# 25 years ago today-- ST2: The Wrath Of Khan **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 4, 2007, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760 "2007-06-04T22:38:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/81 "2007-06-07T01:40:43Z")
[QUOTE=Pushkin] They’re encountered surprisingly frequently from the 23rd century onwards. Luckily, in our universe, the only probe called Nomad that NASA created was a four wheeled rover for experimental work on Earth 😉 [/QUOTE] And we wisely canceled the Voyager program once we found out via the historical documentary that the sixth one would someday return with disasterous consequences. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/82 "2007-06-07T01:50:58Z")
[QUOTE=cochrane] That’s one of the things that didn’t hit me until later, either. I really wish Kirk and Khan had some scenes together, _a la_ the dinner receptiion in Space Seed, or the fight when Khan locked Kirk in the depressurization chamber. There really should have been some face-to-face interaction between Kirk and Khan. Perhaps Khan and some of his followers (believing the Enterprise to be damaged and unable to rescue Kirk) could have beamed to the Genesis chamber, had a fight with the Enterprise crew and physically made off with the Genesis device. [/QUOTE] Several early drafts of the script including various permutations of Kirk-Khan face-to-face confrontations, but all were apparently (a) really lame, and (b) required screwing up the rest of the script. I think there’s something appropriate about a space battle movie in which the two sides spend their time separated by space. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/83 "2007-06-07T02:07:20Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] In one movie the antagonist, such as it is, is a gigantic dildo that likes whales and is limitlessly powerful. You never saw it before, never will again, and don’t care. [/QUOTE] I agreed completely with the rest of your post, but to piggyback on **tdn** ’s thoughts, I always felt that the probe in **IV** was more about the unknown than it was a specific thing. Because we (humans) never actually interacted with it or understood anything about it, it works well as a metaphor for ‘all there is yet unknown in the universe.’ From that perspective, I think it works pretty well. [QUOTE=SpoilerVirgin] I didn’t like the part where the worms came out of the ears either. That’s why the next five times I saw the movie that month, I chose that moment to go to the restroom. 😃 [/QUOTE] Heh. Me too. I would conveniently go to the bathroom or get up to get people some food or something during that scene. Freaky. It’s still freaky, I think. As for **VI** , I enjoyed it, but feel like it had many huge holes. As **Bryan Ekers** says, it was a movie that seemed to fancy itself a political intrigue movie, but failed miserably at that in many places. I did enjoy some of the lines, in particular: _Can it be that we two, you and I, have grown so old as to have outlived our usefulness_ - Spock (or something along those lines) ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/84 "2007-06-07T04:36:16Z")
Say what you want about VI, but it did have the definitive captain’s moment in all the movies and TV shows. Chang is pounding Kirk with his invisible BOP, and _Excelsior_ is racing to join the battle. Sulu is pushing his crew and ship to the limits and beyond, desperate to make it in time. The helmsman turns to Sulu and says “Captain, she’ll fly apart” and Sulu snaps back “Fly her apart then!” Sulu in that scene has always embodied the epitome of what a Starfleet captain should be. To me anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/85 "2007-06-07T04:39:21Z")
Oh yea, did anyone else notice that it was _Excelsior_ that was charting gaseous anomalies at the beginning of the film, but that \*Enterprise \*had the “equipment to chart gaseous anomalies” that they used to modify the torpedo at the end? Hmmmm ---
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/86 "2007-06-07T11:12:32Z")
[QUOTE=Weirddave] Oh yea, did anyone else notice that it was _Excelsior_ that was charting gaseous anomalies at the beginning of the film, but that \*Enterprise \*had the “equipment to chart gaseous anomalies” that they used to modify the torpedo at the end? Hmmmm [/QUOTE] Is this some veiled hint at the Excelsior’s Captain’s flamboyance? Perhaps it was a slow week in Starfleet, you know, time to lean, time to clean. Standing mission: When you’ve got nothing better to do, chart gaseous anomalies. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/87 "2007-06-07T14:10:32Z")
