# 7 Jan 2021 and beyond - the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 8, 2021, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020 "2021-01-08T10:28:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 263
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5251 "2025-01-21T21:19:40Z")
> [@Zoobi](#): > > They don’t hate what Trump did because they don’t think he pardoned any cop killers. ‘They weren’t real police anyway! They was Antifa FBI plants sent there to start the riot!’ ~ Trump Supporting Cops ---
**Author:** ![Billy-o](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e8c25b/32.png) [@Billy-o](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billy-o)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5252 "2025-01-21T21:20:56Z")
The Fraternal Order of Police just endorsed him, a day after he pardoned those who attacked the Capitol Hill police. So… yeah, the pardons aren’t gonna hurt him with cops. Link ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5253 "2025-01-21T21:27:19Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > > [@ParallelLines](#): > > > > As for those “just” guilty of trespassing, well, let me STRONGLY disagree. > > I did not say I would approve of it. I said- it wouldn’t have bothered me, I mean compared to all the other crap trump has just done, it would be a minor blip. Still wrong, but not as wrong as most of his recent actions. I’m going to continue to disagree. Oh, not with how you feel, that’s your right even if I disagree most strenuously. But normalizing what happened as merely “trespassing” no matter the formal crime they were charged with, feeds their (lying) narrative. Sure, there were individuals who did not directly assault guards or break barriers, but cannot in _honesty_ claim they didn’t know what was happening. They claim it to high heaven of course, but no rational person should allow this to pass unchallenged. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5254 "2025-01-21T21:27:31Z")
I read Michael Fanone’s book Hold the Line. What a slap in the face this is.😤 ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5255 "2025-01-21T21:33:22Z")
To be clear, I’m not saying Trump is some unbeatable force that we should all just kneel down and accept. It’s just that there are certain voting groups he is untouchable with, and there is really nothing he can do lose their support. Police, Christians, Military, etc. You’re not going to find some gotcha moment that turns them against him. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5256 "2025-01-21T21:37:49Z")
> [@Zoobi](#): > > It’s just that there are certain voting groups he is untouchable with, and there is really nothing he can do lose their support. Police, Christians, Military, etc. You’re not going to find some gotcha moment that turns them against him. And I’d ask if it’s Trump or the Republicans that they are unfailingly loyal to (and is there even a difference at this point). Wind back the clock to pre-2016 and those groups would always support whoever the Republican was. But your point is made, this isn’t going to hurt him with cops. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5257 "2025-01-21T22:09:07Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Not only is this possible, but I can see trump awarding each and every one of them the presidential medal of freedom. Am I delusional? Only, possibly, the ‘each and every one’ part—that’s hundreds. Trump won’t want to have to do a ceremony for hundreds. But, yes: he IS likely to “honor” several of them at the SOTU (and thanks for that link), and he will give the Medal of Freedom to the worst of them. The most violent, and obviously to Rhodes and Tarrio. Them, he might even find Executive Branch jobs for. > [@ParallelLines](#): > > The police will continue to love him, because he’ll gut any federal efforts to investigate state/local police practices. So they can keep hiding their dirty little secrets. To most cops these days (not all) any police/LEO that got hurt on 1/6 were traitors anyway. ^This. The Capitol and DC cops who were harmed on 1/6/21 will be redefined as evil opponents of God’s Chosen, Donald Trump. 95% or more of law enforcement people will continue to adore their Donald. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5258 "2025-01-21T23:40:26Z")
Re the police & trump. Don’t be too sure the cops are all on board. > **[‘A Betrayal, a Mockery’: Police Express Outrage Over Trump’s Jan. 6 Pardons](https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/21/us/politics/jan-6-pardons-police.html?unlocked_article_code=1.q04.fI1L.e7v-rzw0f-Pl&smid=url-share)** > > More than 150 officers from the Capitol Police and the D.C. police were injured when a pro-Trump mob stormed the Capitol four years ago. > … > > “It’s a miscarriage of justice, a betrayal, a mockery, and a desecration of the men and women that risked their lives defending our democracy,” he [_Aquilino A. Gonell, a former Capitol Police sergeant_] said of the nearly 1,600 pardons and 14 commutations. > > More than 150 police officers from the two agencies were injured during the assault on the Capitol by a pro-Trump mob four years ago. Some were hit in the head with baseball bats, flagpoles and pipes. One lost consciousness after rioters used a metal barrier to push her down as they marched to the building. > > Now many of those officers described themselves as struggling and depressed in response to Mr. Trump freeing their attackers. > > … > > [Harry Dunn](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/25/us/politics/capitol-riot-harry-dunn.html), one of the most outspoken officers who protected the Capitol on Jan. 6, spent Monday and Tuesday checking in with his former colleagues. > > “Everybody’s angry and sad and devastated,” said Mr. Dunn, who has left the Capitol Police. > > One officer, Mr. Dunn said, went to bed after a long shift only to be awakened by an automated voice mail from victim services informing him of the release of a Jan. 6 defendant. > > “Every officer who testified in court is now getting these automated calls that, ‘Hey this defendant is being released,’” Mr. Dunn said. “The number of calls people are getting, it’s unbelievable.” ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5259 "2025-01-21T23:47:37Z")
But those are the officers of the forces that suffered the rioters’ attacks. I’d like to see other police forces and their unions decry the pardons before I’ll believe this will erode police support. ---
**Author:** ![SunUp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SunUp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SunUp)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5260 "2025-01-21T23:48:19Z")
Those seem to be local police. Do we have any similar indications of the feelings of police from any of the U.S.'s other 23,000 or so police departments? I’m not trying to be snarky, its just that I would expect this to hit harder among the Capitol and D.C. police forces, but plenty of police from other forces might not quite feel a sense of unity with them. ETA: Ninja’d! ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2025, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5261 "2025-01-21T23:53:38Z")
It would certainly hit harder with the DC police, but certainly other police departments will feel **some** solidarity now that the locals are expressing their reactions. I guess we’ll have to wait and see. Like with everything else. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5262 "2025-01-22T01:51:51Z")
> [@Zoobi](#): > > Well Trump isn’t running in 2026 for one, so this won’t cost him any votes, police or otherwise. Have you not noticed how upset he gets when a candidate he backs loses? Also, his agenda needs his backers. > [@Billy-o](#): > > The Fraternal Order of Police just endorsed him, Back in September 2024. Not after the pardon > [@ParallelLines](#): > > But normalizing what happened as merely “trespassing” no matter the formal crime they were charged with, feeds their (lying) narrative. Some were charged with exactly that- trespassing- a misdemeanor. And what is “normal” in the age of trump? [https://www.reuters.com/legal/capitol-riot-defendants-face-upheld-trespassing-charges-us-court-2024-10-22/](https://www.reuters.com/legal/capitol-riot-defendants-face-upheld-trespassing-charges-us-court-2024-10-22/) _WASHINGTON, Oct 22 (Reuters) - A U.S. appeals court on Tuesday upheld the use of a criminal trespassing charge against nearly all of the 1,500 defendants accused of taking part in the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol, rejecting an attempt to further restrict the charges available to prosecutors._ _In a 2-1 ruling, a panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit rejected an appeal by [defendant Couy Griffin](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/cowboys-trump-founder-faces-us-capitol-riot-criminal-trial-2022-03-21/) to toss out his conviction on a misdemeanor charge that bars unauthorized people from entering restricted areas protected by the U.S. Secret Service._ Many were charged with more violent crimes, which were _felonies._ So, perhaps you misunderstood what I said? If he had pardoned just the misdemeanor trespassing convictions, which came with rather minor penalties anyway- it would not have gotten me angry, like when he pardoned cop killer violent felons. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5263 "2025-01-22T02:39:31Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Some were charged with exactly that- trespassing- a misdemeanor. And what is “normal” in the age of trump? But your arguments disregard that they were only charged with “Trespassing” because the Republicans _refused_ to treat what happened as what it was, an insurrection. Sure, that’s all they were charged with, because the political powers that be were bound and determined to control the narrative, and thus they were kneecapped from the get go. If you murder someone, and plea bargain it down to manslaughter for … reasons… that doesn’t change that you were a murderer. You’re just a murderer with a good lawyer, and a slightly different conviction. It doesn’t change the facts of what you did. The legal system’s judgement has only a passing relationship with justice, morality, or accountability. The ongoing discussion of this insurrectionists as “Trespassers” is an insidious, and apparently in your case, successful effort to re-write reality. The rest of us are under no obligation to avoid the reality of the situation by dressing it up in legal technicalities built because of obstructionism from the top down. ---
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5264 "2025-01-22T02:54:58Z")
