# 40 Million Americans on Food Stamps: When Do WE Start Rioting? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 31, 2011, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677 "2011-01-31T18:40:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/21 "2011-01-31T19:51:30Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > A compelling argument! Did you really need an argument to counter such a ridiculous comment? ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kearsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/22 "2011-01-31T19:58:20Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Apples and oranges, my friend. Foods stamps /= welfare. Foods stamps just keep you fed, they do no keep you clothed and sheltered. I’m GLAD all these people can get food stamps, but I’d RATHER they had jobs. And that’s kind of the CRUX of the problem … the corporations and stockholders are doing fine, so when the hell will jobs reappear? The corporations will continue shipping jobs overseas and so forth and letting America’s middle class disintegrate. I’m against that. Are you for it? For what reasons do you think jobs get shipped overseas? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/23 "2011-01-31T20:02:49Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > Long term, there shouldn’t be a need to provide that much food assistance. That is what the focus needs to be on. How to get people off of the government teet and back to work (or to work at all in some cases) Sure, but do you really believe that’s going to happen, big enough and fast enough? ---
**Author:** ![AshenLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/94ad74/32.png) [@AshenLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AshenLady)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/24 "2011-01-31T20:03:32Z")
Women and children under 18 are among the most impoverished people in the USA. School lunches are the only meal for lots of kids. Republicans would love to get rid of school lunches for kids…it’s communism, you see. Bailing out Wall Street (corporate welfare is fine), but help a starving kid have a decent meal, and you’ve got them smoking. I hate these kind of peole so bad, and the Republicans are a shame and a pox to society, in the realm of social welfare programs and such. ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/25 "2011-01-31T20:04:23Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > For what reasons do you think jobs get shipped overseas? Jobs are shipped overseas thanks to the tea party! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![AshenLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/94ad74/32.png) [@AshenLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AshenLady)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/26 "2011-01-31T20:05:01Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > No it would not, what politicians pay attention to are voters. This is why old people have so much say in our national politics. They vote, not because politicians fear them taking to the streets. Contrast this with how ineffective the hippy left was at ending the Iraq war. They took to the streets all the time, but did not vote in substantial numbers and were ignored. > > a)The goal of our economic thinkers is already into growing a strong middle class economy. Just no one knows how to do it. Barry O and his minions spent 8 times the cost of the appollo program on economic stimulus that did not work. Previous administrations spent billions on subsidized loans for people to buy houses in the hopes of expanding the middle class, and that blew up in our faces. Green Lantern economics is just silly, every politician knows it is easier to get reelected in a good economy and harder in a bad economy. > b) There is no empirical evidence that money spent on political campaigns translates into electoral success. There is that famous study in Freakonomics. The most recent electoral cycle bears this out. Look at California where Meg Whitman lost to Governor Moonbeam, or Connecticut where Linda McMahon failed in her bid for the senate. > > The Egyptian riots have already seen much killing, and revolutions in general tend to be very bloody. That is why our system is so great, peaceful transistions of power. > > Only people who agree with you have honest convictions, everyone else is a mercenary. > > People who disagree with you are bad, even when they are doing what you say they should be doing. I am sure after your revolution they will be the first up against the wall. C’mon, Sarah Palin and her ilk are in their forties, that’s not so ancient in the view of things. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/27 "2011-01-31T20:08:00Z")
Rioting will happen when the right wingers defund food stamps . They are planning on it. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/28 "2011-01-31T20:08:42Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > Cite? Apollo program 170 billion _A Budgetary Analysis of NASA’s New Vision for Space, September 2004_ Stimulus Bill 787 Billion, plus 700 billion for TARP = 1487 billion ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/29 "2011-01-31T20:26:38Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Rioting will happen when the right wingers defund food stamps . They are planning on it. [/QUOTE] Let’s assume for a moment that this is fact and not something you just made up or are spinning so that it meets your political expectations. Why would they do this? Why would they want riots? How would this help them further their political agenda? How would riots like this impact their core voters? I know you dis-love me and don’t want to engage, but it’s a serious question, as, logically it makes no sense to me at all. [QUOTE=AshenLady] Bailing out Wall Street (corporate welfare is fine), but help a starving kid have a decent meal, and you’ve got them smoking. [/QUOTE] You do realize that the whole ‘bailing out Wall Street’ meme was pretty much bi-partisan, and had as much or more support on the Democrat side as the Republican, right? And that it was more a matter of keeping the whole financial system from complete collapse than paying off supposed rich fat cat bankers and brokers…right? Also, contrary to popular believe, starvation isn’t one of the things most Americans have to worry about. Look at the obesity rates sometime and see that the issue is more the other way around. I’m not saying that poor people eat healthy, mind…but trying to claim that they are starving does nothing to further your argument, when the data of obesity among all groups of Americans continues to rise. -XT ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/30 "2011-01-31T20:35:38Z")
> [@AshenLady](#): > > Republicans would love to get rid of school lunches for kids…it’s communism, you see. You really don’t seem to know what you are talking about. Or, maybe you do but you decided to post this nonsense to get attention. ---
**Author:** ![FasterThanMeerkats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/278dde/32.png) [@FasterThanMeerkats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FasterThanMeerkats)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/31 "2011-01-31T20:51:42Z")
[Obligatory link.](http://xkcd.com/635/) Is it too late to sign up for Battle School? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/32 "2011-01-31T20:53:53Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > No it would not, what politicians pay attention to are voters. This is why old people have so much say in our national politics. They vote, not because politicians fear them taking to the streets. Sure, voting is what matters, and what is the tool that is most effective for dealing with voters? Advertising! And what do you need to buy advertising? Money! And who gives you money? Lobbyists! Who represent whom? Corporations! Glad I could help you out with that. > [@](#): > > Contrast this with how ineffective the hippy left was at ending the Iraq war. They took to the streets all the time, but did not vote in substantial numbers and were ignored. There are still hippies in your world? Lots of them? Tell me … who is the captain of the Enterprise in the TV series you watch? I’m just curious. > [@](#): > > a)The goal of our economic thinkers is already into growing a strong middle class economy. Absolutely not true. Most economists work at growing the economy as a whole, they don’t really focus on how economic groups within the economy do. They are typically indifferent to such issues. > [@](#): > > Just no one knows how to do it. Also not true. There are all sorts of things to be done, it’s just that economists, who are all about traditional economics, oppose them. Such as economic penalties for corporations that outsource, trade barriers to protect American jobs, and tax breaks for corporations that create good-paying jobs and plenty of them. We don’t need a million more part time jobs in the fast food industry. > [@](#): > > Barry O and his minions spent 8 times the cost of the appollo program on economic stimulus that did not work. This is a veritable font of wrongness. 1) The stimulus was not to grow the middle class, it was to get the American economy out of the free fall that the Bush Administration put it in with their reckless and stupid policies, such as letting the banks and securities industries do whatever the hell they liked. (Granted, the repeal of Glass-Steagall happened during the Clinton Admin. but it was a partisan Republican initiative that Clinton stupidly signed on to thanks to his idiot triangulation strategy.) > [@](#): > > Previous administrations spent billions on subsidized loans for people to buy houses in the hopes of expanding the middle class, and that blew up in our faces. You are right that some liberals signed on to this because it seemed like a way to get more people into the middle class, but ARMs, the source of the problem was a banking industry initiative, and the way they were implemented by the real estate and banking industry verged on and actually passed over the line into fraud. It was not a government program, it was a corporate/financial industry program. > [@](#): > > Green Lantern economics is just silly, every politician knows it is easier to get reelected in a good economy and harder in a bad economy. Not sure what you mean by that. Never heard of Green Lantern economics. > [@](#): > > b) There is no empirical evidence that money spent on political campaigns translates into electoral success. There is that famous study in Freakonomics. The most recent electoral cycle bears this out. Look at California where Meg Whitman lost to Governor Moonbeam, or Connecticut where Linda McMahon failed in her bid for the senate. Not familiar with the Freakonomics study, but McMahon and Whitman can both reasonably be characterized as outliers agaisnt the data point of all the other very expensive elections in 2010 where money played a big role. > [@](#): > > The Egyptian riots have already seen much killing, and revolutions in general tend to be very bloody. That is why our system is so great, peaceful transitions of power. I agree with you. My fear is that the political system at present will marginalize people to the point where taking to the streets is their only chance to be heard. > [@](#): > > Only people who agree with you have honest convictions, everyone else is a mercenary. You misunderstand. “I’m all right, Jack!” is British slang for “Fuck you!” from the people who have to the people who have not. I am glad most people are not on food stamps, but it does NOTHING for the ones who are on food stamps to hear about their success, except maybe make them feel worse. > [@](#): > > People who disagree with you are bad, even when they are doing what you say they should be doing. I am sure after your revolution they will be the first up against the wall. I’ll be sure and post that notice to the straw man I keep around for that very purpose. ---
