# 8 UN workers killed, as Afghans protest US pastor's Quran-burning - Hope Pastor Jones is happy now **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 1, 2011, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809 "2011-04-01T16:08:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/41 "2011-04-01T20:18:31Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > No, they kill doctors, shoot at politicians or cops and beat gays instead. Or blow up federal buildings.. And there are examples of left-wingers participating in similar acts. Comparing muslim extremists with (modern) right-wing christian extremists while excluding the acts of left-wing extremists is intellectually dishonest. And muslim extremism is worst than both. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/42 "2011-04-01T20:21:46Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Why? He’s not breaking any laws. He’s expressing a political and/or religious opinion, as he has every right to do. There is no reason he should restrain himself to pacify some radicals on the other side of the planet. That sums it up nicely. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/43 "2011-04-01T20:23:28Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > I do, however, now and forevermore, flatly reject any notion of an obligation to avoid offending radicals for fear of what criminal actions they may take in response. I do not suggest that there is a simple _obligation to avoid offending radicals_. Nor do I suggest that Jones is as culpable as if he’d done the violence himself. What I am saying is that one cannot reasonably escape _all_ responsibility for the foreseeable consequences of deliberately provocative public acts. > [@Oakminster](#): > > Maybe Jones gets a woody when he fires up a Quran. Then he should keep that to himself. Really. Look, I’m for freedom of speech. I’m against religious extremism. I just think this is a big world with a lot of different people and ideas, and there is _some_ moral obligation, if not to try and get along (which would be nice), at least to not go out of our way to make it worse. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/44 "2011-04-01T20:24:01Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > So the entire world should follow Islamic law for fear of what criminals may do? Bullshit. Where do we draw the line? > > No burning Qurans, that might offend the Muslims. > > No eating spaghetti, that might offend the Pastafarians. > > No eating meat, that might offend the Cult of Bambi. > > No fucking out of wedlock, because that offends Christians. > > No more college football, because Saturday is a big deal for Jewish folks. Where I’m having trouble with this is, what personal benefit does one get out of burning the Quran? I mean, you don’t eat meat to offend vegetarians, you do it for sustenance. You don’t eat pork to offend Muslims or Jews, you do it because you like barbecue and your personal code doesn’t say you can’t. You don’t have sex with your girlfriend to piss off Christians, you do it because she’s hot. So fill in the blank for me: you don’t burn the Quran to piss off Muslims, you do it because \_\_\_\_\_. I’m not saying Jones doesn’t have a right to do it. But he’s not a blameless hero who won’t let the radicals dictate his actions. He did it specifically to antagonize and demonize. And that makes him a bag of dicks. ---
**Author:** ![Rotlla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/278dde/32.png) [@Rotlla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rotlla)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/45 "2011-04-01T20:24:55Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > And there are examples of left-wingers participating in similar acts. Comparing muslim extremists with (modern) right-wing christian extremists while excluding the acts of left-wing extremists is intellectually dishonest. > > And muslim extremism is worst than both. Yes, looking around the world it’s easy to think of example after example of leftists [del]committing terrorism[/del] being pothead cowards. I’m not seeing the equivalence. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/46 "2011-04-01T20:28:51Z")
> [@Rotlla](#): > > Yes, looking around the world it’s easy to think of example after example of leftists [del]committing terrorism[/del] being pothead cowards. Someone needs to start spending a little time away from the commune ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/47 "2011-04-01T20:29:00Z")
> [@Omegaman](#): > > What do you mean caving in? They made no demands. That shitstain took upon himself to do something he knew would have reprecussions. They demand the whole fucking world avoid any conceivable insult to their religion, or they will riot and/or kill innocent people. As they did in this instance. As they have done countless times before. As they will do in the future. Until the entire fucking world bows to their Sacred Cow. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/48 "2011-04-01T20:30:25Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > They demand the whole fucking world avoid any conceivable insult to their religion, or they will riot and/or kill innocent people. As they did in this instance. As they have done countless times before. As they will do in the future. Until the entire fucking world bows to their Sacred Cow. Or just finally decides to turn their playground into glass… ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/49 "2011-04-01T20:32:01Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > Or just finally decides to turn their playground into glass… Pastor Jones, is that you? ---
**Author:** ![Rotlla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/278dde/32.png) [@Rotlla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rotlla)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/50 "2011-04-01T20:36:02Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > Someone needs to start spending a little time away from the commune I notice your response did not contain a list of examples. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/51 "2011-04-01T20:41:31Z")
Al Jazeera is reporting that it appears the peaceful protests - which had drawn over 2000 peaceful protesters - were hijacked by insurgents who assaulted and stole the weapons from the 5 nepalese PMC guards who were stationed outside the UN compound. They then opened fire on the guards, killing them, and lit fires inside the compound. Two european UN officers were killed, as well as four protesters. > **[Breaking News, World News and Video from Al Jazeera](https://www.aljazeera.com/)** > > News, analysis from the Middle East & worldwide, multimedia & interactives, opinions, documentaries, podcasts, long reads and broadcast schedule. The article says that the nationalities of the two UN officers are currently unknown, but Dagbladet - Norwegian daily - is reporting that one of the casualties is confirmed to be a female Norwegian UN officer and that the Swedish Foreign Services is reporting one swedish lawyer, Joakim Dunkel, murdered as well. So, peaceful protests hijacked by murderous assholes whose motives are unclear. It’ll be interesting to see if we’ll ever know whether these people were religiously motivated or just political opportunists who saw a chance to attack an UN compound. ---