Personally I love the line. I think Shatner delivers it perfectly. I didn’t like the echo in space edit because in space, no one can hear you scream. I think my favorite line is when Kirk calmly pulls up his communicator and says “It’s been two hours, are you ready?” I mean he could have yelled “POWNED!” to Savik at that moment, and I sure would have. On the DVD Meyers talked about how hard it was to get Shatner to say “here it comes” properly. Shatner kept telegraphing the punch. I have a friend who frequently uses The Relaint’s override code as his password. Now when I first saw the movie I was going to a screening on the day before opening. This was back when I lived in OKC. Well actually I lived in Midwest City on the far east side that. I was going to drive to my GFs house, yes some trek fans actually have girlfriends, and get her from the SW part of OKC and then go up to the NorthPark theatre. The entire date would be about 100 miles of driving. Anyway I had a blowout on I-240. I walked about 5 miles back to my house and called my GF and told her we wouldn’t be going. Then after sitting down, my brother pointed out that I could still make the movie myself. So I went by myself. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/88 "2007-06-07T14:17:33Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] On the DVD Meyers talked about how hard it was to get Shatner to say “here it comes” properly. Shatner kept telegraphing the punch. I have a friend who frequently uses The Relaint’s override code as his password. [/QUOTE] _mental gears grinding_ Was it 16309? 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/89 "2007-06-07T14:18:48Z")
Because if this thread, I watched TWOK last night. I’m firmly convinced that Khan was sentenced to Botany Bay because of his mullet. In fact, the whole BB crew looked like a bad ad for a punk Flock of Seagulls parody. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/90 "2007-06-07T14:25:05Z")
[QUOTE=tdn] Because if this thread, I watched TWOK last night. I’m firmly convinced that Khan was sentenced to Botany Bay because of his mullet. In fact, the whole BB crew looked like a bad ad for a punk Flock of Seagulls parody. [/QUOTE] Well, then, no _wonder_ they were forced to flee Earth. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/91 "2007-06-07T14:43:05Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Well, then, no _wonder_ they were forced to flee Earth. [/QUOTE] I ran I ran so far away … ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/92 "2007-06-07T14:43:07Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Well, then, no _wonder_ they were forced to flee Earth. [/QUOTE] Of course. People born in the 1920s and 30s, sporting 80s hairstyles in 1996, when they should have had 60s hair, obviously needed to travel to the future where they had some small hope of looking hip. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/93 "2007-06-07T15:03:07Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] _mental gears grinding_ Was it 16309? 🆒 [/QUOTE] I don’t know, he is a much bigger geek than I. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/94 "2007-06-07T15:08:15Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] I don’t know, he is a much bigger geek than I. [/QUOTE] I heard he lost weight on the Zemmy Grok program. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/95 "2007-06-07T15:08:20Z")
FWIW, a number of ST fan sites I found on Google confirm that it is indeed 16309. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/96 "2007-06-07T19:37:34Z")
[QUOTE=KneadToKnow] Offhand, I know of 3: the original theatrical release, the TV version (which was the first explanation some got of why Scotty was so torn up over Peter Preston’s death), and the DVD release, which is a little of both, IIRC. [/QUOTE] How 'bout the re-release? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/97 "2007-06-07T19:51:21Z")
[QUOTE=ouryL] How 'bout the re-release? [/QUOTE] Oooh, I hope it’s the pan-and-scan version. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/98 "2007-06-07T19:57:07Z")
Did anyone else read the novelization? I owned both II and III in novel form and a lot of stuff was fleshed out: Peter Preston’s relation to Scotty, Saavik’s love affair with Kirk’s son, the personalities of Carol Marcus’s team on the Genesis project, etc. Maybe the 20 years have softened my focus, but I remember both of them being really good sci-fi novels. ---
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/99 "2007-06-07T19:58:44Z")
I did. I remember Carol Marcus making a big deal that the Lab rats filled up a 50 Meg storage unit (bubble memory?) with a 32 Meg game and remarked just how huge it was. I was a geek. The number stuck. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760/100 "2007-06-07T20:04:01Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] Did anyone else read the novelization? I owned both II and III in novel form and a lot of stuff was fleshed out: Peter Preston’s relation to Scotty, Saavik’s love affair with Kirk’s son, the personalities of Carol Marcus’s team on the Genesis project, etc. Maybe the 20 years have softened my focus, but I remember both of them being really good sci-fi novels. [/QUOTE] I remember that it got the name of the planet Khan was marooned on wrong, and that it had Spock’s body burning up in the atmosphere of the Genesis planet (and then retconned Saavik reprogramming the launch path to put Spock’s coffin on the planet). I thought that they were pretty badly written, personally. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/25-years-ago-today-st2-the-wrath-of-khan/406760.md?page=6)