# $200K/year isn't rich. Why aren't we taxing corporations? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 12, 2011, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110 "2011-09-12T23:36:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/201 "2011-09-14T22:48:24Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > In a lot of areas, yes. Public schools in a lot of areas are absolutely atrocious. You might want to look up what “basic” means. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/202 "2011-09-14T22:53:26Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > Forgive me if I don’t think that we should increase taxes on the poor before someone who lives in a 700k home. Srsly. Here are some $800K houses: [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/sc2922callegrandevis.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/sc2922callegrandevis.jpg) [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/dp34821caminocapistrano.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/dp34821caminocapistrano.jpg) [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/ny2620172nd1.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/ny2620172nd1.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/203 "2011-09-14T22:54:29Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > You might want to look up what “basic” means. I consider giving your kid a reasonable education “basic”. You? ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/204 "2011-09-14T23:00:16Z")
Honest question, any of the people in this thread arguing about how 200,000 really isn’t all that much: Do you believe that revenues need to be increased to solve our debt problem? I suspect that anyone hemming and hawing about how 200k/yr is just aw shucks salt of the earth regular folk, are the same people who think we can “cut” our way out of a recession…somehow. > [@Terr](#): > > Srsly. > > Here are some $800K houses: > > [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/sc2922callegrandevis.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/sc2922callegrandevis.jpg) > > [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/dp34821caminocapistrano.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/dp34821caminocapistrano.jpg) > > [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/ny2620172nd1.jpg](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/files/2009/11/ny2620172nd1.jpg) Just FYI your links are not working for me. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/205 "2011-09-14T23:03:59Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > I consider giving your kid a reasonable education “basic”. You? I’m saying “well, yes, I could go with A), but A) is not good enough for me so I go with B)” is the textbook definition of “not basic”. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/206 "2011-09-14T23:10:31Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > Just FYI your links are not working for me. Oops Lemme try again Here is a $1M home in chicago: [http://images.forbes.com/media/lifestyle/2006/12/13/5\_1214home.jpg](http://images.forbes.com/media/lifestyle/2006/12/13/5_1214home.jpg) $800K home in CA: [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/dp34821caminocapistrano/](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/dp34821caminocapistrano/) another one: [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/ny2620172nd1/](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/ny2620172nd1/) [http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/sc2922callegrandevis/](http://southcoasthomes.ocregister.com/2009/11/10/800k-of-house-in-south-county-vs-country/sc2922callegrandevis/) ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/207 "2011-09-14T23:11:37Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > I’m saying “well, yes, I could go with A), but A) is not good enough for me so I go with B)” is the textbook definition of “not basic”. “well, yes, I could go with bread and water, but bread and water is not good enough for me, so I will go with better food”. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/208 "2011-09-14T23:13:00Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > Honest question, any of the people in this thread arguing about how 200,000 really isn’t all that much: Do you believe that revenues need to be increased to solve our debt problem? I don’t. The federal government is a monster that is spending way too much. It needs to be cut to its constitutional size. ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/209 "2011-09-14T23:13:35Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Let’s try to figure it out. > > $200K income will get you $120K net or so. > > Now let’s look at reasonable monthly expenses for an upper middle class family - husband, wife, one kid. Not “rich” - just upper middle class. Somewhere like California or NYC. > > # $4K mortgage payment $1.2K groceries $1.5K school tuition for kid (if in private school) $1K real estate taxes $800 utilities/internet/cable $400 gas/car insurance $400 entertainment > > $9.3K total. Multiply by 12 = 111K - basically there is your 120K. And I really just took basics into account. Left out all kinds of expenses. I am sure you can think of quite a few. Amazing what you consider basic. How do you think all those families who actually earn a middle income live? If you think it takes $200K to live a ‘basic’ life, then how do the 97% of folks who make less than that manage? For example my husband and I make about $75K a year. We have 4 children. We live what I consider to be a quite comfortable, even luxurious life. But it doesn’t include private school or a $700K home. We have 1 car for 6 people and certainly spend less than $1000 on food. We live a cushy, middle-class life. Imagine that! ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/210 "2011-09-14T23:15:51Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “well, yes, I could go with bread and water, but bread and water is not good enough for me, so I will go with better food”. Precisely. Wait, you think you were providing a counterpoint ? Let’s take it from the top: “basic” means “at or from the base”. The bottom of the barrel. The most frugal. If you choose something that is above that,\* you’re not doing something basic.\* By definition, if something is available that is cheaper and worse than what you choose, that is the base. Not what you’re doing. Glad we could clear that up. ---