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/33 "2011-01-31T20:55:28Z")
Probably when American economic problems look less like spoiled whinging of one of the wealthiest countries in the world. Really, even the implicit comparison with Egypt and other emerging market countries is staggeringly clueless. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/34 "2011-01-31T21:05:14Z")
[QUOTE=wmfellows] Probably when American economic problems look less like spoiled whinging of one of the wealthiest countries in the world. Really, even the implicit comparison with Egypt and other emerging market countries is staggeringly clueless. [/QUOTE] +5 (extra points for tossing in the whinging thing is such a dry, dead pan way…totally cracked me up) -XT ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/35 "2011-01-31T21:19:32Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > You really don’t seem to know what you are talking about. Or, maybe you do but you decided to post this nonsense to get attention. Riiigh. Republicans have no problem with school lunches. And [ketchup is a vegetable.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketchup_as_a_vegetable) ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/36 "2011-01-31T21:30:59Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Riiigh. Republicans have no problem with school lunches. And [ketchup is a vegetable.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketchup_as_a_vegetable) You’ve clearly shown that you have no idea what you are talking about…as evidenced by the OP. Your link is cute but has nothing to do with republicans wanting to get rid of school lunch programs. The larger question is what role the federal government should have in paying for school lunch…I shouldn’t have to explain this to you. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/37 "2011-01-31T21:47:21Z")
I would suggest that we begin rioting immediately over the fact that we send billions in foreign aid while even a single American citizen cannot afford health care or good nutrition. I wish I had the nerve to do what I think we ought to do, but I don’t. Therefore my opinion is worthless. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/38 "2011-01-31T21:47:43Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Riiigh. Republicans have no problem with school lunches. And [ketchup is a vegetable.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketchup_as_a_vegetable) Oy, the best cite you can come up with is a 30-year-old story that was never implemented? If the Republicans want to get rid of school lunches they’re doing an awful job of it and you have nothing to fear. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/39 "2011-01-31T21:54:07Z")
> [@Kearsen](#): > > Long term, there shouldn’t be a need to provide that much food assistance. That is what the focus needs to be on. How to get people off of the government teet and back to work (or to work at all in some cases) Lots of people who get food stamps or visit food banks already have jobs. > [@spark240](#): > > There isn’t actually enough food assistance available, at least not for the long term. Community food banks are in crisis in many parts of the country. Food stamps and food banks are two different things. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2011, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677/40 "2011-01-31T21:54:22Z")
I don’t think we will. Our lives are hard, but 7/8 of the country doesn’t use food stamps. The reality is for a lot of people the recession is more of a mental exercise, only about 20% of the country seems to have been badly hurt by it. And those 20% can be discounted. For the majority of people there has either been no effect, or a localized effect. Those left behind are hurt badly though. The fact that in times of such poverty and financial strain there is a rise of a political movement devoted to ending (as we know it) unemployment insurance, food stamps, medicare, medicaid and social security says a lot. There are talks of making UI a loan instead of a grant, underfunding food stamps, privatizing SS (a couple years after the free market collapsed), and privatizing medicare while likely cutting medicaid too. Granted we are in debt, but the majority of our deficit is recession related. And providing UI to 10 million people would cost about the same as the war in Iraq in its heyday (12-15 billion/month). So it isn’t bankrupting the system. I don’t think there ever will be a riot. But I don’t know what happens with all the dissatisfaction, disillusionment, frustration and rage building up. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/40-million-americans-on-food-stamps-when-do-we-start-rioting/569677.md?page=3)