# 2013 NFL Coaching Carousel **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 31, 2012, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687 "2012-12-31T18:11:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/41 "2013-01-02T22:55:57Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > He’s a guy that by all accounts barely tolerates the shit that goes along with being a NCAA head coach. He has no interest in talking to boosters, shoe companies and doesn’t pound the recruiting trail like a user car salesman. Given the choice he’d probably practice his kids 80 hours a week if they let him. > > In my opinion the NCAA coaches that flop in the NFL are the ones who make their bones recruiting by kissing babies, coddling spoiled primadonnas and reassuring worried parents. The ones that have an awesome Q-rating, worry about the TV ratings of non-conference games and generally win by selling the big program fantasy to 5-star recruits. > > Kelly doesn’t appear to be any of these things. Plus it seems like the NFL would make him happier which makes it all the more surprising that he hasn’t taken a job yet. This year might be the year. Yeah, Kelly doesn’t suffer fools. When Masoli was the starting QB, he couldn’t stay out of trouble, and Kelly had no problem ditching him and starting a freshman QB instead. Also, Oregon’s defense is underrated. We were winning games 50-plus to sub-20 all year. That’s not a shootout, that’s a blowout. Just because he emphasizes a fast tempo offense doesn’t mean he’s ignoring defense and special teams. ---
**Author:** ![phungi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/phungi/32/395_2.png) [@phungi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phungi)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2013, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/42 "2013-01-02T23:57:14Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > _May?_ It’s vitriolic and in places it’s ridiculous, and the reference to “the drug-related death of a nepotistic hire” is cruel and inexcusable, no matter what the author says a few paragraphs later about how it’s sad that Reid’s son died. His criticisms include the fact that Reid was not “congenial” with the press and that Reid tried to win games late in the season by playing Michael Vick and others. That was selfish, you see. Reid has his flaws and the defensive coordinator situation in Philadelphia was terrible - the scapegoating of Castillo was a total mistake - but that column is pretty disgusting. Having lived through all 14 seasons, I can’t find any inaccuracies in the piece. Reid’s inability to be honest and self-critical (beyond saying “that’s my responsibility”) were obvious and apparent. McCoy’s concussion came in the last minutes of a game they could not win, and even after having time to reflect, Reid could only say “I was trying to win the game” when asked if would do things different in that situation. As for his son being a coach and involved with the team, Reid should have been fired immediately after making that decision. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/43 "2013-01-03T01:14:36Z")
> [@phungi](#): > > As for his son being a coach and involved with the team, Reid should have been fired immediately after making that decision. Why? If my child was struggling with addiction issues, I would have absolutely no problem finding him a job, thereby giving him some kind of support and structure. A throw away job in the organization I run where he doesn’t have a huge impact and likely isn’t taking a job from someone else is a good step in trying to get him his life right. You’d prefer he kicked his son to the curb? I have no problem whatsoever with that kind of “nepotism”. ---
**Author:** ![phungi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/phungi/32/395_2.png) [@phungi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phungi)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/44 "2013-01-03T02:10:56Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Why? If my child was struggling with addiction issues, I would have absolutely no problem finding him a job, thereby giving him some kind of support and structure. A throw away job in the organization I run where he doesn’t have a huge impact and likely isn’t taking a job from someone else is a good step in trying to get him his life right. You’d prefer he kicked his son to the curb? I have no problem whatsoever with that kind of “nepotism”. If you look at a [list of “highlights” from Garrett Reid’s life prior to 2009](http://articles.philly.com/2012-08-07/news/33066106_1_garrett-reid-luzerne-treatment-center-britt-reid), you can see that he is an accident waiting to happen, and is not educated, trained, or disciplined for working as a strength and conditioning coach for an NFL team. There is a large gap between “kicking a kid to the curb” and hiring him for a job so you can babysit for him. The first article I linked to questioned his judgement on a variety of decisions, and hiring his son was one of them. THis is not a “throw away job” and it is not appropriate, logical, or justifiable to have an addict and steroid dealer working for an NFL team and interacting with NFL players… any rationalization is not well-founded and exactly the “warning” that Marcus Hayes (The Philly news correspondent) was attempting to provide. