# 2016 Bernie Sanders (D-VT) campaign for POTUS thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 28, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754 "2015-04-28T22:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 33
**Author:** ![harmonicamoon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@harmonicamoon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/harmonicamoon)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/641 "2015-12-11T16:46:30Z")
I read this article today. A rare quality for candidates. > **[Bernie Sanders Has Stuck To The Same Message For 40 Years](https://www.npr.org/2015/12/11/459231940/bernie-sanders-has-stuck-to-the-same-message-for-40-years)** > > The senator has built his political career on decrying a rigged economy. NPR found audio dating back to 1976 that is nearly indistinguishable from 2015 when it comes to this message. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/642 "2015-12-11T16:52:03Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [Sanders wins _Time_ Person of the Year online poll.](http://time.com/4137173/bernie-sanders-time-person-of-the-year-poll-win/) [But Angela Merkel got the title.](http://time.com/time-person-of-the-year-2015-angela-merkel-choice/)😕 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/643 "2015-12-11T18:33:08Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [But Angela Merkel got the title.](http://time.com/time-person-of-the-year-2015-angela-merkel-choice/)😕 IIRC ever since Hank the drunk angry dwarf won years ago they stopped putting full faith in online voting. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/644 "2015-12-12T02:51:00Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [Bernie Sanders’s refreshingly sane foreign policy.](http://www.salon.com/2015/11/25/bernie_sanderss_refreshingly_sane_foreign_policy/) He didn’t have the courage to name Qadafi in his list of ill-advised American led coups. Of course that would mean he was criticizing the Party’s Nominee. He has no real legitimacy as a voice on foreign policy to begin with, but he is acting as an apparatchik at this point. Bernie’s ramblings highlighted in this article do not even attempt to pose a challenge to the other candidates. Most of the candidates are not calling for unilateral action, so his critique is bizarre, and limp-wristed. Many candidates have drawn conclusions about the vacuums created by American intervention. His “refreshingly sane” comments are cliche at this point. Many candidates, wrong or right, finger “radical Islam” as the ideology driving the terrorist acts of late. Bernie offers no alternatives. Bernie, a supposed socialist, is a full-fledged Wilsonian. Debs is rolling in his grave, his supposed progeny is really his jailer. ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/645 "2015-12-12T03:00:39Z")
Bernie Sanders is doing well with the millennial crowd, these people should not even be allowed to vote. They hate America, they don’t understand America. Millennials should not be allowed to vote, they should not be allowed to serve in the U.S. military, nor the PeaceCorps, they should not be allowed to have a say in American society. Some of these fools don’t have any clue about the government of today. > **[Politics a huge turnoff for younger voters, new study finds](https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/article48983630.html)** > > One in five is politically active > **[Millennial Democratics prefer Bernie Sanders - UPI.com](https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2015/12/11/Millennial-Democratics-prefer-Bernie-Sanders/4731449844262/)** > > Young Democrats are gravitating toward Sen. Bernie Sanders, D-Vt., a self-described democratic socialist. > **[Millennials asked to describe the election in one word | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2015/12/10/politics/gallery/campaign-camper-election-one-word/index.html)** > > CNN and Facebook's #campaigncamper has been on a mission to make your voices heard. On a nationwide tour, we asked millennials to describe the 2016 presidential campaign so far in one word. Here's what they had to say. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/646 "2015-12-12T03:44:26Z")
Uh… you realize “millennials” refers to an age cohort? By definition, they _are_ America, more so every year. ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/647 "2015-12-12T04:31:14Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Uh… you realize “millennials” refers to an age cohort? By definition, they _are_ America, more so every year. I know, and with them running the country in a few years, America is on the road to doom. We won’t have an armed forces in ten years. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/648 "2015-12-12T04:44:48Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > The present constitution of the USA was ratified by a temporary small majority. The “Patriots” in the 1770’s didn’t even have a majority. From what my [professor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hackett_Fischer) for my American Revolution course has been telling me, the idea that there was some sort of an even split between Patriots, Tories, and neutrals during the Revolution is largely a myth-the Patriot cause had strong popular support. > [@WillFarnaby](#): > > He didn’t have the courage to name Qadafi in his list of ill-advised American led coups. Of course that would mean he was criticizing the Party’s Nominee. I don’t see why we should complain about our honourable role in the overthrow of a bloody tyrant who had the bloods of