# 46% of Democrats Would Oppose Mormon President **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 8, 2012, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207 "2012-04-08T22:58:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/41 "2012-04-10T04:18:36Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > I’ve never heard of either the website linked to by the OP, or of the pollster. So YMMV, but I personally would want to see a similar result from a more trusted source before going off about it. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > [Poll Position](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Position). > > Seems legit. Perhaps. That is mitigated some by the inability of people reading the link to drill down and examine the poll itself in a little more depth. Although that probably speaks more towards the usefulness of the website than the legitimacy of the pollsters. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/42 "2012-04-10T04:20:55Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Other folks have disagreed,I might have missed it but I’m not aware that Romney has had a similar John F. Kennedy moment. > > CMC fnord! He rather famously gave a JFK-moment speech during the 2008 primary campaign. ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/43 "2012-04-10T04:30:23Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > [http://americannewsreport.com/poll-over-a-third-of-americans-would-not-vote-for-a-mormon-to-be-president-8812739.html](http://americannewsreport.com/poll-over-a-third-of-americans-would-not-vote-for-a-mormon-to-be-president-8812739.html) > > Its often assumed that most opponents of a Mormon candidate for President would be Evangelicals. However according to the poll above 46% of Democrats would oppose a Mormon candidate for President while 29% of Republicans would. And the intolerence isn’t limited to old coots either-a majority of young voters would oppose a Mormon candidate. > > Apparently anti-Mormon bigotry is one of the few bigotries that is growing in this country. Of course most young people like a bit of a drink, a dance, premarital sex, gay marriage etc and assume that a cult like the mormon’s would oppose these things. Which it probably does but given that the president has little power I don’t see it really matters to be honest. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/44 "2012-04-10T04:30:50Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > [Poll Position](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_Position). > > Seems legit. Sounds like their current incarnation dates back only to last September, and even before that, they’d been in business only a few years. I’d ask about their reputation for quality, but it seems that they haven’t had much time to develop any reputation at all. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/45 "2012-04-10T08:11:55Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > He rather famously gave a JFK-moment speech during the 2008 primary campaign. Then I have to wonder how many of those polled simply weren’t paying enough attention to Romney during the 2008 primary campaign to remember or even know he had that JFK moment . . . folks like me :smack:. CMC fnord! I do get points for knowing about the JFK speech? And who Checkers was and what a “good Republican cloth coat” is . . . right, RIGHT? This, kids, is what happens to you when you stop being obsessed with politics sometime in your late 20’s/early 30’s. [Robert De Niro in _Awakenings_] Learn from me, [SIZE=“3”]learn from me! [/RDNi_A_][/SIZE] ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/46 "2012-04-10T13:49:45Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Or maybe the Momons need get out of politics or sacrifice their non-profit status. Maybe we can get the Jews and Catholics out of politics too. Let the Protestants run the country again, the way God intended. Mitt Romney and Harry Reid are members of the LDS Church but that doesn’t mean that the LDS Church is “running” them anymore than the Pope was telling Kennedy what to do. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/47 "2012-04-10T13:51:23Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > Of course most young people like a bit of a drink, a dance, premarital sex, gay marriage etc and assume that a cult like the mormon’s would oppose these things. Which it probably does but given that the president has little power I don’t see it really matters to be honest. The president of _what_ has “little power”? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/48 "2012-04-10T13:55:31Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Sounds like their current incarnation dates back only to last September, and even before that, they’d been in business only a few years. > > I’d ask about their reputation for quality, but it seems that they haven’t had much time to develop any reputation at all. True, but I’ve seen this poll reported by the major networks, and although they may have been sloppy, I would give them the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn’t report a poll from fly-by-night polling corp. Also, stuff like this gets debunked pretty quickly these days if there is any debunking to do, and I haven’t seen debunking yet. So, yeah, it could be a bad poll, but I don’t see any evidence that it is. I still think it’s next to worthless, though, since Romney is so closely tied in people’s minds to “Mormon candidate for President”. I don’t know how you would do a poll on that today without having it tainted with Mormon = Romney. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/49 "2012-04-10T14:09:48Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Maybe we can get the Jews and Catholics out of politics too. Let the Protestants run the country again, the way God intended. Well, I was essentially responding to, [QUOTE=Foggy] The Mormons spent buckets of money getting Prop 8 passed here… [/QUOTE] If it’s actually the case that LDS, Inc. actually dipped into it’s Holy Coffers and openly supported such a campaign, then as much righteous indignation as I can be bothered to muster will be … erm, well, mustered. That aside, I think your premise is fundamentally sound apart from the Protestant bit. In fact, it points out a basic problem with the concept of NP tax status for churches–Ministers, etc. will always use their position to badger their flock into voting their morality into the secular business of government. Nevermind…hijack. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/50 "2012-04-10T14:14:59Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > So, yeah, it could be a bad poll, but I don’t see any evidence that it is. I still think it’s next to worthless, though, since Romney is so closely tied in people’s minds to “Mormon candidate for President”. I don’t know how you would do a poll on that today without having it tainted with Mormon = Romney. Point taken, but the fact that we don’t get to see the questions means we can’t even know if they _tried_ to avoid that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/51 "2012-04-10T14:18:31Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > In fact, it points out a basic problem with the concept of NP tax status for churches–Ministers, etc. will always use their position to badger their flock into voting their morality into the secular business of government. Why is that just a problem for Churches, and not for, say, The Sierra Club? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/52 "2012-04-10T14:22:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Why is that just a problem for Churches, and not for, say, The Sierra Club? Exploring that [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14951822#post14951822), I hope. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/53 "2012-04-10T14:38:18Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > True, but I’ve seen this poll reported by the major networks, and although they may have been sloppy, I would give them the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn’t report a poll from fly-by-night polling corp. That’s what I [used to think](http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/politics/false-nikki-haley-twitter-report-spreads-fast.html?_r=1&hp). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/54 "2012-04-10T14:49:17Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Exploring that [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14951822#post14951822), I hope. That’s not really the same thing. We’ve all seen lots of stuff like this end up in the MSM only to be retracted or corrected later. There has been enough time for that poll (or polling company) to be debunked, if there is any debunking to be had. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/55 "2012-04-10T15:38:39Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > What’s the difference between “Would you vote for a Mormon candidate for president?” and “Would you vote for a presidential candidate of the Mormon faith?” The latter excludes lapsed or excommunicated mormons? It seems like they’re the same question. They are _not_ the same question. I’ve already conceded that they are “perhaps similar;” I tend to Spock-like over-literalism; to most people the questions might be indistinguishable. In any case each question is ambiguous, and, for example, could be interpreted as “Would you prefer a Mormon as President?” I can tell you that if were asked the question (“by interactive voice response technology”) I’d dither between three options: [ul][li] Interpret it as “are you non-prejudiced?” – I’d answer Yes.[/li][li] Interpret is as “are you pro-Romney?” – I’d answer No.[/li][li] Interpret it literally – I don’t know what I’d answer _because the question is ambiguous_.[/li][/ul] The question is flawed. Studying the results is a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/56 "2012-04-10T16:23:10Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Other folks have disagreed,I might have missed it but I’m not aware that Romney has had a similar John F. Kennedy moment. > [@kaylasdad99](#): > > He rather famously gave a JFK-moment speech during the 2008 primary campaign. Romney certainly wanted people to describe it as a JFK moment, but I don’t think JFK would have agreed. [Anyway here is what Romney said on the subject of his faith in 2007.](http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/07/us/politics/07romney.html?pagewanted=all) JFK: “I believe in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute.” Romney: “In recent years, the notion of the separation of church and state has been taken by some well beyond its original meaning.” ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/57 "2012-04-10T16:46:55Z")
Romney is quoted by the NYT as saying in 2007, "Some believe such a confession of my faith will sink my candidacy. If they are right, so be it. But I think they underestimate the American people. Americans do not respect believers of convenience. Americans tire of those who would jettison their beliefs, even to gain the world.” The irony, it burns! Here’s JFK’s 1960 Houston speech - it made Santorum “want to throw up,” but I think it’s still a classic on the separation of church and state: [American Rhetoric: John F. Kennedy -- Address to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association](http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/jfkhoustonministers.html) ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/58 "2012-04-10T16:59:15Z")