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/45 "2013-01-03T03:09:36Z")
Well I’m becoming sold out Chip Kelly, he’s starting to sound like exactly what I want in the coach. The Browns are supposedly building a coach-centric system somewhat philly style where there’s no strong GM, coach has final say on draft picks, etc. I’m not sure that’s a great system overall but I guess it can work if you have the right coach. With a young roster, an owner hopefully willing to make him crazy rich, and being the guy entirely in control of the whole program, I think maybe the Browns have a decent shot to land him. He’ll be interviewed by the Browns on Friday. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/46 "2013-01-03T03:38:52Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > He’s a guy that by all accounts barely tolerates the shit that goes along with being a NCAA head coach. He has no interest in talking to boosters, shoe companies and doesn’t pound the recruiting trail like a user car salesman. Given the choice he’d probably practice his kids 80 hours a week if they let him. That’s because (as the story goes) someone betrayed him to the NCAA for rules violations, dating back to his first day as Oregon coach. After that he went into stealth mode, even changing his telephone numbers. He’s been in plea bargaining mode with the NCAA ever since, stretching it out until he gets a NFL job. Of course, that means nothing to an NFL team. Look at Pete Carroll (USC/Seahawks). ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/47 "2013-01-03T05:53:56Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > [Report: Oakland Raiders expected to fire Greg Knapp](http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000119904/article/report-oakland-raiders-expected-to-fire-greg-knapp) > > Many thought rookie HC Dennis Allen would be shown the door after floundering in Oakland, but apparently their OC will be scapegoated instead. “Scapegoat” means it was unmerited. It wasn’t. Fans knew he would be a terrible fit (given his sterling job as Raiders OC with Jamarcus), he proved to be a terrible fit (taking an offense Hue Jackson had made one of the better ones in the NFL, and turned it into trash) and then started complaining about unreasonable expectations and kept insisting it would get better. It’s hard to get a read on Allen since he comes across as so generic (especially compared to his predecessor) but he should still get another year or two, especially given how talentless the roster is. ---
**Author:** ![Jules\_Andre](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jules_andre/32/9334_2.png) [@Jules\_Andre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jules_Andre)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/48 "2013-01-03T06:58:39Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > He’s a guy that by all accounts barely tolerates the shit that goes along with being a NCAA head coach. He has no interest in talking to boosters, shoe companies and doesn’t pound the recruiting trail like a user car salesman. Given the choice he’d probably practice his kids 80 hours a week if they let him. > > In my opinion the NCAA coaches that flop in the NFL are the ones who make their bones recruiting by kissing babies, coddling spoiled primadonnas and reassuring worried parents. The ones that have an awesome Q-rating, worry about the TV ratings of non-conference games and generally win by selling the big program fantasy to 5-star recruits. > > Kelly doesn’t appear to be any of these things. Plus it seems like the NFL would make him happier which makes it all the more surprising that he hasn’t taken a job yet. This year might be the year. This makes sense to me and goes along with some other stuff I’ve read regarding Kelly. He seems like the type that would buck the trend of college coaches into the NFL and could be successful right away. Eagles players who have familiarity with him (namely Casey Matthews) rave about him in interviews. Kelly also had a quote recently that allayed all my fears about his system adapting to the NFL. > [@Chip Kelly](#): > > Anything you do has to be personnel-driven. You’ve gotta be able to adapt to the personnel that you have. There’s a lot of great offenses out there, but does it fit with the personnel you have? I think the key is being sure what you’re doing is giving your players the chance to be successful. > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Well I’m becoming sold out Chip Kelly, he’s starting to sound like exactly what I want in the coach. Agreed. All new coaches are crapshoots, even experienced ones, but if you’re going to take a swing I’d rather you swing for the fences. If he was just as successful in the NFL as he was at Oregon, that’s a boon for any franchise. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/49 "2013-01-03T15:17:25Z")
Before we get too hung up on the idea that college coaches can’t succeed in the NFL, remember that all of the following Super Bowl winning coaches were previously head coaches in college: Tom Coughlin Jimmie Johnson Bill Parcells (head coach at Air Force) George Seifert (head coach at Cornell) Dick Vermeil Bill Walsh And the following former college coaches took teams to Super Bowls, even though they ultimately lost: Marv Levy (Cal, William & Mary) Bobby Ross (head coach at Georgia Tech) Chip Kelly is a longshot, but so is ANY new head coach from ANY background. MOST coaches fail, no matter where you hire them from. Top NFL offensive and defensive coordinators fall on their faces as head coaches all the time (ask Dave Wannstedt, Steve Spagnuolo. Rochie Pettitbon or Bill Arnsparger). So do guys who were champion head coaches with other teams (Mike Ditka and Hank Stram in New Orleans, Tom Flores in Seattle, Dick Vermeil in Kansas City). ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/50 "2013-01-03T16:40:41Z")
