# 7 Jan 2021 and beyond - the aftermath of the storming of the Capitol **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 8, 2021, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020 "2021-01-08T10:28:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 98
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1947 "2021-07-22T13:00:40Z")
Those who record their crimes should expect that a court just might want to see it. > **[Judge forces US Capitol rioter to unlock laptop seized by FBI | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/21/politics/capitol-rioter-unlock-laptop/index.html)** > > A federal judge forced a US Capitol rioter to unlock his laptop Wednesday after prosecutors argued that it likely contained footage of the January 6 insurrection from his helmet-worn camera. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1948 "2021-07-22T13:40:33Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > The resolution that established the committee specifically said the Speaker can reject appointments. It doesn’t set a precedent for general committee assignments. And that resolution was the result of the GOP voting down the bipartisan version that catered to every whim of their assigned negotiator. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1949 "2021-07-22T13:44:06Z")
I am no fan of these guys, but this seems uncomfortably close to Fifth Amendment self-incrimination. The judge ruled otherwise, treating it as an action under a standard search warrant, but it still makes my skin prickle a bit. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1950 "2021-07-22T14:16:10Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I am no fan of these guys, but this seems uncomfortably close to Fifth Amendment self-incrimination. The judge ruled otherwise, treating it as an action under a standard search warrant, but it still makes my skin prickle a bit . Me too. I hate to think the prosecution could make me open my safe or unlock my phone. Get a warrant and do what you can, but I don’t have to help (\*would be my position, I understand the courts disagree) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1951 "2021-07-22T14:41:12Z")
Reading the CNN article, there _was_ a warrant, but it may have been expired. Certainly if there was a judge involved, a new warrant could easily be issued. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1952 "2021-07-22T14:47:41Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I hate to think the prosecution could make me open my safe or unlock my phone. Get a warrant and do what you can, but I don’t have to help This doesn’t make sense to me. Assuming they had a valid warrant, would you refuse to unlock your house or car for the police or force them to break in? How is your phone or computer or safe any different? (Again, assuming they have a valid search warrant for those things). ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1953 "2021-07-22T14:57:43Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I am no fan of these guys, but this seems uncomfortably close to Fifth Amendment self-incrimination. The judge ruled otherwise, treating it as an action under a standard search warrant, but it still makes my skin prickle a bit. Sounds like potential grounds for an appeal, which if so is a damn shame. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1954 "2021-07-22T14:59:17Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > Assuming they had a valid warrant, would you refuse to unlock your house or car for the police or force them to break in? Yes, they would have to break in. And if they wanted to see what’s in my safe (or what have you) they’d have to break in to that, too. I’m dummying up at that point, and not opening anything for them. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1955 "2021-07-22T15:01:59Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Sounds like potential grounds for an appeal, which if so is a damn shame. I don’t think so. I seem to recall that this is permissible under the law. I just did a quick search and found this: > But without further guidance from the Supreme Court, it’s largely been left up to interpretation by lower courts, with state courts considering their state constitution’s provisions as well as the federal. The result, Crocker says, is “a total patchwork of [decisions from] state Supreme Courts and federal courts.” > For example, in 2019, [Massachusetts’s highest court](https://law.justia.com/cases/massachusetts/supreme-court/2019/sjc-12564.html) forced a defendant to reveal his phone’s passcode while [Pennsylvania’s highest court](https://law.justia.com/cases/pennsylvania/supreme-court/2019/56-map-2018.html) ruled that a defendant could not be compelled to unlock his computer. [Indiana’s](https://calendar.in.gov/site/courts/event/supreme-katelin-enjoo-seo--v-state-of-indiana-no-18s-cr-00595/) and [New Jersey’s](https://www.law360.com/articles/1235874/nj-high-court-challenges-legality-of-forced-iphone-access) highest courts are both considering compelled passcode disclosure cases. On the federal side, the [Third Circuit Court of Appeals](https://regmedia.co.uk/2017/03/20/appeals_court_ruling.pdf) ruled that a defendant could be compelled to unlock multiple password-protected devices, even though the defendant claimed he couldn’t remember his passwords. The [11th Circuit Court of Appeals](https://www.eff.org/files/filenode/opiniondoe22312.pdf), on the other hand, ruled the other way in a different case. > > “It’s very much in flux,” Crocker said. “Eventually, the US Supreme Court could get involved and resolve this.” > **[It’s easier than ever for police to get your phone data](https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/2/24/21133600/police-fbi-phone-search-protests-password-rights)** > > New research shows a surprising number of police departments have the technology to break into your phone — even when it’s password protected. So, Unless there have been more recent cases, I guess it might be an open question and could be grounds for appeal, but I wouldn’t bet on the defendant. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1956 "2021-07-22T15:16:54Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Yes, they would have to break in. And if they wanted to see what’s in my safe (or what have you) they’d have to break in to that, too. The phone/computer thing I can kind of see, in that “breaking” into it would presumably not damage it and why make their jobs easier. But forcing them to break down your front door? What’s the point? You’re just going to have to spend a few hundred bucks to fix it and it won’t stop them for a minute. Seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face, to me. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1957 "2021-07-22T15:31:48Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I am no fan of these guys, but this seems uncomfortably close to Fifth Amendment self-incrimination. The fifth means that you can’t be compelled manufacture new evidence against yourself. If you have **already** made a statement, in your diary, or made a recording, then the evidence already exists. You can be ordered to hand it over, and it can be used as evidence. Here’s a simplified explanation of how it works, in a comic strip, written and drawn by a lawyer. > **[50. Jane Has a Webcomic | The Illustrated Guide to Law](https://lawcomic.net/guide/?p=2545)** ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1958 "2021-07-22T15:49:18Z")
That’s what I was thinking. The choice is not “do I wish to incriminate myself?”, it’s “do I want to have a safe I can use again, or one with holes drilled in it?” ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2021, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1959 "2021-07-22T16:25:56Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Here’s a simplified explanation of how it works, in a comic strip, written and drawn by a lawyer. > > [50. Jane Has a Webcomic | The Illustrated Guide to Law](https://lawcomic.net/guide/?p=2545) I ended up reading thru about 40 pages of that webcomic; it is excellent. Thanks for the introduction, **Peter**! ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1960 "2021-07-23T13:45:58Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > It doesn’t set a precedent for general committee assignments. “Precedent” is what you make of it. The House makes general committee assignments via a resolution at the start of each Congress, adopted by a majority vote. According to this [WaPo article](https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/pelosi-capitol-riot/2021/07/22/b629969a-eb16-11eb-8950-d73b3e93ff7f_story.html), Republicans are contemplating, “how Democrats might pay a price with their own committee assignments when Republicans regain the majority.” ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1961 "2021-07-23T18:48:52Z")
The “QAnon shaman” may be mentally ill, you say? Golly: [https://www.usnews.com/news/top-news/articles/2021-07-23/exclusive-qanon-shaman-in-plea-negotiations-after-mental-health-diagnosis-lawyer](https://www.usnews.com/news/top-news/articles/2021-07-23/exclusive-qanon-shaman-in-plea-negotiations-after-mental-health-diagnosis-lawyer) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2021, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1962 "2021-07-23T22:52:01Z")
> “What we’ve done is we’ve taken a guy who is unarmed, harmless, peaceful … with a pre-existing mental vulnerability of significance, and we’ve rendered him a chocolate soup mess,” Watkins said. He had a _spear_ in his hands; that’s not “unarmed, harmless, peaceful”. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2021, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1963 "2021-07-24T00:35:35Z")
And many people who are mentally ill don’t travel to overthrow the government. That takes a bit of mental stability to plan and carry through on. If he is mentally ill he should be institutionalized as he is a clear danger to himself and more so to society. He followed and led a mob to the Capitol and successfully got in. Should we let someone who wants to overthrow the government like Stalin walk? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2021, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1964 "2021-07-24T14:34:03Z")
Haw-haw! > **[Bumble match turns in January 6 suspect who allegedly whipped police | CNN...](https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/23/politics/capitol-riot-bumble-dating-app-match-andrew-taake/index.html)** > > Yet another US Capitol suspect was caught this week, all thanks to his Bumble match. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2021, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1965 "2021-07-24T14:38:42Z")
And another felony assault against police charge. Where’s Ron “they wouldn’t break any laws” Johnson when they need a defense? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2021, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020/1966 "2021-07-24T14:46:44Z")
Yes. But this pisses me off: > **[National Guard unit starts to make cuts after Congress fails to pay for...](https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/23/politics/national-guard-funding-deadline/index.html)** > > The Nebraska National Guard has begun canceling training events as other Guard units across the country prepare to take even more drastic measures if Congress doesn't reimburse the National Guard Bureau for the more than half a billion dollars spent... [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=97) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/7-jan-2021-and-beyond-the-aftermath-of-the-storming-of-the-capitol/930020.md?page=99)