# 7 Jan 2021 and beyond - the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 8, 2021, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020 "2021-01-08T10:28:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 222
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2023, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4431 "2023-07-23T20:47:45Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > Until one day, nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition! Even fewer expect the Dutch Inquisition. šŸ˜‰ ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4432 "2023-07-24T04:07:30Z")
Not the Supreme Court but another republican willfully missing outcomes: Full title and sub-head: **Pence Stuns CNN Anchor With Nonchalance About ā€˜Dangerousā€™ MAGA Voters - ā€œItā€™s pretty remarkable that youā€™re not concerned about it, given the fact that they wanted to hang you on on Jan. 6,ā€ Bash told the ex-veep.** > **[Pence Stuns CNN Anchor With Nonchalance About ā€˜Dangerousā€™ MAGA Voters](https://www.thedailybeast.com/pences-nonchalance-about-dangerous-maga-voters-leaves-cnn-anchor-dana-bash-stunned)** > > ā€œItā€™s pretty remarkable that youā€™re not concerned about it, given the fact that they wanted to hang you on on Jan. 6,ā€Ā Bash told the ex-veep. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4433 "2023-07-24T12:34:09Z")
Proof once again that Pence has the balls of a hamster. Even though DJT in effect condemned him to die, Pence still has enough fear of the MAGA base and enough delusions about being president that he canā€™t bring himself to call Donaldā€™s conduct criminal. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4434 "2023-07-24T17:54:07Z")
As Miles Taylor put it, he has an ā€œ[erect posture but a flaccid conscience](https://www.thedailybeast.com/ex-trump-official-miles-taylor-tells-cnn-that-mike-pence-has-an-erect-posture-and-flaccid-conscience)ā€. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4435 "2023-07-25T00:07:37Z")
> [@FBI Search and Seizure at Trump's Mar-A-Lago Residence (August 8, 2022)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fbi-search-and-seizure-at-trumps-mar-a-lago-residence-august-8-2022/969329/7037): > > What leads you to predict that? Someone comes from out of nowhere (as has happened from time to time)? Some aspect of the criminal proceedings finally makes him radioactive? His health? Something else? I ask because his base and polling lead obviously would seem to make him the presumptive favorite, the normal ā€œitā€™s way earlyā€ caveat granted. Iā€™m in no way super-confident about anything in politics these days, but if you forced me to bet the house, Iā€™d wager Trumpā€™s the nominee. Iā€™m responding to you here instead of in the FBI Search thread because this is a broader thread in which to discuss consequences from Trumpā€™s efforts to overturn the election and fallout from the documents case as well. Iā€™m definitely less sure about the nominee half of the prediction than the one about the general election, but hereā€™s why I think what I think: 1. As you pointed out, itā€™s still quite early. Most voters arenā€™t even paying that much attention. Iā€™d guess most just reflexively respond, ā€œTrump,ā€ when asked who they prefer as their nominee. 2. The Moneyed Classā„¢, which includes people like Mitch McConnell, the Kochs and other big bux donors, donā€™t want him. Heā€™s too unpredictable and selfish. He wonā€™t play for their team, because Trump recognizes no team except himself. That makes him dangerous ā€“ even to them. They were prepared to back DeSantis, but DeSantis blew it. The MC has now turned its gaze upon Tim Scott. Notice whoā€™s moving up in the polls lately? Keep an eye on that. 3. Trumpā€™s support is softening. Itā€™s slow, but the evidence is in the waning crowds. Youā€™ll notice he only ā€œcampaignsā€ in places where heā€™s sure to bring in a large number of MAGAs, such as Florida and South Carolina. Heā€™s also been unable to rouse the dangerous faithful. Many of their leaders are now serving lengthy prison sentences, so there are fewer people to organize the hate into a cohesive attack force. Trump tried hard to marshal such a force for the dates of his arraignments in both Manhattan and Florida. None materialized. Thatā€™s telling. 4. It becomes very hard for most people to ignore mounting evidence. Some will doubtless cling to the misinformation being promulgated by Fox and other batshit crazy ā€œnewsā€ sources, but the more often _actual evidence_ prevails, the harder it gets to keep bullshitting yourself. The Fox settlement with Dominion demonstrated this. The Meadows texts behind Trumpā€™s back with various other Trump people showing how they were laughing about the stolen election claims demonstrate this too. Clearly Trumpā€™s people view him as a crackpot behind his back. As more evidence of Trumpā€™s crimes and cynicism comes to light, the more his supporters will quietly turn their backs to him and look for a different MAGAt to take up their cause. Thatā€™s why all these chickenshit Trump wannabes such as DeSantis and Scott wonā€™t criticize him and wonā€™t drop out of the race. They want those voters when Trump sinks out of sight. 