So it’s starting to look like Andy Reid to KC. Meanwhile, Arizona is asking for permission to interview Todd Haley. That would be a downgrade from Whisenhunt, if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/51 "2013-01-03T16:51:44Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Meanwhile, Arizona is asking for permission to interview Todd Haley. Because their last Steelers OC worked out so well? ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/52 "2013-01-03T16:55:24Z")
He _did_ get them to a Super Bowl. ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/53 "2013-01-03T16:59:22Z")
I think it would be more fair to say that Warner got Whisenhunt to a Super Bowl, but I see your point. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/54 "2013-01-03T17:08:08Z")
> [@Enginerd](#): > > I think it would be more fair to say that Warner got Whisenhunt to a Super Bowl, but I see your point. Yes, but that’s true of any team. Without a competent QB, you’re not going anywhere. I’d say Kevin Kolb is barely competent, but he couldn’t stay on the field. And I really don’t understand why Whisenhunt gets criticized for bouncing back and forth between Skelton and Lindley. Even if I concede that it hurt their confidence, is anyone really going to argue that a lack of confidence was what held them back? ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/55 "2013-01-03T17:13:00Z")
I think it’s easy to downplay Whisenhunt’s effectiveness as a coach. Fact is he was the OC for the Steelers when they won a Super Bowl and got the Cards to the Super Bowl. The fact that he had good QBs in both of those instances is more because good QBs tend to get to Super Bowls - but I would argue that his play calling would likely have been at least a contributory factor. I strongly suspect that Whisenhunt is a good coach but a lousy judge of a QB (remember, he had Warner riding the pine behind Leinart for a while). Paired with a good GM and scouting department and left to get on with the coaching aspect of the game, I suspect Whisenhunt would get good results elsewhere. This is not to say he shouldn’t have been fired by the Cards - he’s as culpable for the decisions that lead to the clusterfuck that was their offense this year as anyone - but Kolb was 4-2 before going out hurt, which suggests that his coaching ideas might actually be capable of producing winning teams with a QB that isn’t historically bad. ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/56 "2013-01-03T17:15:52Z")
Sorry - double post ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/57 "2013-01-03T20:09:25Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Yes, but that’s true of any team. Without a competent QB, you’re not going anywhere. I’d say Kevin Kolb is barely competent, but he couldn’t stay on the field. And I really don’t understand why Whisenhunt gets criticized for bouncing back and forth between Skelton and Lindley. Even if I concede that it hurt their confidence, is anyone really going to argue that a lack of confidence was what held them back? One problem with Whisenhunt is that he wouldn’t know a competent QB from a hole in the wall. He was starting Matt Leinart and only turned the reigns over to Warner after Leinart broke his collarbone. He then got to the playoffs at 9-7, and went to the SuperBowl thanks to some ungodly play by Warner. After Warner retired, it’s been one fiasco after another, and he was one of the architects of the fiasco. Derek Anderson, Max Hall, Skelton, etc. were his guys, and he was a big part of bringing Kolb in. The poor QB situation is, at least in part, on him. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/58 "2013-01-03T20:11:56Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > So it’s starting to look like Andy Reid to KC. Let the Chefs jokes begin. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/59 "2013-01-03T20:12:53Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > So it’s starting to look like Andy Reid to KC. > [@lieu](#): > > Let the Chefs jokes begin. Great googly moogly. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2013, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687/60 "2013-01-03T20:14:31Z")
What a difference this offseason could make for my fandom, when the options could be like retread (Whisenhunt or something similar) + Lombardi vs Chip Kelly and anyone on planet Earth besides Mike Lombardi. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2013-nfl-coaching-carousel/645687.md?page=4)