# 11 Cents Extra Postage for Square Envelopes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 15, 2000, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361 "2000-09-15T23:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Why\_A\_Duck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/13edae/32.png) [@Why\_A\_Duck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Why_A_Duck)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2000, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/1 "2000-09-15T23:16:03Z")
This really bothers me. I went to buy a birthday card today, and there is a whole new series of cards out there, by Hallmark I think, called “Fresh Ink.” You pick your card, then you pick your envelope. All the cards are sqaure, but there are two sizes of envelope, rectangular and square. The square envelopes say “11 cents extra postage required for square envelopes.” I thought postage was by weight, not by geometry. “Hmmm, your card is a rhombus, that’s gonna cost you…” What gives? Is there special sorting required for square envelopes or is this yet another postal conspiracy? pcubed ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2000, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/2 "2000-09-15T23:19:24Z")
I think square envelopes don’t go through the sorters correctly. I found this on the USPS website rate list for first class mail > [@](#): > > - Nonstandard Size: An additional $0.11 is required if 1 ounce or less and (a) over any of > these dimensions: 11-1/2" long, 6-1/8" high, 1/4" thick; or (b) the length divided by the > height is less than 1.3 or more than 2.5. ---
**Author:** ![Why\_A\_Duck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/13edae/32.png) [@Why\_A\_Duck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Why_A_Duck)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2000, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/3 "2000-09-15T23:49:26Z")
Thanks for the lookup BobT. I figured it was something sorting related, although secretly I was rooting for the secret government conspiracy theory. I still don’t like it. ---
**Author:** ![Bobort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bobort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bobort)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2000, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/4 "2000-09-16T01:21:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BobT \* > > - Nonstandard Size: An additional $0.11 is required if 1 ounce or less and (a) over any of > these dimensions: 11-1/2" long, 6-1/8" high, 1/4" thick; or (b) the length divided by the > height is less than 1.3 or more than 2.5. I guess that means that if you rotate the location of the address, stamp, etc. on a regular envelope 90[sup]o[/sup] you’ll have to pay extra. Fascinating. ---
**Author:** ![dragonlady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@dragonlady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dragonlady)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2000, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/5 "2000-09-16T04:38:22Z")
It is a mechanical sorting issue. I am a letter carrier amd I can tell you that all “oversized” envelopes come separate from the machined mail. They are not in sequence and have to be sorted by hand. Keep in mind that our routes have over 600 addresses each. It takes extra time to sort these, both by the carriers and everyone else up the line. ---
**Author:** ![bare](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bare/32/471_2.png) [@bare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bare)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/6 "2000-09-17T04:21:24Z")
For free postage, 1. write “free matter for the blind” where the stamp goes. 2. use one of those wildlife stamps you always get around christmas. This actually works for postage, I guess no one pays too much attention to envelopes as long as there appears to be a stamp affixed. Reckon I wouldn’t use this method if it absolutely has to get there on time, but then it never does anyway! ---
**Author:** ![Gunslinger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gunslinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gunslinger)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/7 "2000-09-17T04:32:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bare \* > \*\*For free postage,… > I guess no one pays too much attention to envelopes as long as there appears to be a stamp affixed. Reckon I wouldn’t use this method if it absolutely has to get there on time, but then it never does anyway! \*\* I’ve always considered photocopying the stamp area of one of those “business reply–prepaid postage” things (magazine subscription cards, billing return envelopes, etc) onto my own envelopes, but I never liked the idea of relocating to Kansas. (whaddaya wanna bet I have to explain the Kansas reference?) ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/8 "2000-09-17T04:43:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gunslinger \* > \*\*but I never liked the idea of relocating to Kansas. (whaddaya wanna bet I have to explain the Kansas reference?) \*\* Yes, please do. ---
**Author:** ![Montfort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Montfort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Montfort)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/9 "2000-09-17T06:09:55Z")
Ft. Leavenworth, Kansas, home of many a prior mail fraud perpetrator, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![stuyguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@stuyguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stuyguy)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/10 "2000-09-17T07:02:27Z")
