# 25% of Americans think the Sun revolves around the Earth. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 23, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363 "2004-11-23T21:47:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gamaliel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b487fb/32.png) [@Gamaliel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gamaliel)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/1 "2004-11-23T21:47:13Z")
There’s no hope for us. According to a [National Science Foundation survey](http://www.nsf.gov/sbe/srs/seind02/append/c7/at07-10.pdf) (pdf), 25% of Americans think the Sun tools around the Earth. Bigfoot, Elvis, ghosts, creationism, the grassy knoll gunmen, I can let all that go. But now it’s official. It’s been fun while it lasted, but it’s time to give up and close up shop. Everybody back to wherever they or their ancestors emmigrated from to get a decent education. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/2 "2004-11-23T21:49:36Z")
Yeah, but 35% of Americans think radioactive milk can be made safe by boiling it. I guess after the apocalypse, a good third of the survivors will do themselves in anyway, and my roving band of marauders will have less competition. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/3 "2004-11-23T21:52:34Z")
> [@Gamaliel](#): > > It’s been fun while it lasted, but it’s time to give up and close up shop. Everybody back to wherever they or their ancestors emmigrated from to get a decent education. Do you have data showing that people in the countries that non-native Americans came from score higher on similiar tests? ---
**Author:** ![cards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecd19e/32.png) [@cards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cards)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/4 "2004-11-23T21:53:04Z")
Well that’s just silly. Everyone knows the universe revolves around me. ---
**Author:** ![Gamaliel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b487fb/32.png) [@Gamaliel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gamaliel)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/5 "2004-11-23T22:01:34Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Do you have data showing that people in the countries that non-native Americans came from score higher on similiar tests? You make a good point. Since there’s nowhere to go, I guess we should just lace up our Nikes and wait for the next comet. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/6 "2004-11-23T22:04:44Z")
> [@Gamaliel](#): > > There’s no hope for us. > > According to a [National Science Foundation survey](http://www.nsf.gov/sbe/srs/seind02/append/c7/at07-10.pdf) (pdf), 25% of Americans think the Sun tools around the Earth. With respect to an observer where? An observer on Earth is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the Earth. An observer on the Sun is entitled to the conclusion that the Earth revolves around the Sun. An observer on Mars is entitled to the conclusion that both the Sun and the Earth revolve around Mars, and an observer at the center of our galaxy is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the galaxy while the Earth revolve around it. And so forth. I have to believe at least SOME people understood the relativity of motion with respect to the observer and answered accordingly. ---
**Author:** ![Lobsang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobsang/32/4067_2.png) [@Lobsang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobsang)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/7 "2004-11-23T22:08:30Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > An observer on Earth is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the Earth. An observer on the Sun is entitled to the conclusion that the Earth revolves around the Sun. An observer on Mars is entitled to the conclusion that both the Sun and the Earth revolve around Mars, and an observer at the center of our galaxy is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the galaxy while the Earth revolve around it. Are you kidding? Education is supposed to teach people things. That the earth revolves around the sun is pretty fucking basic education. Your world implies people don’t go to school and believe are entitled to believe whatever they believed when they were 8. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/8 "2004-11-23T22:10:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I have to believe at least SOME people understood the relativity of motion with respect to the observer and answered accordingly. You really think 25% of Americans meant it in that way? ---
**Author:** ![Gamaliel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b487fb/32.png) [@Gamaliel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gamaliel)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/9 "2004-11-23T22:11:05Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > With respect to an observer where? > > An observer on Earth is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the Earth. An observer on the Sun is entitled to the conclusion that the Earth revolves around the Sun. An observer on Mars is entitled to the conclusion that both the Sun and the Earth revolve around Mars, and an observer at the center of our galaxy is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the galaxy while the Earth revolve around it. > > And so forth. I have to believe at least SOME people understood the relativity of motion with respect to the observer and answered accordingly. 92% of college grads and 76% of high school grads answered correctly, while only 52% of those who didn’t graduate high school got it right. I don’t think you can attribute this to overanalyzing the question. ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/10 "2004-11-23T22:11:21Z")
“The universe began with a huge explosion”? Not to be pedantic, but that seems a little, uh, simplistic for a question about modern cosmology, no? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/11 "2004-11-23T22:13:53Z")