He doesn’t need the police vote. Or any other vote. He’s in, in case you haven’t noticed. I’ll have to look to what the House and Senate leaders are saying, As a former member of a police union and devote Trump hater, I wonder how the various unions are going to address/spin this. I can’t wait until the Capitol Police union issues a statement. What a POS. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5265 "2025-01-22T03:04:56Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > But your arguments disregard that they were only charged with “Trespassing” because the Republicans _refused_ to treat what happened as what it was, an insurrection > **[The High-Water Mark of the Jan. 6 Prosecutions](https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/the-high-water-mark-of-the-jan.-6-prosecutions)** > > On the fourth anniversary of the attack, 1,583 have been arrested and 1,270 convicted. Now how many will be pardoned? _Of the total 1,583 arrested, according to the [department’s figures](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477248/update-on-capitol-breach-48-months.pdf), 608—or 38 percent—were charged with either [assaulting](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/111) or [impeding](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/231) federal police officers. Of those that assaulted officers, 174 were charged with an enhanced version of the crime for using deadly or dangerous weapons or for inflicting bodily harm on the officer._…_Some 180 rioters were charged with carrying weapons onto the Capitol grounds,…The department has reported, for instance, that among the 327 defendants who have pleaded guilty to felonies,…Some 91 rioters have been charged with destroying government property that day, while 68 were charged with stealing it. … About [57 defendants](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477253/40-months-since-the-jan.pdf) were charged with conspiracy, [including 18](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477248/update-on-capitol-breach-48-months.pdf) who were charged with [seditious conspiracy](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384)—a felony akin to treason that carries a maximum 20-year penalty. [Ten defendants](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477248/update-on-capitol-breach-48-months.pdf) were convicted of seditious conspiracy after trial and [four more pleaded guilty](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477248/update-on-capitol-breach-48-months.pdf) to the charge._ So, many rioters were charged with- and convicted of violent felonies. Few were charged with JUST trespassing- in fact- _But merely stepping into the restricted zone around the Capitol alone was almost never enough to be charged, according to the department, which [says it declined prosecution](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/25477249/numbers-supplemental.pdf) of about 400 such cases._ So, some few were charged with just misdemeanor trespassing. > [@ParallelLines](#): > > The ongoing discussion of this insurrectionists as “Trespassers” is an insidious, and apparently in your case, successful effort to re-write reality. Not at all. _Some few were charged with only misdemeanor trespassing._ Most of the rest with various felony and other charges. So, you have an incorrect idea of what actually happened, nor do i - in any way shape or form- think that those convicted of violent crimes were 'just trespassing" , nor should any of those been pardoned. Pardoning a handful of misdemeanors? meh. The violent criminals were insurrectionists and richly deserve their prison time. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5266 "2025-01-22T05:05:52Z")
Since you seem so enamored of the narrow, legalistic argument, I wish you much luck with it, as you are unwilling to look beyond that. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5267 "2025-01-22T14:31:27Z")
I like the phrasing of “ **Trump pardoned copkillers** ”. Simple, short, and truthy. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5268 "2025-01-22T18:52:11Z")
[![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/v87DkKZ7IUE/maxresdefault.jpg "Michele Bachmann Says Jan. 6 'Was Like A Prayer Meeting'") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v87DkKZ7IUE) Yes Michele, they were worshiping their new god… ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5269 "2025-01-22T19:07:59Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > So, some few were charged with just misdemeanor trespassing. > > > [@ParallelLines](#): > > > > The ongoing discussion of this insurrectionists as “Trespassers” is an insidious, and apparently in your case, successful effort to re-write reality. > > Not at all. _Some few were charged with only misdemeanor trespassing._ Perhaps I am misunderstanding how this works, but I had assumed if the only charge was “misdemeanor trespassing” and a conviction was obtained it was the result of a plea deal. That is, either the accused assisted in the investigation of others who were involved or there were other charges but the prosecution settled for a plea of guilty for the misdemeanor for a reason or reasons unknown. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2025, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/5270 "2025-01-22T19:49:26Z")
That’s no prayer meeting _I_ ever want to go to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=262) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=264)