Here’s why I THINK some of the free mail schemes mentioned above won’t fly. (Mind you, these are just my theories.) 1. Real stamps (and meter strips) use ultraviolet ink. This is what triggers a sensor in the sorting/cancelling/routing machine to position the letter address-side-forward and right-side-up so the keyboard operator can read the address and scoot the letter to the right zip code. I would also imagine a letter w/o a UV stamp gets spit out for special handling, whereupon a pair of human eyes might see the bogus stamp and go “WTF?” (or, “Get me the Postal Police”). 2. Most cards/letters bearing a Return Mail/ Non-Profit/ Bulk Mail/ Presort/ Permit indicia also bear bar codes that tell the routing machine: 1. where to send the piece of mail 2. the postage cost, and 3. the business account that will be billed for that amount. Thus the bar codes do all the work before it gets to a human handler; the indicia itself is basically window dressing. ---
**Author:** ![Tretiak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a88e57/32.png) [@Tretiak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tretiak)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/11 "2000-09-17T13:41:49Z")
“free matter for the blind”? Why in the world would the blind get free mail? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/12 "2000-09-17T19:39:29Z")
Quoth bare: > [@](#): > > Reckon I wouldn’t use this method if it absolutely has to get there on time, but then it never does anyway! Actually, there are some (perfectly legal) tricks that you can use to speed up your mail, by making things easier for the post office. The first is to type out your addresses, rather than write them: Typed text can be read by an OCR computer, so a human needs never handle it. Secondly, always use the full nine-digit zip code. Third, you can actually produce bar codes for the ZIPs, the same as the Post Office uses-- I believe that WordPerfect has a tool to create them. I’m too lazy and unhurried to bother with these most of the time, but my dad always does. His letters always arrive the next day, and packages take between one and three days. ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2000, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/13 "2000-09-17T23:20:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bare \* > \*\*For free postage, > > 1. write “free matter for the blind” where the stamp goes. > 2. use one of those wildlife stamps you always get around christmas. > > This actually works for postage, I guess no one pays too much attention to envelopes as long as there appears to be a stamp affixed. Reckon I wouldn’t use this method if it absolutely has to get there on time, but then it never does anyway! \*\* A person who would defraud the blind and commit a crime to save 33 cents is the lowest person in the history of the universe. They should get cancer and die, except that cancer is too good for them. ---
**Author:** ![Gunslinger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gunslinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gunslinger)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2000, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/14 "2000-09-18T00:15:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Gunslinger \* > > \*\*(whaddaya wanna bet I have to explain the Kansas reference?) \*\* > > Yes, please do. \*\* > [@](#): > > _Montfort sayeth_ > **Ft. Leavenworth, Kansas, home of many a prior mail fraud perpetrator, perhaps?** Yep. ---
**Author:** ![bare](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bare/32/471_2.png) [@bare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bare)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2000, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/15 "2000-09-18T00:33:21Z")
Me thinks you miss the point lad, we’re talking of defrauding the gov’t, not the blind. The blind do not pay for it, it is only yet another loophole our gov’t provides to those in the know. ---
**Author:** ![Ezstrete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ea924/32.png) [@Ezstrete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ezstrete)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2000, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/16 "2000-09-18T02:15:12Z")
As one who remembers when there were two hand deliveries monday through Friday,and one on Saturday-----all of them without benefit of machinery,and at a time when envelopes came in all shapes and sizes, I wonder what type of institution the inmates are running? And before anyone sets up a howl let me point out that the “old neighborhoods” where all of this used to happen haven’t grown at all in the number of residences or people. The postal folk have earned the “snail mail” tag—and now they’re automated to boot! It’s like their ZIP system—who really needed it—the machine? ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2000, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/11-cents-extra-postage-for-square-envelopes/33361/17 "2000-09-18T15:00:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bare \* > \*\*Me thinks you miss the point lad, we’re talking of defrauding the gov’t, not the blind. The blind do not pay for it, it is only yet another loophole our gov’t provides to those in the know. \*\* Fair enough, **bare** than we will do this the official way. When you applied to become a guest of this message board, you agreed to the [following rules](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/member.php?action=signup): > [@](#): > > You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this BB to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, threatening, invasive of a person’s privacy, or otherwise violative of any law. > > You agree to abide by the wishes of the board moderators in interpreting and enforcing these rules. Refusal to cooperate with board moderators or to abide by these rules is grounds for revocation of your posting privileges. This is an official warning. Your post suggesting ways to defraud the United States Postal Service is a violation of this rule. You are not to post suggestions of how to commit fraud. If you repeat this, you will lose your posting privileges.