Since people on this very thread have posted about their dislike of the Puppy stories they have personally read, I’m going to ask:
Cite?
According to the Federal Government he isn’t white he is Hispanic. Don’t argue with me, call your congresscritter.
Science Fiction book sales are going down year over year, people on the sad puppies think it is because the story has gotten lost behind the message. The SP feel the most important thing is the story, not the message or the authors politics or sexual orientation.
Find one place where anyone from the sad puppies ever has said vote for THIS book without reading it first. I’ll wait, but I am not going to hold my breath.
Fifteen seconds with the dictionary on my phone gave me this:
acclaim
verb used with object
- to welcome or salute with shouts or sounds of joy and approval; applaud: to acclaim the conquering heroes
- to announce or proclaim with enthusiastic approval: to acclaim the new king
So once again what loophole did they exploit? The sad puppies bought their own memberships with their own money read the books and voted for the ones they liked. The only two differences between us and the cool kids is 1. We did it in front of the curtain, instead of in the back room and 2. we are the wrong fans, because we are not TrueFans. So which part is the loop hole? Talking out what we like publicly or the fact that we are the wrong fans?
First off this is almost too stupid to reply to. “apparently the normal ones don’t ask people to read the books” Yeah Larry makes a habit of telling people to buy books by other authors and NOT read them. Cite that he got “called out for not giving a shit about that piece of the puzzle” put up or shut up.
As has been mentioned Brad Torgersen is married to a African-American woman, not Larry Correia. If this is going to be your level of interest and involvement in this thread, may you should pass.
So you think that if a hamburger stand names Tommy’s becomes popular and famous and a competitor starts a business call Tommies that Tommy’s should change it’s name. Interesting business strategy. But no. Sad Puppies was around for 2 years before rabid puppies.
Where exactly in Larry quote is he claiming “Victory”?
Oh you mean he should listen the TrueFans, not us regular guys that don’t sit at the cool kids table.
Larry’s website is down for maintenance right now, so I can’t quote it, but he turned down the nomination this year and has publicly stated that he will not accept a nomination in the future.
Yeah the guy with 4 Hugos sees no problem with the system. In other news, water is wet. As I have said before Scalzi has done the same thing, as as Tor books. It is only wrong when the wrong fans do it.
Sigh, so you can’t recognize sarcasm when you see it. It’s a pity really.
Really? You don’t think I can dig them up? Seriously? It’s time I head to bed, but I will be happy to supply with them tomorrow.
If liberal/progressives are overrepresented in the science fiction field it would not surprise me any more than it would surprise me if conservatives are overrepresented in the field of historical novels. (Looking forward as opposed to looking back.)
How else can one read this?
When did I say the Sad Puppies, or anyone besides Beale, was a racist? As for the author’s wife, I take no position on her intelligence; I know nothing about her. I’m just pointing out the weakness and pointlessness of trying to “prove” one is not a racist with a black wife. That tells us very little about someone’s view of race.
I’m in an interracial marriage too, by the way. It doesn’t mean I’m not a racist. I strive to not be a racist, but in my view no one can truly know for sure if they have any racist thoughts or beliefs.
That’ll be hard…
and anyway:
Veteran game and puzzle designer Mike Selinker on what he’d do.
Oh, and a reminder that racism doesn’t exclusively mean “doesn’t like black people.”
Doesn’t matter, MrDibble. For the sake of this argument, Hispanic is regarded as a minority in the USA, therefore Larry Correia cannot be labelled as an “old white guy.”
Logically speaking, seeing as plenty of misogynists are married to women, I don’t see why it would be so strange if some racists were married to people of different races.
The tangent started with this:
Since Rick is addressing a straw man, a dumbed-down version of the actual complaints against the puppy brigade, it doesn’t particularly matter, IMO, that he’s wrong about how ethnicity and race interact, either.
This is absurd. They told people to vote for exactly the same slate. Their entire modus depended on everyone voting for exactly the same slate. This is anathema to the idea of everyone voting for the people they genuinely think are deserving. You’re playing, “I’m not touching you!” expecting that because they never technically said, “Vote for people you haven’t read,” we can’t figure out what the intended effect would be.
