# 6 weeks for Maternity leave... for men? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 16, 2004, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850 "2004-01-16T22:51:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/21 "2004-01-17T17:00:15Z")
> [@badmana](#): > > Is the american system that different from the Canadian one? > > We get 17 weeks Mat leave (only for the women) and 35 weeks for either parent (split between parents) of paid “parental leave” to a max of 52 weeks! > > Of course the government only pays 55% of your pay, while my company puts up another amount to bring it up to 67%. My company pays up to 95%. You’re gettin’ screwed. I admit, I don’t see how six weeks is all that long. If you don’t want human beings taking parental leave, hire andriods. ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/22 "2004-01-17T17:11:13Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Did the guy’s wife have a C-section? Significant complications? A premature baby? There’s a lot of reasons why a new mother might still be bedridden or overwhelmed by the job and would need help. No problems. Perfectly healthy baby girl. And I am happy for him, they really are good folks. > [@burundi](#): > > You say that your co-worker has taken six weeks of paternity leave before. Do you know how old their first child is? Even after a perfectly healthy birth, taking care of a two-year-old and a newborn by yourself would be daunting. Some families are lucky enough to have grandparents, aunties and uncles, and friends who can help take care of the mom while she heals and takes care of the little one for the first few weeks. Many do not. Your co-worker may be one of those families that doesn’t have that kind of support network. > > Sounds like you should really be annoyed at your boss. S/he presumably knew that the co-worker was taking paternity leave and had time to make arrangments to get the rest of you some temporary help. > [@](#): > > If the boss is willing to give him the leave, why shouldn’t he take it? His first loyalty _should_ be to his family, not his employer or co-workers. I’m am definitely annoyed at the boss. She new well ahead of time. But her bosses bosses are so fucking cheap to hire a temp. Gotta meet budget requirements! And the boss really wasn’t _willing_, but you cannot really say no, you know. I understand the family loyalty thing, but having a job is a responsibility too. And in this case, there were no complications, they have a 2 yr old, and have strong family and friend support. > [@AngelicGemma](#): > > If he wants to spend time with his new baby and wife I don’t see why there’s a problem. I don’t either, 3 weeks would have been enough in this case. > [@Unintentionally Blank](#): > > I took six weeks off (burning all vacation and medical leave) when my twins were born and my wife recovered from the C section. > > If you’re upset the guy wants to spend time with his FAMILY, that’s YOUR problem, not HIS. I think you missed my point. There were no complications in this case. Now in your case, your wife was on bed duty due to the C-Section. 6 Weeks is understandable for you, maybe even more. > [@](#): > > Mr. Advisory, do you have children? I suspect your responses would be different if you do. (and if they aren’t, well, I won’t even allude to your misplaced priorities. oops, I guess I did, didn’t I?) I knew this was coming. I’m not going to claim to know what it’s like to have children, but I’m not going to lie, I was at one time, a child myself. To this day, it is still debatable though. When comes the time to have children with that special someone and myself, I plan to take a reasonable amount of time depending on the circumstances. Family is #1, but I do have responsibilities at work too. After all, that is where the income comes from. This guy flat out took 6-weeks regardless of what the circumstances were. And again, IMO, that is ridiculous. I don’t think anyone who takes less then 6-weeks off, loves there children any less then you do. (misplaced priorities) > [@](#): > > A job is a place to earn money to provide shelter, food, and if lucky, some pretty good things in life. Yes, yes it is! > [@](#): > > There will always be other jobs, there won’t always be the time to be with brand new family members WHILE they’re brand new. I can see what you’re saying. You want to cherish every moment with the new one. 3 weeks should do just that. And when you get home from work, he/she will be waiting for you. ---
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/23 "2004-01-17T18:46:50Z")
I’m a good employee. I work hard and I’m damn good at my job. But I take every benefit my employer offers. If you don’t, frankly, that makes you more of a sucker than a saint. It sucks that it puts you in a rough spot, but I don’t see why this guy’s at fault for using the benefits offered. > [@](#): > > _And the boss really wasn’t willing, but you cannot really say no, you know._ Sure, you can. “No, I’m sorry, Joe, that’s not possible. We really need you back after 3 weeks.” See, easy. If the boss didn’t want him to take the leave, she shouldn’t have let him. It really sounds like your boss is the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Iteki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/eada6e/32.png) [@Iteki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iteki)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/24 "2004-01-17T19:15:15Z")
> [@zuma](#): > > Haha. If I were an employer in Sweden, my company would be completely staffed by gays and post-menopausal women. Gays have the same parental leave deal since last year 😛 About 7 years ago though my mutual friends had a baby. The non-birth mommy of the pair wasn’t actually entitled by law to any parental leave but her company gave her the equivelant month off out of their own pockets. Sweet 🙂 To the OP, be pissed as you want at your employer for not providing adequate backup while your co-worker is away, but squeaking about the co-worker makes you come off as a misanthropic. To paraphrase another cliché noone ever said on their deathbed “Wow, I really regret making my co-workers work harder. I shouldn’t have paid less attention to my family”… ---
