# 2016 Bernie Sanders (D-VT) campaign for POTUS thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 28, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754 "2015-04-28T22:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 35
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/681 "2015-12-14T21:38:53Z")
Billionaires paying no taxes due to loopholes would be a huge improvement over the current system, where billionaires pay no taxes by deliberate design. Loopholes get closed when they get found. ---
**Author:** ![GloryDays](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GloryDays](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GloryDays)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/682 "2015-12-14T23:08:56Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > A telltale sign is that they think some groups shouldn’t be allowed to vote. Not everyone should be allowed to vote because some people should not vote at all. They’re should be a price or a $1.00 to be allowed to vote. People are stupid in this country, probably one of the most illiterate and idiocracizied countries in the world. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/683 "2015-12-14T23:12:45Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Not everyone should be allowed to vote because some people should not vote at all. They’re should be a price or a $1.00 to be allowed to vote. People are stupid in this country, probably one of the most illiterate and idiocracizied countries in the world. The irony of this post really makes my day! “They’re should be” some prize for providing your own example awarded here. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/684 "2015-12-15T00:18:06Z")
And the first sentence which uses its own premise to support its own premise is a real gem, too. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/685 "2015-12-15T00:54:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Billionaires paying no taxes due to loopholes would be a huge improvement over the current system, where billionaires pay no taxes by deliberate design. Loopholes get closed when they get found. Billionaires are subject to the AMT. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/686 "2015-12-15T06:00:56Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Because I think in a society as prosperous and as advanced as the modern American Republic, I don’t think its unreasonable that every citizen should be able to afford basic healthcare especially considering every other developed country has universal health insurance. I don’t see why you are asking this question-all your old-school Democratic heroes like FDR, Harry Truman, John F. Kennedy, and so forth would agree on me unequivocally on this point. Truman wanted to build public hospitals, for crying out loud! ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/687 "2015-12-15T06:06:49Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Not everyone should be allowed to vote because some people should not vote at all. They’re should be a price or a $1.00 to be allowed to vote. People are stupid in this country, probably one of the most illiterate and idiocracizied countries in the world. Except it isn’t really? There are countries that have a lot of illiteracy and deliberate obscurantism. The USA, while a bit mad and cultish, isn’t really as illiterate and superstitious as some of the smaller, poorer countries. It’s just very large, rich, powerful, and dangerous, so our faults seem to have bigger effects. That said, we do need to change our energy policy, and should have started phasing out fossil fuels a decade ago. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/688 "2015-12-15T12:07:20Z")
That’s the best union busting plan ever conceived. ---
**Author:** ![Plumpudding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Plumpudding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plumpudding)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/689 "2015-12-15T16:49:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Norway definitely did a good job, but part of that good job was actually exploiting their resources. TLDR: No, **adaher** , you’re wrong. I like to put TLDR before, not after, a screed… > [@adaher](#): > > The US, despite massive oil needs, doesn’t do that. We are the only country to put a large portion of our resources off limits. Which has made Norwegians a lot richer than they’d otherwise be. If we fully exploited our oil resources, oil would be cheaper, we’d be richer, and Norwegians slightly poorer. And Saudis and Kuwaitis and Iranians and Russians a LOT poorer. You know what, ever since the discovery of oil by Norway, we’ve had environmental acticvist groups, wildlife organisations and the fishing industry doing their best to ensure the exact opposite of what you’re saying, with varying degrees of success, which why Norway hasn’t exploited all possible oil fields in Norwegian waters, like f.ex. Lofoten. Realising we’d be able to cover most of our energy needs with renewable energy helped, of course. Norwegian oil industry has moved to a larger and larger degree away from oil and more and more into global investments, also with varying degrees of success. Our oil industry is slowly moving away from oil, the most obvious effect being engineers having a more difficult time getting employment in the oil industry. > [@adaher](#): > > To bring Sanders back into this, one major reason Scandinavian policies don’t translate well to the US is because we have a lot more diversity of opinion here about the proper role of government. Norway, Denmark, Sweden, and Finland don’t have small government conservatives, Scandinavia basically has left socialists, nativist socialists, libertarian