# 24 - Season 3, Episode 18, 6:00AM - 7:00AM (SPOILERS- Sunday night episode!) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 18, 2004, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733 "2004-04-18T23:48:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Max\_Carnage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/max_carnage/32/12775_2.png) [@Max\_Carnage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Carnage)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/61 "2004-04-20T04:34:48Z")
How odd that what’s bound to be the shortest-lived 24 thread of the season due to time between episodes had turned out to be the most replied to so far (I think) That being the case I may mention this again since some ppl may not read the thread any more and what I say is always important enough to be read mulitple times 😉 , but did anyone happen to catch **The Punisher** this weekend? They mentioned Frank Castle was a soldier in the Gulf War and worked for CTU! Of course the first thing I thought…Excellent! A Jack Bauer/Frank Castle team-up. Or better yet, Jack Bauer has to track down a rogue former CTU agent who is on a vigilante spree taking out crime bosses across L.A. That’s some fanfic waiting to happen! Of course there is the 24 comic book coming out in June. And comic book crossovers are not unheard of. sigh…just a comic geek’s wet dream I guess. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/62 "2004-04-20T04:46:30Z")
> [@yellowcakesolid](#): > > Anyone else think the musical score was movie quality? The entrance to the helicopter pad and the attack on the apartment had me thinking movie. I was thinking exactly the same thing as I was watching. Kind of reminded me of how much I liked the score for the remake of _Battlestar Gallactica_. I actually thought the show was getting a better grip on reality. You have to have forgotten how utterly ridiculous last season became if you think otherwise. Palmer made a mistake in giving in. He just set himself up for an endless series of escalating demands. Good episode. It’s getting me interested again. It’s great Tuesday night warm-up for the real action in _The Shield_. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bob55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Bob55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob55)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/63 "2004-04-20T06:27:40Z")
Count me as another who thought the music at the helicoptor scene was amazing for a TV show. My wife and I both pointed it out. ---
**Author:** ![SilentButDeftly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/0ea827/32.png) [@SilentButDeftly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SilentButDeftly)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/64 "2004-04-20T15:49:18Z")
> [@dalovindj](#): > > One more thing I forgot to mention. I really doubt that Michelle will get away with being one of the 10%. That would be kind of a cop out, and it’s not 24’s style. However, I think they might let her live after all. When Saunder’s lackey expressed concern about the virus moving beyond the Americas and Saunder’s replied “Don’t worry, we’ll be fine.”, that pretty much confirms to me that he has an antidote. I mean, he is in LA, he is in America. If he releases the virus he is toast as well. I’m thinking they may track him down, find his personal stash of antidote, and get one to Michelle in time. Or she’s toast. I predict they won’t go with the 10% bullshit. My theory, and I apologize if this has been covered before (I haven’t read all the previous threads on this season), is that Michelle’s pregnant. It’s my understanding that the immune system is all over the map when one is pregnant and this can result in increased immunity to some things, with weakened immunity to others… And in the 24niverse, this results in those “with child” immune to the Cordova (sp?) virus. That or the writers could just say, “oh, the virus doesn’t affect pregnant people – we ‘forgot’ to mention that earlier on.” ::waits patiently for a real immunologist to come by and hand his ass to him on a platter:: ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/65 "2004-04-20T15:54:19Z")
> [@Number Six](#): > > Gotta agree with the dj on this one. Sacrificing one combatant for the chance to save the lives of millions is the moral thing to do. No, it most certainly was not. It was expedient…it was, perhaps, pragmatic (although I think in the end it was not). But it was most certainly not moral. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/66 "2004-04-20T18:12:14Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > No, it most certainly was not. It was expedient…it was, perhaps, pragmatic (although I think in the end it was not). But it was most certainly not moral. Tell that to the millions of dead virus victims… Oh wait, you can’t. THEY’RE DEAD! ---