**Author:** ![Call\_me\_Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Call\_me\_Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Call_me_Frank)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/25 "2004-01-17T19:34:20Z")
Ehhh…I’m going out on a limb here…so if you’re a feminist and this is grossly inaccurate/offensive…feel free to ignore this post, lol… Here’s how I see it…the employer should give the man as many weeks of paternity leave as they would give a woman because it’s the “equal rights for all” thing to do. See, if they only gave **maternity** leave or a very short **paternity** leave, that _forces_ the mother into sacrificing more of her time/career to take care of the little’n in the beginning. And in this post-cave man era (Those were the good ol’ days, man…) the father is supposed to spend as much time raising the kid as the mother; as opposed to having the father work at some company and having the mother be a housewife. ---
**Author:** ![Harriet\_the\_Spry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e56c9b/32.png) [@Harriet\_the\_Spry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harriet_the_Spry)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/26 "2004-01-17T20:58:24Z")
Actually, Call Me Frank, I am a feminist and I do agree with you. Let parents decide who they want in the workforce and who they want at home. There is an obvious caveat in that a woman almost always needs some time to recover medically from delivering the baby. This is usually covered by sick leave or short-term disability, though, not parenting leave. Incidentally, this is a major philosophical difference in how feminism has played out in the US and in Europe. Europe has focused much more on getting leave time and childcare programs that support parenting. The US has been much more on the side of treating women and men equally under the law. ---
**Author:** ![CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crankyasanoldman/32/11670_2.png) [@CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrankyAsAnOldMan)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/27 "2004-01-17T21:30:31Z")
I don’t believe there would have to be complications or a c-section–or even another young sibling to care for–to justify a man wanting to spend over 3 weeks at home with a new baby. If his employer offers it, and he takes it, it’s certainly not unfair or taking advantage. From a family perspective, I think it’s excellent. It might be the _norm_ for American fathers to go back to work ASAP, but that doesn’t mean it’s ideal. I understand it’s a problem when you’re understaffed, but that is an employer problem, not the employee’s problem. No worker should ignore health issues OR family needs just because his employer has a personnel problem. This is a huge life event. Incidentally, we had a baby when my husband was in the midst of an 18-month leave from work. And I took my full leave plus two more weeks (taken out of my vacation). Having both parents home was definitely preferable than having just one. I know we all had a better start for it. ---
**Author:** ![Horseflesh](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horseflesh/32/7502_2.png) [@Horseflesh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horseflesh)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/28 "2004-01-17T21:52:17Z")
> [@ParentalAdvisory](#): > > I don’t either, 3 weeks would have been enough in this case. What formula are you using to come up with the 3 week ideal for a man to spend caring for his family and a new baby? I have a feeling that the amount of time off needed varies for everyone in how they view their responsibilities at home vs. work. From your OP I take it you wouldn’t have a problem (and thus no thread here) if the guy took his paternity leave and it _didn’t_ leave you with a workload problem. If he’s not the one in charge of making sure there’s enough people to do the job, then he has absolutely zero fault in this. ---
**Author:** ![Q.N.Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/3da27b/32.png) [@Q.N.Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.N.Jones)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2004, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/29 "2004-01-17T22:13:29Z")
How is it “unfair to” or “raping” the Company in question if the Company is allowing these fathers to take paid leave? Sounds like they think it’s a good idea! ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/30 "2004-01-18T00:06:55Z")
Geez, my company allows the same parental leave to _adoptive_ parents as biological ones… do you think that unfair? Yeah, I think men should have parental leave options just as women do - anything else would be unfair. Where I work, the men leave early, take a day off, whatever, just as often as the women do. And why shouldn’t they? They’re parents, too! The only thing you won’t see is the men using the breast milk room and refrigerator. For obvious reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Blonde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@Blonde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blonde)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/31 "2004-01-18T01:20:48Z")
As previously mentioned, the FMLA allows for 12 weeks of UNPAID leave for new parents (and other health issues) - with the promise that their job will be waiting for them, at the same pay level, when they return. The FMLA only applies to companies with over 50 employees, by the way. [http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/fmla/](http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/fmla/) I’m surprised more men don’t take advantage of the opportunity to spend the first 3 months with their child - however, I would imagine that there are certain stigmas associated with a male taking time off. I’ve seen fathers who could easily afford to receive no pay for 3 months return to work after a couple of days - I don’t get it, myself. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/32 "2004-01-18T03:41:01Z")
> [@ParentalAdvisory](#): > > So, assuming there are no complications in pregnancy, what do you feel is a good amount of time off for a man to assist his SO at home? With all due respect, what the fuck does that have to do with it?! You are telling us that men should be systematically prevented from spending important early bonding time with their children. You should be ashamed of yourself. Men are parents, too. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/33 "2004-01-18T04:02:11Z")
Frankly, here in the U.S. it comes down to how much your employer is willing to spend to keep you. Fair has little or nothing to do with it. Since there doesn’t seem to be a set policy at your work, one must conclude that for whatever reason, your employer is willing to pay this guy for six weeks in order to keep him for the long term. Now then, would you expect this guy to turn down a raise if it wasn’t offered equally to everyone? If not, then why do you expect him to turn down time off that is offered? It’s the employer who is letting you down, not your coworker. ---