socialists, and the equivalent of our Democrats(which would be the mainstream conservative party). Because of that, there isn’t as much disagreement over ends and means. In the US, we have HUGE fights over issues like that and Sanders’ election to the Presidency wouldn’t change any of that. Sweden was/is in a political deadlock because of a minority-coalition and obstruction by Sverigedemokraterna and Denmark has for a long time had nationalist tendencies with Rasmussen and co. and now have populist nationalists in a coalition-government with the right. Norway has in recent decades mostly had centrist-coalition, often minority, governments, mostly alternating between centrist-right, christian centrist-right, to labour centrist-left. I would consider Bernie Sanders to the left of the current Norwegian administration, consisting of a centre-right and populistic far-right coalition. The far left, Rødt, has as of now around 2.2% share of votes and a bit further to the centre, SV has 4%. True, our right is much more moderate and our labour party is big, but labour is firmly planted in the center to moderate left and often caters to the moderate right. Adaher, if you’re interested I could babble all night long about our more or less grey, political landscape, our failing social policies, our throw-shit-against-the-wall reform-culture and inefficient, monster-bureaucracies and the reasons why, but I have a feeling it would fall on deaf ears. Even if we’ve managed to agree on certain services being near universal, we still disagree on how to manage that. To illustrate our flavour of crazy; Not so long ago our government made a deal with the Netherlands to rent prisons. There are now convicted norwegian citizens facing forced, temporary expulsion to prisons in the Netherlands, for crimes not illegal in The Netherlands. Even though you might be totally oblivious to Norwegian or European politics, what irks me is that you seem completely unaware to what extent american politics, and by proxy american peoples votes, impacts the rest of the world. Not only directly through sometimes incredibly hostile foreign policies - Also indirectly, in for example Norway, my country, by legitimising people that want to destroy more or less everything we’ve managed to build since our lucky break. When your government says jump, many are eager to do so, even in Norway, to the detriment of the environment, health care, education and social policies. Please keep in mind that every irresponsible policy your government enacts spawns similar attempts at irresponsibility all around the world. So to the Norwegian right, USA is the enabler. They point to you as the example, when arguing for restriction of immigration, privatization, criminalization and exploitation. And finally, on topic of Bernie; Go Bernie Sanders! Seems like the only candidate for POTUS with accountability, honesty and guts to bring up actual, pressing national and international issues. Why not everybody would vote for him beats me. Clinton didn’t do it, Obama didn’t do it. This is the first time I’ve wholeheartedly agreed with an American candidate for POTUS, so this serves as an example that absolutely anything can happen, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/690 "2015-12-15T19:09:21Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > They’re should be a price or a $1.00 to be allowed to vote. This - charging people to register or vote - is called a poll tax. It’s a tactic that was frequently used to prevent black people from voting in the post-civil war era, right up until modern times. It’s unconstitutional, both because the 24th amendment explicitly forbids it in federal elections and because the Supreme Court ruled that poll taxes violate the Fourteenth Amendment’s Equal Protection Clause. It’s weird that a great patriot like yourself would want to do something unconstitutional, Glory. Also weird that you’d pick such an irrelevant sum, in today’s money. Who do you suppose would be deterred by $1? Or is that why you don’t want to provide food or healthcare to the poor? So that they’d not be able to afford voting? ETA - > **[Poll taxes in the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_tax_%28United_States%29)** > > Poll taxes in the United States is the history of the use of poll tax (tax of a fixed sum on every liable individual, without reference to income or resources) across the US. Poll taxes had been a major source of government funding among the colonies and states which formed the United States. Poll taxes became a tool of disenfranchisement in the South during Jim Crow, following the end of Reconstruction. This persisted until court action, following the ratification of the 24th Amendment in 196... > **[Twenty-fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fourth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution)** > > The Twenty-fourth Amendment (Amendment XXIV) to the United States Constitution prohibits both Congress and the states from conditioning the right to vote in federal elections on payment of a poll tax or other types of tax. The amendment was proposed by Congress to the states on August 27, 1962, and was ratified by the states on January 23, 1964. > Southern states of the former Confederate States of America adopted poll taxes both in their state laws and in their state constitutions throughout t... ---
**Author:** ![syncrolecyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@syncrolecyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/syncrolecyne)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/691 "2015-12-16T18:29:35Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Because everyone has health. That’s like asking why everyone needs access to food. But then, I