# 2011 Syrian Protests **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 27, 2011, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946 "2011-04-27T20:46:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tyrannosaur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Tyrannosaur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyrannosaur)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/1 "2011-04-27T20:46:41Z")
So basically Syria is the next Libya. There’s a civil war forming there, and it isn’t very civil. The Syrian government has fired upon Syrian protestors and it’s getting bloodier by the hour. What do you think will happen in Syria? Will this spark a civil war? Who do you support, the government or the protestors? Do you think the United States should intervene, like we did with Libya, and if so, how should we intervene? If you want, please try to keep all discussions and news articles about the Syrian protests in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Tyrannosaur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Tyrannosaur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tyrannosaur)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2011, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/2 "2011-04-27T20:59:24Z")
Syria sends army reinforcements into Deraa > [@](#): > > The Syrian army has sent more tanks and reinforcements into Deraa as part of a widening crackdown against opponents of the government, and sporadic explosions are being heard in the flashpoint southern city, witnesses say. > > Witnesses said a convoy of about 30 tanks were seen on the circular highway outside the Syrian capital, Damascus, on Wednesday. > > Troops have been deployed since Monday in Deraa - where the uprising began more than five weeks ago - and activists said more gunfire could be heard on Wednesday. > > A resident of Deraa, speaking under the condition of anonymity for his own safety, said that security forces had taken over the town hospital, and were shooting at anyone who approached the building. > > “Snipers are on top of all the buildings in Deraa and there are lots of bodies on the streets,” the man said in a phone interview. “They were left on the street for three days and we couldn’t remove them.” > > Troops had sealed off the town, and were searching homes at night. > > Read more: [Syria sends army reinforcements into Deraa | News | Al Jazeera](http://aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2011/04/2011427142619235903.html) ---
**Author:** ![bahia\_hombre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@bahia\_hombre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bahia_hombre)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/3 "2011-04-28T06:14:07Z")
Other countries are playing leading roles in the air strikes in Libya. The U.S. isn’t going in whole hog to overthrow Gadhafi; basically just supporting the rebels who are fighting to oust him. We should by all means support Syrian rebels as well in ending another dictatorship. An autocratic government that is not wanted and not elected by its people is invalid and should be terminated. This Arab spring and spread of democracy is a much needed step in the evolution of world harmony. ---
**Author:** ![Commissar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c68b51/32.png) [@Commissar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Commissar)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/4 "2011-04-28T06:34:12Z")
> [@bahia\_hombre](#): > > Other countries are playing leading roles in the air strikes in Libya. The U.S. isn’t going in whole hog to overthrow Gadhafi; basically just supporting the rebels who are fighting to oust him. We should by all means support Syrian rebels as well in ending another dictatorship. An autocratic government that is not wanted and not elected by its people is invalid and should be terminated. This Arab spring and spread of democracy is a much needed step in the evolution of world harmony. I completely disagree. The Ba’ath Party has, by and large, been a positive influence on Syria. The fact that it does not pander to Western ideals of mob-rule (or “representative democracy,” as you may prefer to call it) does not mean that the US or anyone else should start slaughtering these people as well. Syria should be left alone to sort its issues out on its own. Interestingly, Russia apparently had enough of Western shenanigans in Libya, and has absolutely refused to allow a draft anti-Syrian resolution to get off the ground: > **[Syria: EU push for UN condemnation fails](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-13218556)** > > A deeply divided United Nations Security Council fails to agree on an EU-proposed statement condemning Syria's violent crackdown against protesters. Without such a resolution, any foreign intervention would be a grave international crime. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/5 "2011-04-28T11:45:58Z")
[Here](http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/04/27/syria.unrest/index.html?hpt=T2) is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the Syrian dictator: > [@](#): > > Reliable sources have consistently cited the use of artillery fire against unarmed civilians, door-to-door arrest campaigns, shooting of medical personnel who have tried to help, raids of hospitals, clinics and mosques and destruction of medical supplies, he said. Interesting that a particular poster condemns the US and NATO as having some kind of religious hatred against Islam, yet it’s a Muslim country’s Muslim dictator’s Muslim military and Muslim police force destroying Muslim houses of worship. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/6 "2011-04-28T12:05:22Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > [Here](http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/04/27/syria.unrest/index.html?hpt=T2) is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the Syrian dictator: > Interesting that a particular poster condemns the US and NATO as having some kind of religious hatred against Islam, yet it’s a Muslim country’s Muslim dictator’s Muslim military and Muslim police force destroying Muslim houses of worship. And using fucking Muslim snipers against its innocent Muslim population. Snipers! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/7 "2011-04-28T12:13:55Z")