**Author:** ![lawboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c67d28/32.png) [@lawboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawboy)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/67 "2004-04-20T18:35:28Z")
Ok, now what is the deal with that assassin girl who blew up the plane in Season 1 and infected Palmer at the end of Season 2? Though it left a scarring on his arm, the president wasn’t affected that much. Could Palmer have immunity to the virus? ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/68 "2004-04-20T21:22:47Z")
> [@lawboy](#): > > Ok, now what is the deal with that assassin girl who blew up the plane in Season 1 and infected Palmer at the end of Season 2? Though it left a scarring on his arm, the president wasn’t affected that much. Could Palmer have immunity to the virus? Well, I think it did affect him quite a bit- I think the writers originally planned for Palmer to die from it, but they didn’t want to give up the character. I wouldn’t think it had much to do with this day’s virus, unless the big bad had something against Palmer personally and wanted to do some “Your ears you keep, and I’ll tell you why” kind of thing, but I think that’d require a whole lot of killing to be effective. As for the assassin girl, whose name is Mandy, we haven’t seen her aside from the two events you mentioned. Personally, I want to know how she ties in to everything. It’d seem a bit of a copout to toss her in randomly to spice things up, like Q from TNG. ---
**Author:** ![dalovindj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/65b543/32.png) [@dalovindj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalovindj)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/69 "2004-04-20T22:15:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Well, I think it did affect him quite a bit- I think the writers originally planned for Palmer to die from it, but they didn’t want to give up the character. It was kind of wierd how they just brushed that whole thing off with some pills and a line or two. I cracked up when I read the following from a recap over at TWOP: > [@](#): > > Palmer is not dead? Um, let me explain the concept of a cliffhanger to you. A cliffhanger ends with a beloved character hanging from a cliff. The next episode should feature the same beloved character still hanging from the cliff, and the resulting action should satisfy the audience’s desire to see how the character gets down from said cliff. A cliffhanger is NOT a character hanging from a cliff and then the next episode revealing that the beloved character has been alive for the past three years and all of his tormentors behind bars. 'Kay? DaLovin’ Dj ---
**Author:** ![Kaitlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/73ab20/32.png) [@Kaitlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaitlyn)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2004, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/70 "2004-04-20T23:47:47Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > No, it most certainly was not. It was expedient…it was, perhaps, pragmatic (although I think in the end it was not). But it was most certainly not moral. The sacrifice of a relatively small number of combatants (relative to the general population) in defense of a much larger civilian population is the very reason we have a standing military and active intelligence/counter espionage system in the first place. And let me point out that this was a sacrifice Chapelle chose to make. He had a loaded gun moments before he was scheduled to die, yet chose not to prevent Jack from doing what they both believed was necessary at the time. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/71 "2004-04-21T02:55:47Z")
> [@](#): > > The sacrifice of a relatively small number of combatants (relative to the general population) in defense of a much larger civilian population is the very reason we have a standing military and active intelligence/counter espionage system in the first place. There are rules against executing innocent people for ‘larger’ purposes. Or are you suggesting that if Bush announced tomorrow that he had George Tenet shot in the back of the head and dumped in an industrial park because Bin Laden told him he’d release a virus if Bush didn’t do it, that the world would be okay with that? That YOU would be okay with that? Sorry, there are lines you don’t cross. Kneeling down innocents and shooting them in the back of the head is one of them. The notion that it’s okay to execute innocents for a ‘greater good’ is the exact same logic the Chinese and Soviets used to justify their atrocities. ---
**Author:** ![Kaitlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/73ab20/32.png) [@Kaitlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaitlyn)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/72 "2004-04-21T06:13:43Z")
If I knew for a fact that Bin Laden had the virus, that it was in a dozen American cities ready to be released in public places, that if released it would likely spread like wildfire, killing tens or hundreds of millions of innocents, that killing Tenet bought American intelligence enough time to find Bin Laden and prevent this, I would hail Bush as a hero. Hell, under those circumstances, I might even consider voting for him. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/73 "2004-04-21T07:33:52Z")
