# $368 a month on gas = 3 gallons a day! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 6, 2011, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965 "2011-05-06T14:47:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/201 "2011-05-10T03:00:15Z")
> [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](#): > > I wonder if one reason you don’t see many truly small cars on the road in the US (ford KA etc) is that the roads are so crap and potholed? I really wouldn’t want to drive my dad’s KA on some of the roads in NC… The condition of the roads may be an issue, but I’d say it’s due more to couple of other things. First, you’ll often hear people say how unnerving it can be to be in a tiny car surrounded by much bigger ones. That’s not really an excuse, and eventually, as it becomes unaffordable to operate larger personal vehicles, that issue will take care of itself. Secondly, if I’m correctly picturing the kind of car you mean, I can see how families with small kids are reluctant to drive one. It’s not just the car seats but all the kids’ stuff the parents have to carry around whenever they take the kids anywhere. I would have liked to say this issue takes care of itself when the kids grow out of babyhood and the parents don’t have to cart the seats and other paraphernalia around anymore, but now our benighted regulators want kids up to 4’8" to sit in booster seats. I usually don’t complain about safety regs but I think this is just ridiculous. It’s so embarrassing for the kid, especially if he’s smaller than his peers and the only one that has to do that. As an aside, do you visitors from across the sea have to mention our damn roads over and over? We know they’re bad. We get it. Lack of commitment to their maintenance is an issue in many places, but another side of it is that there are so many more miles of road to be maintained. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/202 "2011-05-10T03:24:01Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > You don’t see many truly small cars on the road in the US because (1) Americans are a pretty chunky lot, by and large; (2) gasoline/petrol is cheap enough that it’s not worth the trade-off in space and power; (3) profit margins on small cars are tiny, and the Japanese are better at making small cars Americans want\* than American or European carmakers anyway. The worst part of your reasoning? 1. As a 6’0", 250lb man, I find the backseat and frontseat of my Jetta equally (in front) and more (in back) comfortable and roomy than my dad’s Suburban. 2. Many lighter cars also have significantly better power-to-weight ratios, and smallish hatchbacks/wagons have more than enough space for the average two-child family. 3. Can’t argue here. In other words, the popular beliefs about many of those things are just…well, I doubt any of those folks who’d believe the first two have ever sat in a Jetta with the turbo engine and paddle shifters. =P ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/203 "2011-05-10T03:38:51Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > The condition of the roads may be an issue, but I’d say it’s due more to couple of other things. First, you’ll often hear people say how unnerving it can be to be in a tiny car surrounded by much bigger ones. That’s not really an excuse, What? I drive a sort of small car and it’s unnerving to be driving down the freeway surrounded by SUVs because far too many drivers of those things don’t seem to understand how to use their blinkers and/or rear view mirrors. My car isn’t tiny by any stretch of the imagination, but it is frequently overlooked by drivers of large vehicles who want my lane before I’m done with it. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/204 "2011-05-10T05:00:50Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > If you bike how do you carry your laptop, briefcase, or anything else that might be bigger than a breadbox and doesn’t fit in those cute little baskets? What? You put it in the [panniers](http://www.bikebagshop.com/bike-panniers-e-73.html) of course. This is actually the set-up I am using. I have a conventional bicycle plus panniers. I bought a helmet and front and back lights too- it isn’t exactly free. I mostly only ride it for the 5 or so months the weather is nice, and not even always then. I live very close to work and also everything else, so I doubt I burn even 1/2 gallon of gas a day even if I drive everywhere. I can bike to and from work, or carry groceries &etc. in the panniers. I’m single, but moving into a lxry apt. w/my hot gf sometime soon. We’re paying a premium to live in town, which is worth it to us, plus the whole situation will amount to very much less driving that before. Still, even though I may present a sort of “tough-guy” image to certain people in rl, the fact is that at the first hint of cold weather I become a quivering-lipped weenie. I don’t bike those days, no way! Too cold! It makes me sufferrr, arrrrr! (Also, I am in love with my natural gas furnace). I continue to drive my late-model Corolla because 1)it still gets 25+ mpg even though it used to get 30 and 2) it NEVER breaks down. Once Subaru offers a PHEV Forester, or something equivalent becomes available, I’ll buy a new car. I think 10 years of a plug-in starting in 2013 will be a decent financial decision, but even if I’m wrong it isn’t like they come and take the car away or anything. So over a 12 month span I’d be surprised if my bicycling displaces even 20% of my gasoline usage. I dunno. It is certainly something, I know that much. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/205 "2011-05-10T05:09:42Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > The problem here is that my workplace requires going up a rather steep hill, and though it is just a few miles away, I imagine I would be a sweaty mess by the time I got to the campus; and I don’t want to have to use a college locker room (which might be locked anyway) to shower and clean up and then change clothes so I can teach a class. I took another look and came up with this: > [@](#): > > Electric bikes come in two basic designs - adaptive and purpose-built. The adaptive type starts with a bicycle and adds a drive system to it. A purpose-built e-bike is designed from the ground up. Adaptives … may require installation (allow 3 hours if you’re familiar with tools; otherwise your local bikeshop mechanic will charge about $75). Purpose-builts generate …features (like brake-activated tail lights). Users of both types enjoy easy acceleration, hill climbing, and cutting through headwinds. … Charging costs less than 5¢ of electricity from common 110 VAC wall outlets. …Quick chargers are available. And from the main page, I really like this: > [@](#): > > How e-bikes work is by assisting your pedaling. Electric bikes are everyday bicycles with an added battery-powered electric motor. Although capable of pushing you along without your help, electric bikes perform noticeably better when you pedal. The average “couch potato” who normally rides at 10 mph can ride at 15-20 mph using the same effort. He can also expect a range of 10 miles, with a recharge time of several hours. Do you remember that easy pedaling after you get your bike up to speed? That’s the cruising feeling you get all the time with an electric bike. Makes a guy almost want an e-bike! Until you look at the price tag, forget it. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/206 "2011-05-10T05:39:11Z")
If there was a million dollars (that you cod only spend on fun stuff- not on rent) waiting for you at work every day, but only if you didn’t drive solo, I promise that all of you would find a way to get to work without your car- be it walking, biking, busing, carpooling, moving closer, moving to a transport-friendly city, or whatever. You would make it work. So it’s not that you “can’t”. It’s that it isn’t worth it to you. That’s fine. ---
**Author:** ![put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/da6949/32.png) [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/put_down_the_sabre)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/207 "2011-05-10T09:37:11Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > The condition of the roads may be an issue, but I’d say it’s due more to couple of other things. First, you’ll often hear people say how unnerving it can be to be in a tiny car surrounded by much bigger ones. That’s not really an excuse, and eventually, as it becomes unaffordable to operate larger personal vehicles, that issue will take care of itself. Secondly, if I’m correctly picturing the kind of car you mean, I can see how families with small kids are reluctant to drive one. It’s not just the car seats but all the kids’ stuff the parents have to carry around whenever they take the kids anywhere. Sure - I’m not suggesting that a ford KA is a good family runabout. But eg I’m a grad student, and most of my (20-something, single) US friends drive what to me are relatively big cars - honda accords, toyota corollas, etc. Something like a KA would be quite useful here, but the roads might make it a bumpy ride! I’m a bit sceptical about American claims to only drive because they need to because of my experience here in Chapel Hill. I’m one of only a couple of the people I know who doesn’t have a car, and I am routinely surprised at trips that my US friends will drive, rather than walk or take the (free, regular) buses. eg I lived with some undergrads in my first year of grad school, about 1.5 miles from campus. I walked every day. Several of them (perfectly fit and healthy) drove, and paid huge amounts for parking. There is a cultural difference, I think. > [@Spectre of Pithecanthropus\[quote](#): > > As an aside, do you visitors from across the sea have to mention our damn roads over and over? We know they’re bad. We get it. Lack of commitment to their maintenance is an issue in many places, but another side of it is that there are so many more miles of road to be maintained. Well, I wasn’t mentioning them to be a dick in this case, I was genuinely positing them as a reason. But also we know the US doesn’t have good public transport infrastructure, but that people drive everywhere. So it’s a bit of a shock to see how bad the roads are. pdts ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/208 "2011-05-10T11:48:42Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > If there was a million dollars (that you cod only spend on fun stuff- not on rent) waiting for you at work every day, but only if you didn’t drive solo, I promise that all of you would find a way to get to work without your car- be it walking, biking, busing, carpooling, moving closer, moving to a transport-friendly city, or whatever. You would make it work. Yeah, but I’d only have to go to work for