**Author:** ![gurujulp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ba9def/32.png) [@gurujulp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gurujulp)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/211 "2011-09-14T23:18:47Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > If you are making 200k a year and you don’t have 1% of your yearly income in cash on hand that you can host guests, why is that not an indicator that you are doing something wrong as opposed to “they cannot afford more taxation”? Can and would are different things. Would YOU invite someone you know a bit through a message board to your home by buying them multi-thousand dollar tickets to visit? Not me! Could I if I made that kind of money? If I didn’t want a decent vacation or whatever else I would want that money to go to, sure. Again, though- I probably wouldn’t have it- you don’t seem to have noticed that I have admitted to bad money management skills. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/212 "2011-09-14T23:21:38Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Precisely. > Wait, you think you were providing a counterpoint ? > > Let’s take it from the top: “basic” means “at or from the base”. The bottom of the barrel. The most frugal. If you choose something that is above that,\* you’re not doing something basic.\* By definition, if something is available that is cheaper and worse than what you choose, that is the base. Not what you’re doing. > Glad we could clear that up. Well no. If a private school education is what you consider basic, then there are basic private schools, and there are nicer private schools. There are basic public schools, and there are nicer public schools. ---
**Author:** ![Implicit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Implicit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Implicit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/213 "2011-09-15T00:06:27Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > I don’t. The federal government is a monster that is spending way too much. It needs to be cut to its constitutional size. The imaginary $200K family is a monster that is spending too much. It needs to be cut to its affordable size. This explains the underlying rationale for the made up numbers in your “basic” budget, thanks for clearing that up. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/214 "2011-09-15T00:27:53Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Let’s take it from the top: “basic” means “at or from the base”. The bottom of the barrel. The most frugal. What’s “basic” for upper middle class is not the same as what’s “basic” for you. Or what’s “basic” for you is not the same as what’s “basic” for a trailer park family somewhere in Podunk. And what’s “basic” for them is not the same as what’s basic for a subsistence farmer somewhere in Ethiopia. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/215 "2011-09-15T00:29:22Z")
> [@Implicit](#): > > The imaginary $200K family is a monster that is spending too much. It needs to be cut to its affordable size. The difference is that that imaginary $200K family is earning its way to what you consider “spending too much”. The government is taking my money in order to “spend too much”. Glad I could clear it up for you. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/216 "2011-09-15T00:54:40Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > $4K mortgage payment > $1.2K groceries > $1.5K school tuition for kid (if in private school) > $1K real estate taxes > $800 utilities/internet/cable > $400 gas/car insurance > $400 entertainment This illustrates that the family making $200K/year can easily afford a 3% increase on income above $200K (their additional tax liability will be $0.) Even if we bump it up to them making $201K/year, they can easily afford the extra tax liability of $30/year - that’s only 7.5% of **one month’s** entertainment budget and **0.6%** of their annual entertainment budget. They won’t even notice. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/217 "2011-09-15T00:55:18Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > Honest question, any of the people in this thread arguing about how 200,000 really isn’t all that much: Do you believe that revenues need to be increased to solve our debt problem? I suspect that anyone hemming and hawing about how 200k/yr is just aw shucks salt of the earth regular folk, are the same people who think we can “cut” our way out of a recession…somehow. > > Just FYI your links are not working for me. If you read my posts in this thread I say that a) my wife and I take home over $200k a year, b) we don’t feel rich and c) I support tax increases. In fact, some of the richest urban centers in America are also some of the most supportive of tax increases. ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/218 "2011-09-15T01:17:35Z")
Amazing to me that people here re-define words like ‘basic’ and ‘middle class’ to mean “that which can only be afforded by the top 5% of the people in one of the wealthiest country” ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/219 "2011-09-15T01:25:48Z")
Amazing to me that people here re-define words like ‘basic’ and ‘middle class’ to mean “that which can only be afforded by the top 5% of the people in one of the wealthiest countries in the world.” That’s what the above post should say. (Sorry, got distracted by my son asking about the definition of a subject complement. Could you say without looking it up?) ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110/220 "2011-09-15T01:51:55Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > In a lot of areas, yes. Public schools in a lot of areas are absolutely atrocious. Oh the horrors! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/200k-year-isnt-rich-why-arent-we-taxing-corporations/596110.md?page=12)