I encourage you to learn to count to
- Encouraging people to vote for exactly the same full slate, so that not only would some of their preferred people make the short list, but nobody else’s preferred people would make the shortlist. They tried to guarantee a win for one of their people, no matter what the majority of fans would like, by preventing people from voting for anyone but one of their people in the final round. That loophole.
Are you shitting me? Cite that people have complained about him not caring whether voters are familiar with the works they vote for? Have you read this thread, for starters?
Yeah, okay. I’m not taking book recommendations from this thread for one of the skeezy assholes who tried to ruin the Hugos this year. Make the recommendation elsewhere, and I’ll consider it.
Rick, apparently you identify as a Sad Puppy. Did you nominate for the 2015 Hugos, and did you nominate the SP’s slate in lockstep with them?
If you nominated the SP’s slate, or believe what they did was right, can you honestly say that there was nothing else published in the SFF genre from 2014 that you enjoyed more and also might be worthy of a Hugo?
This is what the Puppies asked their followers to claim with their nominations. IMHO, they had their followers lie to the rest of the Worldcon. The rest of fandom reared up and said, “Hell with that shit.” As soon as I heard about the upswell in supporting memberships to Sasquan, I knew what was going to happen.
The analogy of the obstacle/footrace is an excellent one.
Nice job dealing with the substance of the comment–one of the two heads of the Sad Puppies is married to a black woman but still won’t denounce his buddy who’s saying his wife is sub-human–THAT is the point, not which one of the flunkies is interracially married. If this is going to be your level of intellectual honesty in this thread, maybe you should give it a pass.
Also, earlier, you wrote “MC David what’s his face told people not to boo”
That would be “David Gerrold”: Hugo winner, Star Trek writer, etc. So, if that’s your standard for discussion, you fail. And as someone said, “If this is going to be your level of interest and involvement in this thread, may[be] you should pass.”
From the EEOC definition of minority
He is a minority by the federal government
So what? You were attacking a straw man anyway.
Not really, no. Correia is of Portuguese descent, and has claimed that he discovered when filling out EEOC forms that the Department of Labor considers people of Portuguese descent to be Latino. However, the US Census, folliwing Office of Management and Budget guidelines, does not consider Portuguese to be Hispanic.
Correia is merely attempting a cargo-cult version of identity politics.
Again, when the SP slate included, for Best Novella, one story by Tom Kratman and three by John C. Wright, the above is shown to be just so much disingenuous bullshit.
If he were Hispanic (which, apparently, he isn’t), he could still be an old White guy - and a minority. Like I originally said, the two terms aren’t mutually exclusive.
You’re moving goalposts quite widely here. Your points were that slates were legal and had been done before. You first stated that Scalzi thought that slating was a legal tactic. I pointed out that a) Scalzi said it was legal but a dick move and b) it is ALSO legal to vote “No Award”. I further pointed out that there was historical precedent for Worldcon voters to put slated works below, “No Award”. I then gave a history of campaigning for the Hugos to show that the pup slates were unprecedented. And your response was to ignore all of that to snark on GRRM?? If you are so convinced that you are right, can you cite other slates? And by slates, I mean suggested nominations that fit the ballot size and asked to vote in lockstep.
Where’s the sarcasm? Those folks refer to themselves over and over as members of the ELOE. The fact is that Correia stated that he and Vox were instrumental in picking the slate. Unless you’re calling him a liar. If you disagree, please point out how the slate nominees were picked.
And you missed my question regarding why you believe that 20% (this is the total for both pup factions) of voters should somehow win the awards. I disagree that the pup factions were separate but if you want to draw a very artificial distinction then the sad pups were 10% of the voters.
If “Tommies” becomes more known, more successful, and is associated with white supremacists? Yes.
And, most importantly, “Tommy’s” must not hang out with, speak nicely about, or otherwise promote “Tommies” in their white supremacist pursuits. Because if they do? Then they are deservedly associated with all of “Tommies” baggage.