two days, then I’d quit 😉 In all seriousness though - yeah, we drive as much as we do (nowhere near three gallons a day worth…about half that I’d say) purely due to the cost benefit ratio. Getting to our normal driving destination (kids school) is just too expensive on public transport. If it cost less than driving we’d probably do it a lot more often, but it’s about 3 times more expensive in petrol terms - maybe only twice if you count wear and tear on the car. In some ways I’m kind of looking forward to the price of petrol going up some more. I suspect we’ll get some action on more frequent bus routes then. Trains will be a pain though - they’re already crowded, and getting the infrastructure down to put more of them on the line is going to be seriously painful. ---
**Author:** ![Moonlitherial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4bbf92/32.png) [@Moonlitherial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonlitherial)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/209 "2011-05-10T12:26:11Z")
Well in support of this (since there is no other reason I can see) Canada raised their gas prices last night by $.06/litre to 1.39/l. Last year at this time the radio reports prices were hovering around .98/l. If we continue on this pace I suspect that most people will be looking for more fuel efficient cars soon. There were already people interviewing that they will be selling their cottages because the cost of getting there is getting so high. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/210 "2011-05-10T13:08:25Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > Put it this way: I took the bus to work for several years. I had to stop, because the bus ridership was so low they consolidated routes, and the nearest bus stop would have required me to literally walk halfway to work anyway. I voluntarily walk halfway to work despite there being a train line. I do this because the walk is good for me. Clearly I am just better than you. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/211 "2011-05-10T14:09:41Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > The worst part of your reasoning? > > 1. As a 6’0", 250lb man, I find the backseat and frontseat of my Jetta equally (in front) and more (in back) comfortable and roomy than my dad’s Suburban. > 2. Many lighter cars also have significantly better power-to-weight ratios, and smallish hatchbacks/wagons have more than enough space for the average two-child family. > 3. Can’t argue here. > > In other words, the popular beliefs about many of those things are just…well, I doubt any of those folks who’d believe the first two have ever sat in a Jetta with the turbo engine and paddle shifters. =P What? Apparently you missed the part where I said “truly small cars”. The Jetta is not a truly small car. In fact, by anything except American or Australian standards, it’s not a small car at all. I was responding to a post by **pdts** , who was asking about cars the size of the [Ford Ka](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Ka). The Ka is about 11 feet long. A Jetta is 15 feet long. I just noticed I forgot to qualify my asterisk in that post. I was pointing out that Americans as a group don’t care if their cars ride or handle well, which is why Japanese small cars work better for us. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/212 "2011-05-10T14:46:33Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > First, you’ll often hear people say how unnerving it can be to be in a tiny car surrounded by much bigger ones. That’s not really an excuse, and eventually, as it becomes unaffordable to operate larger personal vehicles, that issue will take care of itself. I wish it would take care of itself pronto. It’s beginning to terrify me to drive my nice little going-on-14-year-old Nissan Sentra, not because of its overall size, but because of its height, which is really low to the ground even in comparison to newer Sentras. We moved about a year ago to a neighborhood where people seem to drive a disproportionate number of really tall SUVs and pickups, and we have a parking spot in the alley. We’ve had quite a number of near-misses trying to get out of the alley, because all the cars parked where the alley meets the street are much taller than ours, so the visibility sucks. And with the other SUVs whipping down our side street far too fast, one or the other of us would likely be a pancake in a collision. Someday the little Sentra will die, and whatever replaces it will for sure be taller, if not larger overall. (I don’t even like driving bigger cars, but \*\*Tom Scud \*\*is a rather leggy 6’2”, and his knees are just about hitting the dashboard of the Sentra. The car predates him in my life by nearly 10 years, and I’m 5’1”, so legroom wasn’t exactly a big consideration at the time. Hopefully we can find a compact car that makes us both happy when the time comes – luckily neither of us is a car nut.) ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/213 "2011-05-10T14:56:50Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > What? Apparently you missed the part where I said “truly small cars”. The Jetta is not a truly small car. In fact, by anything except American or Australian standards, it’s not a small car at all. > > I was responding to a post by **pdts** , who was asking about cars the size of the [Ford Ka](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Ka). The Ka is about 11 feet long. A Jetta is 15 feet long. I did miss that part, or not parse it correctly–You gotta cut me some slack here, the smallest vehicle my parents owned while I was of driving age was a Jeep Grand Cherokee (others included a full-size raised-roof touring van (yes, my dad was that guy for many years), multiple Suburbans and Tahoes, and multiple trucks in the Silverado 3500 class) 😃 In all seriousness, your comparisons apply to the way a lot of Americans think about family cars as well–which a Ford Ka won’t help you with, but the Jetta, well…I could easily imagine taking road trips with a family of five in it without much problem. Since I have a family of three, it seems positively roomy to me–meanwhile, my parents thought a Volvo XC70 was “too small” for the two of them for trips. I should also note I’d buy the heck out of a Ford Ka if they sold 'em over here. With the Jetta for car trips and family errands, I desperately need to replace my Neon with something that is in the same universe as environmentally friendly–and all the plug-ins offered on this side of the pond are outlandishly expensive. > [@put down the sabre](#): > > But eg I’m a grad student, and most of my (20-something, single) US friends drive what to me are relatively big cars - honda accords, toyota corollas, etc. Something like a KA would be quite useful here, but the roads might make it a bumpy ride! I imagine that most of them have their cars because a parent said “here, take the old family car, now that you’ve moved out I’m buying a car I like”. Seemed typical up here. As for why so many college students have cars? I couldn’t tell you–I was a bus guy myself when I was in college and/or living in apartments where the buses actually came. > [@amanset](#): > > I voluntarily walk halfway to work despite there being a train line. I do this because the walk is good for me. > > Clearly I am just better than you. Or less selfish–most of my reasoning boils down to “the bus takes three times as long and that means a half-hour less time I get to spend with my daughter in the evening before she goes to bed.” ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/214 "2011-05-10T17:36:53Z")
> [@purplehorseshoe](#): > > Exhibit A: most of Houston, TX, if you need a concrete (ha!!) example. > > No sidewalks + homes and stores are zoned to be miles apart = drive, or starve. Houston actually has no zoning regulations. My understanding is that they are the only major U.S. city without any. Also, I live in Houston and use no where close to 3 gallons per day. I probably use closer to 1/10th of that. ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/215 "2011-05-10T17:51:34Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Oil dropped to under 100 a barrel yesterday. The pump price stayed the same. If it goes up, the price changes instantly. Weird isn’t it? Compare apples to apples. On Thursday, May 5th WTI crude oil futures did drop below $100/bbl from $109.24 to $99.80. That same exact day, RBOB gasoline futures dropped by $0.2271/gal from $3.3225 to $3.0954. ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/216 "2011-05-10T18:22:39Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > There is a simple solution to America’s gas consumption problem, already mentioned. Just add a buck a gallon or so to the price in taxes, and use the taxes for public transportation or other ways of reducing gas usage. California has very high gas prices relative to the rest of the country and we’ve held consumption pretty steady - more Priuses here than just about everywhere. Our public transportation is also relatively expensive due to lack of ridership. > When I visited Hilversum for work, we decided to go into Amsterdam for dinner, and just to see it. We walked from the hotel to the train station, and took the train in. When we returned it was late, we weren’t absolutely sure where the hotel was, so we took a cab. The cab trip - which was about a kilometer - cost more than one way train fare. With that kind of fee structure even we would get efficient. > > Problem is - this scheme doesn’t work nearly so well in the middle of nowhere, and we have lots of middle of nowhere in the US. I have no idea how reliable the data is for this, but the graph on [this page](http://www.infrastructurist.com/2010/04/26/how-much-gas-does-your-state-use-per-person/) is somewhat related to your post. Check out the biggest users of gasoline on a per barrel per year per capita basis. Wyoming North Dakota South Carolina Alabama Iowa Mississippi Missouri New Hampshire South Dakota Vermont A lot of places with “lots of middle of nowhere” in that group. ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/217 "2011-05-10T18:29:14Z")
> [@Daylate](#): > > BTW, heard on one of the local news broadcasts this morning that the “experts” are predicting that the price of gas will be down to around $3.50 by this summer. The gasoline futures market is backwardated (prices in future are below current prices), but unfortunately not to the extent that would be needed to bring retail gasoline prices down to $3.50. Of course that doesn’t mean the futures market is a great predictor of the future; however, most reputable experts and analysts believe oil prices will be higher in the third quarter this year, so I wouldn’t plan on lower prices. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/218 "2011-05-10T19:57:12Z")