5. Trump fatigue. While they wonā€™t say so on the record, a hell of a lot of Republicans and even fervent supporters are getting sick of the Trump show and privately wish he would just go away. This sentiment will grow as he continues to fleece the rubes of their hard-earned dollars for no greater purpose than to pay his mounting legal bills. Heā€™s burning through the money for sure. 6. These indictments/court appearances/trials are going to bury him. And at some point, a federal judge is going to muzzle him from tainting the jury pool with his constant incitement to violence against DOJ/FBI officials. If he fails to obey, he _will_ be jailed. Those will be some rough days, but itā€™s a corner that must be turned. 7. I expect a lot of the Trump rabble rousers are also going to get scooped up in these investigations/prosecutions. Think Steve Bannon, Mike Flynn, Stephen Miller, Roger Stone, Rudy Giuliani, Mark Meadows, et. al. These scum turn up everywhere around the rotten, fetid sinkhole that is Trump. With them gone, there will be far fewer instigators of the hate and lies. The bad news is, Trumpism doesnā€™t go away with Trump. Weā€™ll be fighting this ongoing attack on our democracy for a very long time. It is what the Republican party has become: A fascist organization that wants to put us all under their boot heels, and in my opinion, we must remain vigilant to prevent it. But one despot at a time, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4436 "2023-07-25T00:16:17Z")
Outstanding analysis. Thanks for the response! ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4437 "2023-07-25T00:21:04Z")
Most welcome. šŸ™‚ Now, letā€™s just hope Iā€™m right! ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4438 "2023-07-25T00:28:00Z")
I think youā€™re missing the most important element - Trump himself. Whatā€™s he going to do if he thinks his support is waning? Heā€™ll go all out against his challengers, whoever happens to be at the top at the time. In 2016, he crushed them all, because thatā€™s what the Republican voter base responds to best - bombastic attacks and grievance. I donā€™t see why this would change, even if heā€™s on trial. I think itā€™s clear that Republicans, in general, want Trump. Not Trump light, or Trump without the baggage - the grievance and bombast and crazy nonsense are features, not bugs. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4439 "2023-07-25T00:30:16Z")
Like I said, Iā€™m less confident he wonā€™t end up the nominee. But if he does, thatā€™s all right. Joe Biden knows what heā€™s doing, and he will win against Trump. Iā€™m frankly far more afraid if Tim Scott _does_ get the nomination. Or Asa Hutchinson (unlikely) or Chris Christie (cold day in hell). ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4440 "2023-07-25T00:39:58Z")
Fair enough. I also think Trump will lose the general. I just canā€™t imagine a realistic scenario, short of Trumpā€™s death, that leads to someone else getting the nomination. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4441 "2023-07-25T00:42:29Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Iā€™m frankly far more afraid if Tim Scott _does_ get the nomination. I just donā€™t see rank and file republicans turning out for a _black_ guy. Thatā€™s such a 180 from the trump era. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4442 "2023-07-25T00:49:41Z")
No, I donā€™t think they will, either. Too much of the Republican bile is based on pure racism. But some Never Trumper Republicans seem hopeful. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4443 "2023-07-25T00:52:30Z")
Agreed on support for a Black candidate. There are definitely Republicans who would love to vote for ā€œone of the good onesā€. I remember when there were rumors about Colin Powell putting his name in the ring for elections, and there was some buzz from the right. But overall, I just donā€™t see it. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4444 "2023-07-25T00:56:45Z")
The one who scares me the most who I think may come galloping out from the right is Glenn Younkin, current Governor of Virginia. Heā€™s good at pretending to be a moderate. Heā€™s anything but. It worked well to get elected as a governor. He might fool enough people in a general election, too. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4445 "2023-07-25T01:06:34Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The MC has now turned its gaze upon Tim Scott. Notice whoā€™s moving up in the polls lately? Depends on the poll. But Iā€™d say [Vivek Ramaswamy](https://harvardharrispoll.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/HHP_July2023_KeyResults.pdf) is moving up the most. Admittedly I just cherry-picked the best poll I could find for Ramaswamy, but I didnā€™t spot any move up that dramatic for Scott. Those MCā€™s donā€™t have the power they used to. If it goes like in 2016, Ramaswany will be the type to rise to the top of the polls and quickly flame out. And I guess being a Hindu could do it. Now, if the Democrats were running Harris, I think being Hindu would help him get the nomination, since Republicans could own the libs by nominating a ā€œrealā€ Indian. But without a hook like that, the Hindu thing may play poorly. So I donā€™t dismiss Scott. Not because party bosses like him, but because Iā€™m convinced the own-the-libs impulse to avoid a white male is real. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > While they wonā€™t say so on the record, a hell of a lot of Republicans and even fervent supporters are getting sick of the Trump show and privately wish he would just go away. Learned from painful experience that doesnā€™t matter. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > These indictments/court appearances/trials are going to bury him. The jury said he, by the normal definition, raped a woman. And the polls didnā€™t move. See my last link. Voters are thinking Biden means inflation and recession. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > And at some point, a federal judge is going to muzzle him from tainting the jury pool with his constant incitement to violence against DOJ/FBI officials. If he fails to obey, he _will_ be jailed. I admit you could have something there. > [@Aspenglow](#): > > The bad news is, Trumpism doesnā€™t go away with Trump. Hope you are wrong, but am not disagreeing with whatā€™s quoted. [Candace Owens](https://plus.thebulwark.com/p/president-candace-owens) sounds a good deal worse than Tim Scott or even Ramaswamy. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4446 "2023-07-25T01:13:19Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The bad news is, Trumpism doesnā€™t go away with Trump. Which is why itā€™s so important to, along with other strategies, POUND on the (objectively factual) message that _itā€™s a sin to vote for **any** Republican, for **any** office._ ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4447 "2023-07-25T01:31:34Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The Moneyed Classā„¢, which includes people like Mitch McConnell, the Kochs and other big bux donors, donā€™t want him. Heā€™s too unpredictable and selfish. He wonā€™t play for their team, because Trump recognizes no team except himself. That makes him dangerous ā€“ even to them. They were prepared to back DeSantis, but DeSantis blew it. The MC has now turned its gaze upon Tim Scott. Notice whoā€™s moving up in the polls lately? Keep an eye on that. My take is that the money-class Republicans are terrified that Trumpā€™s shenanigans will send the GOP into the dustbin of history with the Whigs and Federalists, and theyā€™ll be facing a couple of election cycles of Democratic dominance (resulting in an end to their holiday from paying taxes and following regulations) until a new two-party system solidifies. ---
**Author:** ![pirviii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pirviii/32/3233_2.png) [@pirviii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pirviii)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4448 "2023-07-25T04:07:48Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Voters are thinking Biden means inflation and recession. I wonder where they get that idea? Iā€™ve heard nothing but inflation and recession for 3 years. It seems like inflation is coming down, but it seems like the moneyed class has been trying to manufacture a recession with high interest rates and mass layoffs, it just hasnā€™t been working, yet. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4449 "2023-07-25T04:16:34Z")
> [@pirviii](#): > > I wonder where they get that idea? Iā€™ve heard nothing but inflation and recession for 3 years. It seems like inflation is coming down, but it seems like the moneyed class has been trying to manufacture a recession with high interest rates and mass layoffs, it just hasnā€™t been working, yet. Wall Street seems to like Bidenomics: > **[Morgan Stanley credits ā€˜Bidenomicsā€™ in lifting its U.S. economic-growth outlook](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/morgan-stanley-credits-bidenomics-in-lifting-its-u-s-economic-growth-outlook-cfcb6ba8)** > > Pointing to infrastructure and manufacturing revivals, Morgan Stanley projects 1.9% GDP growth for the first half of 2023, much higher than its previous call. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/4450 "2023-07-25T11:52:16Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I wonder where they get that idea? Iā€™ve heard nothing but inflation and recession for 3 years. Where they got the idea? You could say, in the context of the poll I linked, that they got the recession from being asked the question. However, that canā€™t explain why so many voters associate Biden and inflation. The thread is about the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol. I think that in the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol, median voters gave up on worrying about the government being overthrown. If you look at [page 16 of that poll](https://harvardharrispoll.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/HHP_July2023_KeyResults.pdf), 34 percent of voters cite inflation as among ā€œthe most important issues facing the country todayā€ ā€“ more than for any other issue. And only 4 percent cite January 6. Few persuadable voters think getting an answer to the question of whether Donald Trump is a criminal, either for January 6, or for document secrecy violations, or for Stormy-Daniels-related campaign law violations, or for anything else, is anywhere near an important issue. However, Iā€™ve been wrong before. And if Trump was actually imprisoned, whether he could do the president job from a cell could become a real issue. I say that with email access he could, but, then, I donā€™t want more imperial presidencies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=221) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=223)