Sure I’d vote for a Mormon for President, but he’d have to be a pretty bad Mormon. ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/59 "2012-04-10T17:30:19Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Its often assumed that most opponents of a Mormon candidate for President would be Evangelicals. However according to the poll above 46% of Democrats would oppose a Mormon candidate for President while 29% of Republicans would. And the intolerence isn’t limited to old coots either-a majority of young voters would oppose a Mormon candidate. > > Apparently anti-Mormon bigotry is one of the few bigotries that is growing in this country. Here are all ten questions asked during this poll: [1. Donald Trump says that he is considering becoming an independent candidate for President of the United States in 2012. Would you seriously consider voting for Donald Trump if he ran as an independent U.S. presidential candidate next year?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-Crosstabs-Trump-for-President.pdf) **Democrats** : 13.5% yes, 76.9% no | **Republicans** : 20.2% yes, 66.7% no [2. Would you vote for a U.S. presidential candidate of the Mormon faith?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-Crosstabs-Mormon-for-President.pdf) **Democrats** : 27.8% yes, 45.7% no | **Republicans** : 48.3% yes, 28.6% no [3. Would you vote for a U.S. presidential candidate who was an atheist?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-crosstabs-Atheist-for-President.pdf) **Democrats** : 35.5% yes, 45.4% no | **Republicans** : 12.2% yes, 78.2% no [4. Would you vote for a U.S. presidential candidate who had a history of marital infidelity?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-crosstabs-candidate-infidelity.pdf) **Democrats** : 29.5% yes, 51.8% no | **Republicans** : 23.1% yes, 55.1% no [5. Do you think there should be more or fewer U.S. presidential candidate debates?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-Crosstabs-Number-of-debates.pdf) **Democrats** : 26.6% more, 40.9% fewer | **Republicans** : 30.7% more, 38.9% fewer [6. Do you believe that the U.S. should take military action against Iran if that is required to prevent Iran from building its own nuclear weapon?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-Crosstabs-Iran-Military-Action.pdf) **Democrats** : 29.2% yes, 52.4% no | **Republicans** : 63.4% yes, 19.5% no [7. Do you believe that the U.S. war in Iraq was worth the cost in lives and expense?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-Crosstabs-Iraq-war-costs.pdf) **Democrats** : 13.8% yes, 72.2% no | **Republicans** : 43.7% yes, 41.8% no [8. The National Transportation and Safety Board is recommending that vehicle drivers be banned from using cell phones and other personal electronic devices except in the case of emergencies. The NTSB proposal would also ban hands-free use of those devices. Would you support or oppose a ban on the use of cell phones and PDA’s by vehicle drivers?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-crosstabs-NTSB.pdf) **Democrats** : 54.5% support, 39.8% oppose | **Republicans** : 45.7% support, 49.9% oppose [9. NBC is considering the possibility of making “American Idol” TV show host Ryan Seacrest the co-host of NBC’s “Today Show.” If Ryan Seacrest co-hosted NBC’s “Today Show,” would you be more or less inclined to watch the “Today Show”?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-crosstabs-NBC-Today-Ryan-Seacrest.pdf) **Democrats** : 13.5% more, 39.3% less | **Republicans** : 12.5% more, 39.7% less [10. With several heavily-advertised movies premiering in theaters in the coming weeks, do you plan to go to at least one movie at a theater between now and early January?](http://media.pollposition.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/Poll-Position-crosstabs-holiday-movies.pdf) **Democrats** : 41.5% yes, 44.0% no | **Republicans** : 34.5% yes, 52.4% no So apparently along with anti-Mormon bigotry, anti-atheist bigotry is also growing, as well as anti-horndog bigotry, anti-Donald Trump bigotry and anti-Ryan Seacrest bigotry. I can get behind that last one, though. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207/60 "2012-04-10T17:57:31Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Maybe he means the blood atonement thing. Yes. Here’s a good source for the topic: [http://20truths.info/mormon/blood.html](http://20truths.info/mormon/blood.html) > [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Indeed. ITR Champion, do you suggest that I as an atheist should use similar reasoning–i.e., rejecting any candidate who believes in supernatural entities that I think are pretty self-evidently impossible? Do you think that Christians ought to refuse to vote for Jews, given the self-evident messianic nature of Jesus? You are free to vote as you please. If you choose not to vote for the Obama-Biden ticket because it has two Christians, you are free to do so. As for the question of whether the same logic that I use to rule out supporting a Mormon candidate would also apply a Jewish candidate, it would not, because there is no abundant evidence of the falsehood of Judaism, as there is for the LDS Church. In the case of Mormonism, for part of the Mormon scriptures (the Book of Abraham), we have part of the original manuscript, and thus can see factually that it isn’t what Joseph Smith said it was, or in other words it’s a fraud. The entire Book of Mormon deals with vast civilizations whose existence is fully ruled out by archaeology. From the [Mark Hofmann affair](http://www.mormoninformation.com/hofmann.htm), we know that the LDS Church has paid hush money to silence what it thought was genuine history. Mitt Romney, not being entirely ignorant, is surely aware of these facts and many others that cast doubt on his church’s claims, yet he remains a member and self-proclaimed believer. There are no comparable issues that a Jewish candidate would have to face about his or her religion. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/46-of-democrats-would-oppose-mormon-president/618207.md?page=4)