# 14th Amendment: Ratified?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [April 11, 2004, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405 "2004-04-11T01:35:04Z")
**Posts on this page:** 7
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Alien2022](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alien2022)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/1 "2004-04-11T01:35:04Z")
This one is fairly straight forward. Some people that I have been involved in a heated debate with have claimed that since the 14th Amendment was never ratified, it does not exist.
While that would hold to be true. The Amendment must have been ratified to be included in the Constitution. I’ve done some of my own research (quick Google searches) and have found that there is indeed evidence to support that the 14th Amendment was ratified.
Basically, was the 14th Amendment ratified? By which states, and when?
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### Author:  [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/2 "2004-04-11T02:15:44Z")
> [@](#):
>
> The fourteenth amendment to the Constitution of the United States was proposed to the legislatures of the several States by the Thirty-ninth Congress, on the 13th of June, 1866. It was declared, in a certificate of the Secretary of State dated July 28, 1868 to have been ratified by the legislatures of 28 of the 37 States. The dates of ratification were: Connecticut, June 25, 1866; New Hampshire, July 6, 1866; Tennessee, July 19, 1866; New Jersey, September 11, 1866 (subsequently the legislature rescinded its ratification, and on March 24, 1868, readopted its resolution of rescission over the Governor’s veto, and on Nov. 12, 1980, expressed support for the amendment); Oregon, September 19, 1866 (and rescinded its ratification on October 15, 1868); Vermont, October 30, 1866; Ohio, January 4, 1867 (and rescinded its ratification on January 15, 1868); New York, January 10, 1867; Kansas, January 11, 1867; Illinois, January 15, 1867; West Virginia, January 16, 1867; Michigan, January 16, 1867; Minnesota, January 16, 1867; Maine, January 19, 1867; Nevada, January 22, 1867; Indiana, January 23, 1867; Missouri, January 25, 1867; Rhode Island, February 7, 1867; Wisconsin, February 7, 1867; Pennsylvania, February 12, 1867; Massachusetts, March 20, 1867; Nebraska, June 15, 1867; Iowa, March 16, 1868; Arkansas, April 6, 1868; Florida, June 9, 1868; North Carolina, July 4, 1868 (after having rejected it on December 14, 1866); Louisiana, July 9, 1868 (after having rejected it on February 6, 1867); South Carolina, July 9, 1868 (after having rejected it on December 20, 1866).
>
> Ratification was completed on July 9, 1868.
>
> The amendment was subsequently ratified by Alabama, July 13, 1868; Georgia, July 21, 1868 (after having rejected it on November 9, 1866); Virginia, October 8, 1869 (after having rejected it on January 9, 1867); Mississippi, January 17, 1870; Texas, February 18, 1870 (after having rejected it on October 27, 1866); Delaware, February 12, 1901 (after having rejected it on February 8, 1867); Maryland, April 4, 1959 (after having rejected it on March 23, 1867); California, May 6, 1959; Kentucky, March 18, 1976 (after having rejected it on January 8, 1867).
From here: [http://www.nps.gov/malu/documents/amend14.htm](http://www.nps.gov/malu/documents/amend14.htm)
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### Author:  [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/3 "2004-04-11T02:22:59Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#):
>
> From here: [http://www.nps.gov/malu/documents/amend14.htm](http://www.nps.gov/malu/documents/amend14.htm)
Going by the count and the dates, it would appear that rescissions by state legislatures are (or were) not recognized by the Secretary of State. The necessary total did get reached, but if you allow rescissions, not until about a year after the official adoption.
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### Author:  [@Alien2022](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alien2022)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/4 "2004-04-11T02:23:00Z")
My next question is does Ohio rescinding its ratification, void the process? Or does it have no effect?
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### Author:  [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/5 "2004-04-11T03:17:44Z")
> [@Alien2022](#):
>
> This one is fairly straight forward. Some people that I have been involved in a heated debate with have claimed that since the 14th Amendment was never ratified, it does not exist.
>
> While that would hold to be true. The Amendment must have been ratified to be included in the Constitution. I’ve done some of my own research (quick Google searches) and have found that there is indeed evidence to support that the 14th Amendment was ratified.
>
> Basically, was the 14th Amendment ratified? By which states, and when?
Hasn’t the law moved well past any argument as to the legitimacy of the 14th amendment? I mean important court decisions are based on it and subsequent practice’s and law’s relying on those decisions have long since rendered moot any discussion of the legitimacy of the amendment.
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### Author:  [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/6 "2004-04-11T03:21:24Z")
Make that “practices” and “laws.” As I’ve been forced to say before, English really is my native language. Honest.
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### Author:  [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2004, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/14th-amendment-ratified/239405/7 "2004-04-11T03:58:49Z")
> [@David Simmons](#):
>
> Hasn’t the law moved well past any argument as to the legitimacy of the 14th amendment? I mean important court decisions are based on it and subsequent practice’s and law’s relying on those decisions have long since rendered moot any discussion of the legitimacy of the amendment.
Yes, this is exactly correct, but there are huge numbers of tax avoiders and various other kooks in our country who operate under the delusion that if they can somehow find a loophole in the correct procedure for the passage of a bill or amendment not only will it become immediately invalidated but all subsequent laws that refer to it are equally void.
It doesn’t matter that no court will agree to this, because the courts are part of the conspiracy.
This wonderful site, the [TAX PROTESTER FAQ](http://evans-legal.com/dan/tpfaq.html) refers to dozens of arguments like these.
There have been various instances of legislatures first ratifying an amendment and then later rescinding that ratification. As far as I am aware, none of these have ever been declared to be valid by any final higher court decision.
This probably would have become a major battle had a 36th state ratified the Equal Rights Amendment in the allotted time.
[http://www.equalrightsamendment.org/era.htm](http://www.equalrightsamendment.org/era.htm)
> [@](#):
>
> Hopes for victory continued to dim as other states postponed consideration or defeated ratification bills. Illinois changed its rules to require a three-fifths majority to ratify an amendment, thereby ensuring that their repeated simple majority votes in favor of the ERA did not count. Other states proposed or passed rescission bills, despite legal precedent that states do not have the power to retract a ratification.
That would have been an epic battle and probably would have settled the question for all time. But it didn’t happen and the earlier examples are just murky enough to allow some to continue the argument.