**Author:** ![the\_Lady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bb73d2/32.png) [@the\_Lady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_Lady)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/52 "2011-04-01T20:42:47Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Where I’m having trouble with this is, what personal benefit does one get out of burning the Quran? I mean, you don’t eat meat to offend vegetarians, you do it for sustenance. You don’t eat pork to offend Muslims or Jews, you do it because you like barbecue and your personal code doesn’t say you can’t. You don’t have sex with your girlfriend to piss off Christians, you do it because she’s hot. > > So fill in the blank for me: you don’t burn the Quran to piss off Muslims, you do it because \_\_\_\_\_. > > I’m not saying Jones doesn’t have a right to do it. But he’s not a blameless hero who won’t let the radicals dictate his actions. He did it specifically to antagonize and demonize. And that makes him a bag of dicks. This. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/53 "2011-04-01T20:42:55Z")
> [@Omegaman](#): > > What do you mean caving in? They made no demands. That shitstain took upon himself to do something he knew would have reprecussions. Let’s say I take offense when you walk down my street, and tell you that if you do it again I’ll kill your dog. If you walk down my street, and I kill your dog, are you a shitstain? After all, you did something that you knew would have repercussions. [QUOTE=Oakminster] They demand the whole fucking world avoid any conceivable insult to their religion, or they will riot and/or kill innocent people. As they did in this instance. As they have done countless times before. As they will do in the future. Until the entire fucking world bows to their Sacred Cow. [/QUOTE] Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/54 "2011-04-01T20:53:20Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Let’s say I take offense when you walk down my street, and tell you that if you do it again I’ll kill your dog. If you walk down my street, and I kill your dog, are you a shitstain? After all, you did something that you knew would have repercussions. Knew? No, unless you have a history of killing dogs - just as muslim extremists have a history of murdering people after seeing mundane actions of profanity against their religion. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/55 "2011-04-01T20:57:13Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > just as muslim extremists have a history of murdering people after seeing mundane actions of profanity against their religion. So, we should all tip-toe around? Maybe they just need to get the fuck over it already… ---
**Author:** ![Rotlla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/278dde/32.png) [@Rotlla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rotlla)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/56 "2011-04-01T21:07:16Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > So, we should all tip-toe around? > > Maybe they just need to get the fuck over it already… Pretty much everybody needs to get the fuck over a lot of fucking things. However, when you’re talking about a people living in a country with no real leadership, who, according to the lies they’re told, are living in a shithole due to the actions of Western imperialists who are enemies of Allah, and who are largely uneducated, and who don’t have any alternative to a culture whose practices date back at least a couple thousand years, it’s not likely they’re going to get the fuck over it any time soon. If your concern is with foreign aid workers who may be their victims, placing your hope in them “getting the fuck over” whatever the fuck they’re pissed off about may not actually be helpful. Of course, since later reports suggest pretty strongly that it wasn’t just dumb ragheads pissed off over the Qur’an being burned but rather a political struggle related to the current war in their country, it’s doubly unclear how “getting the fuck over it” would be the solution to the problem here. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/57 "2011-04-01T21:07:46Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > So, we should all tip-toe around? Please note the use of “mundane”, then please explain how you think I’m saying anything that even resembles “we should tip-toe around”. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/58 "2011-04-01T21:11:33Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Knew? No, unless you have a history of killing dogs - just as muslim extremists have a history of murdering people after seeing mundane actions of profanity against their religion. Oh it’s you again. My heart leaps up. How many dogs would I have to kill before you become the shitstain? ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/59 "2011-04-01T21:18:25Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > How many dogs would I have to kill before you become the shitstain? No idea - but it’s certainly not zero. Are you arguing that the number is zero? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2011, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809/60 "2011-04-01T21:25:41Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Let’s say I take offense when you walk down my street, and tell you that if you do it again I’ll kill your dog. If you walk down my street, and I kill your dog, are you a shitstain? After all, you did something that you knew would have repercussions. If he’s doing it specifically because he wants to prove a point about how he won’t be dictated to, and not because he has a particular need to get to the other end of that street… then yeah, he kinda is. I mean, it’s great that he stood up for his principles, and all, but it’s pretty rough on the poor dog, whom I’m pretty sure didn’t give a shit one way or the other about his principles. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/8-un-workers-killed-as-afghans-protest-us-pastors-quran-burning-hope-pastor-jones-is-happy-now/576809.md?page=4)