> [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](#): > > Sure - I’m not suggesting that a ford KA is a good family runabout. But eg I’m a grad student, and most of my (20-something, single) US friends drive what to me are relatively big cars - honda accords, toyota corollas, etc. Something like a KA would be quite useful here, but the roads might make it a bumpy ride! This is likely a circumstance of the market. Grad students typically don’t drive new cars, but rather used ones, the choices of which are necessarily affected by market conditions years ago when the cars were new. And when people do buy new cars, they generally hang onto them a lot longer now than they used to. We have yet to see waves of VW New Beetles or Cooper Minis entering the used car market. Meanwhile, some of the relatively recent entrants into the American Market, such as Kia, were so shoddy when they first appeared that some banks wouldn’t finance them. Although that brand, for example, has improved significantly since then, it would be just plain foolish to buy a '99 Kia, if there still are any that run. > [@](#): > > I’m a bit sceptical about American claims to only drive because they need to because of my experience here in Chapel Hill. I’m one of only a couple of the people I know who doesn’t have a car, and I am routinely surprised at trips that my US friends will drive, rather than walk or take the (free, regular) buses. I am skeptical too, because I lived this experience, and I have to cop to it. God what a lazy fool I was; I used to drive across campus to study in the library in the evening – **and I lived there!** I can’t justify this, but back then I was very lazy physically. Just a skinny dude with no interest in physical exertion of any kind, I was. By contrast, more than 30 years on, I love to walk places whenever I can, and am more than willing to use public transit when I need to go farther. Although, in L.A. this isn’t always practical; most of the local public transportation is still just buses, and bus transit just isn’t suited to long trips across town. > [@](#): > > But also we know the US doesn’t have good public transport infrastructure, but that people drive everywhere. So it’s a bit of a shock to see how bad the roads are. > > pdts I wonder if the roads worse than usual in NC. IME in L.A., potholes usually are repaired reasonably promptly although they are an annual nuisance following the rainy season. In general though, I never see local streets that I wouldn’t want to drive a small car on. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/219 "2011-05-10T20:03:06Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > Glad you brought up this very fundamental choice. > > There might have been some uptick in per capita fuel consumption with the popularity of SUVs and trucks in the 1990s. Now, though, I’d say that I don’t see so many true SUVs on the road these days as I do smaller crossovers. A lot of those get as good mileage as my Nissan sedan, if the figures are to be believed. But over forty years, as automotive engine efficiency improved and we reduced our overall per capita consumption, we grew the population by fifty percent. When I think about this, I just want to break something. A major objective of conservation is to extend the usefulness of a natural resource over time–this is what we were taught in school. But we (as a country and as a planet) have not done that. Conservation has, in the end, served only to accommodate more people living _now_ rather than future generations of people. I keep running into this - we conserve in one area so us big-brained humans think, “Woohoo! Lookkit all that extra room we have to waste now!” I’m not sure at this point that we’ll **ever** get it as a species - it’s not enough to reduce in one area if we’re just going to pick up the slack in others. > [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > \ > As an aside, do you visitors from across the sea have to mention our damn roads over and over? We know they’re bad. We get it. Lack of commitment to their maintenance is an issue in many places, but another side of it is that there are so many more miles of road to be maintained. We must not have been to the right places; we were in awe of how good the roads were everywhere we’ve gone in the US compared to Canadian roads. > [@even\_sven](#): > > \ > > So it’s not that you “can’t”. It’s that it isn’t worth it to you. That’s fine. That’s what I’m talking about; people are so quick to use the word “can’t” when what they really mean is, “For various reason (some good and some less good), I’m choosing not to do that.” ---
**Author:** ![put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/da6949/32.png) [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/put_down_the_sabre)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965/220 "2011-05-10T20:36:49Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > That’s what I’m talking about; people are so quick to use the word “can’t” when what they really mean is, “For various reason (some good and some less good), I’m choosing not to do that.” I know what you mean, but in many ways this is a perfectly normal way of talking. I can’t torture a child. Except I could, but I choose not to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/368-a-month-on-gas-3-gallons-a-day/580965.md?page=12)