**Author:** ![HomerIU](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HomerIU](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HomerIU)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/34 "2004-01-18T04:22:18Z")
I personally tend to side with the original poster. 6 weeks for BOTH parents…I just can’t see that being reasonable. One or the other for 6 weeks, but not both. The parents can choose. ``` OF course I am in a situation where there is no possible way that we could allow 6 weeks off for every parent that has a new child. There is no conceivale way it could work. And I have not had a period of time where I have had six weeks off work since.....well, since I started working when I was 15. So maybe I am just a bit jealous, but I still don't agree with it. As for 15 MONTHS....come on. That is just ludicrous, in my opinion. ``` ---
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/35 "2004-01-18T04:35:54Z")
> [@HomerIU](#): > > I personally tend to side with the original poster. 6 weeks for BOTH parents…I just can’t see that being reasonable. One or the other for 6 weeks, but not both. The parents can choose. > > ``` > OF course I am in a situation where there is no possible way that we could allow 6 weeks off for every parent that has a new child. There is no conceivale way it could work. And I have not had a period of time where I have had six weeks off work since.....well, since I started working when I was 15. So maybe I am just a bit jealous, but I still don't agree with it. > > As for 15 MONTHS....come on. That is just ludicrous, in my opinion. > > ``` Your jealousy is mis-spent, **Homer** the first six weeks with the twins was one long bleary feeding and diaperchange. That was WITH The assistance of my parents helping. Nothing show the measure of a man than mandatory feedings every four hours, 24/7. and THEN manage to keep up the schedule after returning to work. I was fairly lucky. The Boys started sleeping thru the night at three months. There were times I left work, went down to the parking garage, and grabbed an hour nap before leaving. Otherwise I’da lost consiousness on the drive home and left the kids fatherless. At it’s worst, I was getting 6 hours of sleep. That sounds pretty good, right? it’s not so bad. Try 10-1, wake up for an hour, and then get another two hours from 2-4…THEN do a 60 minute commute, work 8 hours and 60 home. So forgive me if I’m not particularly sympathetic to towing the company line. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/36 "2004-01-18T04:44:16Z")
> [@](#): > > **ParentalAdvisory** : So, assuming there are no complications in pregnancy, what do you feel is a good amount of time off for a man to assist his SO at home? I’m in agreement with **js\_africanus** on this one. The paternity leave is **not** about assisting the mother. It is about parenting and bonding. It’s about what is best for the family – especially individual relationships with the baby. Don’t blame the father for putting his child ahead of his job and his colleagues. It shows that his priorities are in order. If anyone was at fault, it was your employer. You will survive. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/37 "2004-01-18T05:19:35Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > I’m in agreement with **js\_africanus** on this one. The paternity leave is **not** about assisting the mother. Thank goodness. I thought for sure I was going to get mobbed on this one. ---
**Author:** ![tanookie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/48db29/32.png) [@tanookie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanookie)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/38 "2004-01-18T13:12:25Z")
**Unintentionally blank** makes an excellent point too. It really is not a six week _vacation?_ I know we weren’t spending our days sipping mimosas and sleeping until noon. When the boy was still in the hospital my husband would drive me to spend the day with him and then take our daughter home since she was too young to be at the hospital with me and he would try and get some work done, do a bit of wash and then some cleaning and spend time with our daughter. Then he would pack her back in the car, pick me up and we’d scrounge supper, spend some time with our daughter and crash, exhausted to do it all again. Then he came home and, being a preemie, he ate every 2 hours around the clock and it took him forever to finish a bottle. So that was a bleary blur for both of us. I have no idea how people with twins or more :eek: handle things! These benefits are presumably there for you too if you should have a child and decide to take the time off. This idea that -it’s unfair that he got more time off than me this year- would only apply if you both had children this year and while he got six paid weeks you only got two. ---
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/39 "2004-01-18T15:35:03Z")
> [@tanookie](#): > > I have no idea how people with twins or more :eek: handle things! a) they were our first kids, we didn’t know any better. b) It’s only about 20% worse as you’re doing the same thing twice at the same time (two feedings, two diaperchanges, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![AussieSven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@AussieSven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AussieSven)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2004, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850/40 "2004-01-18T16:06:10Z")
> [@zuma](#): > > Haha. If I were an employer in Sweden, my company would be completely staffed by gays and post-menopausal women. Sorry, but age, sex and sexual preference discrimination is illegal in sweden. BTW the state pays 80% of the minimum wage to those on parental leave. Some companies will make up the difference so you will drop maybe 20% of your actual wage if you earn more than minimum (if your company doesn’t do this then you’re stuck on sub-minimum wage). This is a system that help kids get a decent start in life by having parents home from work in their first year, before they are carted off to day-care. Makes a lot more sense to me than sending a 6 week old baby off to child care because the parents can’t take anymore time off work. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/6-weeks-for-maternity-leave-for-men/224850.md?page=1)