# 13 October 2015 Democratic debate (for commentary during & after) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 14, 2015, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593 "2015-10-14T00:20:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/81 "2015-10-14T12:29:46Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I stopped reading after clicking the link and seeing “Mostly True”. They hardly ever go higher than that! That basically means it’s true. > > Not to mention that one of the fundamental axioms of politics is when you’re explaining, you’re losing. Trying to explain away the Soviet trip you took the day after you got married and subsequently called a honeymoon but now say was not really a honeymoon…yeah. Good luck with that. :rolleyes: > > ETA: To clarify where I am coming from, I took a trip through the Soviet Union at around the same time and came back very impressed. I have argued on this very board that Gorbachev should have been given more time to implement his more humane form of socialism. So I am quite left-wing, particularly on economics. But I am also more realistic than most of the lefties I know. If there was a carbon copy of me running in the presidential primaries, there is no way I would vote for alt-me. Maybe if my doppelgänger was running to be mayor of Seattle or something. But not the presidency, because I don’t like putting up sacrificial lambs. Maybe you should go back and read the article. Seriously. This is a case of “mostly true” meaning “literally true, but…”. This was a diplomatic trip between sister cities, Bernie was part of a delegation, and it only ended up being a honeymoon because the timing happened to coincide with his marriage. It was at the beginning of perestroika and, as you mention, Gorbachev was in power. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/82 "2015-10-14T12:35:00Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Trying to explain away the Soviet trip you took the day after you got married and subsequently called a honeymoon but now say was not really a honeymoon…yeah. Good luck with that. :rolleyes: I believe the Red Scare has been dead for some time. I don’t think anyone gives a rat’s ass about a trip to the USSR ages ago. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/83 "2015-10-14T12:39:33Z")
Mike Huckabee’s bizarre tweet during the debate: > [@](#): > > I trust @BernieSanders with my tax dollars like I trust a North Korean chef with my labrador! #DemDebate Yeah, Mike. We know you’re still alive. Now crawl back under that rock with the other vermin. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/84 "2015-10-14T12:42:06Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Mike Huckabee’s bizarre tweet during the debate: > > Yeah, Mike. We know you’re still alive. Now crawl back under that rock with the other vermin. Wow. Huck isn’t on my radar, really, except as “the über-Christian guy.” Is he usually openly racist, or is this new for him? ---
**Author:** ![ElderSign](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eldersign/32/8263_2.png) [@ElderSign](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElderSign)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/85 "2015-10-14T12:47:10Z")
This is the most national exposure any of the other candidates besides HRC have received. Heading into the debate, Clinton had a RCP average of 43.3% and Bernie 25.1%. Everyone else was under 1% (unannounced Biden 17%). I have to assume that although the ratings and media coverage will be lower than the GOP debates, Democrats will start to dismiss Biden, so he will lose some points, which may be Bernie’s gain. Although this is HRC’s election, I have to imagine some older liberals liked Bernie’s Noam Chomsky imitation, and the young ones liked his angst. There is a reason why Bernie is an internet phenomenon- his sentences could have easily come from parts of this very message board. Webb is on the wrong side…Chaffey seems like a lame standard politician…O’Malley was boring…HRC performed well considering she had Anderson Cooper’s support. ---
**Author:** ![ElderSign](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eldersign/32/8263_2.png) [@ElderSign](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElderSign)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/86 "2015-10-14T12:50:04Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I believe the Red Scare has been dead for some time. I don’t think anyone gives a rat’s ass about a trip to the USSR ages ago. I agree. I’m not sure most Americans even know what the USSR was or that vacationing in Russia used to be a taboo thing. 🙂 Anyway, Bernie is open about his socialist views, so it shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone watching him what he visited there, diplomatic trip or vacation. It’s a non-issue in 2015. Conservatives won’t vote for him regardless. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/87 "2015-10-14T12:52:59Z")
> [@CGav8r](#): > > Not a problem. Also, despite his lackluster debate performance, and some stances I disagree with, I like Jim Webb; don’t forget his exchange with W. after Webb was newly-sworn in (from the NY Times): Yeah, he gets permanent karma points for that exchange. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/88 "2015-10-14T12:56:02Z")
From the little I’ve had time to watch and the tons of highlights I’ve seen, I think Hilary did a very good job. I would still rather have Bernie, but Hilary would do fine, I’m sure. Bernie did not do as good as I’d hoped. He’s still my first choice, but he didn’t get his message across as clearly as I’d have liked. I knew nothing about Webb before this debate. He might be a great guy, but he came across as angry and bitter. Chafee flubbed badly. He should have just owned the vote and explained that times were different, he’s evolved, or some other acceptable reason for a change of mind. He seemed very nervous. O’Malley. I don’t know. He says the right things usually, but his record isn’t that great. I thought he was going to cry when he was talking about mass shootings, but he just doesn’t seem sincere to me. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/89 "2015-10-14T12:59:19Z")