I hope it’s not taboo to post to ‘last week’s’ 24 thread, but I haven’t been around and it was only 2 days ago. Palmer didn’t have a choice. He had no leverage with which to bargain with Saunders for vials, especially considering these are sort of preliminary demands, not the main event- he’s just toying with Palmer. There’s no reason for Saunders to work with them, they can’t make any kind of effective threat against him. They can not do what he wants, but then he kills mass numbers of American civilians. The only reason the thing has been mostly contained in LA so far (and they’re barely holding on) is that CTU knew exactly what was going to happen, and when and where. Unbeknownst to the Prez - but knownst to us - vials are headed for Cleveland, Chicago and Las Vegas among other places. Saunders intentionally picked a location that was containable to demonstrate his point. If he hadn’t done that, CTU would be screwed despite **Sam** ’s valid point about the virus. Hundreds of people could be infected at a mall or some other public place, and by the time enough of them came to any one hospital for someone to get suspicious, there’d loads of people exposed and more symptomatic people wandering around infecting others. It’d be impossible to track everyone down. Saunders obvious does have some kind of grand plan, but I don’t see the benefits of total non-cooperation right now. Yes, it’s clear they’ll just get more terror. But they have to stall him while they try and track him down. How do they know he won’t just release the virus once he has what he wants anyway? Anything that buys CTU time and doesn’t compromise national security or something (maybe tonight’s demand does that and we’ll see if they do it) should probably be done. The scale of casualties could be different- hundreds of people will die in LA, if the virus gets out in some other city, it’d probably be thousands. If it was ten other cities, who knows, because the chances someone slips through and infects more people increase. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/74 "2004-04-21T08:27:06Z")
> [@](#): > > Something I’ve been wondering. I saw a similar discussion about the West Wing. Where does real-life history stop and 24 history begin? Was Clinton the last president before Palmer? IRL, the Dept of Homeland Security was created after 9/11, right? So apparently, though it was never discussed, the WTC was destroyed in the 24-verse as well. Unless the DHS was created in response to the nuclear bomb in season 2. Regardless, Palmer has a terible track record when it comes to America getting attacked. My personal take on this, since Season 1 aired in 2004 and was set on CA primary election day in an election year, was that it was 2004 (which would have placed Season 1 on Tuesday, March 3rd 2004). Season 2 took place 16 months later, on a Saturday, which would make it either the 4th, 11th, 18th, or 25th of July, 2005. This season, then, would be occuring in 2008, and since there was a presidential debate taking place that evening, we can guess that it’s a Tuesday (the usual night for presidential debates, IIRC) in August, September, or possibly October. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/75 "2004-04-21T08:28:28Z")
Correction: I meant to say, of course, that Season 1 aired in 2001, not 2004. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2004, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/76 "2004-04-22T02:18:06Z")
This was definitely a heavy one. I thought he was going to find some way to save Chappelle, but… The actor playing that part did an awfully good job portraying the guy when his time came up. One thing that nobody at CTU has mentioned – or even thought about, it seems – is that finding Saunders doesn’t end the threat. His couriers are already en route to big cities. Saunders is smart – a step ahead of everybody – I would guess he has given the couriers standing orders to release the virus vials if they don’t hear from him at certain checkpoints (i.e. if he’s captured or killed). The threat isn’t over unless you get the couriers. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2004, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733/77 "2004-04-22T04:12:27Z")
True. But it’s much easier to find one guy (who they know is in or around LA) than it is to find eleven other people, and I guess the hope is that if you cut off the head, the body will die. Whether or not they have orders to just release the virus at some point, it’ll be hard to get them and stop all of them from doing anything. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/24-season-3-episode-18-6-00am-7-00am-spoilers-sunday-night-episode/240733.md?page=3)