# 8 UN workers killed, as Afghans protest US pastor's Quran-burning - Hope Pastor Jones is happy now **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 1, 2011, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809 "2011-04-01T16:08:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2011, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/181 "2011-04-02T23:21:35Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Tell me, how the hell can you still see your computer screen, what with it covered with so much spittle? :rolleyes: Well, to be fair, he does the same thing when he rants to the toaster. And that doesn’t even have an internet connection. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2011, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/182 "2011-04-02T23:25:15Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Nonsense. He killed those UN workers just as much as the people who committed the actual act. That’s _why_ he did what he did. He knew he could whip up religious hate, get people killed, and then sit back and smirk while people like you defend him. The Right does that all the time. Calling Nurse Ratched! Calling Nurse Ratched! Emergency!!! Oh never mind, it’s just Der Trihs with his usual nonsense talk. Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2011, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/183 "2011-04-02T23:50:17Z")
Can someone do me a favor and quote post #110 on the off-chance (hah!) that magellan01 is ignoring that much as he ignores other facts? Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/184 "2011-04-03T00:01:18Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > Not-breaking-the-law and having-the-right are not sufficient to make an action _right_. > > Honestly, **Oak** , I thought you had enough independent moral fiber to recognize that principle. > > I agree, absolutely. They are vicious criminals, and their (moral) crime is worse than his. > > But Jones is not blameless. And how exactly did they find out about it 8000 miles away? It was published as news. We’ve put Christianity and Islam on trial on this board on a regular basis. What Reverend Jones did was not newsworthy and most news organizations declined to cover his event knowing the results. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/185 "2011-04-03T00:56:20Z")
The trouble seems to have started when Karzai spoke about it the other day and demanded Jones be punished. There were calls for protests in response and I think most of us would agree that that’s understandable. And it sounds like Taliban/Al Qaeda types showed up armed at the protests and started murdering people because that’s what they do. If that’s all true: \*The violence was done by the same jerks who always do it. \*While this was somewhat predictable and Jones is still a dick, it probably reduces his responsibility - the most you can say is that he gave them an excuse. \*Anybody who did the ‘oh, of course they freaked out and can’t control themselves and did something barbaric’ may need to reconsider that kind of reaction. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/186 "2011-04-03T01:17:25Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The trouble seems to have started when Karzai spoke about it the other day and demanded Jones be punished. Punished by whom ? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/187 "2011-04-03T01:28:46Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Nonsense. He killed those UN workers just as much as the people who committed the actual act. No, a dipshit publicity hound burned a book that he bought and was his to destroy. Then people on the other side of the world that he doesn’t know, and who don’t know him, decided to kill people they didn’t know who had nothing to do with any of it, because they think their precious magic book was hurt somehow, and the only language they understand is brute violence. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/188 "2011-04-03T01:33:35Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > No, a dipshit publicity hound burned a book that he bought and was his to destroy. Then people on the other side of the world that he doesn’t know, and who don’t know him, decided to kill people they didn’t know who had nothing to do with any of it, because they think their precious magic book was hurt somehow, and the only language they understand is brute violence. That’s exactly the attitude Pastor Jones counted on. Both your attitude and the killer’s attitude. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/189 "2011-04-03T01:39:35Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > That’s exactly the attitude Pastor Jones counted on. Both your attitude and the killer’s attitude. My attitude, which I wish everyone would share, is that you shouldn’t kill people you don’t know for no good reason. Your mileage may vary. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/190 "2011-04-03T04:10:11Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What do you feel you are unable to do because of “fanatics,” and what do you mean by “we’ll explode?” Open for interpretation. Unlike mullahs on the other side of the planet, I don’t presume to have authority over other’s reactions. Maybe a national burn the Quran Day Maybe, we turn their playground into glass and be done with it Maybe we just all drop trou and hang them the moon In order to have the desired effect, it would have to be noteworthy action. One solitary lunatic taking action would be insufficient ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/191 "2011-04-03T11:00:24Z")
If I were Rev. Jones, I would issue a press release stating, “If the Islamist violence doesn’t cease, I will burn TWO Qurans!” ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/192 "2011-04-03T11:10:34Z")