> [@Lobsang](#): > > Are you kidding? Education is supposed to teach people things. That the earth revolves around the sun is pretty fucking basic education. Your world implies people don’t go to school and believe are entitled to believe whatever they believed when they were 8. **Bricker** is speaking of relativity, in which any point can be the center of the universe. Technically, the Earth being the center of the universe is as true as any other point. But I doubt that those 25% were answering in the spirit of relativity. I’d bet that most of them know of Einstein only as “Some really smart guy with bad hair.” ---
**Author:** ![Blown\_Injected](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@Blown\_Injected](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blown_Injected)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/12 "2004-11-23T22:15:02Z")
you must be nuts - of course it revolves around the earth and I’ll keep saying it until the church lets me out of the dungeon under the pew ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/13 "2004-11-23T22:16:44Z")
Interestingly, correct answers peaked at baccalaureate and declined for graduate/professional for questions B, D, K, N, P, and Q. ---
**Author:** ![Bean\_Counter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/db5fbb/32.png) [@Bean\_Counter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bean_Counter)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/14 "2004-11-23T22:17:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > With respect to an observer where? > > An observer on Earth is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the Earth. An observer on the Sun is entitled to the conclusion that the Earth revolves around the Sun. An observer on Mars is entitled to the conclusion that both the Sun and the Earth revolve around Mars, and an observer at the center of our galaxy is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the galaxy while the Earth revolve around it. > > And so forth. I have to believe at least SOME people understood the relativity of motion with respect to the observer and answered accordingly. If you would have left Mars out of it, you would have had a viable argument. It is the movement of Mars that specifically points out the problem of an Earth-centric galaxy. As the Earth approaches and passes Mars in their respective orbits around the Sun, Mars seems to move backwards across the sky. Not something that would happen if everything was orbiting the Earth. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/15 "2004-11-23T22:22:12Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Do you have data showing that people in the countries that non-native Americans came from score higher on similiar tests? [Sure.](http://timss.bc.edu/timss1995i/presspop3.html) > [@](#): > > Lowest-performing countries in mathematics and science literacy included Cyprus and South Africa. The Czech Republic, the United States, and Austria were among the lowest-performing countries in both advanced mathematics and physics. I think it’s a truism, talked about many times on this board, that there is excellent education to be found in the US - the best in the world, still the number of “JayWalking” (as on Leno) individuals are staggering. I’m too lazy to do a search now, having the flu and local time is closing in on midnight, but I’m sure you can find it. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/16 "2004-11-23T22:23:33Z")
Bigfoot Elvis!? :eek: Cool… ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/17 "2004-11-23T22:24:20Z")
It’s interesting how big the spread is male vs. female on that Sun question. 14% men vs. 34% women. Also, Question K on links between smoking and lung cancer is pretty good proof that saturation advertising does work. 94% correct over all people! ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/18 "2004-11-23T22:25:00Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > With respect to an observer where? > > An observer on Earth is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the Earth. An observer on the Sun is entitled to the conclusion that the Earth revolves around the Sun. An observer on Mars is entitled to the conclusion that both the Sun and the Earth revolve around Mars, and an observer at the center of our galaxy is entitled to the conclusion that the Sun revolves around the galaxy while the Earth revolve around it. > > And so forth. I have to believe at least SOME people understood the relativity of motion with respect to the observer and answered accordingly. Nope. Under Einstein’s theory of relativity, acceleration (in this case changing direction) is _not_ relative. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/19 "2004-11-23T22:26:18Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > **Bricker** is speaking of relativity, in which any point can be the center of the universe. Technically, the Earth being the center of the universe is as true as any other point. But I doubt that those 25% were answering in the spirit of relativity. I’d bet that most of them know of Einstein only as “Some really smart guy with bad hair.” Wrong kind of [relativity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galilean_relativity). Einstein’s theory of relativity deals with the fact that light has the same measured speed regarless of one’s reference frame. The idea that simple motion has no absolute reference frame is actually Galilean relativity. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363/20 "2004-11-23T22:30:16Z")
It is good to see support for the Aristotelian view making a comeback. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-of-americans-think-the-sun-revolves-around-the-earth/276363.md?page=2)