hundreds of Americans on his hands. > [@GloryDays](#): > > Bernie Sanders is doing well with the millennial crowd, these people should not even be allowed to vote. They hate America, they don’t understand America. Millennials should not be allowed to vote, they should not be allowed to serve in the U.S. military, nor the PeaceCorps, they should not be allowed to have a say in American society. Some of these fools don’t have any clue about the government of today. > > [http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/article48983630.html](http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/article48983630.html) > > [Millennial Democratics prefer Bernie Sanders - UPI.com](http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2015/12/11/Millennial-Democratics-prefer-Bernie-Sanders/4731449844262/) > > [http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/10/politics/gallery/campaign-camper-election-one-word/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/10/politics/gallery/campaign-camper-election-one-word/index.html) Lol. I’m very much a Millennial and my politics are of a distinct paleoliberal/social nationalist bent in the tradition of FDR, Truman, Humphrey, and Scoop Jackson-very much in favour of universal social insurance/welfare programs and labour rights but also liberal internationalist on foreign policy and conscious of the need for national unity and solidarity. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/649 "2015-12-12T05:00:27Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > I know, and with them running the country in a few years, America is on the road to doom. We won’t have an armed forces in ten years. The kids are all right. Have a little faith. ---
**Author:** ![Sputnikkk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Sputnikkk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sputnikkk)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/650 "2015-12-12T13:15:18Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by GloryDays View Post > Bernie Sanders is doing well with the millennial crowd, these people should not even be allowed to vote. They hate America, they don’t understand America. Millennials should not be allowed to vote, they should not be allowed to serve in the U.S. military, nor the PeaceCorps, they should not be allowed to have a say in American society. Some of these fools don’t have any clue about the government of today. I think Americans hating America, or other Americans that disagree with their point of view on ISIS, is the only thing driving the voters to the Polls. On a chart, rising levels of hate would probably correlate to rising number of voters. My generation is somewhere between the baby boomers and generation x. But I can identify with the millennials. America, richest country in the world, but violent, angry, and depressing. I don’t know what or who America is anymore, its not the same place I grew up in. I moved to New Zealand, I still feel like I am in the US, its pretty Americanized here, everyone is talking about which TV Series is best American Horror or Fargo, Simpsons is on TV and I went to McDonald’s today for lunch. So, America is all around the world. And New Zealand feels more like the America I grew up in. Its a better version of America and more socialist, everyone gets 4 weeks vacation and I was forced to take mine. I’ve seen four rounds of republican presidents, alternating with democrat presidents, and America still seems to be in a downward spiral, so pretty disillusioning. I’m tempted to vote for either Bernie or Trump. I want an outsider and a complete shake up. So if this is a Millennial… > [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > I’m very much a Millennial and my politics are of a distinct paleoliberal/social nationalist bent in the tradition of FDR, Truman, Humphrey, and Scoop Jackson-very much in favour of universal social insurance/welfare programs and labour rights but also liberal internationalist on foreign policy and conscious of the need for national unity and solidarity. I wonder what generation this is? > [@](#): > > kingneddy - Dec 3, 2015 > Go Trump. No.1 problem in America is leftists. The colleges are brainwashing students to be socialists/communist traitors.Most, if not all, professors are marxists lenninist scum Leftists are traitors to America,capitalism and the middle class. leftists hate white culture and tradition. Even mentioning the word white in a positive light is racist to these traitors. Feminazis,liberals,socialist and communists need to be identified now as the enemy within. they are destroying the west. look at what these leftist scum have done to white Europe and white men in general. Who do you think should be allowed to vote? ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/651 "2015-12-12T14:44:43Z")
> [@Sputnikkk](#): > > I think Americans hating America, or other Americans that disagree with their point of view on ISIS, is the only thing driving the voters to the Polls. On a chart, rising levels of hate would probably correlate to rising number of voters. > > My generation is somewhere between the baby boomers and generation x. But I can identify with the millennials. America, richest country in the world, but violent, angry, and depressing. I don’t know what or who America is anymore, its not the same place I grew up in. I moved to New Zealand, I still feel like I am in the US, its pretty Americanized here, everyone is talking about which TV Series is best American Horror or Fargo, Simpsons is on TV and I went to McDonald’s today for lunch. So, America is all around the world. And New Zealand feels more like the America I grew up in. Its a better version of America and more socialist, everyone gets 4 weeks vacation and I was forced to take mine. I’ve seen four rounds of republican presidents, alternating with democrat presidents, and America still seems to be in a downward spiral, so pretty disillusioning. I’m tempted to vote for either Bernie or Trump. I want an outsider and a complete shake up. > > So if this is a Millennial… > > I wonder what generation this is? > Who do you think should be allowed to vote? I would not say all millennials are stupid, but some of them are. Some of them are capitalists. Not all of them believe in a massive welfare state. ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/652 "2015-12-12T15:03:49Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Bernie Sanders is doing well with the millennial crowd, these people should not even be allowed to vote. They hate America, they don’t understand America. Millennials should not be allowed to vote, they should not be allowed to serve in the U.S. military, nor the PeaceCorps, they should not be allowed to have a say in American society. Some of these fools don’t have any clue about the government of today. links snipped I feel the same way about old white bigots in Queens. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/653 "2015-12-12T15:23:18Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Bernie Sanders is doing well with the millennial crowd, these people should not even be allowed to vote. They hate America, they don’t understand America. No, **Glory,** [these](http://www.salon.com/2013/11/17/americas_angriest_white_men_up_close_with_racism_rage_and_southern_supremacy/) are the people who hate America and don’t understand America. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/654 "2015-12-12T15:24:18Z")
So. **GloryDays** , you think that the only people who should be allowed to vote are those who hate democracy? ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/655 "2015-12-12T16:08:31Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > So. **GloryDays** , you think that the only people who should be allowed to vote are those who hate democracy? No. Who are the people that hate democracy? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/656 "2015-12-12T16:28:05Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Who are the people that hate democracy? A telltale sign is that they think some groups shouldn’t be allowed to vote. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/657 "2015-12-12T17:29:22Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > I don’t see why we should complain about our honourable role in the overthrow of a bloody tyrant who had the bloods of hundreds of Americans on his hands. > > Lol. I’m very much a Millennial and my politics are of a distinct paleoliberal/social nationalist bent in the tradition of FDR, Truman, Humphrey, and Scoop Jackson-very much in favour of universal social insurance/welfare programs and labour rights but also liberal internationalist on foreign policy and conscious of the need for national unity and solidarity. A whole paragraph describing yourself when simply “American fascist”, or even “George W. Bush Democrat” would do? You really are a millennial. Anyways, if you bothered to peruse the ramblings of Bernie in that brief article you could see he was trying to make the case several other candidates have made that overthrowing regional strongmen has led to problems. He very opaquely left out Qadafi from that list because the Queen of Chaos would have been unhappy. Thus his role this election is Party Functionary. In fact Qadafi had turned a corner and had been cooperative in keeping the religious extremists muffled. His ouster puts more American lives in danger than would have been if he had held power. Of course if your objective is running guns from a Libyan wasteland to fuel a civil war in Syria, removing him makes perfect sense. > **[Here’s the Key Question in the Libyan War](https://www.counterpunch.org/2011/12/01/heres-the-key-question-in-the-libyan-war/)** > > As the “Humanitarian Warriors” Gloat… > **[Seymour M. Hersh · The Red Line and the Rat Line: Erdoğan and the Syrian rebels](https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v36/n08/seymour-m.-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line)** > > The full extent of US co-operation with Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar in assisting the rebel opposition in Syria has... ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/658 "2015-12-12T21:35:50Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > I would not say all millennials are stupid, but some of them are. Some of them are capitalists. Not all of them believe in a massive welfare state. Or like me you could believe in both and that far from being contradictory, one requires the other. > [@WillFarnaby](#): > > A whole paragraph describing yourself when simply “American fascist”, or even “George W. Bush Democrat” would do? You really are a millennial. Rather ironic since most actual fascists and neo-Nazis I know are part of what I like to call the “Ron Paul coalition”-that medley of Christian Reconstructionists, America Firsters, America hating leftists, conspiracy theorists, potheads, college students, and/or combinations thereof who regardless of any disagreements can agree that America is the Evil Empire ™, that Edward Snowden is a great political martyr, that NSA data collection is just as totalitarian as the Gulag Archipelago, that Putin is a swell