wouldn’t be surprised if your attitude there is “well then, let them starve”. I do think there has to be some responsibility that goes with this right…but are we ready for a society with government mandated weight loss or tobacco tests? Or we can do as the Czech Republic did to some degree, encourage a low-cost, taxable, mortality inducing activity to trim state expenses. > **[Public Finance Balance of Smoking in the Czech Republic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Finance_Balance_of_Smoking_in_the_Czech_Republic)** > > The Public Finance Balance of Smoking in the Czech Republic was a 2001 report commissioned by Philip Morris's Czech division following concerns raised by the Czech health ministry that smoking's costs outweighed its fiscal benefits. > The study was conducted by Arthur D. Little and found that smokers' early mortality and cigarette-tax revenue outweighed the costs of health-care and lost tax revenue from early death. The study concluded through cost-benefit analysis "based on up-to-date reliable da... ---
**Author:** ![Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/919ad9/32.png) [@Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rather_a_Vicious_Gentleman)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/692 "2015-12-16T19:04:27Z")
Hello my name is **RaVG** , and I’m a recovering bush era cynic. Sen Sanders is however giving me an unexpected political yen and I’d like to ride the high as far as I can… So besides forwarding my “election suggestion” to the DNC and possibly the electoral college, do you straightdopin political junkies have any notion of how one actually goes about campaigning for our guy? I mean do I people still sign on at some kinda hq and lick envelopes etc? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/693 "2015-12-16T19:05:49Z")
> [@Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](#): > > Hello my name is **RaVG** , and I’m a recovering bush era cynic. > Sen Sanders is however giving me an unexpected political yen and I’d like to ride the high as far as I can… > So besides forwarding my “election suggestion” to the DNC and possibly the electoral college, do you straightdopin political junkies have any notion of how one actually goes about campaigning for our guy? I mean do I people still sign on at some kinda hq and lick envelopes etc? Yes, they do. Or make phone calls, or run errands, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/694 "2015-12-16T20:28:25Z")
> [@Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](#): > > Hello my name is **RaVG** , and I’m a recovering bush era cynic. > Sen Sanders is however giving me an unexpected political yen and I’d like to ride the high as far as I can… > So besides forwarding my “election suggestion” to the DNC and possibly the electoral college, do you straightdopin political junkies have any notion of how one actually goes about campaigning for our guy? I mean do I people still sign on at some kinda hq and lick envelopes etc? You can call your local office or go to the campaign website (all the candidates have one) and click the Volunteer button. If there’s a local office for you candidate of choice, you might just drop in. It will probably be a little quiet for the next few weeks, but should pick up in January. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2015, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/695 "2015-12-17T05:58:13Z")
But do you Sanders people REALLY think he has a chance? The DNC wants Hillary and they wont take any others. I dont think Sanders even has a chance for vp. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2015, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/696 "2015-12-17T06:26:38Z")
> [@Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](#): > > Hello my name is **RaVG** , and I’m a recovering bush era cynic. > Sen Sanders is however giving me an unexpected political yen and I’d like to ride the high as far as I can… > So besides forwarding my “election suggestion” to the DNC and possibly the electoral college, do you straightdopin political junkies have any notion of how one actually goes about campaigning for our guy? I mean do I people still sign on at some kinda hq and lick envelopes etc? Figure out how to clear your calendar to caucus for Sanders. Figure out how to convince others to do so. It can be done! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2015, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/697 "2015-12-17T15:07:05Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But do you Sanders people REALLY think he has a chance? If he got the nomination, he would wipe the floor with anybody the Pubs have got now. So, no. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2015, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/698 "2015-12-17T16:31:54Z")
> [@](#): > > But do you Sanders people REALLY think he has a chance? A small one, but yes, he does. More to the point, though, even if he doesn’t get the nomination, he stands an excellent chance of getting more attention paid to the issues he considers important. I believe that’s probably the primary reason he’s running. ---
**Author:** ![Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/919ad9/32.png) [@Rather\_a\_Vicious\_Gentleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rather_a_Vicious_Gentleman)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2015, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/699 "2015-12-17T18:21:00Z")
How much of an advantage might the Senator hold in VT? ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/700 "2015-12-18T05:49:09Z")
A big one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=34) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=36)