# 12 people shot dead at BATMAN movie screening in Denver. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 20, 2012, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835 "2012-07-20T09:31:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/361 "2012-07-23T20:44:21Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > The youngest son of an old and dear family we’ve been close to for fourty years now was in the Aurora theater with two of his four kids. Gordon Cowden is gone and once again the world makes no sense. I’m so sorry for your friends’ loss. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/362 "2012-07-23T22:14:27Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > I think you’re wrong. This is guns and possibly neuroscience research and guns and maybe autism (caused by vaccines) and guns and mental illness pleas and guns. It may not reach the level of the Truthers/Birthers, but it’ll become a part of the stable of CTs that get routinely trotted out regarding any of those issues. > > And Joe Scarborough is a morning host on MSNBC, so whether or not you know who he is, he’s not exactly an unknown figure in American TV. Ah, Joe Scarborough. The man with a dead aide in his office. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/363 "2012-07-23T22:41:22Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > I think you’re wrong. This is guns and possibly neuroscience research and guns and maybe autism (caused by vaccines) and guns and mental illness pleas and guns. It may not reach the level of the Truthers/Birthers, but it’ll become a part of the stable of CTs that get routinely trotted out regarding any of those issues. > > And Joe Scarborough is a morning host on MSNBC, so whether or not you know who he is, he’s not exactly an unknown figure in American TV. Well, I don’t watch TV (except for when specifically turn it on for the news and then shut if off in disgust :P) so I don’t know. I’ll take your word for it. I think there’s more of a local fallout than anything. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > As am I. But how can you be pro death penalty ‘sometimes’? I feel like it’s either all or nothing. I know a lot of people are okay with it except for when it really fails us, but then what if some rapist/murderer is put on trial and is sentenced to death and it’s later found he is innocent? It happens. How sure is ‘sure’? Obviously he’s guilty of the crime, but he’s a sick man. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/364 "2012-07-23T23:14:21Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > The youngest son of an old and dear family we’ve been close to for fourty years now was in the Aurora theater with two of his four kids. Gordon Cowden is gone and once again the world makes no sense. He, like his parents, brothers and sister is, or now was, just an incredibly strong, gentle, admirable person. Quiet, unassuming but with a wonderful sense of humor and intellect. His family writes that he was a true Texas gentleman and always intent on doing the right thing no matter the issue or cost. That’s about as well put as it can be and his loss is a painful thing to behold. You’ll probably hear the least about him as they’re private, quiet people but for those of us that knew him and know what the undeserving family must now face, the pain goes to our very soul and beyond. I’ll be at the funeral Friday. I don’t expect it will answer any questions or heal any wounds but I do think the strength of all the others there will allow us to focus on all that was so good and admirable in him and give focus to what is worthy of trying to emmulate. Gordon’s death is an enormous loss to everyone that knew him and finding where to put that, making sense of why he’s gone is something we may struggle with for years to come if not forever. It’s almost impossible to process the fact he’s just one of so many taken from us Saturday morning. Thank you for posting this, **lieu**. You helped make this more personal for us and more real. Your friends have my sympathy for the loss of their son, as do all the victims of this tragic crime. I know how distressed you must be at the news, and you have my sympathy, also. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/365 "2012-07-23T23:16:22Z")
And so it begins. [Alleged shooter’s mom: Reports she knew son was troubled were wrong](http://www.denverpost.com/theatershooting/ci_21139349/alleged-shooters-mom-reports-she-knew-son-was) > [@](#): > > Lawyer Lisa Damiani said her client Arlene Holmes knew nothing about the mass murder in Denver when she was awakened about 5:45 a.m. PST Friday by ABC News. Damiani she was asked if she was Arlene Holmes, and if her son was James Holmes. Reading a statement from Arlene, Damiani said “I said ‘Yes, you have the right person.’ But I was talking about myself.” ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/366 "2012-07-23T23:19:50Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The report doesn’t really provide much evidence that copycat murders are an actual issue. There aren’t actually that many if these incidents, and of the ones that occur I haven’t seen any evidence they were inspired by their predecessors. As a general rule, some combination of mental illness and strange political views seem to be the cause. > > I think the whole fear of “copycats” is just another example of the urge people have to pin these incidents on some flawed social institution. Some people like to blame the violent videogames, or lack of religious instruction in schools, or whatever. > > And some people want to blame the news media. Cries of encouraging “Copycats” gives them a mechanism. That by reporting these incidents “wrong”, the media is creating the next mass murderer. I think