# 2016 Bernie Sanders (D-VT) campaign for POTUS thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 28, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754 "2015-04-28T22:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 63
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2016, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1241 "2016-05-10T22:20:37Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I’m noticing that too. People aren’t listening to Bernie as much as they are shaking their head at him and telling him to get out of the way and let Hillary concentrate on beating Trump. That is no good reason for Bernie to shut up. Hillary can focus on Trump after the convention, there will be plenty of time for that, and far more time than she needs to beat him. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1242 "2016-05-11T01:41:39Z")
**SlackerInc** , we get it, you don’t like Bernie. That doesn’t make him lacking intelligence, and you’re the only person who has even tried to make that claim that I have seen. This should be obvious to people who aren’t of middling intelligence however that it is perfectly fine to be critical of Wal-Mart using taxpayers as their benefits department and also want the US taxpayers to pay for universal healthcare and the like because his plan involves Wal-Mart and the Walton family who owns them paying a bigger (and he would claim fairer) share in that than they currently are. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1243 "2016-05-11T01:43:32Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > That is no good reason for Bernie to shut up. Hillary can focus on Trump after the convention, there will be plenty of time for that, and far more time than she needs to beat him. Especially since Hillary Clinton didn’t announce the end of her 2008 campaign despite Obama being in the driver’s seat for a long time, until [four days after the primary season ended](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-weigant/the-end-of-hillary-clinto_b_9791460.html). ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1244 "2016-05-11T02:01:05Z")
She was very close and had a realistic chance right up until that day. Sanders is not and does not. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1245 "2016-05-11T02:02:20Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > That is no good reason for Bernie to shut up. What is a good reason for him to keep up the attacks? All he’s doing, and all his supporters are doing, is to increase the possibility of electing Trump. Why do you want Trump elected? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1246 "2016-05-11T03:10:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > She was very close and had a realistic chance right up until that day. Sanders is not and does not. It was a much closer race, true, however she was getting [calls to drop out of the race](http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=4705151&page=1) as early as late April: > [@](#): > > Obama won 11 straight primaries or caucuses in Louisiana, Nebraska, Washington State, the U.S. Virgin Islands, Maine, Maryland, Virginia, Washington, D.C., Hawaii, Wisconsin, and Rhode Island. > > The streak included some of Obama’s most impressive victories including a 64-35 percent win in Virginia, 75-24 percent in his native Hawaii, and a 58-41 percent margin in Wisconsin. > > As the losses kept coming, calls for Clinton to withdraw from the race began to grow louder, but the former first lady vowed to fight on in Texas and Ohio, which both held contests on March 4. And what happened down the stretch when the inevitable was closing in? > [@](#): > > Clinton focused on pushing the Democratic National Committee to recognize the disputed votes in Florida and Michigan…Clinton did succeed in getting some delegates recognized from Michigan and Florida but not all that she wanted. > > Clinton supporters angry, some disrupting the committee proceedings, chanting, “Denver! Denver! Denver!” as a sign they want Clinton to take her fight all the way to the Democratic Convention. > > “Mrs. Clinton has instructed me to reserve her right to take this to the Credentials Committee,” Harold Ickes, a key Clinton strategist told the Democratic National Committee. Not very different than what Bernie is dealing with now. The reason many people don’t realize that Obama had a solid lead was because of the superdelegate math and the fact that in 2008 the media reported the ongoing tally including the superdelegates that she actually led with; this year the [DNC requested](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-abramson/the-national-media-has-be_b_9364170.html) the media use pledged delegates to keep the score (the linked article claims they didn’t always comply; perhaps, but the distinction was not hard to discern compared to 2008). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1247 "2016-05-11T03:20:56Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > What is a good reason for him to keep up the attacks? All he’s doing, and all his supporters are doing, is to increase the possibility of electing Trump. > > Why do you want Trump elected? First of all, he is not attacking Hillary nearly as much as even a month ago. And he is stepping up his attacks against Trump. Secondly, there is [no reason for her to ask](http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/05/politics/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-exit-race/) Sanders to leave the race: > [@](#): > > Democrats close to Clinton and the man who could become a top surrogate – President Barack Obama – insist they won’t pressure the Vermont senator to leave. That reluctance is based on fear inside the Democratic establishment that such a move would make it more difficult to unite the party later this year. > > Clinton needs the excited supporters that have rallied around Sanders and hopes treating the senator’s campaign respectfully will make them more likely to back her against Trump. Clinton has already started to make overtures to Sanders’ supporters – pledging to support them even if they don’t support her – and campaign aides have said those will continue in the coming weeks. Maybe Hillary knows better how to handle this than you do. Thirdly, since Sanders has shown that he is increasingly resigned to talking about influencing the campaign and party even if he doesn’t get the nomination, Hillary could call him up and tell him “I promise that your ideas and passion will be a part of my campaign and I hope we can work together to take down Trump” that he would be quite amenable to that. Hillary can make that call tomorrow, even telling him to stay in the race if he likes because it won’t hurt her whether the party unites next week or next month as long as they do try and unite. So is it your suggestion that if Hillary is unwilling to make that call or that she is willing to tell someone who got 40% of Democratic primary votes and excited young voters that he and they should pound sand that means she wants to see Trump elected? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1248 "2016-05-11T03:22:18Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > It was a much closer race, true, however she was getting [calls to drop out of the race](http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=4705151&page=1) as early as late April That should read as early as late February. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1249 "2016-05-11T03:59:29Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > **SlackerInc** , we get it, you don’t like Bernie. That doesn’t make him lacking intelligence, and you’re the only person who has even tried to make that claim that I have seen. It’s not that commonly made, but that doesn’t make it wrong. And I’d say a lot of the negative reactions to his disastrous _Daily News_ interview are in this vein, even if they don’t use the phrase “middling intelligence” (I never said he was flat out stupid). Take [this writeup in The Atlantic, for example:](http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/04/bernie-sanderss-rough-ride-with-the-daily-news/476919/) > [@](#): > > Throughout his interview, Sanders seemed taken aback when he was pressed on policy—and not just on the matters that are peripheral to his approach, like the Israeli-Palestinian conflict or interrogation of detainees, but even on bread-and-butter matters like breaking up the big banks, the Democratic presidential hopeful came across as tentative, unprepared, or unaware. > [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > This should be obvious to people who aren’t of middling intelligence however that it is perfectly fine to be critical of Wal-Mart using taxpayers as their benefits department and also want the US taxpayers to pay for universal healthcare and the like because his plan involves Wal-Mart and the Walton family who owns them paying a bigger (and he would claim fairer) share in that than they currently are. You are basically fanwanking his position, because that’s not what he said. He mentioned nothing about how much Walmart or the Waltons pay in taxes. Read it again: > [@](#): > > Walmart — which is owned by the Walton family, the wealthiest family in this country, worth some $149 billion — they get a huge subsidy from the taxpayers of this country, from you, from me, from every working people, person, because the wages they pay their employees are so low that many of those workers have to go on Medicaid or food stamps in order to survive. His complaint there is clearly that Walmart pays their workers too little, and that as a result those workers have to go on welfare, which is funded by hardworking members of the middle class who aren’t on welfare themselves. This is something he probably read in _The American Prospect_ or some sort of center-left publication like that. And I repeat: it is incoherent and contradictory when he attempts to marry it to his overall portfolio of proposals. But not only did he say it in this interview (which could be more easily forgiven as a momentary slipup), he apparently says it in every speech! That’s just not terribly perspicacious, I’m afraid. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1250 "2016-05-11T05:06:09Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > His complaint there is clearly that Walmart pays their workers too little, and that as a result those workers have to go on welfare, which is funded by hardworking members of the middle class who aren’t on welfare themselves. This is something he probably read in _The American Prospect_ or some sort of center-left publication like that. And I repeat: it is incoherent and contradictory when he attempts to marry it to his overall portfolio of proposals. But not only did he say it in this interview (which could be more easily forgiven as a momentary slipup), he apparently says it in every speech! That’s just not terribly perspicacious, I’m afraid. It’s not incoherent or contradictory at all to call attention to wealthy people gaming the system for their benefit. I’m not sure how you think it is. Perhaps you could explain? ---
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1251 "2016-05-11T06:01:11Z")
Most working people who need Medicaid are working jobs that can’t pay them well: waiting tables, cleaning houses, cutting lawns and so on. The issue is that the Waltons pay their workers poorly when they could be paying them a hell of a lot better. So they’re basically shunting the cost of running their business — which they could easily afford themselves — on to the taxpayers. I’m no Sanders fan, but that seems a solid argument to me. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1252 "2016-05-11T06:01:12Z")
Oh the Daily News interview. :rolleyes: Here’s what [Robert Reich](https://www.facebook.com/RBReich/posts/1192384144107513) thought about it: > [@](#): > > The criticism is bonkers. Bernie was absolutely correct when he said the President has the authority to break up the big banks under Dodd-Frank. He’s repeatedly specified exactly how he’d use that Dodd-Frank authority to do so. His critics are confusing the Dodd-Frank Act with the Federal Reserve. Whether the Fed has the authority on its own to break up the biggest banks is irrelevant. Others found the interview more of an indictment of a [clueless media](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-daily-news_us_5704779ce4b0a506064d8df5) than a clueless candidate: > [@](#): > > In several instances, it’s the Daily News editors who are bungling the facts in an interview designed to show that Sanders doesn’t understand the fine points of policy. In questions about breaking up big banks, the powers of the Treasury Department and drone strikes, the editors were simply wrong on details. Now, Reich is not a dummy, but he is a Sanders supporter. However the author of the Huffington Post piece says at the end of it “I have my own view, that Sanders has shown himself to be a lousy manager of his staff on Capitol Hill over the years, which doesn’t bode well for a presidency, and has not shown much interest in organizing, or ability to organize coalitions within the House or the Senate to advance his agenda, outside of his audit-the-Fed legislation, and some improvements to Obamacare,” lest you think that he is one of the Bernie supporter idiots who are somehow allowed to post conspiracy theory bullshit and anti-Hillary propaganda there (Seth Abramson and H. A. Goodman and the offenders). And also other people agree, including [Corey Robin](http://coreyrobin.com/2016/04/06/homo-politicus-%E2%89%A0-homo-wonkus/) and Juan González who happened to be a [part of the Daily News](http://www.democracynow.org/2016/4/6/juan_gonzalez_was_at_bernie_sanders) Editorial Board. > [@](#): > > I, overall, thought that Bernie Sanders handled the exchange very well. And I think that there were a few places where he stumbled, and—but I was amazed at his ability to parry the questions that were thrown at him. And [Paul Rosenberg at Salon](http://www.salon.com/2016/04/17/our_media_is_just_this_dumb_easily_suckered_press_screws_bernie_sanders_again/) makes the case that this is part of a bias that the media has with Sanders: > [@](#): > > Of course, it’s not just Sanders as an individual candidate they don’t like. Rather, it’s a reflection of deep ideological biases, which the Sanders campaign challenges head on. He is attacking the establishment for decades of mismanagement—on the rigged economy and the corruption of democracy most of all, but also on climate change, reckless foreign wars, and more recently (having actually listened to and learned from Black Lives Matter activists) on racial justice. The establishment media are part of the establishment, and they are attacking Sanders in return—not because he’s wrong, but because he’s right. I don’t buy a lot of the conspiracy theory crap that tries to explain why Sanders is losing. I know why he’s losing - it’s because he is unable to appeal to minorities (black voters in particular) and women, urban dwellers who make up a larger portion of the electorate. But the media didn’t help Sanders and a large part of that is that the mainstream media sucks at actually telling the news. If they did they wouldn’t keep calling him a socialist rather than a Democratic socialist. I mean, if they can’t even get right how the guy self-identifies… :smack: But he isn’t losing because he is unintelligent. Those who actually looked at the transcript can see that interview was more of an indictment of the media getting something they should know wrong rather than an indictment on Sanders. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1253 "2016-05-11T10:37:59Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > First of all, he is not attacking Hillary nearly as much as even a month ago. Good for him, then. :rolleyes: But he’s still doing it, isn’t he? And yes, we do know he’s been energetically doing all the things his acolytes have always indignantly claimed Clinton would do to him. > [@](#): > > And he is stepping up his attacks against Trump. While still damaging Clinton’s chances of beating Trump. Which you support. I asked why, and you’re evading it. > [@](#): > > Secondly, there is [no reason for her to ask](http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/05/politics/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-exit-race/) Sanders to leave the race:Maybe Hillary knows better how to handle this than you do. She shouldn’t have to ask, and nobody is asking her to. Again, please explain why you want Trump elected instead of her. > [@](#): > > Thirdly, since Sanders has shown that he is increasingly resigned to talking about influencing the campaign and party even if he doesn’t get the nomination Not by continuing to attack the nominee, he isn’t. > [@](#): > > Hillary could call him up and tell him “I promise that your ideas and passion will be a part of my campaign and I hope we can work together to take down Trump” that he would be quite amenable to that. Again, the responsibility to withdraw is _his_. The people have chosen Clinton and her agenda, not Sanders. That’s the fact that galls you so. Can you point to any other election where it has been the people’s choice’s responsibility to get losers to withdraw? Or is this the first election you’ve ever paid attention to, as seems to be the case? > [@](#): > > she is willing to tell someone who got 40% of Democratic primary votes and excited young voters that he and they should pound sand that means she wants to see Trump elected? C’mon now, do you think Sanders has any responsibility to anyone other than himself here? Do you? Once more, he, and you, are acting in a way that can only help Trump. You haven’t explained why, so here’s another chance to avoid evading it. Why? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1254 "2016-05-11T11:47:31Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > But he isn’t losing because he is unintelligent. There’s the second time you’ve trotted out this straw man. I never said he was unintelligent. Is that what you think “middling intellect” means? I’d say that describes the majority of the population, including most college graduates and even many with graduate degrees. But compared to most lawyers or college professors, sure: he doesn’t measure up. > [@Nonsuch](#): > > Most working people who need Medicaid are working jobs that can’t pay them well: waiting tables, cleaning houses, cutting lawns and so on. The issue is that the Waltons pay their workers poorly when they could be paying them a hell of a lot better. So they’re basically shunting the cost of running their business — which they could easily afford themselves — on to the taxpayers. I’m no Sanders fan, but that seems a solid argument to me. Yes, it’s a solid center-left argument. But to complain that taxpayers have to foot the cost of their Medicaid, because Walmart’s wages are too low, implies that Walmart should be paying for their medical care (through higher wages which can be used to buy it on the private market; or if we’re charitable in our interpretation, maybe through a medical benefit that comes with the job), \*not \*taxpayers. When we know he actually wants \*everyone’s \*medical care to be paid for by taxpayers. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1255 "2016-05-11T11:53:18Z")