fellow, and that Jews-excuse me Zionists-are the source of all our misfortune. Naturally they love Gadaffi and see him having been a victim of the Zionist-Washington imperialism-Hell, he even shared the same fate as Mussolini. Nor am I a George W. Bush Democrat-I don’t see how any President who tried privatizing Social Security and secured two massive tax cuts for the wealthy is any way a New Dealer. > [@](#): > > Anyways, if you bothered to peruse the ramblings of Bernie in that brief article you could see he was trying to make the case several other candidates have made that overthrowing regional strongmen has led to problems. He very opaquely left out Qadafi from that list because the Queen of Chaos would have been unhappy. Thus his role this election is Party Functionary. I generally avoid reading Salon articles excepting those by Michael Lind because I wish to avoid contracting cancer. Anyhow, that just means that avoiding certain regional strongmen at certain situations may not be appropriate while overthrowing other regional strongmen in different situations are. [QUOTE] In fact Qadafi had turned a corner and had been cooperative in keeping the religious extremists muffled. His ouster puts more American lives in danger than would have been if he had held power. Of course if your objective is running guns from a Libyan wasteland to fuel a civil war in Syria, removing him makes perfect sense. > **[Here’s the Key Question in the Libyan War](https://www.counterpunch.org/2011/12/01/heres-the-key-question-in-the-libyan-war/)** > > As the “Humanitarian Warriors” Gloat… [Seymour M. Hersh · The Red Line and the Rat Line: Erdoğan and the Syrian rebels](http://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n08/seymour-m-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line)[/QUOTE And by 2011 he was actively engaged in a civil war with his own citizens and murdering thousands of them. I don’t think not intervening ultimately made any difference-the rebels still would have held to a good bit of territory and without our intervention they’d be if anything for sympathetic to Islamism. ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/659 "2015-12-12T21:45:51Z")
[quote=“Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi, post:658, topic:718754”] Or like me you could believe in both and that far from being contradictory, one requires the other. Rather ironic since most actual fascists and neo-Nazis I know are part of what I like to call the “Ron Paul coalition”-that medley of Christian Reconstructionists, America Firsters, America hating leftists, conspiracy theorists, potheads, college students, and/or combinations thereof who regardless of any disagreements can agree that America is the Evil Empire ™, that Edward Snowden is a great political martyr, that NSA data collection is just as totalitarian as the Gulag Archipelago, that Putin is a swell fellow, and that Jews-excuse me Zionists-are the source of all our misfortune. Naturally they love Gadaffi and see him having been a victim of the Zionist-Washington imperialism-Hell, he even shared the same fate as Mussolini. Nor am I a George W. Bush Democrat-I don’t see how any President who tried privatizing Social Security and secured two massive tax cuts for the wealthy is any way a New Dealer. I generally avoid reading Salon articles excepting those by Michael Lind because I wish to avoid contracting cancer. Anyhow, that just means that avoiding certain regional strongmen at certain situations may not be appropriate while overthrowing other regional strongmen in different situations are. [QUOTE] In fact Qadafi had turned a corner and had been cooperative in keeping the religious extremists muffled. His ouster puts more American lives in danger than would have been if he had held power. Of course if your objective is running guns from a Libyan wasteland to fuel a civil war in Syria, removing him makes perfect sense. > **[Here’s the Key Question in the Libyan War](https://www.counterpunch.org/2011/12/01/heres-the-key-question-in-the-libyan-war/)** > > As the “Humanitarian Warriors” Gloat… > **[Seymour M. Hersh · The Red Line and the Rat Line: Erdoğan and the Syrian...](https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v36/n08/seymour-m.-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line)** > > The full extent of US co-operation with Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar in assisting the rebel opposition in Syria has... [/QUOTE And by 2011 he was actively engaged in a civil war with his own citizens and murdering thousands of them. I don’t think not intervening ultimately made any difference-the rebels still would have held to a good bit of territory and without our intervention they’d be if anything for sympathetic to Islamism.[/QUOTE] We don’t need a massive welfare state. We have to have a balance. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2015, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/660 "2015-12-12T21:49:50Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > We don’t need a massive welfare state. We have to have a balance. I agree we need a balance between allowing capitalism to work and ensuing minimal living standards for all. However, there’s plenty of room to expand in terms of doing better to guaranteeing health care access, raising the minimum wage, and the like while remaining very much a capitalist society-as we can see with the social market economic model of Germany and her neighbours. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=32) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=34)