One more thought about Webb: his Vietnam service was genuinely courageous, but I think it’s unrealistic to draw a connection between one’s actions under fire in a war that ended in January 1973, and one’s fitness for the Presidency in January 2017. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/90 "2015-10-14T13:07:38Z")
The debate addressed issues and, for the most part, avoided set piece speeches. Interesting to contrast the Dem and Rep players: Clinton v Trump Sanders v Carson Webb v Fiorina The Dems really looked good. Crane ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/91 "2015-10-14T13:15:42Z")
This was a good showing for Hillary. Her goal was to avoid land mines and she did that. The rest of the field seemed content to let her go about her business. And really, what are those 3 other guys doing on the stage? They wouldn’t even be at the kids’ table on the GOP side with their numbers. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/92 "2015-10-14T13:29:56Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > Chafee flubbed badly. He should have just owned the vote and explained that times were different, he’s evolved, or some other acceptable reason for a change of mind. He seemed very nervous. Feel the Chafe! ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/93 "2015-10-14T13:32:50Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Wow. Huck isn’t on my radar, really, except as “the über-Christian guy.” Is he usually openly racist, or is this new for him? He is usually openly racist. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/94 "2015-10-14T14:22:08Z")
I’m sure Chafee is a really sweet guy. Webb observed the Republican party had moved away from him, so he’s running Democrat. This is too bad because he would have been the diamond in the cesspool at the Republican food fights. I can’t believe 50% of this country (those loyal to the Republican party) enjoy the prospect of having a broad selection of buffoons to choose from–Webb strikes me as having the strength, honor, and integrity to slam some reality back into the party. Of course, he hasn’t. And he walked away from that battle. O’Malley didn’t fuck it up. He hasn’t got “it” so I don’t see him beating Hillary or Bernie, but what he didn’t do was give cause to strike his name from the ballot. Sanders: Pretty sure he never sleeps. Pretty sure he’s an Aspie. He strikes me as someone who gets headaches thinking down to the level of normal people, but he does it anyway because he feels he should. Angry professor. If he gets the presidency, he will truly transform this country for the better, but we’ll never really be comfortable with _him_. Good president, not ‘presidential’. Which totally works for me–I hate affectation. Clinton: The safe bet. She will not change anything, but she won’t make things worse. Funny thing: my kids (15 & 17) were watching. They liked Sanders and felt he was nuts, but honest. They thought Hillary looked like she had already been president (because of her polish), but they also were scared of her. Clever, manipulative, and effective like Saruman, only not quite as outwardly creepy/evil. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/95 "2015-10-14T14:23:22Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Wow. Huck isn’t on my radar, really, except as “the über-Christian guy.” Is he usually openly racist, or is this new for him? How in the name of common sense do you get “racist” out of that quote? I think it’s pretty clever. Everybody knows how poorly-fed the North Koreans are; and if you take Saunders at his word about how much new spending he wants to do, your tax dollars are in as much danger from him as a dog would be in a semi-starving society. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/96 "2015-10-14T14:29:48Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > How in the name of common sense do you get “racist” out of that quote? The implications that Koreans eat dogs is a common racist (anti-Korean, or anti-Asian in general) trope. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/97 "2015-10-14T14:31:39Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > How in the name of common sense do you get “racist” out of that quote? > > I think it’s pretty clever. Everybody knows how poorly-fed the North Koreans are; and if you take Saunders at his word about how much new spending he wants to do, your tax dollars are in as much danger from him as a dog would be in a semi-starving society. It’s racist in that it reinforces the stereotype that Asians eat dogs. “Your” tax dollars are already being spent, Sanders would just reprioritize the spending as well as collect more from our deadbeat welfare queen millionaires and corporations. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/98 "2015-10-14T14:32:52Z")
It’s an especially poor choice of analogy, given [Huckabee’s history with his own son and dogs](http://www.snopes.com/politics/politicians/huckabeedog.asp). ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/99 "2015-10-14T14:34:37Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Anyway, the debate. I was blown away by how much Hillary kicked ass. I had been one of those getting skittish about her this summer, but then I was somewhat reassured by a recent _Meet the Press_ appearance. Now I am more than reassured: I am excited by her candidacy again. She was absolutely dominant. I had no idea she had that in her. Clinton is a very good debater. She has had tons of practice at it as well (she had a few 8 years ago ;)) and definitely puts in the work in debate prep. It helps that she really enjoys the wonky aspects, so it seems like she has fun up there (far more fun than just delivering a stump speech). ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593/100 "2015-10-14T14:35:33Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Finally, Jim Webb looked like he was holding in a fart all night for fear of shitting his pants. Yeah, we get it Jim. You went to Vietnam. If it wasn’t for you, we might have lost that war. Oh wait… Webb looked like the dumb jock who signed up for the debate team by mistake. Dumb jock? Are you kidding me? I can see not liking the guy, thinking he comes across as too stiff, disagreeing with him on his positions, but I can’t see anyone thinking he came across as dumb. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/13-october-2015-democratic-debate-for-commentary-during-after/734593.md?page=6)