**Commissar** has previously expressed views in favor of brutal dictatorship so I’m not really surprised. I think tomorrow’s “Day of Rage” is going to be the tipping point one way or the other - if enough people come out in force there’s going to be slaughter but they could still prevail. Also, the Syrian ambassador has now been “dis-invited” from the Royal Wedding tomorrow. That’s gotta sting. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/8 "2011-04-28T12:28:54Z")
There’s been an article floating about CNN’s website, the headline of which read something like “Why Aren’t We Attacking Syria Instead Of Lebanon”. I didn’t read it, but I’d like to now. I can’t imagine the US getting involved in yet another conflict. ---
**Author:** ![Commissar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c68b51/32.png) [@Commissar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Commissar)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/9 "2011-04-28T18:41:11Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > [Here](http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/04/27/syria.unrest/index.html?hpt=T2) is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the Syrian dictator: > Interesting that a particular poster condemns the US and NATO as having some kind of religious hatred against Islam, yet it’s a Muslim country’s Muslim dictator’s Muslim military and Muslim police force destroying Muslim houses of worship. It is worth noting that, were I to post an article hostile to the US and purporting to base its criticism on anonymous “reliable sources,” I would hear no end to the complaining about it from you, my friend. But setting that point aside, your argument is still meaningless and entirely devoid of logic. Any government can be attacked in this manner, as long as the attacker is willing to follow your lead of only highly-selective facts. Let’s try it now: "Here is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the brutal US regime: You are supporting the only nation in the history of humanity to use nuclear weapons against other humans. You are supporting a nation that starts illegal wars of aggression in the Middle East with abandon. You are supporting a nation that is, as we speak, using remote-controlled planes to slaughter civilians in Libya. What kind of monster are you if you can support something like that?” Hey, it works. From now on, all nations should be given the Monty treatment. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/10 "2011-04-28T18:51:07Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > [Here](http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/04/27/syria.unrest/index.html?hpt=T2) is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the Syrian dictator: > Interesting that a particular poster condemns the US and NATO as having some kind of religious hatred against Islam, yet it’s a Muslim country’s Muslim dictator’s Muslim military and Muslim police force destroying Muslim houses of worship. Well, sure, we have Commissar’s standard nonsense about wars of aggression (remember, he denies that you can state that someone is a war crime without a verdict, even if you prove that it is a war crime, but he likes to claim things are wars of aggression without any support because… _hey look over there!_) Folks might even begin to wonder why the standards seem to change so rapidly when the subject is something that might annoy westerners. But the Assad regime isn’t Muslim, and Syria really isn’t either. Syria and its ruling regime are, for all practical purposes, secular. So what we have are its secular rulers murdering its Muslim populace. In fact, the Assad regime perpetrated the single worst organized act of mass murder against a Muslim civilian population in modern history. But, of course, as Commissar has standards that seem to change when the argument has the potential to annoy people, that’s okay because Assad is a brutal tyrant. But NATO nations trying to _save_ Muslim civilians? Obviously they’re crusaders. Obviously. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/11 "2011-04-28T18:58:13Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I think tomorrow’s “Day of Rage” is going to be the tipping point one way or the other - if enough people come out in force there’s going to be slaughter but they could still prevail. > [/SIZE] Like how this [Day of Rage](http://articles.latimes.com/2011/mar/12/world/la-fg-saudi-unrest-20110312) was so successful? ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/12 "2011-04-28T18:59:38Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > There’s been an article floating about CNN’s website, the headline of which read something like “Why Aren’t We Attacking Syria Instead Of Lebanon”. I didn’t read it, but I’d like to now. I can’t imagine the US getting involved in yet another conflict. Attacking? How? ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/13 "2011-04-28T19:18:09Z")
> [@bahia\_hombre](#): > > Other countries are playing leading roles in the air strikes in Libya. The U.S. isn’t going in whole hog to overthrow Gadhafi; basically just supporting the rebels who are fighting to oust him. We should by all means support Syrian rebels as well in ending another dictatorship. An autocratic government that is not wanted and not elected by its people is invalid and should be terminated. This Arab spring and spread of democracy is a much needed step in the evolution of world harmony. nnononononononononono Do you know who is funding the Syrian rebels? Lebanon. Jordan. Iraq. Do you know who probably supports the current Syrian regime? Iran. We shouldn’t be supporting the Libyan rebels either. Do you know who supports them? Iran. Do you know who supports Ghadafi? Iran. Who is going to run Libya (or a split Libya)? Who is the face of Libya? Who isn’t so happy about these mid east protests? China and Russia. Your statement, “An autocratic government that \*\*is not wanted \*\*and not elected by its people is invalid and should be terminated,” only matters if it comes from the people. But that only works if you have a plan. Lighting yourself on fire is not a plan. That shit is a mess. You can’t “spread democracy”. That is theoretically impossible. Democracy happens by goodwill and faith of a new government and culture of a people. Do you really think a democracy could come out of Syria anytime soon? Or Libya? Ugh. It’s either another cold war or a real one. It’s like China & Iran v. NATO fighting over political control of unstable countries. edit: Look at Egypt’s new democracy. What a joke. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/14 "2011-04-28T19:20:41Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > But the Assad regime isn’t Muslim, and Syria really isn’t either. Syria and its ruling regime are, for all practical purposes, secular. So what we have are its secular rulers murdering its Muslim populace. In fact, the Assad regime perpetrated the single worst organized act of mass murder against a Muslim civilian population in modern history. Don’t forget their special hatred of Kurds. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/15 "2011-04-28T20:27:14Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Don’t forget their special hatred of Kurds. Hatred of Kurds isn’t really all that special, though. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/16 "2011-04-28T21:01:49Z")
> [@Commissar](#): > > It is worth noting that, were I to post an article hostile to the US and purporting to base its criticism on anonymous “reliable sources,” I would hear no end to the complaining about it from you, my friend. I’m not your friend. My friends have a much more than passing acquaintance with facts. You wouldn’t happen to have any proof that I would be complaining about something posted from reliable sources, would you? Didn’t think so. > [@](#): > > But setting that point aside, your argument is still meaningless and entirely devoid of logic. Any government can be attacked in this manner, as long as the attacker is willing to follow your lead of only highly-selective facts. Let’s try it now: _My_ lead? You wouldn’t happen to have any evidence that I’m doing that, would you? Didn’t think so. > [@](#): > > "Here is what you’re in favor of if you’re supporting the brutal US regime: You are supporting the only nation in the history of humanity to use nuclear weapons against other humans. You are supporting a nation that starts illegal wars of aggression in the Middle East with abandon. You are supporting a nation that is, as we speak, using remote-controlled planes to slaughter civilians in Libya. What kind of monster are you if you can support something like that?” Again, didn’t think you had anything even resembling a fact for your tirades and pretenses. > [@](#): > > Hey, it works. From now on, all nations should be given the Monty treatment. You misspelled [_Commissar_](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=598262) (link to Pit Thread). ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/17 "2011-04-28T21:41:30Z")
> [@](#): > > The Syrian government has fired upon Syrian protestors and it’s getting bloodier by the hour. I had heard or read that the Syrian government brought in specialists from Iran to help them quell the riots, but it doesn’t seem to be working as well for them as it has for the Iranians. > [@](#): > > What do you think will happen in Syria? It’s hard to say, but whatever happens it won’t be good. If Syria goes down or becomes like Libya then it will affect the entire region. Much more than Egypt or Libya has. > [@](#): > > Will this spark a civil war? It seems to be right on the verge of going that way. > [@](#): > > Who do you support, the government or the protestors? Probably the protesters more than the government, though my ‘support’ is rather nebulous at this point, as it is for the various factions in Libya. I think the government in Syria is a tyrannic and authoritarian monster, but who knows whether anything that emerges from an all out civil war would be any better? Still, I can certainly understand and sympathize with the people who have to live under the crushing weight of that government…it’s not hard to see why many of the authoritarian governments in the ME are facing near universal unrest at this point. > [@](#): > > Do you think the United States should intervene, like we did with Libya, and if so, how should we intervene? No…I don’t think we should intervene (nor do I think we will in this case, regardless). Of course, I didn’t think we should have intervened in Libya either, so that doesn’t really say much. It’s hard to see a series of events that would bring the US into direct intervention in Syria, though, especially not when we are even quasi-involved in what’s happening in Libya (it’s mostly a NATO show at this point). I seriously doubt that the Arab League or anyone else involved is going to request US or NATO intervention (I’m not sure NATO would have any grounds to stand on to intervene in Syria…I think even their grounds for intervening in Libya were pretty tenuous). -XT ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/18 "2011-04-28T22:04:15Z")
Who exactly are the sides in Syria, other than “The Assad Regime vs. The People”? Are there any notable ethnic or religious or cultural or class or regional or ideological conflicts or divisions? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/19 "2011-04-28T22:08:18Z")
And, does anyone outside the government really believe, any more (if ever they did), in Ba’athism as such, as an ideology? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946/20 "2011-04-28T22:13:07Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Don’t forget their special hatred of Kurds. I see on [this map of Kurdistan](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kurdish-inhabited_area_by_CIA_%281992%29.jpg) (defining same as Kurdish-majority areas) that in Syria it includes only this little wedge in the northeast corner of the country and an even littler half-moon on the northern border. If those bits were to be separated and made part of an independent Kurdistan or something, would the average Syrian resent the loss of territory too terribly? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2011-syrian-protests/579946.md?page=2)