”. > [@So, it's June... WHERE THE \*\*\*\* IS THIS LOOMING GENETIC CRISIS!?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-its-june-where-the-is-this-looming-genetic-crisis/542669/84): > > > [@So, it's June... WHERE THE \*\*\*\* IS THIS LOOMING GENETIC CRISIS!?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-its-june-where-the-is-this-looming-genetic-crisis/542669/25): > > > > There was one study this year, **Orcenio** , which seemed to be an initial shot across the bow against the general argument that we are all more or less equivalent branches of the same genetic trunk: [this Science article](http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/328/5979/710) is one of the first to provide at least one genetically-based distinction between Eurasians and sub-saharans. > > I can’t wait for them to come. I can only wonder how wild your wild-ass racial interpretations of any of these papers will get. For these people “the proof” is always coming (just around the corner) and it will vindicate everything they say about the races. We just need to watch out/run for cover/convert now; before its too late! They grab everything new and science related to be the first to pervert it into a racialized screed and make wild claims on top of more wild claims hoping that their interlocutor isn’t well versed in whatever niche science (or African history) they are perverting. Jeez. We can even see the technique (unashamedly) used in this thread which is dedicated to celebrating the 10 year milestone of another claim. With a complete lack of any sense of irony. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/32 "2019-12-03T01:30:23Z")
I don’t see the point of the math quibbles, but I decided to just look up the details of the conversation I paraphrased from memory in post #9. Sam Harris spends a lot of his time calmly ranting about the political correctness of the left and its stifling effect on scientific inquiry, so I’m sure he’s used this anecdote numerous times; the version I’d heard was from Harris’s _Making Sense_ podcast episode 161 (June 24, 2019) in which he chatted with Jared Diamond. [At around minute 36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itXdxaMUvtM), Harris noted: Harris: I remember in 2014 when it was found that _homo sapiens_ DNA had been comingled with Neanderthal DNA to the tune of, you know, 2.7 percent or 3 percent. Basically everyone on Earth with the exception of people who have just all of their ancestors in Africa is part Neanderthal, right, and so I remember going out on social media that day and quite sanctimoniously saying “Attention all racists: you were right. Whites _are_ special. We’re part Neanderthal. Blacks are just human”, right? You know it took me about five seconds after sending that tweet to understand; what if it had gone the other way? What if the only people on Earth who were part Neanderthal were people of African, direct African descent? That would have been a life-deranging, probably life-destroying discovery for the geneticist who had the misfortune to make it, or for any journalist who had the temerity to even talk about it, right? It just would have been so awful for reasons that we have to perform an exorcism on. We can’t politically be vulnerable to, just the data coming in. The data will be whatever they are, right? And who cares who’s part Neanderthal in the end? But I feel that we as a community of public intellectuals, for lack of a better word, are truly vulnerable to what is a kind of moral panic around the politics of discussing human difference. If Harris has revisited the issue since, he may have updated his facts. ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/33 "2019-12-03T01:37:28Z")
How can a racist view be appraised, without objective definitions of “black” and “white”? It’s too stupid to critique, like a physics hypothesis that’s so wrong, it’s not even “wrong”. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/34 "2019-12-03T01:53:42Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Consider three possible pairings of two parameters: > a — (2.0, 2.0) > b — (2.0, 0.5) > c — (2.0, 0.) > If forced to choose, I might say that (b) is more similar to (c) than it is to (a). **MrDibble** prefers to cluster (b) with (a). And why is this important, even if true? It’s a mystery why you’re even fixated on 2.0%. It was mentioned upstream that non-Africans typically have 1 to 2% Neanderthal DNA. So in your pairings above, replace 2.0 with 1.0, and give us your assessment. See how crazy your perseverance looks to most of us now? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/35 "2019-12-03T08:29:07Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > 😕 I know that decaf contains a “fair amount” of caffeine because it keeps me awake if I drink too much of it. I’m sure there’s nothing psychosomatic about that in the slightest…:rolleyes: > [@](#): > > _ **But what does any of this have to do with the fact that 2.0% is four times as large as 0.5%?