# 1st person or 2nd person when writing a bio? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 22, 2007, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985 "2007-03-22T03:44:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![benny73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@benny73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/benny73)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/1 "2007-03-22T03:44:35Z")
I once read somewhere a long time ago that, according to an “expert,” a person should write their biography in the 2nd person, though I can’t recall the reason(s) given. Might any of you seriously brilliant people know why the second person perspective is the way to go (if true)? I would think it awkward, but then what do I know. Also, can any of you tell me if it’s legal to write a bio and insert lots of quotes from a book that is no longer in print (though said references will be attributed to the book in question)? Thanks VERY MUCH(!!) in advance for your comments, if any. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/2 "2007-03-22T04:13:51Z")
The second person is “you.” As in, you went to the store and met with your political manager to test the waters about your political candidacy." I can’t imagine you meant that. Nobody writes a biography that way. Even worse, when you say “a person should write their biography” it almost sounds as if you’re talking about an autobiography. That leaves first person, “I” and third person, “he or she.” 99.999% of autobiographies are written in the first person. For good and obvious reasons. 99.999% of biographies are written in the third person. For good and obvious reasons. Out of print is not at all the same thing as out of copyright. Only books that came out pre-1923 are certain to be out of copyright. You can certainly quote books if you attribute them. You are limited in how much of a copyrighted book you can quote. There is no exact formula for this, however. Too much is too much and this will be pretty apparent to everyone. How much is too much? That’s a question for philosophers. Just don’t overdo it. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/3 "2007-03-22T04:29:15Z")
But the exceptions can be a lotta fun: I love _The Autobiography of Alice B. Toklas_, by Gertrude Stein. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/4 "2007-03-22T04:37:01Z")
A best-selling novel written in the second person: Jay McInerney’s _Bright Lights, Big City_ (1984): > [@](#): > > You are not the kind of guy who would be in a place like this at this time of morning. But here you are, and you cannot say that the terrain is entirely unfamiliar, although the details are funny. You are at a nightclub talking to a girl with a shaved head. The club is either Heartbreak or the Lizard Lounge. All might come clear if you could just slip into the bathroom and do a little more Bolivian Marching Powder. ---
**Author:** ![benny73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@benny73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/benny73)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/5 "2007-03-22T04:37:40Z")
Mapcase, thanks!! ---
**Author:** ![daffyduck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ec9cab/32.png) [@daffyduck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/daffyduck)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/6 "2007-03-22T04:41:30Z")
**Exapno Mapcase** nailed it. The only “biography” that you would write for yourself should not be in any person. Born: date Schools attended: Miss Manners College of Baloney - etc. If you need to personalize it, use the first person: “I was born…” in which case you are now writing an autobiography. Pretending that you are someone else writing about you would be silly or deceitful or pretentious. I was taught to remember “person” with this little saying… "I am the first person, you are the second person and he is the third person. Using your name can also be third person. If you and I are talking and you say (about yourself) “Benny73 is a great guy” then that is speaking in the third person because you are speaking about Benny as someone other than you or me. People who speak of themselves in the third person are universally recognized as idiots. ---
**Author:** ![CaveMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cavemike/32/16379_2.png) [@CaveMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaveMike)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/7 "2007-03-22T05:11:06Z")
[QUOTE=Walloon] A best-selling novel written in the second person: Jay McInerney’s _Bright Lights, Big City_ (1984): > [@](#): > > You are not the kind of guy who would be in a place like this at this time of morning. But here you are, and you cannot say that the terrain is entirely unfamiliar, although the details are funny. You are at a nightclub talking to a girl with a shaved head. The club is either Heartbreak or the Lizard Lounge. All might come clear if you could just slip into the bathroom and do a little more Bolivian Marching Powder. [/QUOTE] If you go to the bathroom and snort coke, turn to page 46. If you offer the girl a ride in your DeLorean, turn to page 78. Reminds me of the Choose Your Own Adventure books from the same time. I remember the book, but I never read it. It is interesting to know that it was written in second person. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/8 "2007-03-22T12:18:08Z")
[QUOTE=CaveMike] If you go to the bathroom and snort coke, turn to page 46. If you offer the girl a ride in your DeLorean, turn to page 78. Reminds me of the Choose Your Own Adventure books from the same time. I remember the book, but I never read it. It is interesting to know that it was written in second person. [/QUOTE] I skimmed over a few pages of a novel by Edna O’Brien that was written in the second person, many years ago. Can’t remember which one, it’s not like I’m an authority on Edna. ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/9 "2007-03-22T13:15:17Z")
The songwriter Al Stewart does seem to be able to do this. [_Year of the Cat_](http://www.alstewart.com/lyrics/yearofthecat.htm) On a morning from a Bogart movie In a country where they turn back time You go strolling through the crowd like Peter Lorre Contemplating a crime [_Flying Sorcery_](http://www.alstewart.com/lyrics/flyingsorcery.htm) With your photographs of Kitty Hawk And the biplanes on your wall You were always Amy Johnson From the time that you were small. No schoolroom kept you grounded While your thoughts could get away You were taking off in Tiger Moths Your wings against the brush-strokes of the day Are you there? [_Sand In Your Shoes_](http://www.alstewart.com/lyrics/sandinyourshoes.htm) You always were a city kid T hough you were country raised And back in some forgotten time W e shared the cold north days But the simple life was not your style, And you just had to escape So it’s goodbye to my lady of the islands [_Not The One_](http://www.alstewart.com/lyrics/nottheone.htm) And so you sit there in the middle of the carpet With her suitcases around you And it comes to you she journeyed to the center of your life But she never really found you Just another girl in a raincoat Who shared the passing of the days And you’re glad of the warmth that she gave you And you hardly need to say That she’s not the one you’re thinking of No she’s not the one you really want Just a point along the line you’re leaving from ---
**Author:** ![benny73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@benny73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/benny73)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/10 "2007-03-22T15:17:36Z")
Hey, thanks EVERYBODY!!! I’m going to read 'em all a few more times and let it all soak into my tired head. I knew this place had smart, friendly people, and you proved it. Thanks!!! ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/11 "2007-03-22T15:30:48Z")
Ray Davies of _The Kinks_, seminal Brit rock band of the 60s and 70s, managed to write his own _Unauthorised Autobiography_ **X-Ray** by creating a situation in which the author (Ray Davies), as a flunky of a future corporation, goes to interview old rocker Ray Davies. Pretty clever really. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2007, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1st-person-or-2nd-person-when-writing-a-bio/396985/12 "2007-03-22T16:30:58Z")
Oh, I know of numerous works of fiction in the second person. Bright Lights, Big City is a stunningly good debut, no doubt. There are many examples. And writers do odder things than that. Laurence Sterne’s Tristram Shandy is a first person account of his life that starts with his conception. It’s the first postmodern novel. From 1767. But the OP asked about biographies. I don’t doubt that somewhere, sometime, somebody wrote a biography or an autobiography in the second person. People do things to be different, noticeable, weird, perverse, experimental, arty, or an asshole. That’s why I threw in the 99.999% CYA. I just have never come across one in real life.