people making that claim need to come up with some actual evidence that showing a killers face, or using his name or whatever has actually inspired another murderer. It is interesting you bring this up now. I’ve just this moment finished reading Malcolm Gladwell’s book ‘ **The Tipping Point** ’, and the above link had already reminded me of the passage on teen smoking. (Quick summary: most of the strategies to reduce teen smoking were having the opposite of the intended effect because they were unintentionally glamourizing smoking.) In the Afterword to the January 2002 first e-book edition, pp. 179 - 184, ‘ **Understanding the Age of Isolation** ’ deals with the aftermath of the Columbine shooting. Here is a brief quotation > [@](#): > > The school massacre at Columbine High in Littleton, Colorado happened on April 20, 1999. In the twenty-two months that followed, there were nineteen separate incidents of school violence accross the United States - ten of them foiled, fortunately, before anyone got hurt - each patterned, almost eerily, on the Columbine shootings. Seth Trickey, a seventh grader in Fort Gibson, Oklahoma, who pulled out a 9mm semiautomatic handgun and fired fifteen rounds into a group of classmates in December of 1999, was so obsessed with the Columbine shootings that before the incident he was receiving psychological counseling. A seventeen year old at Millbrae, California, was arrested after threatening to ‘do a Columbine’ at his school. Police found an arsenal of fifteen guns and rifles in his home. He continues on from there; I present that as a cite that copycats are a concern. And as far as I’m concerned, all these loser shooters are copycats - I would be very interested in pursuing what the forensic psychiatrist points up as ‘the wrong way to report on these mass shootings’. To what extent are they influenced by what they know of how previous shooters operated? Most importantly, are the news reports accidentally glamourizing mass shootings through their reportage? ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/367 "2012-07-24T00:11:02Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > I am not a psycho killer but I have exhibited delusional behavior in the past. Thank you for the insight. It helps. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/368 "2012-07-24T01:06:48Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > [Page 89 of the _The Dark Knight Returns_](http://i.imgur.com/kawVV.jpg) I don’t know what all that Joker business was about, but when I saw him with orange hair, I immediately thought of this. > [@Zsofia](#): > > I saw a news story in the local paper that 50 people have called the local theater (here in South Carolina) they interviewed because they were concerned about safety at yesterday’s movie showings. > > WTF did these 50 people ASK on the phone? “Uh, do you have Bat-Masked-Gunman-Repellent-Spray available for guests?” “Is this guaranteed to be a gunplay-free showing?” “We actually have a shooting in progress, ma’am. You might want to try back in an hour.” **lieu** , that is terrible and I am sorry. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/369 "2012-07-24T01:11:42Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > But how can you be pro death penalty ‘sometimes’? I’m not. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/370 "2012-07-24T04:04:29Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > On the other hand, it may just be cheaper to kill him. I’ve seen studies showing it’s actually cheaper to keep someone in prison for decades than to put him on Death Row. All the extra security and automatic appeals etc. > [@Kolga](#): > > If this guy is found to be incompetent to stand trial due to mental issues, all hell is going to break loose. I don’t believe a finding of insanity should be based on supposed popular opinion. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Surely everyone who votes the kill the guy in a trial believes there is “zero room for doubt.” Well, there’s zero room for doubt and then there’s zero room for doubt. Ya know what I mean? ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/371 "2012-07-24T05:09:48Z")
[Warner Bros. is donating to the Aurora fund](http://www.denverpost.com/theatershooting/ci_21142447/warner-bros-announce-substantial-donation-shooting-victims). I just donated to [this girl’s](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/petra-anderson-hope-rises-relief-fund) fund. Her story was…wow. A little [glurgy](http://bstrait.wordpress.com/2012/07/22/a-miracle-inside-the-the-aurora-shooting-one-victims-story/), but jeebs! Talk about odds. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/372 "2012-07-24T05:10:53Z")
[Warner Bros. is donating to the Aurora fund](http://www.denverpost.com/theatershooting/ci_21142447/warner-bros-announce-substantial-donation-shooting-victims). I just donated to [this girl’s](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/petra-anderson-hope-rises-relief-fund) fund. Her story was…wow. A little [glurgy](http://bstrait.wordpress.com/2012/07/22/a-miracle-inside-the-the-aurora-shooting-one-victims-story/), but jeebs! Talk about odds. > [@](#): > > The doctor explains that Petra’s brain has had from birth a small “defect” in it. It is a tiny channel of fluid running through her skull…Only a CAT scan would catch it, and Petra would have never noticed it. > > But in Petra’s case, the shotgun buck shot…enters her brain from the exact point of this defect. Like a marble through a small tube, the defect channels the bullet from Petra’s nose through her brain. It turns slightly several times, and comes to rest at the rear of her brain. And in the process, the bullet misses all the vital areas of the brain. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/373 "2012-07-24T14:22:00Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > I saw a news story in the local paper that 50 people have called the local theater (here in South Carolina) they interviewed because they were concerned about safety at yesterday’s movie showings. > > WTF did these 50 people ASK on the phone? “Uh, do you have Bat-Masked-Gunman-Repellent-Spray available for guests?” “Is this guaranteed to be a gunplay-free showing?” What possible security questions could you have that the teenage kid who answers the phone at the AMC Googleplex can possibly answer to your satisfaction? “We’ve installed automated gunshot-homing turrets in the ceiling, but there was a tragic incident where someone snapped their gum too loud; they’re working on it”. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/374 "2012-07-24T17:24:57Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I don’t believe a finding of insanity should be based on supposed popular opinion. Did I say that it was? I simply stated a fact - public opinion doesn’t always recognize the decisions of a court as valid. If this guy is either found incompetent to stand trial, or NGRI (which are two different things), either one is going to create a massive shitstorm of outrage. Just because either of those findings may be legally valid doesn’t mean that people won’t be pissed off at them. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Nader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Darth\_Nader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Nader)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/375 "2012-07-24T17:31:07Z")
Where has it been confirmed that he _warned_ folks about his apartment? I’d bet it was more like– (inside police car) MANIAC: Whoo! What a rush! I’m the Joker! Say, how many did I take out when my apartment blew up? The downstairs neighbor’s s.o. has family living nearby. Who cares? I only know this because [fuck local TV “news”.](http://www.valleycentral.com/news/story.aspx?id=778884) ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/376 "2012-07-24T21:32:13Z")
Let the lawsuits commence: [http://gawker.com/5928633/aurora-shooting-victim-sues-movie-theater-for-negligence?comment=51243219](http://gawker.com/5928633/aurora-shooting-victim-sues-movie-theater-for-negligence?comment=51243219) > [@](#): > > (Torrance) Brown claims in his lawsuit that it was negligent of Century 16 not to guard or alarm their emergency doors. Shooting suspect James Holmes reportedly propped open the emergency doors before returning to his vehicle to fetch his weapons. > > In addition to the movie theater, Brown has also named Holmes’ doctors as defendants for alleged mismanagement of Holmes’ as-yet-unconfirmed medical condition. > > Brown is also suing Warner Bros., claiming that The Dark Knight Rises was so violent that it delayed the reaction of many moviegoers who thought the shooting was a promotional stunt. The story also mentions that he escaped unscathed, but is suffering from “extreme trauma.” ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/377 "2012-07-24T21:44:05Z")
I’m sure that Torrance Brown didn’t come up with this theory and idea to sue everyone associated with the incident on his own…some ambulance chaser signed him up as soon as he could. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2012, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/378 "2012-07-24T23:03:28Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > [Warner Bros. is donating to the Aurora fund](http://www.denverpost.com/theatershooting/ci_21142447/warner-bros-announce-substantial-donation-shooting-victims). > > I just donated to [this girl’s](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/petra-anderson-hope-rises-relief-fund) fund. Her story was…wow. A little [glurgy](http://bstrait.wordpress.com/2012/07/22/a-miracle-inside-the-the-aurora-shooting-one-victims-story/), but jeebs! Talk about odds. > [@](#): > > The doctor explains that Petra’s brain has had from birth a small “defect” in it. It is a tiny channel of fluid running through her skull…Only a CAT scan would catch it, and Petra would have never noticed it. > > But in Petra’s case, the shotgun buck shot…enters her brain from the exact point of this defect. Like a marble through a small tube, the defect channels the bullet from Petra’s nose through her brain. It turns slightly several times, and comes to rest at the rear of her brain. And in the process, the bullet misses all the vital areas of the brain. Wow. Reminds me of a smaller crime that happened here ten years ago or so. The owner of a mini-mart was shot in the chest during a robbery. During surgery they found a two-inch aneurism on his aorta. Even with his chest already open, it made the surgery team nervous. More in line with the basic thread - [a message from Batman regarding guns](http://dresdencodak.tumblr.com/post/27659958722/words-to-live-by). Appologies if it’s already been posted. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/379 "2012-07-25T02:24:17Z")
Heh. [Victims get a visit from Christian Bale](http://www.denverpost.com/theatershooting/ci_21147699/christian-bale-town-visiting-victims-shooting). That’s…kind of awesome. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2012, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835/380 "2012-07-25T02:50:31Z")
Man, you really get picked apart when you do something like this. The CNN website was saying he had completely shunned Facebook, Twitter and such websites, but the authorities were working to determine if he had a sex ad up on Adult Friend Finders. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/12-people-shot-dead-at-batman-movie-screening-in-denver/628835.md?page=20)