** _ Nothing, you’re the one who brought it up. I can’t presume to imagine what conversation is going on in your head. I do know 4 times is less than one order of magnitude, though… > [@](#): > > Your talk of a “cline” Does your use of scare quotes indicate you think the variation _isn’t_ clinal? > [@](#): > > suggests you “need” your debate opponents to concede that 0.5% is more than zero. 🙂 Hilarity reigns. I don’t need you to concede anything, the factual studies summarised by the link I already posted makes any concessions you or anyone might make completely superfluous. That the admixture is more than zero is a fact. Harris is simply wrong when he said there wasn’t any Neanderthal admixture in always-in-Africa groups. Exact _amount_ of admixture is _your_ red herring. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/36 "2019-12-03T11:53:14Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Harris is nevertheless _wrong_, since Neanderthal admixture _does_ [occur in Africa-limited lineages](https://www.ancient-origins.net/human-origins-science/widespread-appearance-neanderthal-dna-africans-have-it-too-008690). Not _as_ much, but that’s to be _expected_ given locuses of _H. sapiens_/Neanderthal interaction. The notion of pre-colonial genetic separation of Africa from the rest of the world doesn’t hold up. I’d also argue that racialists often cite the achievement gap between white and black Americans as evidence of the latter’s genetic inferiority relative to the former. But black Americans have, on average, about 20% European ancestry and thus possess quite a bit of that super powerful Neanderthal DNA. ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/37 "2019-12-03T12:33:49Z")
I want to be here so I can make fun of the fools that swore "LGBT couple will cause the population to drop " in 20 years ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/38 "2019-12-03T13:50:58Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I don’t see the point of the math quibbles, but I decided to just look up the details of the conversation I paraphrased from memory in post #9. Sam Harris spends a lot of his time calmly ranting about the political correctness of the left and its stifling effect on scientific inquiry, so I’m sure he’s used this anecdote numerous times; the version I’d heard was from Harris’s _Making Sense_ podcast episode 161 (June 24, 2019) in which he chatted with Jared Diamond. [At around minute 36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itXdxaMUvtM), Harris noted: > > Harris: I remember in 2014 when it was found that _homo sapiens_ DNA had been comingled with Neanderthal DNA to the tune of, you know, 2.7 percent or 3 percent. Basically everyone on Earth with the exception of people who have just all of their ancestors in Africa is part Neanderthal, right, and so I remember going out on social media that day and quite sanctimoniously saying “Attention all racists: you were right. Whites _are_ special. We’re part Neanderthal. Blacks are just human”, right? You know it took me about five seconds after sending that tweet to understand; what if it had gone the other way? The irony here is that Harris was the one who immediately interpreted the Neanderthal finding through a politicized racialist prism. He could’ve just dispassionately and objectively considered the science, thoughtfully mused about what this could mean about long held assumptions regarding mating between Homo species, and then moved on with life like most people have done with this neat but ultimately trivial discovery. But instead, dude immediately brought ideology into it. And then projected that same mindset onto everyone else. I just can’t. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/39 "2019-12-03T15:40:12Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I was going to suggest an alternative, namely a poster who predicted circa 2009 that gay marriage would have vaguely negative effects on society some forty years after being legalized because the generation who grew up with it as normalized would view marriage as less “special” or something. He was vague on this point. Serious, but vague. Was never able to describe what warning signs we might see, but he was damn serious. And vague. > > I was a little surprised to see he’s gone inactive, too, since March of 2019, his final post about how migrant labor wasn’t necessary to the American economy. Maybe he’s busy writing for the New York Times: Ross Douthat: _Are Liberals Against Marriage?_ That could have been a link to what I assume is more nonsense, but why give that guy more clicks? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236/40 "2019-12-03T17:02:03Z")
> [@nightshadea](#): > > I want to be here so I can make fun of the fools that swore "LGBT couple will cause the population to drop " in 20 years Well, population growth is slowing, particularly in the wealthier countries who are also those countries more likely to embrace LGBT rights. Now I don’t in any way think that these are connected, but if I were of such a mind I could claim that the stats back me up. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/10-years-after-the-looming-crisis-in-human-genetics/844236.md?page=3)