I would propose that since Jones would not be found guilty of this, I think that besides giving him and his church shame and ridicule for all time, that we should see if it is possible to revoke their tax free status as they can’t help injecting themselves in things that involve the state and other nations. With any meager tax moneys collected then going to the UN or the families of the victims. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/193 "2011-04-03T11:41:17Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > I would propose that since Jones would not be found guilty of this, I think that besides giving him and his church shame and ridicule for all time, that we should see if it is possible to revoke their tax free status as they can’t help injecting themselves in things that involve the state and other nations. > > With any meager tax moneys collected then going to the UN or the families of the victims. Of course, we should shame Pastor Jones. He’s a nutcase. However, not only would he not be found guilty of this, he won’t ever be charged. In this country, we’re allowed to criticize religions and leaders and burn books without fear of being arrested. It’s one of the reasons that I love this country. Tax exempt status is currently granted to many organizations that inject themselves into matters involving the state and other nations. Surely you’ve heard of gay marriage, abortion, apartheid, immigration, welfare, animal rights, environmental protection, education reform, human trafficking, free trade… BTW, 20-25% of the entire U.N. budget is already paid by the U.S. taxpayers. Without the U.S., the UN would (arguably) cease to exist. ---
**Author:** ![newcomer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e5b9ba/32.png) [@newcomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcomer)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/194 "2011-04-03T14:31:15Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > My attitude, which I wish everyone would share, is that you shouldn’t kill people you don’t know for no good reason. Your mileage may vary. How do you explain then that democratically elected leader in US can invade another country and kill people he did not know? On a much deeper level, how do you reconcile your sense of self-righteousness toward people and situation you don’t know (but conclude they are in the wrong) with people you do know, who knowingly did wrong and you helped with your tax dollars and inaction? ---
**Author:** ![Lumchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Lumchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumchan)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/195 "2011-04-03T15:20:52Z")
Is provocateur just a word in the dictionary? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/196 "2011-04-03T15:39:20Z")
N/M ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/197 "2011-04-03T16:35:58Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > … I’ve forgotten who said that mankind would never be free until the last priest was crushed by the last stone of the last church but he had his cap on straight. You are probably thinking of a quote commonly attributed to Voltaire, but more correctly to Diderot, but originating with the fascintating case of the “atheist priest”. > [@](#): > > “And [with] the guts of the last priest let’s strangle the neck of the last king.” - Jean Meslier (1664-1729) > **[Jean Meslier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Meslier)** > > Jean Meslier (.mw-parser-output .IPA-label-small{font-size:85%}.mw-parser-output .references .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .infobox .IPA-label-small,.mw-parser-output .navbox .IPA-label-small{font-size:100%}French: \[melje\]; also Mellier; 15 June 1664 – 17 June 1729) was a French Catholic priest (abbé) who was discovered, upon his death, to have written a book-length philosophical essay promoting atheism and materialism. Described by the author as his "testament" to his parishioners, the t ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/198 "2011-04-03T17:14:06Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > Maybe, we turn their playground into glass and be done with it So we should respond to violence by a minority with total genocide of innocents? > [@](#): > > In order to have the desired effect, it would have to be noteworthy action. One solitary lunatic taking action would be insufficient What is the desired effect? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/199 "2011-04-03T17:22:15Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Punished by whom ? The United States and the UN, I guess. I don’t see any full transcripts of what he said, but [the Wall Street Journal sums it up this way](http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703806304576240643831942006.html): > [@](#): > > Most Afghans learned about the Quran burning in Florida only when Mr. Karzai on March 24 condemned the act as “a crime against the religion and the entire Muslim nation,” called on the U.S. and the U.N. to bring the perpetrators to justice and demanded “a satisfactory response to the resentment and anger of over 1.5 billion Muslims around the world.” > > Following Sunday’s meeting with Gen. Petraeus and the ambassadors, Mr. Karzai requested in a new statement that “the U.S. government, Senate and Congress clearly condemn [Rev. Jones’] dire action and avoid such incidents in the future.” Mr. Karzai issued this demand even though President Barack Obama has already described the Quran burning as “an act of extreme intolerance and bigotry”—adding that “to attack and kill innocent people in response is outrageous, and an affront to human decency and dignity.” I assume the second statement was made after it was explained to him that these actions are legal here, no punishment is forthcoming, and that his fuckwitted statement also helped give the killers an excuse to go nuts. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2011, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/200 "2011-04-03T17:35:48Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > So we should respond to violence by a minority with total genocide of innocents? QFT. If we nuke them why don’t we nuke ourselves and Russia at same time? Russian and American involvement are directly responsible for Afghan society. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809.md?page=11)