[Here’s how Clinton sees it](https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/05/09/hillary-clinton-just-issued-a-challenge-to-progressives-they-should-take-her-up-on-it/): > [@](#): > > “I’m three million votes ahead of Senator Sanders, nearly 300 pledged delegates ahead of him. He has to make his own mind up. > > “But I was very heartened to hear him say last week that he is going to work seven days a week to make sure Donald Trump doesn’t become president. And I want to unify the party. I see a great role and opportunity for him and his supporters to be part of that unified party, to move into not just November to win the election against Donald Trump, but to then govern based on the progressive goals that he and I share. > > “We both want to raise the minimum wage. We both understand you have got to rein in bad actors on Wall Street and in corporate America to make sure they don’t wreck Main Street. We have a lot of the same goals. And I hope we can unify around them.” If Sanders were really about policy rather than ego, wouldn’t he gladly agree? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1256 "2016-05-11T12:11:18Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [Here’s how Clinton sees it](https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2016/05/09/hillary-clinton-just-issued-a-challenge-to-progressives-they-should-take-her-up-on-it/):If Sanders were really about policy rather than ego, wouldn’t he gladly agree? He will at the convention. He told his supporters that he would fight for every vote and he will, but he didn’t attack Hillary last night (at least IIRC), and I think that from now on his messaging will be positive for his issues and negative attacks on Trump. His big emphasis last night was on the importance of beating Trump. I’m fine with Bernie staying in, as long as he focuses on the importance of beating Trump. If this long and slow withdrawal from the race is what it takes to bring his supporters onboard, then I’m fine with it. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1257 "2016-05-11T13:51:21Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > **SlackerInc** , we get it, you don’t like Bernie. That doesn’t make him lacking intelligence, and you’re the only person who has even tried to make that claim that I have seen. > > This should be obvious to people who aren’t of middling intelligence however that it is perfectly fine to be critical of Wal-Mart using taxpayers as their benefits department and also want the US taxpayers to pay for universal healthcare and the like because his plan involves Wal-Mart and the Walton family who owns them paying a bigger (and he would claim fairer) share in that than they currently are. > [@Nonsuch](#): > > Most working people who need Medicaid are working jobs that can’t pay them well: waiting tables, cleaning houses, cutting lawns and so on. The issue is that the Waltons pay their workers poorly when they could be paying them a hell of a lot better. So they’re basically shunting the cost of running their business — which they could easily afford themselves — on to the taxpayers. I’m no Sanders fan, but that seems a solid argument to me. It’s a trifle more nuanced; Hillary Clinton did a long — paid — stint on the board of Walmart during the '80s and '90s, as well as being part of their legal representation, and she held the party line admirably against the Twin Demons of Unionization and Higher Pay. And she is reaping her reward now, as well as in Heaven. _ **If** _ Walmart paid it’s workers more and gave better benefits, **then** it would be too poor to support Hillary financially; to mention only _one_ donation, Alice Walton has given a third of a million dollars to Hillary’s campaign. And if Hillary isn’t in the White House, who is there to speak for the little Waltons ? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1258 "2016-05-11T14:48:11Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > _ **If** _ Walmart paid it’s workers more and gave better benefits, **then** it would be too poor to support Hillary financially… Is this your opinion, or someone else’s? ---
**Author:** ![Pashnish\_Ewing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8797f3/32.png) [@Pashnish\_Ewing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pashnish_Ewing)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1259 "2016-05-11T15:28:19Z")
Hillary staying in the 2008 race until the bitter end turned out to be a positive thing for the Obama general election campaign. Each primary state was able to build a foundation of volunteers and support that carried over into the big show. If the 2016 HRC campaign is smart, they’ll ask Bernie to stay in as long as he can. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2016, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754/1260 "2016-05-11T15:43:18Z")
I just want to say that come election time, I’ll vote Hillary to keep Trump out. I do so because for once, I believe that the vote I cast, (along with the friends I was able to convince to vote Hillary too), actually matters. Trump would be a disaster, and even though I live in a democratic state, NY is where Trump is from… So I feel obligated to vote for ‘not’ Trump. But I will always believe that Bernie Sanders is/was the best candidate. I’m feel a little upset that people didn’t see what I saw in him. Or didn’t perceive him the way I did. He’ll always be a great person in my eyes. I’m happy to have gotten to know him. He really inspires me to be more. Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=62) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2016-bernie-sanders-d-vt-campaign-for-potus-thread/718754.md?page=64)